WEBVTT - Sharri | 27 May

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<v Speaker 1>Sho Welcome Well.

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<v Speaker 2>First tonight more downing allegations about the nine News cover

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<v Speaker 2>up over the allegations of sexual harassment against former news

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<v Speaker 2>boss Darren Wick. This time it involves a senior female executive.

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<v Speaker 2>Two women have claimed that director of Communications and Public

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<v Speaker 2>Relations at nine, Victoria Buckan, spoke to them about allegations

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<v Speaker 2>of sexual harassment against Darren Wick five years ago.

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<v Speaker 1>But he remained in his job.

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<v Speaker 2>This comes as nine News chief executive Mike Sneezeby broke

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<v Speaker 2>his overseas holiday where he was celebrating his fiftieth birthday

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<v Speaker 2>to order an external investigation into the complaints against Wick

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<v Speaker 2>that we first aired on this show a week ago.

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<v Speaker 2>And in a moment, I'll show you an astonishing video

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<v Speaker 2>of Wick at a Logi's after party where he holds

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<v Speaker 2>the hand of a female colleague. But before that, we

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<v Speaker 2>can tonight reveal the conflicts of interest and paul governance

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<v Speaker 2>that led to serious allegations of sexual harassment, sexism, and

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<v Speaker 2>a toxic culture being swept under the rug at nine

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<v Speaker 2>Victoria Buchan sought to suppress the scandal of Wick's inappropriate

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<v Speaker 2>conduct after the twenty nineteen Logis after party.

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<v Speaker 1>At the function. We've now learned of four women.

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<v Speaker 2>Who Darren Wick allegedly groped, sexually harassed, or propositioned. One

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<v Speaker 2>on air presenter who was the victim of sexual harassment

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<v Speaker 2>claims that Victoria Buchan rang her in the weeks afterwards

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<v Speaker 2>to ask about the incident, and the woman says that

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<v Speaker 2>Bucan asked her whether she leaked information to the media

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<v Speaker 2>about Darren Wick's behavior and whether he had sexually harassed her.

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<v Speaker 2>The woman said she hadn't leaked to the media, and

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<v Speaker 2>the presenter claims that Buchan, along with another nine female executive,

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<v Speaker 2>asked if she intended to make a formal complaint. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>like many women at nine, she didn't want to lodge

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<v Speaker 2>a formal complaint so that it wouldn't affect her career

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<v Speaker 2>at Progression Now, Wick remained in his job.

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<v Speaker 1>Another woman who works in an.

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<v Speaker 2>Off air role at nine received a call from Buchan

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<v Speaker 2>to ask if she'd been gossiping about Wick's behavior at

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<v Speaker 2>the Logi's after party, and the woman claims that Bucken

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<v Speaker 2>defended Wick by saying he had mixed medication with alcohol.

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<v Speaker 1>Now. Buchan denies this.

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<v Speaker 2>When the woman pressed Buchan on the sexual harassment allegations.

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<v Speaker 1>Bucken said that it had been dealt with.

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<v Speaker 2>One nine employee told me today and I quote, HR

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<v Speaker 2>is working hand in hand with publicity, so it's not

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<v Speaker 2>really a safe space.

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<v Speaker 1>Now.

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<v Speaker 2>I've asked Victoria who buck and twice whether it's correct

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<v Speaker 2>that over the years she'd become aware of allegations that

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<v Speaker 2>Wick behaved inappropriately towards women when he was intoxicated. I

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<v Speaker 2>asked her what action she took about this, and whether

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<v Speaker 2>she was more concerned about bad publicity for nine and

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<v Speaker 2>protecting Wick than a duty of care to vulnerable women.

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<v Speaker 2>Buckan responded to say, I was aware that Darren Wick

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<v Speaker 2>was intoxicated at the Logis.

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<v Speaker 1>He was spoken to and left the event.

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<v Speaker 2>After the event, I spoke to people who came to

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<v Speaker 2>me about his drinking. I spoke to Darren Wick on

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<v Speaker 2>a number of occasions about his drinking.

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<v Speaker 1>People knew this.

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<v Speaker 2>I was never at events where I was aware of

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<v Speaker 2>the behavior described as Hansy occurred. I didn't receive any

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<v Speaker 2>internal complaints to deal with or external media inquiries about

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<v Speaker 2>such behavior.

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<v Speaker 1>She said.

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<v Speaker 2>My role here is quite clearly to have media inquiries

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<v Speaker 2>about our business and our people, which are many and varied.

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<v Speaker 2>It requires consultation across all parts of Nine. Victoria Buckin said,

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<v Speaker 2>I have always done my best to operate with integrity

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<v Speaker 2>and support for all our people.

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<v Speaker 1>Well tonight we.

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<v Speaker 2>Can show you clear evidence of Wick's love of partying

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<v Speaker 2>with staff who worked under him.

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<v Speaker 1>Have a look at this video.

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<v Speaker 2>As you can see there, Wick reaches down to hold

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<v Speaker 2>an on air presenter's hand on the dance floor. This

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<v Speaker 2>was taken at the previous year's logis. It was the

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<v Speaker 2>after party in twenty eighteen, and it clearly shows Wick

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<v Speaker 2>on the dance floor holding the hand of a woman

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<v Speaker 2>who we know was an on air colleague while dancing.

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<v Speaker 1>The video clearly demonstrates that Wik was.

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<v Speaker 2>Happy to blur the lines of appropriate employer employee interaction,

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<v Speaker 2>especially when the logis and alcohol were involved. Now it's

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<v Speaker 2>not just Nine's corporate affairs that women claim covered up

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<v Speaker 2>allegations of inappropriate conduct. During mister Costello Peter Costello's term

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<v Speaker 2>as chair of nine, a high profile nine News presenter

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<v Speaker 2>raised concerns about Wick's workplace behavior with a board member.

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<v Speaker 2>The presenter, who first shared her story here on Sky News'

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<v Speaker 2>last Wednesday, said that she was so distressed, she felt

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<v Speaker 2>she had nowhere else to turn, so she called a

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<v Speaker 2>director in confidence to speak about the toxic culture under Wick. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>this director, who is still on the board, was sympathetic

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<v Speaker 2>and assured the senior presenter that they would deal with

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<v Speaker 2>the issue. The nine Star was then extremely disappointed when

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<v Speaker 2>nothing was done to.

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<v Speaker 1>Address the situation.

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<v Speaker 2>She said there was no assistance provided by the network

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<v Speaker 2>to source the leaks, stamp out the toxic behavior, or

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<v Speaker 2>change the culture. After board level, there's nowhere to go,

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<v Speaker 2>and I was fearful of losing my job. So, as

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<v Speaker 2>I said those revelations we first aired last Wednesday, Well,

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<v Speaker 2>I asked Chair Peter Costello.

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<v Speaker 1>About this again today.

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<v Speaker 2>I asked him whether any board directors had raised issues

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<v Speaker 2>about darren Wick with him, and.

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<v Speaker 1>If so, what action did he take.

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<v Speaker 2>Costello declined to answer the question, even though it was

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<v Speaker 2>put to him three times. The board member also didn't

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<v Speaker 2>respond to specific questions about whether they fulfilled their obligations

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<v Speaker 2>as a director. There are now serious questions being raised

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<v Speaker 2>about the board governance at nine and about why a

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<v Speaker 2>six figure payout was given to darren Wick despite the

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<v Speaker 2>known legal complaint of inappropriate behavior. One employee told me

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<v Speaker 2>today They're all talking about budget cuts that are coming,

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<v Speaker 2>yet Wiki gets a massive payout.

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<v Speaker 1>It leaves a bitter taste.

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<v Speaker 2>So far, dozens of women have bravely revealed their stories

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<v Speaker 2>of sexual harassment, inappropriate behavior or a toxic workplace under

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<v Speaker 2>Darren Wick. We broke the story of Wick's history of

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<v Speaker 2>hansy and inappropriate conduct here on Sky News last Monday.

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<v Speaker 2>Our coverage was the front page of the Daily Telegraph

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<v Speaker 2>on Thursday. The Sydney Morning Herald spoke to more women

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<v Speaker 2>on Saturday for their front page, and The Australian also

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<v Speaker 2>ran it on their front page today. After first reporting

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<v Speaker 2>last Monday that a complaint of inappropriate behavior had led

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<v Speaker 2>to Wick's departure, nine chief executive Mike Sneezeby, as I said,

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<v Speaker 2>broke his overseas trip and address staff. Today he fronted

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<v Speaker 2>the news he announced an external investigation into complaints. He

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<v Speaker 2>also offered to confidentially speak to any women at an

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<v Speaker 2>off site location. He followed this with an email at

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<v Speaker 2>four pm where he said, this afternoon, I'm meeting with

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<v Speaker 2>our people across nine News to talk about recent reports

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<v Speaker 2>about alleged inappropriate behavior and broader cultural issues in our

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<v Speaker 2>television newsrooms. I want to begin by saying I'm aware

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<v Speaker 2>this has been a very tough time for many of you,

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<v Speaker 2>and I acknowledge the distress and frustration the substance of.

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<v Speaker 1>Those reports has caused. He said.

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<v Speaker 2>The recent reports that detail alleged serious failings of leadership

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<v Speaker 2>in television news clearly tells me more work needs to

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<v Speaker 2>be done to ensure we have a safe and inclusive

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<v Speaker 2>workplace throughout Nine. Now Mike Sneeze be the chief executive.

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<v Speaker 2>He said, the recent reports and the internal feedback he'd

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<v Speaker 2>received and other nine leaders had received in recent days

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<v Speaker 2>has made it clear that he needs to accelerate the

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<v Speaker 2>work he's doing to build a culture of respect and trust,

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<v Speaker 2>and he announced the external review. He announced that there'd

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<v Speaker 2>be an ongoing formal complaint line. He also allowed open

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<v Speaker 2>door access to nine's executive group and said there'd be

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<v Speaker 2>a helpline for emotional.

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<v Speaker 1>Or psychological support.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, this is all a good start in external review

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<v Speaker 2>into a long history of complaints or issues with inappropriate conduct.

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<v Speaker 2>But this issue, and specifically how Nine protected a senior

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<v Speaker 2>television executive with a long history of shocking conduct towards women.

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<v Speaker 2>While this has a long way to go. Now, let's

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<v Speaker 2>bring in tonight's Sky News panel, sky News host Liz

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<v Speaker 2>Storer and commentator Joe Hildurrand.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to you both, Hi, Joe.

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<v Speaker 2>Look, this is now a major scandal for Channel nine.

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<v Speaker 2>It's an ASX listed company. There are questions being asked

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<v Speaker 2>not only about Darren Wick's conduct, but about why this

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<v Speaker 2>was allowed to go on for so long when so

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<v Speaker 2>many people clearly knew about the issues.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you think enough has been done at this point?

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<v Speaker 3>Look, it seems that Mike Sneedsby is taking this seriously,

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<v Speaker 3>the fact that he's cut forward his holiday, his birthday

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<v Speaker 3>celebrations to come back and deal with it. That email

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<v Speaker 3>struck me as fairly fairly sincere. I think the problem

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<v Speaker 3>that I've been reading all about this, my overwhelming feeling

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<v Speaker 3>is just one of sadness. I mean, the legacy media,

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<v Speaker 3>the mainstream media, is fighting for its survival in the

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<v Speaker 3>twenty first century. We've got all sorts of new and

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<v Speaker 3>often very sinister threats to just you know, just good

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<v Speaker 3>old fashioned news reporting, news breaking. The skills and the

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<v Speaker 3>abilities and the platforms we need to be able to

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<v Speaker 3>do that, and to have yet another body blow like

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<v Speaker 3>this and and again you know Channel nine is not alone,

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<v Speaker 3>but another body blow. It just fills me with a

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<v Speaker 3>sort of sense of sadness. I think that we also

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<v Speaker 3>need to the thing that upset me the most, and

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<v Speaker 3>I met Darren Wick, I think on two occasions, once

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<v Speaker 3>in an event in Canberra and another time we had

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<v Speaker 3>lunch after I left Channel ten. But you know, and

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<v Speaker 3>I had heard and i'd heard, you know, I never

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<v Speaker 3>seen or witness but had heard some of these reports.

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't realize just how bad it was.

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<v Speaker 1>I think no one knew how extensive.

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<v Speaker 3>I think a lot of people. I think a lot

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<v Speaker 3>of people thought it was you know, like you know,

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<v Speaker 3>it's just people getting drunk having a good time. Maybe

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<v Speaker 3>some people went a bit too far, woke up with

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<v Speaker 3>sore heads and regretted things, and obviously there seemed to

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<v Speaker 3>have been more than that now. But also what really

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<v Speaker 3>struck me, and I know has really hurt at least

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<v Speaker 3>some of the people involved, is that that cold kind

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<v Speaker 3>of freezing out of people after those incidents in the

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<v Speaker 3>cold light of day, and crushing their careers, often their dreams,

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<v Speaker 3>and that all sort of been tied into it. And

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<v Speaker 3>to me that almost feels like the more sort of

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<v Speaker 3>toxic element, that stuff that happened in the cold light

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<v Speaker 3>of day.

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<v Speaker 2>Look, I think you know you're right that emotional turmoil

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<v Speaker 2>is very difficult. But you know, I've spoken to a

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<v Speaker 2>number of women now who were sexually harassed.

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<v Speaker 1>They I should say they alleged they were.

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<v Speaker 2>Sexually harassed, and you know the trauma of that, the distress,

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<v Speaker 2>the tears, because you know you can't do anything.

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<v Speaker 1>It's your boss.

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<v Speaker 2>He's the most powerful television executive in the media company,

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<v Speaker 2>and they felt that they had to put up with it.

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<v Speaker 1>And sometimes there.

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<v Speaker 2>Were repeat instances over many years, and very difficult for

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<v Speaker 2>people to live like that and to work like that

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<v Speaker 2>and to know how to handle it, especially when, as

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<v Speaker 2>we've reported, at least some senior female executives knew about

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<v Speaker 2>it and apparently didn't do anything, or at least if

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<v Speaker 2>they did, it was nothing that meant that Wick didn't

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<v Speaker 2>have his job. Now, let's have a look at another

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<v Speaker 2>out of touch leader, well, the PM Anthony Alberanizi. He

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<v Speaker 2>opened last Tuesday a new affordable housing project in western Sydney,

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<v Speaker 2>but just hours later he was feasting on apparently three

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<v Speaker 2>lobsters with billionaire Justin hems at his new restaurant, where

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<v Speaker 2>lobsters are said to cost up to two hundred and

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<v Speaker 2>fifty dollars a kilo. Three days later, Anthony Alberanzi was

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<v Speaker 2>back out in Western Sydney again, making a big speech

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<v Speaker 2>where he said that he too could feel voter's cost

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<v Speaker 2>of living pain.

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<v Speaker 4>Have a look, I know that when you are living

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<v Speaker 4>week to week, it's hard to even find the time

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<v Speaker 4>to think about the future, let alone plan for it

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<v Speaker 4>with confidence.

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<v Speaker 2>Liz, you know you can bet if this had been

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<v Speaker 2>Albanese's counterpart and the opposition team, he would have accused

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<v Speaker 2>them of being out of touch for having lunch with

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<v Speaker 2>a billionaire, as he has in the past.

0:14:00.280 --> 0:14:02.520
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, and look, there's nothing wrong with being wealthy. There's

0:14:02.520 --> 0:14:06.400
<v Speaker 5>nothing wrong with having wealthy friends. Where where yeah, enjoy

0:14:06.440 --> 0:14:09.240
<v Speaker 5>your two hundred and fifty dollars obs tomate. Where this

0:14:09.440 --> 0:14:12.360
<v Speaker 5>rubs Australians up the wrong way, as it should is

0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:14.079
<v Speaker 5>when you also want to pretend to be a man

0:14:14.120 --> 0:14:17.400
<v Speaker 5>of the people. I was raised in social housing, etcetera, etcetera,

0:14:17.440 --> 0:14:20.080
<v Speaker 5>and so on his whole I'm still Jenny from the bronc.

0:14:20.160 --> 0:14:21.840
<v Speaker 1>He used to have a little, Now I have a lot.

0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.160
<v Speaker 1>Routine is getting really, really old.

0:14:24.320 --> 0:14:27.680
<v Speaker 5>This cost of living crisis is dragging out. His government

0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:30.760
<v Speaker 5>is doing little to nothing to save it. So when

0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:33.240
<v Speaker 5>he still tries to pretend like, oh, I'm a man

0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:33.800
<v Speaker 5>of the people.

0:14:33.840 --> 0:14:36.520
<v Speaker 1>We all know your master five million.

0:14:36.200 --> 0:14:41.320
<v Speaker 5>Dollar portfolio of land holdings he takes home almost six

0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:45.480
<v Speaker 5>hundred thousand dollars a year. Just don't pretend to be

0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:48.880
<v Speaker 5>one of us as well, which he still tries to

0:14:48.920 --> 0:14:52.520
<v Speaker 5>stir up. I am you, you know, I'm one of you.

0:14:52.600 --> 0:14:56.120
<v Speaker 5>But it's talking these people, especially out in Western Sydney,

0:14:56.160 --> 0:14:59.120
<v Speaker 5>being like, oh me as well, no, not you as well.

0:14:59.400 --> 0:15:01.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it seems like he has forgot in his roots.

0:15:01.840 --> 0:15:04.440
<v Speaker 2>But I think what's funny is that at that Western

0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:07.240
<v Speaker 2>Sydney function where he was claiming to be a man

0:15:07.280 --> 0:15:09.160
<v Speaker 2>of the people and talking about how tough the cost

0:15:09.160 --> 0:15:11.720
<v Speaker 2>of living is with Joe in the Daily Mail article

0:15:11.760 --> 0:15:14.920
<v Speaker 2>on this, he was seen hugging one of those men

0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:15.560
<v Speaker 2>of the people.

0:15:15.800 --> 0:15:21.520
<v Speaker 3>That's right, you exactly, absolute tally and good on the Mail.

0:15:21.560 --> 0:15:23.200
<v Speaker 3>They do a great job with that. And then I

0:15:23.280 --> 0:15:25.560
<v Speaker 3>say the PM sort of beaming because he's hugging somebody

0:15:25.560 --> 0:15:29.600
<v Speaker 3>at this Western Sydney event, and I'm like that's me.

0:15:30.320 --> 0:15:33.560
<v Speaker 3>I know that cheap ass off the rack Jack's and

0:15:34.120 --> 0:15:37.520
<v Speaker 3>beautiful long brown locks as well. But yes, I was there.

0:15:37.560 --> 0:15:39.160
<v Speaker 3>I thought it was a very good speech. I think

0:15:39.160 --> 0:15:41.880
<v Speaker 3>this is all a bit and again there's always.

0:15:41.640 --> 0:15:44.560
<v Speaker 1>Kind of who the person going after going pleasure.

0:15:44.680 --> 0:15:47.160
<v Speaker 3>Well, unlike Laura Tingle, I don't pretend I'm impartial, but

0:15:48.640 --> 0:15:52.480
<v Speaker 3>unlike I mean, obviously, if you're going to you know,

0:15:52.640 --> 0:15:54.720
<v Speaker 3>if you're going to go and eat lobster with a billionaire,

0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:56.760
<v Speaker 3>the media is going to taie you up the Daily

0:15:56.800 --> 0:15:59.200
<v Speaker 3>Mail or the Daily Telegraph, will whoever. Obviously, if you

0:15:59.280 --> 0:16:01.760
<v Speaker 3>buy a couple of you know, bowing seven three sevens

0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:03.640
<v Speaker 3>for your prime ministerial fleet, you're going to get a

0:16:03.640 --> 0:16:05.640
<v Speaker 3>towel up on two GB or whatever it may be.

0:16:05.680 --> 0:16:09.080
<v Speaker 3>So it's also a fair game and good sport. But honestly,

0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:11.880
<v Speaker 3>does anyone actually think that the Prime Minister of Australia

0:16:11.920 --> 0:16:14.040
<v Speaker 3>is earning a pauper's wage and wearing a hair shirt

0:16:14.080 --> 0:16:15.800
<v Speaker 3>and living in the straight Of course, he's made it.

0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:17.520
<v Speaker 3>That doesn't mean he didn't grow up poor. It doesn't

0:16:17.560 --> 0:16:20.400
<v Speaker 3>mean he doesn't understand what it was like, far more

0:16:20.440 --> 0:16:23.040
<v Speaker 3>than most prime ministers. But I think the whole point

0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:26.600
<v Speaker 3>of a labor government should be to raise people from poverty,

0:16:26.600 --> 0:16:28.800
<v Speaker 3>from the working class and help them get ahead.

0:16:28.800 --> 0:16:32.360
<v Speaker 2>I mean the accusation is that he's forgotten what it's

0:16:32.600 --> 0:16:34.200
<v Speaker 2>like to do it tough in this cost to live

0:16:34.240 --> 0:16:36.160
<v Speaker 2>in crisis. So just before we move on to the

0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:38.840
<v Speaker 2>next topic, let's have a look at Joe hugging elbow

0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:42.800
<v Speaker 2>for next time he tries to him as he always loved,

0:16:44.720 --> 0:16:47.120
<v Speaker 2>really leaning in there for a friendly hug.

0:16:47.200 --> 0:16:47.360
<v Speaker 1>Joe.

0:16:47.760 --> 0:16:51.360
<v Speaker 3>Look how happy he is Minister as an objective, free

0:16:51.400 --> 0:16:53.800
<v Speaker 3>and fairless and partial journalist. I think that was a

0:16:53.800 --> 0:16:56.280
<v Speaker 3>great peak, right all right.

0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:59.320
<v Speaker 2>Well, let's move on to ABC journalist Laura Tingle, who's

0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:02.840
<v Speaker 2>landed herself in hot water after she claimed that Australia

0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:06.360
<v Speaker 2>is a racist country. She says, the comments that Opposition

0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:09.879
<v Speaker 2>leader Peter Dutton has given license for migrants to be

0:17:09.920 --> 0:17:13.119
<v Speaker 2>abused when looking to buy or rent property in Australia.

0:17:13.160 --> 0:17:15.200
<v Speaker 1>Have a look, I mean.

0:17:15.280 --> 0:17:17.639
<v Speaker 6>We are a racist, calculates face that we always have

0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:21.639
<v Speaker 6>been astray depressing. To give a license like that I

0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:25.280
<v Speaker 6>find more profoundly depressing and a terrible prospect for the

0:17:25.320 --> 0:17:25.800
<v Speaker 6>next election.

0:17:29.200 --> 0:17:33.960
<v Speaker 2>Look, Liz, even Tanya Plubisek disagreed with the remarks. She says,

0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:37.440
<v Speaker 2>while some Australians have experienced racism and we're seeing a

0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:40.399
<v Speaker 2>lot of antisemitism at the moment, she said, overwhelmingly the

0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:43.000
<v Speaker 2>country's not racist, and I'd agree with that.

0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:46.360
<v Speaker 5>Yeah, And what Dutton was talking about was the unprecedented

0:17:46.480 --> 0:17:48.960
<v Speaker 5>level of immigration that we've seen in the last year

0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:52.040
<v Speaker 5>and how the math simply doesn't add up. We're letting

0:17:52.080 --> 0:17:55.400
<v Speaker 5>all these people in when we can't even accommodate basic

0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:59.120
<v Speaker 5>needs of a people who are already here, and claiming

0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:03.720
<v Speaker 5>that is racism or as she claimed, gives people license

0:18:04.040 --> 0:18:07.239
<v Speaker 5>to discriminate against people if you're at an auction and

0:18:07.560 --> 0:18:11.320
<v Speaker 5>somebody's bidding and they don't look Australian, whatever that means. Anyway,

0:18:11.400 --> 0:18:16.000
<v Speaker 5>We're a very multicultural society. No one looks Australian anymore.

0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:22.160
<v Speaker 5>Is outright ridiculous being against these high levels of immigration.

0:18:22.320 --> 0:18:25.560
<v Speaker 5>As a Resolve poll showed just this month, two thirds

0:18:25.560 --> 0:18:28.960
<v Speaker 5>of Aussies are like, yeah, cut that back even further

0:18:29.040 --> 0:18:31.320
<v Speaker 5>than you've already promised to. What are we all racist

0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:33.720
<v Speaker 5>now for saying that it's got nothing to do with

0:18:33.760 --> 0:18:36.240
<v Speaker 5>the color of people's skin or where they're coming from

0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:40.480
<v Speaker 5>or who they are. It's simply about putting Australians first.

0:18:40.560 --> 0:18:43.920
<v Speaker 1>And that's what done. Putting Australians first.

0:18:44.000 --> 0:18:46.080
<v Speaker 2>I think the issue dote In is trying to highlight

0:18:46.480 --> 0:18:49.520
<v Speaker 2>is the strain on the housing supply. And Joe here's

0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:53.879
<v Speaker 2>link exactly their first access with the high immigration levels.

0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:56.919
<v Speaker 2>And we have seen unprecedented immigration levels.

0:18:57.359 --> 0:19:00.639
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I've gone on the record on this network on

0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:04.360
<v Speaker 3>my podcast. The real story with Jojo something that actually

0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:07.520
<v Speaker 3>that's a false equivalence. The idea that more migrants just

0:19:07.560 --> 0:19:10.800
<v Speaker 3>means less stuff for everybody who's already here is actually wrong.

0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:16.840
<v Speaker 1>So simple for a million people last year.

0:19:17.080 --> 0:19:19.120
<v Speaker 3>Not that simple. And I and that's.

0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:23.120
<v Speaker 1>Not affecting the housing crisis. A million extras in one year.

0:19:23.359 --> 0:19:25.760
<v Speaker 3>Houses get built when people think there are more people

0:19:25.760 --> 0:19:27.479
<v Speaker 3>coming to buy them. And the reason why there's been

0:19:27.480 --> 0:19:29.800
<v Speaker 3>a glut and a trough is because everyone stopped building

0:19:29.800 --> 0:19:32.080
<v Speaker 3>houses when we stop letting my migrantcy in during COVID.

0:19:32.119 --> 0:19:33.679
<v Speaker 3>You're welcome having said that.

0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:35.920
<v Speaker 5>And what has the government done about it that they're

0:19:36.000 --> 0:19:36.480
<v Speaker 5>letting them in?

0:19:36.600 --> 0:19:37.119
<v Speaker 1>I'm nothing.

0:19:37.440 --> 0:19:40.480
<v Speaker 3>The idea that anyone who raises these concerns is racist

0:19:40.720 --> 0:19:43.879
<v Speaker 3>is incredibly unhelpful. It's the sort of rhetoric that lost

0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:47.159
<v Speaker 3>the Voice referendum just last year, and it had me

0:19:47.280 --> 0:19:48.920
<v Speaker 3>tearing my hair out. We had everyone saying, oh, you

0:19:48.960 --> 0:19:51.080
<v Speaker 3>don't know for this year racist or Australias the racist country,

0:19:51.119 --> 0:19:53.800
<v Speaker 3>or anyone who poses it's racist or it's rooted in racism.

0:19:54.160 --> 0:19:56.080
<v Speaker 3>You would think that people who think that they are

0:19:56.080 --> 0:19:58.679
<v Speaker 3>so smart and consider themselves part of the intelligence here

0:19:58.720 --> 0:20:01.479
<v Speaker 3>would be intelligent enough to learned from that lesson. Clearly

0:20:01.520 --> 0:20:04.080
<v Speaker 3>they have not. I would say, I know the sort

0:20:04.080 --> 0:20:06.440
<v Speaker 3>of crowd that goes the Melbourne Writers' Festival. They're whiter

0:20:06.480 --> 0:20:08.640
<v Speaker 3>than a polar bear in a snowstorm. It'd be great

0:20:08.640 --> 0:20:12.000
<v Speaker 3>to see, you know. The whitest electorates were the ones

0:20:12.080 --> 0:20:14.119
<v Speaker 3>that actually voted. If you want to talk about racism,

0:20:14.200 --> 0:20:18.040
<v Speaker 3>let's talk about racism to Indigenous Australians. The whitest electorates,

0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:21.280
<v Speaker 3>the whitest and richest electorates, were the ones very few

0:20:21.320 --> 0:20:24.160
<v Speaker 3>ones who actually ended up voting yes for the referendum

0:20:24.280 --> 0:20:27.760
<v Speaker 3>was the most multicultural electorates who voted no. So if

0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:31.040
<v Speaker 3>Laura Tingle is accusing Australia of being racist, she's accusing

0:20:31.119 --> 0:20:33.240
<v Speaker 3>a land mass of being racist, and I'm not sure

0:20:33.240 --> 0:20:35.919
<v Speaker 3>how a lump of rock can be racist. If she

0:20:36.000 --> 0:20:39.040
<v Speaker 3>is accusing Australians of being racist, then she is. It

0:20:39.080 --> 0:20:41.439
<v Speaker 3>would appear by all the data that we have, unless

0:20:41.440 --> 0:20:43.359
<v Speaker 3>she's got any other data that she might want appoint

0:20:43.400 --> 0:20:44.840
<v Speaker 3>us to that she is accusing.

0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:46.320
<v Speaker 1>Didn't point to any.

0:20:46.160 --> 0:20:48.240
<v Speaker 3>She's accusing migrants themselves.

0:20:48.320 --> 0:20:51.800
<v Speaker 2>You know what, for a supposedly objective ABC journalist, she

0:20:52.040 --> 0:20:53.160
<v Speaker 2>is very opinionated.

0:20:53.359 --> 0:20:55.159
<v Speaker 3>Sometimes it helps to admit your bias.

0:20:55.320 --> 0:20:58.159
<v Speaker 2>Far All right, Liz Storry, Joe Hude Bran, thank you

0:20:58.160 --> 0:21:00.000
<v Speaker 2>both so much, and list we'll see you back here

0:21:00.160 --> 0:21:04.040
<v Speaker 2>ten o'clock now. Coming up, Deputy Prime Minister Richard Marles

0:21:04.080 --> 0:21:07.720
<v Speaker 2>says anti Semitism in this country is the worst he's seen.

0:21:07.520 --> 0:21:08.480
<v Speaker 1>In his lifetime.

0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:11.719
<v Speaker 2>Well, that's no thanks to months of inaction from his

0:21:11.840 --> 0:21:16.280
<v Speaker 2>own government. Senator James Patterson will join me next. Plus

0:21:16.359 --> 0:21:20.840
<v Speaker 2>Lisa Wilkinson's million dollar legal bill revealed over Bruce Lehman's.

0:21:20.480 --> 0:21:21.760
<v Speaker 1>Failed defamation case.

0:21:22.000 --> 0:21:24.720
<v Speaker 2>Will have the latest from the Federal Court today with

0:21:24.800 --> 0:21:26.520
<v Speaker 2>the legal expert Chris Merrit.

0:21:31.520 --> 0:21:32.120
<v Speaker 1>Welcome back.

0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:35.520
<v Speaker 2>Well, anti Semitic chants could be banned under new hate

0:21:35.560 --> 0:21:39.960
<v Speaker 2>speech laws being drafted by Attorney General Mark Dreyfuss. The

0:21:40.000 --> 0:21:44.320
<v Speaker 2>bill will reportedly carry criminal and not civil penalties for

0:21:44.480 --> 0:21:51.280
<v Speaker 2>serious offenses of vilification based on someone's race, sexuality, gender, disability,

0:21:51.480 --> 0:21:56.080
<v Speaker 2>or religion. Now, the timing could not be better. After

0:21:56.119 --> 0:22:02.240
<v Speaker 2>Melbourne's biggest Jewish school was vandalized with tragic death threat sprayed.

0:22:01.960 --> 0:22:02.879
<v Speaker 1>Across its fence.

0:22:03.480 --> 0:22:07.399
<v Speaker 2>The statement jew die was graffited across the entrance to

0:22:07.440 --> 0:22:13.080
<v Speaker 2>the school last Friday night, terrorizing and upsetting students and parents.

0:22:13.560 --> 0:22:17.040
<v Speaker 2>Here was the school principal and Deputy PM, Richard Miles.

0:22:17.040 --> 0:22:20.520
<v Speaker 7>Today there are a number of families who chose not

0:22:20.560 --> 0:22:23.360
<v Speaker 7>to send their children to school today. This is off

0:22:23.400 --> 0:22:28.639
<v Speaker 7>the back of the community already feeling quite unsafe, given

0:22:28.880 --> 0:22:32.359
<v Speaker 7>the anti Israel protests that have been going on, and

0:22:32.400 --> 0:22:34.840
<v Speaker 7>the fear that our families have that they might find

0:22:34.880 --> 0:22:38.520
<v Speaker 7>their ways to high schools, not just or to Jewish schools,

0:22:38.560 --> 0:22:40.000
<v Speaker 7>and not just university campuses.

0:22:40.160 --> 0:22:42.480
<v Speaker 8>The levels of anti Semitism that we have seen in

0:22:42.520 --> 0:22:45.560
<v Speaker 8>the past few months more than any that I've seen

0:22:45.640 --> 0:22:49.199
<v Speaker 8>during my lifetime, and it must stop. It has no

0:22:49.320 --> 0:22:51.160
<v Speaker 8>place in our country.

0:22:52.880 --> 0:22:54.080
<v Speaker 1>So deeply upsetting.

0:22:54.080 --> 0:22:56.520
<v Speaker 2>All right, Let's bring in now Shadow Home Affairs Minister

0:22:56.680 --> 0:23:01.200
<v Speaker 2>James Patterson. I mean, James, look all all these protesters

0:23:01.480 --> 0:23:04.040
<v Speaker 2>and others claim that you know, this is about Israel,

0:23:04.160 --> 0:23:07.600
<v Speaker 2>this isn't about being Jewish, that they're not anti Semitic. Well,

0:23:07.680 --> 0:23:12.680
<v Speaker 2>graffiti like that Ju Dae just shows what a mockery

0:23:12.960 --> 0:23:16.439
<v Speaker 2>their claims are. And I strongly believe that right now,

0:23:16.720 --> 0:23:21.159
<v Speaker 2>if you're denying Israel's right to exist, that anti Zionism

0:23:21.320 --> 0:23:23.760
<v Speaker 2>is indistinguishable from anti Semitism.

0:23:23.920 --> 0:23:26.800
<v Speaker 1>What do you think, of.

0:23:26.760 --> 0:23:30.960
<v Speaker 9>Course, that's exactly right, Shari. Scratch the surface on almost

0:23:31.080 --> 0:23:35.000
<v Speaker 9>every vehement anti Zionist and you will find an anti

0:23:35.000 --> 0:23:38.040
<v Speaker 9>Semite if they're smart enough. They couch the language in

0:23:38.160 --> 0:23:40.600
<v Speaker 9>terms of Zionism in the State of Israel, but it

0:23:40.640 --> 0:23:43.720
<v Speaker 9>doesn't take much before you get to what's really underlying

0:23:43.880 --> 0:23:46.000
<v Speaker 9>all of it, and that is a hatred of Jewish

0:23:46.000 --> 0:23:49.359
<v Speaker 9>people and racism towards the Jewish community. I agree with

0:23:49.400 --> 0:23:51.520
<v Speaker 9>what the Deputy Prime Minister said today, but I think

0:23:51.520 --> 0:23:54.480
<v Speaker 9>we would all be forgiven for wondering whether Richard Mirles

0:23:54.480 --> 0:23:56.520
<v Speaker 9>has been in an induced coma for the last six

0:23:56.560 --> 0:23:58.960
<v Speaker 9>months and is only just woken up and realized what's

0:23:59.000 --> 0:24:01.919
<v Speaker 9>going on, Because it shouldn't have taken what has happened

0:24:01.920 --> 0:24:04.240
<v Speaker 9>at Mount Skoper's for him to realize how serious the

0:24:04.240 --> 0:24:07.240
<v Speaker 9>anti Semitism crisis has been in our country for more

0:24:07.280 --> 0:24:09.520
<v Speaker 9>than six months now, since the seventh of October. It's

0:24:09.560 --> 0:24:12.480
<v Speaker 9>abundantly clear what's happening and where has been the action

0:24:13.080 --> 0:24:16.240
<v Speaker 9>to complement these serious words that we're now hearing out

0:24:16.240 --> 0:24:17.919
<v Speaker 9>of the deep Prime Minister and some others.

0:24:18.200 --> 0:24:19.840
<v Speaker 1>Well, next week it will be eight months.

0:24:19.880 --> 0:24:23.159
<v Speaker 2>Actually, you know, it's eight months that we've seen this

0:24:23.240 --> 0:24:27.520
<v Speaker 2>extreme anti semitism. And look, as I've said repeatedly, the

0:24:27.640 --> 0:24:31.359
<v Speaker 2>strong daily anti Israel rhetoric that we see from this

0:24:31.480 --> 0:24:37.480
<v Speaker 2>government where they wrongly accuse Israel of targeting civilians, of

0:24:38.119 --> 0:24:42.000
<v Speaker 2>causing of not acting in accordance with humanitarian law when

0:24:42.000 --> 0:24:45.960
<v Speaker 2>they call for an immediate humanitarian cease fire because they

0:24:46.040 --> 0:24:51.800
<v Speaker 2>think they claim again wrongly that Israel is targeting civilians. Well,

0:24:51.840 --> 0:24:55.600
<v Speaker 2>all of this sends the message to people on the street,

0:24:55.640 --> 0:24:59.960
<v Speaker 2>to Australians that you know, Israel isn't behaving properly, isn't

0:25:00.119 --> 0:25:03.320
<v Speaker 2>behaving in accordance with international law, and this is part

0:25:03.359 --> 0:25:06.919
<v Speaker 2>of what's driving the anti Semitism. So doesn't the government

0:25:07.000 --> 0:25:10.760
<v Speaker 2>have to take some responsibility for the levels of antisemitism

0:25:10.840 --> 0:25:11.480
<v Speaker 2>that we're seeing.

0:25:13.240 --> 0:25:15.600
<v Speaker 9>Of course they do sharow, that's exactly what they should do.

0:25:16.000 --> 0:25:18.199
<v Speaker 9>But the Prime Minister right now can't even control his

0:25:18.240 --> 0:25:20.800
<v Speaker 9>own caucus when it comes to these questions. He's had

0:25:21.040 --> 0:25:25.159
<v Speaker 9>Senator Fadam a payman out there the previous week endorsing

0:25:25.280 --> 0:25:27.119
<v Speaker 9>a phrase which the Prime Minister has said is a

0:25:27.200 --> 0:25:30.000
<v Speaker 9>very violent statement which has no place in Australia. And

0:25:30.040 --> 0:25:33.280
<v Speaker 9>again today she is tweeting that we should end all

0:25:33.800 --> 0:25:36.720
<v Speaker 9>trade and economic relations with israelm and we should unilaterally

0:25:36.840 --> 0:25:40.399
<v Speaker 9>elect recognize a Palestinian state. I mean, what she knows

0:25:40.520 --> 0:25:44.040
<v Speaker 9>is there are no consequences for defying a weak prime minister.

0:25:44.480 --> 0:25:46.800
<v Speaker 9>And if the Prime Minister kind of control his own caucus,

0:25:46.840 --> 0:25:49.200
<v Speaker 9>what hope does he have defending the Jewish community against

0:25:49.240 --> 0:25:51.880
<v Speaker 9>these unprecedented levels of anti Semitism.

0:25:52.040 --> 0:25:54.960
<v Speaker 2>And look, he's barely lifted a finger to even try

0:25:55.240 --> 0:25:59.280
<v Speaker 2>defend the Jewish community in my opinion. Now, Immigration Minister

0:25:59.320 --> 0:26:03.080
<v Speaker 2>Andrew Jaile were his order apparently to go soft on

0:26:03.160 --> 0:26:07.200
<v Speaker 2>foreign born criminals who have ties to Australia, has continued

0:26:07.240 --> 0:26:10.520
<v Speaker 2>to haunt him. The Australian Today reporting that thanks to

0:26:10.560 --> 0:26:15.440
<v Speaker 2>the Immigration Minister's direction ninety nine, a child rapist was

0:26:15.520 --> 0:26:18.840
<v Speaker 2>allowed to stay in the country. Now, James, this New

0:26:18.920 --> 0:26:23.280
<v Speaker 2>Zealand bond man reportedly raped his fourteen year old stepdaughter

0:26:23.560 --> 0:26:27.280
<v Speaker 2>while his wife was giving birth to his child in hospital.

0:26:28.200 --> 0:26:34.040
<v Speaker 2>Surely Andrew Giles has to resign for this. How does

0:26:34.080 --> 0:26:35.480
<v Speaker 2>it get worse than this?

0:26:37.720 --> 0:26:39.879
<v Speaker 9>Every minister would hope that they would have a Prime

0:26:39.880 --> 0:26:43.159
<v Speaker 9>Minister who was as tolerant of incompetence and weakness as

0:26:43.200 --> 0:26:47.560
<v Speaker 9>Anthony Alberanzi is. But surely even Anthey Albanesi has his limits.

0:26:47.600 --> 0:26:52.200
<v Speaker 9>Surely allowing a pedophile to stay in this country who

0:26:52.240 --> 0:26:55.359
<v Speaker 9>should otherwise been deported is a bridge too far, even

0:26:55.400 --> 0:26:58.600
<v Speaker 9>for Anthony Alberenzi. But that is exactly the effect of

0:26:58.720 --> 0:27:02.800
<v Speaker 9>Andrew Giles direct to his department. Because under Andrew Giles,

0:27:02.800 --> 0:27:05.440
<v Speaker 9>and under this direction issued in January twenty twenty three,

0:27:05.760 --> 0:27:08.720
<v Speaker 9>he told his department and therefore also the AAT and

0:27:08.760 --> 0:27:11.760
<v Speaker 9>other bodies that consider their decisions, that as a primary

0:27:11.800 --> 0:27:16.480
<v Speaker 9>consideration they must evaluate the connection of this person to Australia,

0:27:16.480 --> 0:27:19.800
<v Speaker 9>and if they have a connection to Australia, regardless of

0:27:19.880 --> 0:27:22.199
<v Speaker 9>the level of their offending, they must be allowed to

0:27:22.200 --> 0:27:23.840
<v Speaker 9>a stay in Australia and there's now been not just

0:27:23.880 --> 0:27:25.879
<v Speaker 9>one case like this, but dozens of cases like this.

0:27:26.640 --> 0:27:30.240
<v Speaker 9>Andrew Giles should be sacked and tomorrow Direction ninety nine

0:27:30.240 --> 0:27:32.720
<v Speaker 9>match he issued should be repealed and replaced with what

0:27:32.760 --> 0:27:34.840
<v Speaker 9>the Coalition had in power, which is if you're a

0:27:34.840 --> 0:27:37.240
<v Speaker 9>non citizen and commit a crime, you'll be deported no

0:27:37.359 --> 0:27:38.160
<v Speaker 9>if nobuts.

0:27:39.240 --> 0:27:42.800
<v Speaker 2>Look, this is a major issue and it's unbelievable how

0:27:42.840 --> 0:27:46.440
<v Speaker 2>many lives Andrew Giles has and I think Anthony Albernizi

0:27:46.640 --> 0:27:49.160
<v Speaker 2>boasts about the fact that he hasn't lost a minister

0:27:49.240 --> 0:27:51.280
<v Speaker 2>in his first term as Prime Minister, but it is

0:27:51.359 --> 0:27:54.040
<v Speaker 2>nothing to boast about because when you see this much

0:27:54.080 --> 0:27:57.680
<v Speaker 2>incompetence and it has affected public safety. We have seen

0:27:57.800 --> 0:28:02.560
<v Speaker 2>people who've been allegedly bashed, assaulted, injured by some of

0:28:02.600 --> 0:28:08.040
<v Speaker 2>these release detainees. Then this is affecting public safety decisions

0:28:08.119 --> 0:28:09.680
<v Speaker 2>directly made by his government.

0:28:10.400 --> 0:28:10.960
<v Speaker 1>He's got to go.

0:28:11.040 --> 0:28:13.520
<v Speaker 2>It's a sign of weakness that he won't sack him.

0:28:13.600 --> 0:28:15.359
<v Speaker 2>Not something to boast about.

0:28:16.680 --> 0:28:19.000
<v Speaker 9>That's right. And I bet the family of the young

0:28:19.080 --> 0:28:21.720
<v Speaker 9>man who was allegedly murdered by someone who was allowed

0:28:21.760 --> 0:28:24.200
<v Speaker 9>to stay in Australia after they breached the character visions

0:28:24.200 --> 0:28:26.800
<v Speaker 9>of the Migration Act. Doesn't take much comfort from the

0:28:26.800 --> 0:28:29.240
<v Speaker 9>fact that the Prime Minister hasn't lost a minister. In fact,

0:28:29.280 --> 0:28:30.960
<v Speaker 9>I don't think they care at all. I don't think

0:28:30.960 --> 0:28:34.600
<v Speaker 9>most Australians care at all. It's a bizarre boast when

0:28:34.680 --> 0:28:36.840
<v Speaker 9>your ministers are failing to protect the community, which is

0:28:36.880 --> 0:28:39.440
<v Speaker 9>the sacred and first duty of every Australian government.

0:28:39.760 --> 0:28:43.640
<v Speaker 2>Indeed, James Patterson, thank you very much for your time tonight.

0:28:43.680 --> 0:28:47.880
<v Speaker 2>And James is, of course the Shadow Home Affairs Minister. Well,

0:28:48.000 --> 0:28:51.520
<v Speaker 2>Lisa Wilkinson is seeking one point eight million dollars from

0:28:51.640 --> 0:28:54.880
<v Speaker 2>her employer, her old employer, Network ten, to cover her

0:28:54.920 --> 0:28:58.480
<v Speaker 2>costs of fighting the defamation case against Bruce Lehman. A

0:28:58.520 --> 0:29:02.200
<v Speaker 2>shot hearing this morning discussed whether Wilkinson's cost should be

0:29:02.280 --> 0:29:05.920
<v Speaker 2>sent to a referee for assessment, after ten had agreed

0:29:05.960 --> 0:29:10.720
<v Speaker 2>to pay reasonable costs for her defense team earlier this year.

0:29:10.880 --> 0:29:12.760
<v Speaker 2>But they say they won't pick up the bill for

0:29:12.800 --> 0:29:18.360
<v Speaker 2>anything that was unnecessarily deceptive or wasteful. Well, let's bring

0:29:18.400 --> 0:29:21.600
<v Speaker 2>in now the Rule of Law Institute of Australia's Chris Merritt.

0:29:22.040 --> 0:29:24.600
<v Speaker 1>Chris, thank you very much for joining us. Look what

0:29:24.680 --> 0:29:26.080
<v Speaker 1>are the court here today?

0:29:26.520 --> 0:29:30.760
<v Speaker 2>And you know, is there any real point to determining

0:29:30.800 --> 0:29:33.960
<v Speaker 2>the costs when we know that Bruce Lherman can't afford

0:29:34.000 --> 0:29:34.880
<v Speaker 2>to pay in any case?

0:29:35.000 --> 0:29:38.400
<v Speaker 10>Well, we know that for sure now. Justice Lee made

0:29:38.440 --> 0:29:41.560
<v Speaker 10>the point that there are limited prospects of recovering anything

0:29:41.680 --> 0:29:47.680
<v Speaker 10>from mister Luhrman. He strongly urged Ten and Lisa Wilkinson

0:29:47.800 --> 0:29:52.120
<v Speaker 10>to narrow the scope of their dispute over how much

0:29:52.280 --> 0:29:56.280
<v Speaker 10>Ten should pay Wilkinson for the costs of her separate defense.

0:29:57.120 --> 0:30:02.160
<v Speaker 10>If that there's no ability to narrow that dispute, it

0:30:02.200 --> 0:30:06.960
<v Speaker 10>will probably go to a referee to objectively assess it.

0:30:07.080 --> 0:30:11.160
<v Speaker 10>That will cost money. Justice Lee was very strong in

0:30:11.200 --> 0:30:14.200
<v Speaker 10>his encouragement for them to narrow the terms of that

0:30:14.360 --> 0:30:17.320
<v Speaker 10>so that they don't lose more money. They're the losers

0:30:17.880 --> 0:30:21.200
<v Speaker 10>if you look at the reality here, the financial reality,

0:30:21.560 --> 0:30:25.120
<v Speaker 10>the winners of that defamation case in financial terms, are

0:30:25.160 --> 0:30:26.320
<v Speaker 10>the biggest losers.

0:30:26.880 --> 0:30:30.200
<v Speaker 2>So, you know, Bruce Lehman brought on this defamation case.

0:30:30.320 --> 0:30:34.080
<v Speaker 2>I mean effectively he has nothing to lose. Really, he's

0:30:34.160 --> 0:30:36.240
<v Speaker 2>lost the case, but he's not going to be able to.

0:30:36.240 --> 0:30:37.120
<v Speaker 1>Pay any costs.

0:30:37.240 --> 0:30:41.240
<v Speaker 2>Shouldn't there be some provision or new law that litigans

0:30:41.240 --> 0:30:43.760
<v Speaker 2>shouldn't be able to take up defamation cases that are

0:30:43.760 --> 0:30:47.880
<v Speaker 2>going to cost those defending them millions of dollars if

0:30:47.880 --> 0:30:48.440
<v Speaker 2>they can't pay.

0:30:48.520 --> 0:30:54.160
<v Speaker 10>But there are provisions for plaintiffs in these circumstances who

0:30:54.160 --> 0:30:58.200
<v Speaker 10>are impecunious to post security for costs. Courts are extremely

0:30:58.240 --> 0:31:02.680
<v Speaker 10>reluctant to do that. The worst example of that reluctance

0:31:02.720 --> 0:31:07.280
<v Speaker 10>took place a few years ago with a war criminals

0:31:07.320 --> 0:31:12.240
<v Speaker 10>known as Captain Dragon, who know the case well, who lost,

0:31:12.600 --> 0:31:16.160
<v Speaker 10>who caused News Corporation just spend millions of dollars and

0:31:16.200 --> 0:31:18.480
<v Speaker 10>they never got it back and they won. They won

0:31:18.520 --> 0:31:21.840
<v Speaker 10>in the end. So it's yes, there is a scope

0:31:21.840 --> 0:31:27.200
<v Speaker 10>for serious reform here. People with limited ability to pay

0:31:27.240 --> 0:31:30.440
<v Speaker 10>the cost of the other side can impose a massive

0:31:30.480 --> 0:31:34.000
<v Speaker 10>financial detriment on people who have done nothing wrong.

0:31:34.560 --> 0:31:37.160
<v Speaker 1>Seems like there could be reform in that area.

0:31:37.960 --> 0:31:40.400
<v Speaker 2>Now, I want to ask you about these text messages

0:31:40.440 --> 0:31:44.160
<v Speaker 2>that have emerged in discovery process between Britney Higgins and

0:31:44.240 --> 0:31:48.240
<v Speaker 2>her fiance David Charaz and how this relates to the

0:31:48.280 --> 0:31:52.680
<v Speaker 2>defamation case that Linda Reynolds is pursuing against Higgins.

0:31:52.360 --> 0:31:53.240
<v Speaker 1>And Schirats book.

0:31:53.280 --> 0:31:58.040
<v Speaker 10>This is extremely significant during the pre trial discovery process,

0:31:58.240 --> 0:32:04.000
<v Speaker 10>Linda Reynolds solicitor Martin Bennett discovered a WhatsApp exchange between

0:32:04.240 --> 0:32:07.520
<v Speaker 10>mister Sharaz and miss Higgins and what it shows that

0:32:07.600 --> 0:32:11.280
<v Speaker 10>they were arranging. He would argue, he has argued in

0:32:11.360 --> 0:32:15.800
<v Speaker 10>court that they were arranging between themselves who would post things.

0:32:16.080 --> 0:32:18.400
<v Speaker 10>It appeared to be a joint enterprise. Now why is

0:32:18.400 --> 0:32:22.760
<v Speaker 10>that significant? Because Linda Reynolds is suing over four social

0:32:22.800 --> 0:32:26.239
<v Speaker 10>media posts that were posted not by miss Higgins, but

0:32:26.760 --> 0:32:31.160
<v Speaker 10>only by mister Charraz. Now this is very relevant when

0:32:31.160 --> 0:32:34.880
<v Speaker 10>you consider that mister Charaz is already effectively given up.

0:32:35.280 --> 0:32:39.080
<v Speaker 10>He's agreed to judgment against him and in favor of

0:32:39.200 --> 0:32:41.320
<v Speaker 10>Linda Reynolds. He's impecunious.

0:32:41.400 --> 0:32:43.080
<v Speaker 2>Well, he says he doesn't want to take part in

0:32:43.160 --> 0:32:44.480
<v Speaker 2>this legal process.

0:32:44.640 --> 0:32:48.479
<v Speaker 10>The bottom line is he can. The judgment against him

0:32:48.520 --> 0:32:52.360
<v Speaker 10>could be millions and millions dollars. He's unemployed, he doesn't

0:32:52.440 --> 0:32:55.280
<v Speaker 10>own a shadow in France. He doesn't have two point

0:32:55.320 --> 0:32:59.000
<v Speaker 10>four million dollars, but miss Higgins does. She's got two

0:32:59.040 --> 0:33:02.560
<v Speaker 10>point four million dollars. So the joint enterprise argument is

0:33:02.640 --> 0:33:10.160
<v Speaker 10>how mister Bennett, Martin Bennett, Linda Reynold's lawyer can impose liability,

0:33:10.240 --> 0:33:11.680
<v Speaker 10>could impose library.

0:33:11.600 --> 0:33:14.360
<v Speaker 2>On Higgins because of those what's that messages where they

0:33:14.400 --> 0:33:20.200
<v Speaker 2>discuss posting. Fascinating, Chris Merritt, thank you very much. You're

0:33:20.240 --> 0:33:24.520
<v Speaker 2>always across the detail. Now coming up, why new polling

0:33:24.600 --> 0:33:27.440
<v Speaker 2>says a minority government is a fifty to fifty bet

0:33:27.560 --> 0:33:31.280
<v Speaker 2>at the next election as Labour losers support in the regions.

0:33:31.320 --> 0:33:38.680
<v Speaker 2>My political panel will join me next. Welcome back with

0:33:38.840 --> 0:33:42.280
<v Speaker 2>new polling out today shows that a minority government or

0:33:42.320 --> 0:33:45.120
<v Speaker 2>a hung parliament is a fifty to fifty bet.

0:33:44.960 --> 0:33:45.800
<v Speaker 1>At the next election.

0:33:46.480 --> 0:33:50.320
<v Speaker 2>The Thin Review reports that Labor is predicted to govern

0:33:50.440 --> 0:33:53.520
<v Speaker 2>at the next election, either in a hung parliament or

0:33:53.600 --> 0:33:57.080
<v Speaker 2>with a thin majority. Now, the poll they published today

0:33:57.120 --> 0:34:00.560
<v Speaker 2>also shows that the coalition could win back a number

0:34:00.640 --> 0:34:05.440
<v Speaker 2>of Labor held regional seats. Let's bring in now Tonight's

0:34:05.480 --> 0:34:08.920
<v Speaker 2>political Insiders panel, Bill Shotton's former chief of staff and

0:34:09.000 --> 0:34:12.520
<v Speaker 2>now gxostrategy is director Cameron Milner and Sky News host

0:34:12.560 --> 0:34:13.240
<v Speaker 2>kayleab Bond.

0:34:13.480 --> 0:34:14.840
<v Speaker 1>Welcome to you both.

0:34:15.400 --> 0:34:19.279
<v Speaker 2>So, Cameron, this is fascinating because this poll is predicting

0:34:19.800 --> 0:34:23.360
<v Speaker 2>that the Liberals could win back seats in the outer

0:34:24.280 --> 0:34:28.200
<v Speaker 2>suburban regional area, including Robertson and Gilmour in New South

0:34:28.239 --> 0:34:33.400
<v Speaker 2>Wales lines in Tasmania. But they're saying that the Liberals

0:34:33.440 --> 0:34:36.160
<v Speaker 2>aren't strong enough to win back the Teal.

0:34:36.040 --> 0:34:37.320
<v Speaker 1>Seats that they lost.

0:34:37.440 --> 0:34:42.160
<v Speaker 2>So based on this, Peter Darton's prospects aren't looking great

0:34:42.200 --> 0:34:43.000
<v Speaker 2>at the next election.

0:34:43.400 --> 0:34:47.200
<v Speaker 11>What do you think, Well, I think it's very true.

0:34:47.200 --> 0:34:49.279
<v Speaker 11>I think we are heading towards a minority government given

0:34:49.320 --> 0:34:51.800
<v Speaker 11>the trajectory of the Albanese government. And let's not forget

0:34:51.800 --> 0:34:54.680
<v Speaker 11>that Gillard and Swann took a much larger RUD majority

0:34:55.000 --> 0:34:57.319
<v Speaker 11>and destroyed that and created a minority government in twenty ten,

0:34:57.400 --> 0:34:59.919
<v Speaker 11>so Lava knows how to do this with the first term.

0:35:00.560 --> 0:35:03.360
<v Speaker 11>But what a horror show. What a horror show we're contemplating.

0:35:03.360 --> 0:35:06.960
<v Speaker 11>I mean, can you imagine the marriage of labor after

0:35:06.960 --> 0:35:08.520
<v Speaker 11>the next election if this is the case. The groom

0:35:08.560 --> 0:35:11.520
<v Speaker 11>there's Albow, Penny Wong's the best man, the blushing and

0:35:11.560 --> 0:35:14.080
<v Speaker 11>bearded bride and bands there at the altar, you know,

0:35:14.320 --> 0:35:17.279
<v Speaker 11>with the Teals being that, you know, the maids of honor.

0:35:17.320 --> 0:35:19.200
<v Speaker 11>I mean, it would be a horror show for Australia

0:35:19.400 --> 0:35:21.200
<v Speaker 11>in the midst of a cost of living crisis. So

0:35:21.719 --> 0:35:24.200
<v Speaker 11>let's hope that's not going to happen, But Albo would

0:35:24.239 --> 0:35:26.920
<v Speaker 11>be very happy because he'd be a promise suit without

0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:28.960
<v Speaker 11>having to do any more than he's already doing, and

0:35:29.120 --> 0:35:31.840
<v Speaker 11>they'd be perfectly perfect for Alba. So no threat to

0:35:31.880 --> 0:35:34.080
<v Speaker 11>alban He's been Prime Minister in I'm already government. Just

0:35:34.120 --> 0:35:34.920
<v Speaker 11>the rest of Australia.

0:35:36.040 --> 0:35:36.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Caleb.

0:35:36.960 --> 0:35:39.880
<v Speaker 2>Look, it is going to be a tough ask for

0:35:39.960 --> 0:35:43.399
<v Speaker 2>the Coalition to claw back the nineteen seats that they

0:35:43.480 --> 0:35:47.440
<v Speaker 2>need to win majority government. But I do think that

0:35:47.520 --> 0:35:50.520
<v Speaker 2>there are shortcomings with polling, particularly when it comes to

0:35:50.560 --> 0:35:53.720
<v Speaker 2>the Teal seats. You know, the emergence of the Teals

0:35:53.840 --> 0:35:56.200
<v Speaker 2>are really a new trend at the last election, so

0:35:56.600 --> 0:36:01.400
<v Speaker 2>it might not capture whether or not people have tied

0:36:01.480 --> 0:36:04.680
<v Speaker 2>of the tials. And you know, partly the reason people

0:36:04.800 --> 0:36:07.880
<v Speaker 2>in at least in wealthier seats embrace the tials is

0:36:07.920 --> 0:36:10.720
<v Speaker 2>because they were turned off Scott Morrison at the last election.

0:36:10.800 --> 0:36:12.920
<v Speaker 2>They didn't want to vote for Morrison, but they weren't

0:36:12.920 --> 0:36:14.120
<v Speaker 2>prepared to vote for Labor.

0:36:14.239 --> 0:36:17.000
<v Speaker 1>So I think you might see some of these seats

0:36:17.400 --> 0:36:18.480
<v Speaker 1>return to the Coalition.

0:36:18.840 --> 0:36:22.080
<v Speaker 12>What do you think potentially My feeling is that the

0:36:22.160 --> 0:36:25.440
<v Speaker 12>Teals haven't had their day. Yet we can't also forget

0:36:25.480 --> 0:36:28.520
<v Speaker 12>that part of the Till phenomenon, beyond, of course the

0:36:28.960 --> 0:36:32.759
<v Speaker 12>moneyed up Champagne socialists who voted for the Teals, is

0:36:32.760 --> 0:36:34.880
<v Speaker 12>that the demographics in a lot of these seats have

0:36:34.920 --> 0:36:38.560
<v Speaker 12>also changed. They have a much higher proportion of renters

0:36:38.600 --> 0:36:40.480
<v Speaker 12>than they used to because you've had a lot of

0:36:40.520 --> 0:36:44.080
<v Speaker 12>large properties that have been subdivided and turned into apartments, etc.

0:36:44.440 --> 0:36:46.920
<v Speaker 12>So you still have those rich types, but you also

0:36:47.040 --> 0:36:49.839
<v Speaker 12>have a much larger cohort of renters who are more

0:36:49.960 --> 0:36:52.520
<v Speaker 12>likely to vote for a left wing candidate any way,

0:36:52.560 --> 0:36:55.600
<v Speaker 12>and then we know how the preferences will flow after that.

0:36:56.080 --> 0:36:58.520
<v Speaker 12>Given the nineteen seats, as you said, that the coalition

0:36:58.600 --> 0:37:00.840
<v Speaker 12>would need to claw back in order to form government,

0:37:01.360 --> 0:37:06.480
<v Speaker 12>it's basically a statistical impossibility. The government has a majority

0:37:06.640 --> 0:37:10.400
<v Speaker 12>of only two or three seats, so it is highly

0:37:10.560 --> 0:37:12.680
<v Speaker 12>likely that that will be lost and they will go

0:37:12.760 --> 0:37:15.279
<v Speaker 12>into minority. That is what I have been saying for

0:37:15.360 --> 0:37:17.839
<v Speaker 12>quite some time will happen, and then it's just a

0:37:17.840 --> 0:37:21.000
<v Speaker 12>matter of which independence they get on board. I haven't

0:37:21.040 --> 0:37:23.120
<v Speaker 12>gone to check what the odds are on sports better

0:37:23.200 --> 0:37:26.240
<v Speaker 12>any of the bookies yet, but that would be my bet.

0:37:26.320 --> 0:37:29.640
<v Speaker 12>I reckon a minority government formed by Labor because the

0:37:29.680 --> 0:37:32.080
<v Speaker 12>problem for the coalition is, let's say they craw back

0:37:32.160 --> 0:37:34.520
<v Speaker 12>five or six seats, which would be a pretty good result,

0:37:34.800 --> 0:37:37.719
<v Speaker 12>they then still need a huge number of people on

0:37:37.760 --> 0:37:40.360
<v Speaker 12>the cross bench in order to get them over the line.

0:37:40.440 --> 0:37:41.520
<v Speaker 12>And I just can't see.

0:37:41.360 --> 0:37:42.080
<v Speaker 1>That happening now.

0:37:42.360 --> 0:37:45.200
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, well, there's still a long way to go, potentially

0:37:45.400 --> 0:37:49.280
<v Speaker 2>up to a year, so anything could happen now. Earlier

0:37:49.360 --> 0:37:51.560
<v Speaker 2>in the show and the last segment, we were talking

0:37:51.600 --> 0:37:55.520
<v Speaker 2>about how Andrew Anthony Albanezi is proud of the fact

0:37:55.560 --> 0:37:58.160
<v Speaker 2>that he hasn't lost a minister in his first term

0:37:58.160 --> 0:38:01.840
<v Speaker 2>as PM, and he wants the perception of stability leading into.

0:38:01.600 --> 0:38:02.320
<v Speaker 1>The next election.

0:38:02.440 --> 0:38:05.160
<v Speaker 2>And you know this is partly why he hasn't sacked

0:38:05.239 --> 0:38:09.080
<v Speaker 2>Andrew Giles, even though the reports today are that Giles

0:38:09.120 --> 0:38:13.040
<v Speaker 2>allowed a child rapist to remain in Australia thanks to

0:38:13.080 --> 0:38:17.480
<v Speaker 2>his nonsensical direction ninety nine. But Cameron Milner, there's another

0:38:17.719 --> 0:38:20.880
<v Speaker 2>reason as well that Albanize hasn't moved on Andrew Giles.

0:38:20.960 --> 0:38:23.160
<v Speaker 2>And I bet you can explain it to us. You

0:38:23.239 --> 0:38:25.480
<v Speaker 2>would know it more than most. It's that Giles is

0:38:25.520 --> 0:38:29.719
<v Speaker 2>one of his factional heavyweights. It's one of his numbers men.

0:38:30.000 --> 0:38:32.840
<v Speaker 2>You know, tell us about whether you think this is why,

0:38:33.760 --> 0:38:37.400
<v Speaker 2>at least partly why Albanize would be protecting Andrew Giles

0:38:37.440 --> 0:38:41.520
<v Speaker 2>despite he's repeated and proven incompetence. And I think we've

0:38:42.040 --> 0:38:45.239
<v Speaker 2>just lost and now he's back. We've got Karen Milner back.

0:38:45.960 --> 0:38:48.319
<v Speaker 2>I think we've we've got you back, Cameron Hope.

0:38:48.360 --> 0:38:51.840
<v Speaker 1>So yeah, all right, well I can hear you, yes, yeah.

0:38:51.640 --> 0:38:56.000
<v Speaker 2>Okay, we'll tell us about Andrew Giles been one of

0:38:56.120 --> 0:38:58.279
<v Speaker 2>Albo's factional men.

0:38:59.360 --> 0:39:02.520
<v Speaker 11>Well, is definitely an Albanista. That's the only possible reason

0:39:02.520 --> 0:39:05.080
<v Speaker 11>for his survival. But the second reason is the worst

0:39:05.120 --> 0:39:07.040
<v Speaker 11>kept secret in Canberra, is that Albanize is going to

0:39:07.080 --> 0:39:10.200
<v Speaker 11>have a minister or reshuffle. This guy needs to refresh

0:39:10.200 --> 0:39:12.160
<v Speaker 11>with his numbers. So Albot's going to have a ministry

0:39:12.239 --> 0:39:15.440
<v Speaker 11>or reshuffle very soon. And I think in that stage,

0:39:15.680 --> 0:39:17.640
<v Speaker 11>Giles if we move sideways and put in a different

0:39:17.640 --> 0:39:21.040
<v Speaker 11>portfolio to save the embarrassment, but he'll still be a minister.

0:39:21.400 --> 0:39:23.799
<v Speaker 11>And then people like Andrew Charlton or Gillian Hill who's

0:39:23.840 --> 0:39:28.200
<v Speaker 11>very ambitious, they'll be promoted into the ministry to refresh

0:39:28.200 --> 0:39:30.520
<v Speaker 11>the ministry. So I think Albo's is waiting for the

0:39:30.560 --> 0:39:33.839
<v Speaker 11>minister a reshuffle which is coming to refresh his own

0:39:33.920 --> 0:39:34.880
<v Speaker 11>numbers in Canberra.

0:39:36.640 --> 0:39:38.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean it's extraordinary.

0:39:38.239 --> 0:39:40.759
<v Speaker 2>I think you know, as much as I on this

0:39:40.840 --> 0:39:44.120
<v Speaker 2>show care strongly about the anti seminism crisis, and we

0:39:44.239 --> 0:39:46.840
<v Speaker 2>talk talk about it every night. Caleb, you know we

0:39:46.880 --> 0:39:51.160
<v Speaker 2>will do we will do. Yes, thank you Cameron. But Caleb,

0:39:51.320 --> 0:39:56.120
<v Speaker 2>to perhaps mainstream Australians, it's stories like this that the

0:39:56.160 --> 0:39:59.319
<v Speaker 2>minister allowed a child rapist to stay in Australia that

0:39:59.600 --> 0:40:02.880
<v Speaker 2>really cut through and are own example of the government's

0:40:02.920 --> 0:40:05.040
<v Speaker 2>and competence most certainly.

0:40:05.040 --> 0:40:07.680
<v Speaker 12>And I know mister Giles is generally pretty useless, but

0:40:07.719 --> 0:40:09.959
<v Speaker 12>I'd be checking where he was about two minutes ago

0:40:10.000 --> 0:40:11.960
<v Speaker 12>when Cameron cut out, because I think he might have

0:40:12.280 --> 0:40:14.600
<v Speaker 12>pulled the plug to prevent what he knew was coming.

0:40:14.880 --> 0:40:16.520
<v Speaker 1>But not that part.

0:40:17.880 --> 0:40:23.400
<v Speaker 12>Let's talk about why this happened. This Directive ninety nine

0:40:23.440 --> 0:40:27.040
<v Speaker 12>was essentially because New Zealand and its Prime Minister at

0:40:27.040 --> 0:40:31.280
<v Speaker 12>the time, Jacinda R. Dune, was herself facing an election

0:40:31.520 --> 0:40:34.360
<v Speaker 12>in New Zealand, which he won in twenty twenty. But

0:40:34.440 --> 0:40:36.640
<v Speaker 12>we know what happened to her after that, and she

0:40:36.880 --> 0:40:40.239
<v Speaker 12>was taking this hardline at the time that Australia was,

0:40:40.440 --> 0:40:43.720
<v Speaker 12>you know, dumping its criminals on New Zealand. You're trying

0:40:43.760 --> 0:40:47.240
<v Speaker 12>to deport these New Zealand citizens back to our country

0:40:47.360 --> 0:40:50.000
<v Speaker 12>even though they've lived their whole lives in your country.

0:40:50.200 --> 0:40:52.680
<v Speaker 12>They're your problem and you should deal with it now.

0:40:52.680 --> 0:40:55.920
<v Speaker 12>Scott Morrison, to his credit, did not cave into that

0:40:55.960 --> 0:40:58.880
<v Speaker 12>and as good as said get stuffed. But soon after

0:40:59.040 --> 0:41:02.920
<v Speaker 12>Alberanizi became Prime Minister he said, oh, we'll take a

0:41:02.920 --> 0:41:04.799
<v Speaker 12>look at this. There's something we can do about this,

0:41:04.840 --> 0:41:07.839
<v Speaker 12>and sure enough, in January last year that's exactly what

0:41:07.920 --> 0:41:10.960
<v Speaker 12>they did. That directive was sent out to say that

0:41:11.000 --> 0:41:13.560
<v Speaker 12>people who are not citizens but have lived a significant

0:41:13.560 --> 0:41:16.280
<v Speaker 12>portion of their lives in this country should be allowed

0:41:16.280 --> 0:41:19.839
<v Speaker 12>to remain. Now you saw Richard Miles today say the

0:41:19.880 --> 0:41:23.160
<v Speaker 12>government tried to deport this fella and then a decision

0:41:23.320 --> 0:41:27.640
<v Speaker 12>of an independent body sorry overturned that. Well, no, no,

0:41:27.840 --> 0:41:30.960
<v Speaker 12>If it weren't for the decision of Andrew Giles that

0:41:31.000 --> 0:41:33.880
<v Speaker 12>people who have lived a significant portion of their lives

0:41:34.040 --> 0:41:37.480
<v Speaker 12>should not be deported, he would have been deported. The

0:41:37.520 --> 0:41:40.480
<v Speaker 12>government's talking out of both sides of their mouths and

0:41:40.520 --> 0:41:41.040
<v Speaker 12>claiming it.

0:41:41.080 --> 0:41:41.880
<v Speaker 1>Wasn't their fault.

0:41:42.160 --> 0:41:44.360
<v Speaker 12>As a direct result of their decision.

0:41:45.200 --> 0:41:48.440
<v Speaker 2>Now, just before we go, Ukraine has been left waiting

0:41:48.480 --> 0:41:52.360
<v Speaker 2>for six months for a response from the Labor government

0:41:52.760 --> 0:41:56.560
<v Speaker 2>after the Ukrainian ambassador requested an urgent shipment of coal

0:41:57.040 --> 0:42:00.400
<v Speaker 2>as its power plants are targeted by Russia. Now the

0:42:00.440 --> 0:42:03.920
<v Speaker 2>Age Today reporting that Ukraine lodged the request in December,

0:42:04.280 --> 0:42:08.279
<v Speaker 2>with a follow up written to Foreign Minister Pennywog just

0:42:08.400 --> 0:42:13.120
<v Speaker 2>earlier this month. Cameron, you know that this clearly seems

0:42:13.160 --> 0:42:15.840
<v Speaker 2>there are so many examples of this, how the Albanizi

0:42:15.880 --> 0:42:19.160
<v Speaker 2>government has let Ukraine down over and over.

0:42:19.040 --> 0:42:24.239
<v Speaker 11>Again they have, and it's been terrible what we've done

0:42:24.239 --> 0:42:25.719
<v Speaker 11>in terms of Ukraine, but it's also terrible what we

0:42:25.840 --> 0:42:28.319
<v Speaker 11>have done with China as well. I mean, Penny Wong

0:42:28.440 --> 0:42:31.680
<v Speaker 11>is completely distracted with winning a PLA award for the

0:42:31.680 --> 0:42:35.319
<v Speaker 11>Palestinian Liberation Army at the hotline her mass you know,

0:42:35.560 --> 0:42:40.080
<v Speaker 11>I mean, this is a terrible woman distracted by political

0:42:40.120 --> 0:42:43.600
<v Speaker 11>movement in the Middle East and everywhere else, couldn't care

0:42:43.680 --> 0:42:45.280
<v Speaker 11>less about and that's terrible for Australia.

0:42:45.840 --> 0:42:46.160
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:42:46.239 --> 0:42:49.040
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And just before I get sued by Penny Wong,

0:42:49.160 --> 0:42:52.560
<v Speaker 2>of course she claims. She says she doesn't support her

0:42:52.600 --> 0:42:55.919
<v Speaker 2>MASS or the PLO or any other terrorist group.

0:42:56.000 --> 0:42:58.280
<v Speaker 1>She would be arguing that she Mass.

0:42:58.040 --> 0:43:00.840
<v Speaker 11>Certainly supports Penny Wong has put.

0:43:00.719 --> 0:43:03.800
<v Speaker 1>Out statements supporting moves that Pennyone has made. That is true.

0:43:03.920 --> 0:43:06.680
<v Speaker 2>All right, Cameron, Mina, Caleb, thank you both very much

0:43:06.680 --> 0:43:09.439
<v Speaker 2>for your time. Now after the break the train wreck

0:43:09.520 --> 0:43:12.839
<v Speaker 2>speech that has voters concerned that Joe Biden isn't fit

0:43:13.160 --> 0:43:19.960
<v Speaker 2>for another four years in office. Koshagada will join me next.

0:43:22.120 --> 0:43:25.200
<v Speaker 2>We're just five months out from the election. A Gaffield

0:43:25.239 --> 0:43:29.360
<v Speaker 2>speech has intensified criticism that President Joe Biden is not

0:43:29.560 --> 0:43:31.920
<v Speaker 2>fit for another four years in office.

0:43:31.960 --> 0:43:32.520
<v Speaker 1>Have a look.

0:43:34.080 --> 0:43:37.239
<v Speaker 13>And when I was Vice president, thanks were kind of

0:43:37.280 --> 0:43:42.239
<v Speaker 13>bad during the pandemic. And what happened was Rock said,

0:43:42.280 --> 0:43:46.399
<v Speaker 13>and he'd go to Detroit and help fix it. Well,

0:43:46.440 --> 0:43:48.600
<v Speaker 13>poor Mary spend more time with me than he ever

0:43:48.640 --> 0:43:51.239
<v Speaker 13>thought he was going to have you well.

0:43:51.280 --> 0:43:55.400
<v Speaker 2>The White House reportedly issued nine corrections following that speech

0:43:55.440 --> 0:43:57.640
<v Speaker 2>for the Black Civil Rights group. It was filled with

0:43:57.800 --> 0:44:02.080
<v Speaker 2>mispronunciations and factual errors. Joining me now, Sky News contributed

0:44:02.160 --> 0:44:04.919
<v Speaker 2>Kosha Gata Koisha, thank you very much for your time.

0:44:04.920 --> 0:44:09.879
<v Speaker 1>Look what were some of the errors here, it kind

0:44:09.880 --> 0:44:10.760
<v Speaker 1>of ran the gamut.

0:44:10.880 --> 0:44:13.560
<v Speaker 14>Some of them were you could be charitable and say

0:44:13.600 --> 0:44:16.319
<v Speaker 14>that he just misspoke, and they were relatively minors. Some,

0:44:16.400 --> 0:44:18.759
<v Speaker 14>as you say, were quite factual, like, for example, he

0:44:18.840 --> 0:44:21.799
<v Speaker 14>said the average American household can expect to save eight

0:44:21.880 --> 0:44:24.359
<v Speaker 14>hundred thousand dollars a year, when the fact was eight

0:44:24.480 --> 0:44:26.880
<v Speaker 14>hundred dollars a year from some amendments they made to

0:44:27.360 --> 0:44:30.920
<v Speaker 14>the government run healthcare Obamacare system, so that one was

0:44:30.960 --> 0:44:35.040
<v Speaker 14>kind of funny. And then some just unfortunate use of words,

0:44:35.040 --> 0:44:38.840
<v Speaker 14>such as, instead of an insurrectionist for the January sixth issue,

0:44:39.280 --> 0:44:42.160
<v Speaker 14>he used something else like erectionist or something that was

0:44:42.480 --> 0:44:44.080
<v Speaker 14>sad and funny. But I think you know, all it

0:44:44.120 --> 0:44:48.120
<v Speaker 14>does is this advances the opinion that everybody has that he's.

0:44:47.920 --> 0:44:50.279
<v Speaker 1>Not fit cognitively right now.

0:44:50.280 --> 0:44:52.640
<v Speaker 14>And it just also advanced the speculation of are they

0:44:52.640 --> 0:44:54.200
<v Speaker 14>going to pull a SWITCHARU or are they going to

0:44:54.320 --> 0:44:55.880
<v Speaker 14>go with him?

0:44:55.960 --> 0:44:58.640
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's amazing they're leaving it so late, but again

0:44:58.680 --> 0:45:02.360
<v Speaker 2>it could still happen. Trump, though, also received a frosty

0:45:02.440 --> 0:45:06.120
<v Speaker 2>reception and a major gathering of libertarians in Washington, DC.

0:45:06.280 --> 0:45:10.000
<v Speaker 2>Here he is now I think you should nominate me,

0:45:10.239 --> 0:45:13.840
<v Speaker 2>or at least vote for me and we should win together.

0:45:16.440 --> 0:45:20.520
<v Speaker 2>So you can hear the booing there. He left after

0:45:20.680 --> 0:45:24.200
<v Speaker 2>just thirty four minutes. This is unusual for Trump. Was

0:45:24.239 --> 0:45:26.720
<v Speaker 2>it the area, the venue, what happened?

0:45:28.880 --> 0:45:32.080
<v Speaker 14>I think it was the party, the Libertarian convention that

0:45:32.120 --> 0:45:34.480
<v Speaker 14>he spoke to. It was definitely a mixed reception, the

0:45:34.560 --> 0:45:37.120
<v Speaker 14>resumpturing a lot of booing and heckling, as you mentioned.

0:45:37.560 --> 0:45:39.719
<v Speaker 14>But I think what's important to remember is who the

0:45:39.840 --> 0:45:43.960
<v Speaker 14>intended recipients are and were for him in this. It's

0:45:43.960 --> 0:45:47.160
<v Speaker 14>not the diehard libertarians. He would not be appealing to them,

0:45:47.800 --> 0:45:50.640
<v Speaker 14>for example, just his spending record among other issues. Those

0:45:50.680 --> 0:45:54.320
<v Speaker 14>are people who are really purest about purists, about limited,

0:45:54.400 --> 0:45:57.040
<v Speaker 14>extremely constricted government in all aspects of life.

0:45:57.360 --> 0:45:58.359
<v Speaker 1>He wouldn't be there, guy.

0:45:58.719 --> 0:46:01.800
<v Speaker 14>But who he is appealing to, not just those attending

0:46:01.840 --> 0:46:03.879
<v Speaker 14>in person, but the tens of millions of people who

0:46:04.280 --> 0:46:07.040
<v Speaker 14>view speeches that he gives any time anywhere, is the

0:46:07.080 --> 0:46:11.000
<v Speaker 14>independent minded voters who are dissatisfied with both sides and

0:46:11.040 --> 0:46:15.040
<v Speaker 14>are maybe considering an independent vote to an RFKJ or

0:46:15.120 --> 0:46:16.600
<v Speaker 14>Jill Stein or somebody like that.

0:46:16.600 --> 0:46:17.600
<v Speaker 1>That's who he's courting.

0:46:17.880 --> 0:46:20.200
<v Speaker 14>And one other observation I'd make too, is he is

0:46:20.320 --> 0:46:22.480
<v Speaker 14>playing on offense right now, where he's going into the

0:46:22.520 --> 0:46:25.760
<v Speaker 14>Lions den of crowds that would not historically be favorable

0:46:25.800 --> 0:46:28.279
<v Speaker 14>to him like these guys, or he went into the

0:46:28.320 --> 0:46:31.680
<v Speaker 14>South Bronx, which is a Democrat stronghold. No Republican candidate

0:46:31.680 --> 0:46:33.759
<v Speaker 14>has been there for forty years, so he's doing that,

0:46:33.840 --> 0:46:36.280
<v Speaker 14>whereas you see the other side seems to be on defense,

0:46:36.280 --> 0:46:39.160
<v Speaker 14>where they're also speaking to the black vote in Detroit

0:46:39.200 --> 0:46:42.360
<v Speaker 14>and other places, which is something that typically they wouldn't

0:46:42.360 --> 0:46:44.080
<v Speaker 14>want to be spending their time doing because it should

0:46:44.080 --> 0:46:44.439
<v Speaker 14>be a lock.

0:46:45.160 --> 0:46:46.880
<v Speaker 2>And do you think there is a chance that Trump

0:46:46.960 --> 0:46:50.279
<v Speaker 2>could pick up some of those areas that haven't traditionally

0:46:50.360 --> 0:46:53.959
<v Speaker 2>voted for Republicans or is this just a strategy game.

0:46:56.200 --> 0:46:58.759
<v Speaker 14>I think so, because these elections are won and lost

0:46:58.760 --> 0:47:01.160
<v Speaker 14>on razor thin margins. So it's coming down to ten

0:47:01.200 --> 0:47:04.120
<v Speaker 14>thousand votes twenty thousand votes in select areas, as you know,

0:47:04.200 --> 0:47:06.839
<v Speaker 14>in a country with three hundred plus million people, so

0:47:06.840 --> 0:47:08.520
<v Speaker 14>it really will make a difference if he can peel

0:47:08.520 --> 0:47:10.680
<v Speaker 14>away a little bit more. All eyes seem to be

0:47:10.719 --> 0:47:13.239
<v Speaker 14>on the black vote because he got eight percent of

0:47:13.280 --> 0:47:17.000
<v Speaker 14>them in sixteen twelve percent in twenty twenty, so he's

0:47:17.040 --> 0:47:20.919
<v Speaker 14>grown his share and that those are numbers that Republicans

0:47:21.000 --> 0:47:23.560
<v Speaker 14>have not seen since Ronald Reagan forty years ago. So

0:47:23.560 --> 0:47:25.520
<v Speaker 14>if he can even peel off a little bit more,

0:47:25.680 --> 0:47:30.000
<v Speaker 14>that puts the Democrats on defense. It's not that Republicans

0:47:30.040 --> 0:47:31.880
<v Speaker 14>are going to take the black vote, but they could

0:47:32.120 --> 0:47:34.359
<v Speaker 14>stye me the other side. And then also, I think

0:47:34.400 --> 0:47:38.680
<v Speaker 14>appealing to these libertarian minded independence not the hardcore libertarians,

0:47:38.960 --> 0:47:41.000
<v Speaker 14>is another one where if he could peel back a

0:47:41.000 --> 0:47:44.080
<v Speaker 14>little bit ten thy twelve thousand folks in those battleground states,

0:47:44.120 --> 0:47:45.000
<v Speaker 14>it could make the difference.

0:47:45.640 --> 0:47:48.560
<v Speaker 2>Look, a lot of commentitis have suggested that Trump would

0:47:48.560 --> 0:47:52.200
<v Speaker 2>easily win against Biden given his age and incompetence, but

0:47:52.239 --> 0:47:55.239
<v Speaker 2>it seems like the polls have them a lot cloiser

0:47:55.280 --> 0:47:56.360
<v Speaker 2>than we expected.

0:47:59.160 --> 0:48:02.560
<v Speaker 14>Indeed, I think, you know, one thing, polls are polls,

0:48:02.600 --> 0:48:05.440
<v Speaker 14>and they haven't exactly covered themselves in glory the polling

0:48:05.480 --> 0:48:08.200
<v Speaker 14>industry in recent times, so we take it as an indicator,

0:48:08.200 --> 0:48:10.839
<v Speaker 14>but with a huge rain of salt. The second thing, too, though,

0:48:10.920 --> 0:48:14.760
<v Speaker 14>is that US elections are increasingly about the machinery because

0:48:14.800 --> 0:48:18.120
<v Speaker 14>it rather than the candidates, because we don't have mandatory voting.

0:48:18.480 --> 0:48:20.920
<v Speaker 14>So these elections are won and lost ultimately on turnout

0:48:21.000 --> 0:48:23.279
<v Speaker 14>and who has the better apparatus on the ground, and

0:48:23.320 --> 0:48:25.879
<v Speaker 14>they can go out into those specific counties and battle

0:48:25.920 --> 0:48:28.960
<v Speaker 14>ground states and get voters who don't vote typically to

0:48:29.000 --> 0:48:30.920
<v Speaker 14>come out, and when it comes to that, the domoates

0:48:30.920 --> 0:48:32.560
<v Speaker 14>just seem to do better, which is why you see

0:48:32.560 --> 0:48:33.080
<v Speaker 14>that tightening.

0:48:33.360 --> 0:48:36.319
<v Speaker 2>Thanks so much for your time, Koshagada. Now I'll see

0:48:36.360 --> 0:48:38.480
<v Speaker 2>you all tomorrow night at eight o'clock. Don't forget, Josh

0:48:38.560 --> 0:48:41.000
<v Speaker 2>Fridenberg's documentary is on at seven PM.

0:48:41.120 --> 0:48:43.000
<v Speaker 1>All looking forward to that. Here's Paul Mari