1 00:00:03,290 --> 00:00:06,560 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear and Greed Daily Interview. I'm Sean Aylmer. 2 00:00:06,890 --> 00:00:09,740 Sean Aylmer: It's a fascinating time to be managing a super fund 3 00:00:09,740 --> 00:00:12,920 Sean Aylmer: in Australia. They've benefited from the economic and share market 4 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:15,739 Sean Aylmer: recovery to deliver some of the best returns to members 5 00:00:15,950 --> 00:00:19,460 Sean Aylmer: in years. Increasingly, we're seeing more funds as major players 6 00:00:19,460 --> 00:00:22,820 Sean Aylmer: in the purchase of large assets, particularly in infrastructure, and 7 00:00:22,820 --> 00:00:25,340 Sean Aylmer: with the superannuation guarantee now at 10 per cent, the 8 00:00:25,340 --> 00:00:28,160 Sean Aylmer: super funds have more money to invest. But at a 9 00:00:28,160 --> 00:00:31,490 Sean Aylmer: very personal level, superannuation has played a key role in 10 00:00:31,490 --> 00:00:34,850 Sean Aylmer: helping people get through the pandemic, with around three million 11 00:00:34,850 --> 00:00:39,320 Sean Aylmer: Australians accessing their super early. At the same time, the Your Future, 12 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:42,800 Sean Aylmer: Your Super reforms introduced this year have made some significant 13 00:00:42,800 --> 00:00:45,160 Sean Aylmer: changes to the industry, not all of them welcomed by 14 00:00:45,170 --> 00:00:48,200 Sean Aylmer: the funds. Over the last 20 years, CareSuper has been 15 00:00:48,200 --> 00:00:51,170 Sean Aylmer: one of Australia's top performing super funds. It was founded 16 00:00:51,170 --> 00:00:55,190 Sean Aylmer: in 1986 to manage the super of office-based employees and 17 00:00:55,190 --> 00:00:57,740 Sean Aylmer: is now the largest fund for professionals. It's also a 18 00:00:57,740 --> 00:01:00,260 Sean Aylmer: great supporter of Fear and Greed. Julie Lander is the 19 00:01:00,260 --> 00:01:02,670 Sean Aylmer: CEO of CareSuper. Julie, welcome to Fear and Greed. 20 00:01:03,110 --> 00:01:03,770 Julie Lander: Good morning. 21 00:01:04,459 --> 00:01:07,400 Sean Aylmer: The super landscape is a tricky one to get your 22 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:09,250 Sean Aylmer: head around when you're not in it day to day. 23 00:01:09,260 --> 00:01:11,720 Sean Aylmer: Where does CareSuper fit into that landscape? 24 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:15,740 Julie Lander: Well, you've introduced us very well. We've been around for 25 00:01:15,740 --> 00:01:19,760 Julie Lander: about thirty-five years and we do focus on the super 26 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:24,289 Julie Lander: needs of professionals and office-based people, although right now we 27 00:01:24,290 --> 00:01:27,290 Julie Lander: know that many of our members could be working from 28 00:01:27,290 --> 00:01:28,130 Julie Lander: the kitchen table. 29 00:01:29,540 --> 00:01:30,110 Sean Aylmer: Indeed. 30 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:34,940 Julie Lander: Our focus has remained unchanged over the last thirty-five years. It has, 31 00:01:34,940 --> 00:01:37,610 Julie Lander: and always will be to support our members to achieve 32 00:01:37,610 --> 00:01:40,910 Julie Lander: their best possible futures and really to make a difference 33 00:01:40,910 --> 00:01:44,000 Julie Lander: to their lives. We hopefully spend quite a lot of 34 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:47,990 Julie Lander: time in retirement and people need an income. So that's 35 00:01:47,990 --> 00:01:51,110 Julie Lander: what super is all about. And of course, at CareSuper we want 36 00:01:51,110 --> 00:01:56,360 Julie Lander: to maximise that income and make sure that people have 37 00:01:56,360 --> 00:02:01,280 Julie Lander: choices in retirement and can enjoy the lifestyle they've dreamt about. 38 00:02:01,730 --> 00:02:04,040 Sean Aylmer: So how many members have you got and how much funds 39 00:02:04,040 --> 00:02:04,650 Sean Aylmer: under management? 40 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:08,630 Julie Lander: Well, at this point we've got almost 20 billion dollars 41 00:02:08,630 --> 00:02:12,559 Julie Lander: in funds under management and about 220,000 members. 42 00:02:13,340 --> 00:02:13,520 Sean Aylmer: Wow. 43 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:17,780 Julie Lander: So, sort of a medium-sized fund. It sounds large, but we're medium-sized 44 00:02:18,290 --> 00:02:21,290 Julie Lander: and that means we're really able to be agile in 45 00:02:21,290 --> 00:02:25,790 Julie Lander: the market, execute an active investment strategy. But we're big 46 00:02:25,790 --> 00:02:28,100 Julie Lander: enough to make a difference and really to deliver for 47 00:02:28,100 --> 00:02:31,040 Julie Lander: our members. But we're small enough to care about them, too, 48 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:34,340 Julie Lander: and understand them and how they think and how we 49 00:02:34,340 --> 00:02:36,079 Julie Lander: can make their lives better. 50 00:02:36,500 --> 00:02:39,080 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so you're talking about the market. There's been lots 51 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:42,709 Sean Aylmer: of mergers in recent years and, certainly, regulators are pushing 52 00:02:42,710 --> 00:02:46,760 Sean Aylmer: down that path. Does being a medium-sized fund protect you from that? 53 00:02:46,790 --> 00:02:48,620 Sean Aylmer: Do you think there will be more mergers in the 54 00:02:48,620 --> 00:02:51,519 Sean Aylmer: industry going forward? How do you see that landscape playing out? 55 00:02:52,470 --> 00:02:55,190 Julie Lander: Yes, there certainly has been a lot of merger activity over the 56 00:02:55,190 --> 00:02:59,150 Julie Lander: last couple of years, actually, and we've seen the emergence 57 00:02:59,150 --> 00:03:02,870 Julie Lander: of what we might call mega-funds. With the introduction of 58 00:03:02,870 --> 00:03:08,150 Julie Lander: so much government regulation and different changes and things like that, 59 00:03:08,150 --> 00:03:12,500 Julie Lander: we're probably going to see more mergers over time. But 60 00:03:12,950 --> 00:03:17,390 Julie Lander: I really believe that there's a place for boutique industry 61 00:03:17,389 --> 00:03:22,070 Julie Lander: super funds like CareSuper that have a different value proposition 62 00:03:22,070 --> 00:03:26,660 Julie Lander: to some of those mega-funds. We don't want every fund 63 00:03:26,660 --> 00:03:31,160 Julie Lander: looking the same and being homogeneous. So we really believe 64 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,429 Julie Lander: that a fund of, sort of, CareSuper size, although we've certainly 65 00:03:34,430 --> 00:03:37,369 Julie Lander: got a bit more capacity to grow, has a different 66 00:03:37,370 --> 00:03:40,340 Julie Lander: value proposition in the way it can invest, the way 67 00:03:40,340 --> 00:03:43,940 Julie Lander: it can service its members, understand its members, build affinity 68 00:03:43,940 --> 00:03:47,090 Julie Lander: with them and offer a more personalised service. 69 00:03:47,580 --> 00:03:50,510 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, I often wonder that. So compared to AusSuper (AustralianSuper), which 70 00:03:50,510 --> 00:03:54,020 Sean Aylmer: is the biggest industry fund and it's probably 10 times 71 00:03:54,020 --> 00:03:57,050 Sean Aylmer: your size in funds under management or thereabouts, right? 72 00:03:57,440 --> 00:03:57,640 Julie Lander: Yeah. 73 00:03:57,710 --> 00:04:00,470 Sean Aylmer: The thing I think about those really big ones is 74 00:04:00,470 --> 00:04:04,310 Sean Aylmer: that I'm not sure how they make themselves different. I mean, 75 00:04:04,310 --> 00:04:07,970 Sean Aylmer: their competitive advantage is their size, I suppose. The thing about 76 00:04:07,970 --> 00:04:10,880 Sean Aylmer: medium-sized funds, which I wonder, is it more on the 77 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:13,130 Sean Aylmer: investment side where you can make a real difference, or 78 00:04:13,130 --> 00:04:15,290 Sean Aylmer: do you think it's more on the service of members 79 00:04:15,290 --> 00:04:16,670 Sean Aylmer: side that you can make a real difference? 80 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:22,100 Julie Lander: I think it's both. And funds of all sizes are 81 00:04:22,100 --> 00:04:24,979 Julie Lander: going to exist. And I think really each fund has 82 00:04:24,980 --> 00:04:29,210 Julie Lander: to make the most of its size. But a fund 83 00:04:29,210 --> 00:04:34,430 Julie Lander: the size of CareSuper's can effectively implement an active investment strategy, 84 00:04:34,430 --> 00:04:40,220 Julie Lander: be nimble, take advantage of capacity constrained opportunities and, by 85 00:04:40,220 --> 00:04:43,610 Julie Lander: having that model, we've really been able to demonstrate over 86 00:04:43,610 --> 00:04:48,620 Julie Lander: the long term really strong, risk-adjusted returns and provide a 87 00:04:48,620 --> 00:04:53,599 Julie Lander: smoother ride for members. Those larger funds will do things differently, 88 00:04:53,750 --> 00:04:57,020 Julie Lander: and members should be aware of the differences. They will 89 00:04:57,020 --> 00:05:01,989 Julie Lander: invest differently and they'll probably expect members to deal with 90 00:05:01,990 --> 00:05:06,940 Julie Lander: them electronically more. You have to have a strong electronic 91 00:05:06,940 --> 00:05:10,780 Julie Lander: platform as well, but we're very happy to deal with 92 00:05:10,779 --> 00:05:14,529 Julie Lander: people on a one to one basis personally over the 93 00:05:14,529 --> 00:05:19,750 Julie Lander: phone and we visit workplaces and encourage people to meet 94 00:05:19,750 --> 00:05:23,440 Julie Lander: with us, ideally in a normal world, face to face, 95 00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:25,880 Julie Lander: but otherwise virtually as well. 96 00:05:26,470 --> 00:05:28,480 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Julie. We'll be back in a minute. 97 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:37,540 Sean Aylmer: My guest this morning is Julie Lander, CEO of CareSuper. 98 00:05:37,970 --> 00:05:40,340 Sean Aylmer: Okay now, the market at the moment, there is so 99 00:05:40,339 --> 00:05:43,340 Sean Aylmer: much M&A (Mergers & Acquisitions) activity going on away from the super funds, 100 00:05:43,490 --> 00:05:46,700 Sean Aylmer: but certainly, the super funds are part of that. Why 101 00:05:46,700 --> 00:05:49,970 Sean Aylmer: do you think super funds are becoming more active in 102 00:05:49,970 --> 00:05:52,789 Sean Aylmer: buying some of these assets? And even in terms of 103 00:05:52,790 --> 00:05:56,060 Sean Aylmer: investing in infrastructure, particularly, it seems that all the infrastructure 104 00:05:56,060 --> 00:05:58,310 Sean Aylmer: assets that are up for sale seem to have a 105 00:05:58,310 --> 00:06:01,280 Sean Aylmer: super fund attached to them somewhere along the line. Why 106 00:06:01,279 --> 00:06:04,279 Sean Aylmer: is it that infrastructure is such a good investment for 107 00:06:04,400 --> 00:06:07,850 Sean Aylmer: super funds? Be it direct or via buying on the market. 108 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:14,130 Julie Lander: Infrastructure has become a really important part of our investment program. 109 00:06:14,390 --> 00:06:18,650 Julie Lander: Of course, we invest in listed assets as well, stock market, 110 00:06:18,650 --> 00:06:24,410 Julie Lander: for instance. But the beauty about infrastructure assets is that 111 00:06:24,410 --> 00:06:28,039 Julie Lander: they play the role of being a really good diversifier 112 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:32,450 Julie Lander: to those listed market assets. They're sort of usually less 113 00:06:32,450 --> 00:06:37,100 Julie Lander: volatile than shares. They also have the possibility of achieving 114 00:06:37,100 --> 00:06:42,140 Julie Lander: better risk-adjusted returns than other asset types. And there's a 115 00:06:42,140 --> 00:06:46,130 Julie Lander: view that the trend towards long term ownership of these 116 00:06:46,130 --> 00:06:49,549 Julie Lander: assets ties in with the long term goals of superannuation. 117 00:06:49,910 --> 00:06:53,960 Julie Lander: We are investing really for the long term. Most people 118 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:58,339 Julie Lander: are going in super for 50, 60, 70 years, and we've 119 00:06:58,339 --> 00:07:00,770 Julie Lander: got to look at that long term goal. So these 120 00:07:00,770 --> 00:07:05,630 Julie Lander: sorts of assets provide good, stable returns over the long 121 00:07:05,630 --> 00:07:10,310 Julie Lander: term and are a good diversifier for listed assets that 122 00:07:10,310 --> 00:07:14,330 Julie Lander: can show a lot more volatility, given that they're subject 123 00:07:14,330 --> 00:07:18,140 Julie Lander: to the vagaries of investor sentiment. So the bottom line 124 00:07:18,140 --> 00:07:20,870 Julie Lander: is there are lots of merits to that asset class 125 00:07:21,020 --> 00:07:24,800 Julie Lander: because of the high cash flow and more stable returns 126 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:26,810 Julie Lander: and good long term growth prospects. 127 00:07:27,500 --> 00:07:30,050 Sean Aylmer: Another thing that super funds do for members, which is 128 00:07:30,050 --> 00:07:33,290 Sean Aylmer: more difficult, I think, on an individual basis, is invest 129 00:07:33,290 --> 00:07:36,200 Sean Aylmer: in overseas assets. Do you think that super funds, just 130 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:38,150 Sean Aylmer: because of the weight of money coming into the local market, 131 00:07:38,150 --> 00:07:41,240 Sean Aylmer: they've got to invest it somewhere, will increasingly put money 132 00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:42,410 Sean Aylmer: into overseas assets? 133 00:07:42,950 --> 00:07:48,410 Julie Lander: Australian super funds already invest overseas and overseas funds invest 134 00:07:48,410 --> 00:07:50,810 Julie Lander: in Australia too you might be interested to know. 135 00:07:51,140 --> 00:07:53,989 Sean Aylmer: The Ontario Teachers Fund. We're always hearing about that one. 136 00:07:54,410 --> 00:07:58,160 Julie Lander: Yes. And they're very interested in infrastructure assets, too. 137 00:07:58,240 --> 00:07:58,480 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. 138 00:07:58,880 --> 00:08:02,990 Julie Lander: And the interest in infrastructure assets started a few years ago 139 00:08:02,990 --> 00:08:06,770 Julie Lander: when we saw the privatisation of assets that were previously 140 00:08:06,770 --> 00:08:10,310 Julie Lander: owned by governments. The beauty about this too, I think, 141 00:08:10,310 --> 00:08:14,090 Julie Lander: about Australian funds owning these assets is that they stay 142 00:08:14,090 --> 00:08:17,630 Julie Lander: in Australian hands and that's the role we can play 143 00:08:17,630 --> 00:08:22,160 Julie Lander: in nation-building. So that's really another, I think, strong side 144 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:27,020 Julie Lander: aspect to investing in infrastructure. And of course, our sole 145 00:08:27,020 --> 00:08:31,580 Julie Lander: purpose is to provide strong risk-adjusted returns for members. But 146 00:08:31,580 --> 00:08:33,349 Julie Lander: there is that added benefit of doing it. 147 00:08:34,220 --> 00:08:37,559 Sean Aylmer: Investing overseas is one thing. You're going to invest in Australia. 148 00:08:37,790 --> 00:08:40,760 Sean Aylmer: Is there a risk with so much money flowing around 149 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:45,920 Sean Aylmer: Australia that the fundamental prices of assets will rise too 150 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:49,820 Sean Aylmer: high when not just super funds, obviously all investors are 151 00:08:49,820 --> 00:08:51,800 Sean Aylmer: trying to get their hands on those assets? 152 00:08:52,580 --> 00:08:56,390 Julie Lander: Look, I mean, investing is is a global business. But 153 00:08:56,690 --> 00:09:00,110 Julie Lander: in terms of whether funds could end up paying too 154 00:09:00,110 --> 00:09:02,630 Julie Lander: much for assets, which I think is where you're going. 155 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:04,099 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly it. 156 00:09:04,250 --> 00:09:08,180 Julie Lander: I don't think so. I mean, as professional investors, we 157 00:09:08,179 --> 00:09:11,870 Julie Lander: need to know what is the appropriate price to pay 158 00:09:11,870 --> 00:09:16,040 Julie Lander: for something. And we have to be disciplined about buying 159 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:20,890 Julie Lander: things at the right price, but there is a strong deal flow. 160 00:09:21,179 --> 00:09:24,410 Julie Lander: So there are lots of assets going to come onto 161 00:09:24,410 --> 00:09:26,690 Julie Lander: the market. There are a lot of drivers for that 162 00:09:26,690 --> 00:09:31,280 Julie Lander: because we need to see sort of infrastructure modernisation. There's 163 00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:36,890 Julie Lander: always the scope for infrastructure to be modernised and upgraded. 164 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:40,070 Julie Lander: Even in first world countries, there's a lot of ageing 165 00:09:40,070 --> 00:09:43,760 Julie Lander: of assets and there's always investment needed. With the shift 166 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:47,630 Julie Lander: to decarbonisation of electricity, there's a lot of room for 167 00:09:47,630 --> 00:09:53,929 Julie Lander: investment in the electricity sector to decarbonise it. There's use for 168 00:09:53,929 --> 00:09:57,350 Julie Lander: data and cell towers and things like that. And because 169 00:09:57,350 --> 00:10:00,470 Julie Lander: we're seeing population growth, there's always going to be the 170 00:10:00,470 --> 00:10:04,400 Julie Lander: need for more assets. So in terms of whether there's 171 00:10:04,400 --> 00:10:07,100 Julie Lander: a frenzy or people are going to pay too much 172 00:10:07,100 --> 00:10:11,660 Julie Lander: for assets, I don't think disciplined investors do that. On 173 00:10:11,660 --> 00:10:15,110 Julie Lander: the other hand, there are potentially some sovereign funds that 174 00:10:15,110 --> 00:10:20,120 Julie Lander: may have lower return hurdles and they might have different objectives. 175 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:24,050 Julie Lander: They might pay more for an asset than a super 176 00:10:24,050 --> 00:10:28,339 Julie Lander: fund might. But I think this is also another really 177 00:10:28,340 --> 00:10:34,340 Julie Lander: strong aspect of funds like CareSuper, where people can access 178 00:10:34,550 --> 00:10:38,150 Julie Lander: the benefits of infrastructure, which is really very difficult to 179 00:10:38,150 --> 00:10:39,710 Julie Lander: do as an individual investor. 180 00:10:39,770 --> 00:10:43,160 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, yeah. Just quickly, Your Future, Your Super reforms were 181 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:46,580 Sean Aylmer: introduced into parliament earlier this year. Things like stapling so 182 00:10:46,580 --> 00:10:48,830 Sean Aylmer: you basically have one fund that follows you around from 183 00:10:48,830 --> 00:10:53,420 Sean Aylmer: job to job. The online comparison tool, YourSuper. Annual performance testing. 184 00:10:53,750 --> 00:10:56,000 Sean Aylmer: Duties to ensure super trustees act in the best interests 185 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:59,870 Sean Aylmer: of members. Were they reforms that were needed? Do you welcome the reforms? 186 00:11:00,500 --> 00:11:04,880 Julie Lander: We certainly welcome the intent of the legislation. Super funds 187 00:11:04,880 --> 00:11:07,670 Julie Lander: should always be doing the right thing by their members. 188 00:11:07,940 --> 00:11:11,570 Julie Lander: And we would say that we've always had that fiduciary 189 00:11:11,570 --> 00:11:14,360 Julie Lander: duty to act in the best interests of our members. 190 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:20,780 Julie Lander: But this legislation, I guess, strengthens that. In terms of stapling, yes, 191 00:11:20,780 --> 00:11:23,600 Julie Lander: what we've seen over the last 20 or 30 years 192 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:28,820 Julie Lander: since the advent of compulsory super is that people have 193 00:11:28,820 --> 00:11:32,960 Julie Lander: acquired multiple super accounts just because of the way the 194 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:37,670 Julie Lander: system's worked. And that hasn't necessarily been in the best 195 00:11:37,670 --> 00:11:42,140 Julie Lander: interests of people. They've been paying multiple fees and insurance 196 00:11:42,140 --> 00:11:46,880 Julie Lander: premiums potentially as well. So the intent of the legislation 197 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:51,620 Julie Lander: to stop this proliferation of accounts is good. So we're 198 00:11:51,620 --> 00:11:54,980 Julie Lander: supportive of that. It is a change for super funds 199 00:11:54,980 --> 00:11:57,380 Julie Lander: and it's certainly going to be a change for employers 200 00:11:57,380 --> 00:12:01,520 Julie Lander: once the 1st of November comes around, because they will 201 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:06,290 Julie Lander: have to onboard new employees differently and realise that they 202 00:12:06,290 --> 00:12:10,070 Julie Lander: can't just sign up all new employees to their default fund. 203 00:12:10,250 --> 00:12:13,340 Julie Lander: They will need to offer people the choice form and 204 00:12:13,340 --> 00:12:15,949 Julie Lander: if that form isn't returned, then they'll need to go 205 00:12:15,950 --> 00:12:21,080 Julie Lander: to the ATO (Australian Taxation Office) to find out what the person's stapled fund is, i.e. 206 00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:23,900 Julie Lander: a fund that they've already got in the system. And 207 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,020 Julie Lander: only in the absence of one of those, would they then 208 00:12:27,020 --> 00:12:30,380 Julie Lander: put somebody into the default fund. And of course, there 209 00:12:30,380 --> 00:12:33,900 Julie Lander: are people working their first job so there is always 210 00:12:33,900 --> 00:12:35,090 Julie Lander: the need for a default fund. 211 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:35,420 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. 212 00:12:36,410 --> 00:12:38,630 Julie Lander: But it's very hard to get legislation perfect. One of the 213 00:12:38,630 --> 00:12:41,390 Julie Lander: things that we would say about the way that this 214 00:12:41,390 --> 00:12:44,000 Julie Lander: is going to work is that people could still be 215 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:49,130 Julie Lander: stapled to their existing fund, which is an underperforming fund, 216 00:12:49,460 --> 00:12:52,880 Julie Lander: if that's the case. Having said that, there are very 217 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:56,630 Julie Lander: drastic measures for funds if they do underperform and they 218 00:12:56,630 --> 00:13:01,800 Julie Lander: will have to write to their members to advise them 219 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:04,910 Julie Lander: that it's been determined that they've underperformed. And when we 220 00:13:04,910 --> 00:13:10,250 Julie Lander: say underperformed, it's underperforming a benchmark that is unique to 221 00:13:10,250 --> 00:13:15,380 Julie Lander: that fund based on its own strategic asset allocation. It's 222 00:13:15,380 --> 00:13:21,470 Julie Lander: different to underperforming the median or the market or comparable funds. 223 00:13:21,890 --> 00:13:24,860 Julie Lander: So members will need to be aware of that and 224 00:13:24,860 --> 00:13:29,210 Julie Lander: what underperformance actually means. The underperformance test is really about 225 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:32,699 Julie Lander: underperforming what you say you going to do. 226 00:13:33,290 --> 00:13:33,770 Sean Aylmer: Yourself. 227 00:13:33,900 --> 00:13:35,959 Julie Lander: Yeah. Underperforming your own objectives. 228 00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:36,410 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. 229 00:13:36,590 --> 00:13:38,930 Julie Lander: But what we've seen is that that is possible. And 230 00:13:39,140 --> 00:13:41,390 Julie Lander: we are talking about a measure that says if you 231 00:13:41,390 --> 00:13:45,920 Julie Lander: underperform your own objectives by only point five of a 232 00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:51,470 Julie Lander: per cent over a seven-year period, or eight-year period it will ultimately be, but seven years 233 00:13:51,470 --> 00:13:54,410 Julie Lander: this year, that's actually not much leeway. 234 00:13:54,470 --> 00:13:54,870 Sean Aylmer: No, not at all. 235 00:13:56,350 --> 00:13:59,990 Julie Lander: But CareSuper, I'm pleased to say, will not be an underperforming fund. 236 00:13:59,990 --> 00:14:00,620 Sean Aylmer: Fantastic. 237 00:14:00,830 --> 00:14:04,280 Julie Lander: Which is great news for our members. But not only 238 00:14:04,280 --> 00:14:07,520 Julie Lander: is it not underperforming its own benchmark, it's been a 239 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:11,630 Julie Lander: very competitive and high performing fund over many years. 240 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:14,030 Sean Aylmer: That's a great place to leave it, Julie. Thank you 241 00:14:14,030 --> 00:14:15,260 Sean Aylmer: for talking to Fear and Greed. 242 00:14:15,410 --> 00:14:16,370 Julie Lander: Okay, thank you. 243 00:14:16,670 --> 00:14:19,940 Sean Aylmer: That was Julie Lander, CEO of CareSuper. This is the 244 00:14:19,940 --> 00:14:22,130 Sean Aylmer: Fear and Greed Daily Interview. Join me every morning for 245 00:14:22,130 --> 00:14:24,710 Sean Aylmer: the full Fear and Greed podcast with all the business 246 00:14:24,710 --> 00:14:27,800 Sean Aylmer: news you need to know. I'm Sean Aylmer. Enjoy your day.