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Speaker 1: There's a call for a levee on gambling. Two percent

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Speaker 1: on gambling revenue could replace gambling ads on free to

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Speaker 1: wear advertising. Let's have a chat with Stephen Long, senior

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Speaker 1: fellow at the Australian Institute on this. Stephen, good morning, gooday, Matthew.

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Speaker 1: So how would this work? So two percent based on

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Speaker 1: what the take.

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Speaker 2: So it's based on the latest figures we've been able

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Speaker 2: to get official statistics about gambling revenue, which was just

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Speaker 2: over seventeen billion. Now that may be an underestimate. The

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Speaker 2: industry spent about two hundred and thirty nine million on

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Speaker 2: advertising on the latest figures that are available. So if

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Speaker 2: you do the simple mass, you could put a one

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Speaker 2: point four percent levee on the industry's revenue and you

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Speaker 2: could replace for all the Free toware network all the

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Speaker 2: money that they've lost in advertising. Now we know the

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Speaker 2: government's main objection to banning ads for gambling companies on

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Speaker 2: free to wear isn't that they like the gambling companies

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Speaker 2: or they want to see more advertising to people with

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Speaker 2: high rates of addiction and children. It's that the free

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Speaker 2: to wear networks will suffer. So this is an easy

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Speaker 2: remedy in fact, it's more than a win win because

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Speaker 2: you could not only replace that lost revenue, you could

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Speaker 2: actually then would then have the networks in a position

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Speaker 2: where they could sell the advertising slots and make more money.

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Speaker 2: And the two percent, well, we rounded it up from

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Speaker 2: the one point four percent you need to replace all

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Speaker 2: that lost advertising revenue and said, well you could give

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Speaker 2: a bit more to the ABC as well, because they're

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Speaker 2: complaining that their budget's thin cut. So one point four

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Speaker 2: percent two percent, however you slice and diced, it's a

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Speaker 2: very very small percentage.

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Speaker 1: I think the ABC's got to act of money when

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Speaker 1: they can send breakfast announcers from Adelaide to Paris. But

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Speaker 1: that's a story for another time. But I mean, you'd

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Speaker 1: put it into health, wouldn't you all other places?

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Speaker 2: Well exactly, you know, there's lots of different ways you

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Speaker 2: could slice this up, but the principle remains the same

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Speaker 2: that a very very small revenue, a very very small

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Speaker 2: levy on gambling industry money could basically mean you solve

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Speaker 2: the problem that the government is perceiving as a barrier,

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Speaker 2: which is that you know that in this day of

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Speaker 2: fragmenting media audiences, then we need to give a leg

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Speaker 2: up to the free toware networks. That's that's that's the

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Speaker 2: view that's put.

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Speaker 1: I don't know that anyone would mind. You know, once

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Speaker 1: they lose money in gambling, what happens to that money.

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Speaker 1: So if money of two percent was taken out to

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Speaker 1: be used in the way you suggest, well, win win,

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Speaker 1: isn't it.

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Speaker 2: It is a win win. The only people who possibly

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Speaker 2: lose out of this the executives and shareholders of the

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Speaker 2: gambling companies. It's a win win for the media, it's

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Speaker 2: a win for the public in terms of the enormous

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Speaker 2: cost of society. I don't know what you've experienced, but

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Speaker 2: my son said that his school just about all the

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Speaker 2: kids we're watching these ads when they watch the footy

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Speaker 2: or watch programs around it and putting on bets on

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Speaker 2: these multis and things that are high risk. And I

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Speaker 2: love the way they sell it bigger odds. Bigger odds

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Speaker 2: means you're more likely to lose, but that's not necessarily

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Speaker 2: the way it translates in the minds of the teenagers

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Speaker 2: who are getting.

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Speaker 1: Sucked into the Are teenagers allowed to play bets?

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, the thing is, how easy is it

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Speaker 2: to regulate when we've got online apps these days, it's

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Speaker 2: not we know that there's huge estimated harms from gambling.

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Speaker 2: The barrier, the only barrier that's been raised in Parliament

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Speaker 2: and Canberra from anyone on any side of politics to

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Speaker 2: this is well, the free towar and media networks can't

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Speaker 2: afford to lose the money. So here's the simple remedy.

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Speaker 1: Can we take it off social media as well? Would

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Speaker 1: that work? Take the ads on? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Yep, same, yes, yes, for sure.

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Speaker 1: Okay, because you know they are prolific. It doesn't matter

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Speaker 1: whether you're watching a footy show or just scrolling through

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Speaker 1: your phone. They are there and they're constant.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's right, they and they work. They're not advertising

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Speaker 2: as a charity to media businesses. They're advertising because guess

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Speaker 2: what it works. It gets people in and makes money

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Speaker 2: for the gambling businesses and takes money that people would

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Speaker 2: otherwise be spending on their families. What about useful things.

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Speaker 1: Non free toware Would you like to see it taken

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Speaker 1: off pay TV?

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Speaker 2: Look, that's the reason we've structured it the way we have, Matthew,

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Speaker 2: And the reason why I thought about it in the

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Speaker 2: way that I did with this is that the problem

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Speaker 2: that's been identified as the stumbling block to actually banning

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Speaker 2: advertising is that the freeoware TV networks and radio networks

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Speaker 2: need the money, and so we were looking to solve

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Speaker 2: that problem. In principle, there's no reason why you couldn't

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Speaker 2: extend it, but we're addressing the barrier that the politicians

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Speaker 2: have put up.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all right, we'll see where it goes, Steven, So

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Speaker 1: you've put this into the federal government.

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Speaker 2: We've released it today. There's already discussion going on amongst

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Speaker 2: various members of Parliament. We know that, so we'll see

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Speaker 2: how it goes. But certainly, the only thing the government

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Speaker 2: has said as to why it can't ban advertising outright

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Speaker 2: on these on TV, free toware TV and radio is

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Speaker 2: the objection about the loss revenue. And this way it's

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Speaker 2: more than a win win, it's actually a revenue bonanza

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Speaker 2: for the media companies. Maybe we could get a bit

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Speaker 2: more Australian content made in return.

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Speaker 1: Alrighty, Stephen, appreciate your time. Thank you, no worries. Stephen Long,

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Speaker 1: Senior Fellow Australian Institute on the Australia Institute on taking

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Speaker 1: a two percent cut out of revenue, that is lost

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Speaker 1: to gambling and used to replace ads on Freedom Wear TV.

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Speaker 1: Not a bad idea, there are too many. There's no

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Speaker 1: doubt about that