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Speaker 1: A good eight champs and championettes. I guess it's champs around, really,

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Speaker 1: isn't it. It's not a gender thing, good a champs.

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Speaker 1: It's Jumbo, it's Tiff, it's Bobby, it's the Project, that's you.

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Speaker 1: It's Thursday. Is it Thursday? Ye, it's Thursday, and we're

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Speaker 1: all busy, We're busy. Just what's her name? Tiff? I

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Speaker 1: had Tazzy and Tiff. TIFFs just got back from Tazzy,

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Speaker 1: so that twenty seven times fast. And Bobby's just got

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Speaker 1: back from the West Coast to the East coast, No,

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Speaker 1: the other way around the East coast to the West coast.

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Speaker 1: Is it nice being back in the sun, Bobby.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's Clardyon raining here. It was really nice being

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Speaker 2: back on the East coast. To be fair, it's blows freezing.

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Speaker 2: It got colder in New York than it wasn't Antartica

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Speaker 2: at one point, but I loved it.

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Speaker 1: Nice. Tazzy was Tazzy colder than here.

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Speaker 3: Tiff, Well, thank you for Lee because here was quite

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Speaker 3: ludicrous when I left, but it was. It was about

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Speaker 3: twenty two to twenty three every day, which in Taggy

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Speaker 3: is just lovely.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Well it's all been going on. We've

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Speaker 1: all had a few things going on. I want to

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Speaker 1: unpack any of mine, but I will one day. And Bobby,

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Speaker 1: how are you feeling because you've had a few peaks

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Speaker 1: and troughs. How's your head, how's your heart, how's your energy?

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Speaker 1: How to work?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Things have been things have been intense. A lot

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Speaker 2: of stuff happened in hopes. But you know what, I'm

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Speaker 2: still alive. I'm still here. So let's talk about that.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about like all of us coaches, all of

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Speaker 1: us are coaches in some shape or form, what's your

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Speaker 1: responsibility or what's the expectation? Because I've been thinking about

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Speaker 1: this lately.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: It's like you said to me just before we started,

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Speaker 1: how are your parents? And I went, yeah, I can't

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Speaker 1: tell you. That's not a one minute answer. That's more.

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Speaker 1: And by the way, everybody, thanks for all your well wishes.

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Speaker 1: A few struggles going on on a planet Harper, but

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Speaker 1: they're getting there, they're okay. But what do you think.

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Speaker 1: Let's start with you, tif Like, I know you have

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Speaker 1: peaks and troughs because you talk about it, our listeners,

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Speaker 1: your listeners know about it. And in the middle of

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Speaker 1: you know, shit falling apart, which you can sometimes for

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Speaker 1: a month or a week or a day or an hour.

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Speaker 1: What's your kind of thinking around how do I still

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Speaker 1: be that positive, high energy person but also be authentic

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Speaker 1: because at the moment, I feel like dogshit, But you

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Speaker 1: can't turn up to coach someone and go probably won't

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Speaker 1: be a great session because I'm having a moment. How

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Speaker 1: do you navigate that?

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Speaker 3: I think I'm like when you show up to do

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Speaker 3: a job, you kind of step into that not character

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Speaker 3: so much, but that professional space, like that headspace. But

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Speaker 3: in the middle of that, I feel like I've always

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Speaker 3: maintained and a pretty open persona and you know, I

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Speaker 3: share what's going on, not not in this session. It's

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Speaker 3: like once we're done with that, yeah, definitely, or maybe

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Speaker 3: sometimes sometimes it's relevant. Sometimes it's relevant to go, oh,

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Speaker 3: this is this is what's going on for me right now,

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Speaker 3: and this is what i'm you know, and sometimes there's

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Speaker 3: helpful insights in that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: What about for you? Energy management? Like do you get

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Speaker 1: to the point where you go just where I'm at

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Speaker 1: right now my energy and my head, like I'm just exhausted,

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Speaker 1: I've got no juice in the tank. It's probably better

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Speaker 1: for the client that I go listen, Can we just

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Speaker 1: put this one on hold? Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Often we'll not not putting people on hold often,

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Speaker 3: but I often have to manage my energy, especially lately

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Speaker 3: like hormones awol, and it's new for me. It's new

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Speaker 3: to go. I'm why am I so tired right now?

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Speaker 3: And how like, I've had to change a lot of

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Speaker 3: how I do things so that I can continue to

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Speaker 3: show up because you you know, like it's people first,

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Speaker 3: it's your job first.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Yeah, it's tricky.

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Speaker 2: It's tricky.

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Speaker 1: What about you, Robert, What about when you're not you're

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Speaker 1: personally not feeling great, but you want to show up

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Speaker 1: and be a version of great for your clients, or

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Speaker 1: your team or your audience.

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Speaker 2: I think my perspective is similar to Tiffanis. First of all,

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Speaker 2: I don't think it's important to show up quote unquote

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Speaker 2: positive all the time for every session. I was listening

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Speaker 2: to your podcast with doctor ca McDonald We love Them.

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Speaker 2: I really enjoyed that episode. But you had pointed out

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Speaker 2: you can't always control how you feel, so there's a

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Speaker 2: lot of influences there. So for me, it's a matter

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Speaker 2: of what am I focusing on? Where am I directing

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Speaker 2: my attention? Which I mean, if you have a lot

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Speaker 2: of stuff on and you you know, let's say you

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Speaker 2: haven't slapped, you're fatigued, you are more susceptible to things

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Speaker 2: like emotional contagion. But at the same time, what's also

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Speaker 2: true is focusing single mindedly on your client. That conversation

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Speaker 2: is in fact a form of mindfulness, and it's very

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Speaker 2: helpful for you to step outside of yourself as much

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Speaker 2: as you realistically can and focus single mindedly on what's

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Speaker 2: important for the client in front of you in the moment.

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Speaker 2: So I don't think positivity is something that you need

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Speaker 2: to show up with every single session, But I think

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Speaker 2: self awareness and tak us some time before the session,

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Speaker 2: not jumping from one thing into another, just even a

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Speaker 2: couple of minutes ago. Kurk Right, what's my intention here,

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Speaker 2: where's my focus? Whatever mental reserve I have? How do

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Speaker 2: I allocate that away from me and towards the client

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Speaker 2: for a little while.

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Speaker 1: I think if we like, as you're saying this, as

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Speaker 1: we're saying this, I'm recognizing and respecting that most people

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Speaker 1: who listen to this aren't coaches. So I think it's

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Speaker 1: probably and that's that's not good or bad, that's just

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Speaker 1: a situation.

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Speaker 2: But also I.

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Speaker 1: Would think the majority, more than fifty percent, may be

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Speaker 1: way higher of our listeners are parents, and I think

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Speaker 1: or as a parent, or as a partner, or as

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Speaker 1: a boss for that matter, whatever, or a coach. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: how do I show up like I would think?

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Speaker 2: Well, I wouldn't think.

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Speaker 1: I respect that parenting is fucking infinitely harder than doing

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Speaker 1: the job. Us three dumb asses do right, None of

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Speaker 1: us to my knowledge, Bobby, unless there's something you want

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Speaker 1: to tell differ and I right now. Although Tiff is

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Speaker 1: a parent of sorts and you have been to and

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Speaker 1: I have been for that matter, But yeah, like, just

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Speaker 1: how do I be a mum or a dad, or

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Speaker 1: how do I be a good friend, or how do

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Speaker 1: I just be that person for that person and without

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Speaker 1: denying what I'm going through all my feelings but not

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Speaker 1: kind of let them be a victim of my not

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Speaker 1: feeling good in the moment, Like, how do I be

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Speaker 1: as consistent as I can for them?

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Speaker 2: Either of you? I think sometimes part of that is

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Speaker 2: being honest.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: Brene Brown said something where she talked about in marriage

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Speaker 2: that type of relationship. Sometimes one person shows up with

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Speaker 2: a lot more energy reserves than another, and you hold

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Speaker 2: that space like some person might be at like hundred percent,

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Speaker 2: but your partner might be at sixty. And you know

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Speaker 2: the Internet, she got a lot of flak for that.

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Speaker 2: It's like, no, everybody, you have to show up one

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Speaker 2: hundred percent all the time, be committed. And it's like,

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Speaker 2: I think you're being dishonest and unfair to your partner

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Speaker 2: because even if you're showing up one hundred percent all

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Speaker 2: the time, which will to be fair, that's unlikely that

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Speaker 2: you do. Your one hundred looks very different day to day.

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Speaker 2: And sometimes, you know, just telling your partner, hey, you know,

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Speaker 2: this is where I'm at and this is what I'm

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Speaker 2: going through, I think that mitigates the intensity of those

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Speaker 2: emotions in you. It's honest, it's authentic with your partner.

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Speaker 2: I think there's also urgency and importance. You know, some

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Speaker 2: some conversations that are critical are important, some are urgent.

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Speaker 2: Some are a combination of the two. So if you're

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Speaker 2: dealing with something that is highly important but it's not urgent,

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Speaker 2: we don't have to have this right now. I think

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Speaker 2: sometimes just say hey, you know, this is my bandwidth

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Speaker 2: in the moment, and I know this is important to you,

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Speaker 2: right and I really want to be present, you know it.

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Speaker 2: Can we do this, you know tomorrow, because I don't

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Speaker 2: want my stuff to get in the way now. Sometimes

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Speaker 2: things are urgent and you can't really do that and

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Speaker 2: then showing up as much as you possibly can. But

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Speaker 2: I think it's that level of honesty with yourself and

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Speaker 2: your honesty with the person you're speaking to. And by

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Speaker 2: the way, this is coming from someone who hypocritically doesn't

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Speaker 2: always practice that, because there's a difference between where I

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Speaker 2: think I should be and where I actually am. And

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Speaker 2: it's like, Okay, I'm feeling like I'll scale from one

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Speaker 2: to ten. I'm like a four, But okay, I'm going

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Speaker 2: to do this right now because somebody else wants me

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Speaker 2: to do this, and there's a place I think that's important.

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Speaker 2: But sometimes like can I give Can I give an

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Speaker 2: example of something that happened with me? And this this

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Speaker 2: isn't like a personal relationship, but my first hands on

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Speaker 2: practical coaching exam I ever took. This is going back

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Speaker 2: a long time ago. I was ready, I was there

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Speaker 2: at the table, I was anxious and I got on

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Speaker 2: with instructor and she was in bits. This is someone

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Speaker 2: who I've been in correspondence with, and she was she

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Speaker 2: was you could tell she's she had been crying and

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Speaker 2: something had really gone very very wrong in her marriage

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Speaker 2: that morning. And she's like, I don't think I have

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Speaker 2: I don't think I have the mental space to do this,

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Speaker 2: and I know all the preparation that went into this.

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Speaker 2: Can we reschedule? And one I remember feeling horrible for

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Speaker 2: her because I know if I was on the other

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Speaker 2: end of that call what that would have felt like,

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Speaker 2: plus the stuff she was going through. But I also

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Speaker 2: remember feeling quite grateful because I thought that was not

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Speaker 2: something I was doing for her, that was also something

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Speaker 2: simultaneously she was doing for me, because she could have

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Speaker 2: powered through that, and that's something that could have affected,

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Speaker 2: you know, my life and hers. So I think that

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Speaker 2: level of openness and honest and awareness is important. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: one hundred percent.

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Speaker 1: So I'm going to present a hypothetical, or I guess

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Speaker 1: a question to you, tiff In. When we talk about

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Speaker 1: negative states that we all get into emotional and psychological,

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Speaker 1: I'm speaking about more which we know have a physical consequence.

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Speaker 1: But what's the state that's most likely to derail.

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Speaker 2: You in the moment.

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Speaker 1: So I'm sure there's more than this, but what comes

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Speaker 1: to mind for me is anxiety, self doubt, for our

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Speaker 1: self loathing, overthinking. Maybe there's another one, but what's the

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Speaker 1: one that for you has been the biggest struggle? So

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Speaker 1: two part question that like, what what's going to fuck

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Speaker 1: you up the most? I just I may or may

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Speaker 1: not riff on this, but for me, I think it's unworthiness.

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Speaker 1: I always feel not good enough, unworthy. What's the biggest

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Speaker 1: one for you? And then how do you deal with that?

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Speaker 1: You do about that?

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Speaker 3: I feel like maybe overwhelm because I don't recognize and

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Speaker 3: I don't know what to do with it. And I

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Speaker 3: felt a bit recently, so I think overwhelmed can get

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Speaker 3: put me into a state of a lot of those things,

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Speaker 3: anxiety and reactivity and irritability and negativity and being quite

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Speaker 3: cynical and a very different version of myself. So my

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Speaker 3: outlook of everything shifts, and I actually can't in that moment.

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Speaker 3: Definitely it's a struggle to pinpoint it. So I'm like,

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Speaker 3: I don't actually I can't recognize where this is coming from.

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Speaker 3: It's going to take a bit of stepping back and

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Speaker 3: getting self aware and looking at my environment and what's

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Speaker 3: going on at the moment and try and piece it together.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, just being that person in the middle of

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Speaker 3: that is very hard and frustrating for me.

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Speaker 1: Because I'm this is my guess, right, that state as

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Speaker 1: an emotional state. You are emotional, but then you've got

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Speaker 1: to try and understand it logically and as critically as

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Speaker 1: a critical thinker, you know. And so you're in this

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Speaker 1: state where you're actually your prefrontal cortext is not operating

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Speaker 1: at an all time high, so you can't think real

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Speaker 1: clearly because you're in overwhelm. Yeah. Yeah, that's maybe only

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Speaker 1: a hindsight thing that where you can an hour or

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Speaker 1: two later go, nah, I think it was this and

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Speaker 1: this is probably the reason why.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. And what's interesting is because I've always been very independent.

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Speaker 3: I think I always it's easy to withdraw and just

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Speaker 3: not be around people. So that's confronting as well. So

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Speaker 3: now I have someone in my life that I am

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Speaker 3: speaking to every day and I can't just I can't

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Speaker 3: just withdraw, So I have to go, oh, I can't just.

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Speaker 2: It's so good you said that.

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Speaker 1: I was going to say I know I've thrown you

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Speaker 1: under the bus hundred times with old mate we love him,

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Speaker 1: good Scotti. You're a big fuck stick, Yeah, a big

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Speaker 1: fuck stick. But yeah, I think for you because, like

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Speaker 1: I've said a thousand times tips the girl who's got

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Speaker 1: you know, the T shirt that says give me a

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Speaker 1: hug and the baseball cap that says but fuck off. Though, right,

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Speaker 1: so like you're you're also you're quite quite lovable, but

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Speaker 1: a little bit fucking terrifying. And so even for me,

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Speaker 1: who reads people pretty well, I'm.

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Speaker 2: Like, eah, fuck, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, And I could be really.

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Speaker 3: Aware of being quite cunty. There's no other word to

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Speaker 3: describe how I feel when i'm that.

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Speaker 1: But I'm like, can you say that again, because I

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Speaker 1: think I spoke of you.

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Speaker 3: I can be very aware when I'm being quite cunty

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Speaker 3: and go and I'm like, oh, I don't want to

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Speaker 3: be that person, but right now that's the person that

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Speaker 3: is stuck inside me. And so I don't want to

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Speaker 3: be around people and I don't think it's fair on them.

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Speaker 3: And then yeah, it's a challenge.

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Speaker 1: And right now my Migdala is running the show. So

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Speaker 1: you can all fuck off get back to me in

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Speaker 1: an hour or so, Bobby, Bobby, what about you in

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Speaker 1: terms of like when something's going to come?

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Speaker 2: I could be county as well. Why do you ask?

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Speaker 1: Well, we know that, but specifically when something some emotional

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Speaker 1: state or whatever kind of what's the thing most likely

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Speaker 1: to take you.

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Speaker 2: Out of the game temporarily? Wow, there's so many of them.

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Speaker 2: I think overwhelm is definitely part of that. Overwhelm is

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Speaker 2: big for me. The other thing is, I don't know

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Speaker 2: how like whether it's self anger or disappointment. But when

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Speaker 2: I feel like I'm about to fail on one, not

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Speaker 2: fail because you know I'll feel disappointment, I'll get over it.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes I find failure quite engaging, like I actually enjoy

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Speaker 2: it because of what you learn in reflection. But if

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Speaker 2: I feel like I'm about to fail another person, yes,

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Speaker 2: that is so disruptive for me. And it can be

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Speaker 2: over something small like my wife send me to the

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Speaker 2: shop and say I bring back you know, salmon, and

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Speaker 2: I'll bring back I don't know, like cigarettes, cigarettes. That

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Speaker 2: would be funny, and I will feel this incredible sense

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Speaker 2: of angst inside. Like for her, she'll be like, oh okay, yeah, whatever,

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Speaker 2: for me, I will feel like self loathing and disgust,

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Speaker 2: and I'll also feel fear as if like there's going

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Speaker 2: to be severe repercussions. And I know where that stuff

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Speaker 2: comes from. Yeah, and that's not the relationship I'm in

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Speaker 2: in my marriage, but it's definitely the relationship I grew

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Speaker 2: up in. So I think, upon reflection again, to TIFF's point,

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Speaker 2: I can say, oh, I see what happened there. It's

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Speaker 2: not that serious, and I can recalibrate, But in the moment,

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Speaker 2: I don't really have access to my cognitive faculties. And

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Speaker 2: you know what, I'm a complete state.

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Speaker 1: So what is I think difficult sometimes is how do

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Speaker 1: I say this? So right now, Mum and Dad are

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Speaker 1: going through some stuff and Mums let's just say, you know,

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Speaker 1: her memory and stuff's not working great, and there's you know,

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Speaker 1: there's a few issues. But she will say something to

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Speaker 1: me one day and then emphatically say the opposite the

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Speaker 1: next day, right. And the thing that didn't worry her

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Speaker 1: the day before is a cadashphe the next day, right.

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Speaker 1: And so for me, the.

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Speaker 2: Like there's two parts this.

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Speaker 1: There's a real cognitive part, a critical thinking part, and

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Speaker 1: there's an emotional part empathy, you know, and it's trying

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Speaker 1: to trying to just be wherever they're at, you know,

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Speaker 1: rather than going, mum, we spoke about this yesterday you said, yes,

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Speaker 1: it's all good. And now I don't do that. I

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Speaker 1: don't even try to do that. I just try to

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Speaker 1: love her. I go, how do I be the most

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Speaker 1: loving and how do we get through this conversation because

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Speaker 1: all I don't.

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Speaker 2: Firstly, I want to look after them physically, but I

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Speaker 2: just this is weird.

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Speaker 1: But for me, I just want to be for them

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Speaker 1: emotionally and mentally, because I think that's the biggest trauma.

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Speaker 1: The physiology. Yeah, sure things have fallen apart a bit,

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Speaker 1: but you know, old people get to a point, and

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Speaker 1: I mean this with love nearly all old people where

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Speaker 1: just everything's overwhelming and terrifying and they can't remember shit,

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Speaker 1: and you know, it just goes there. So for me,

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Speaker 1: it's trying to, you know, theory of mind understand what's

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Speaker 1: going on in their mind, but also empathy understand what's

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Speaker 1: going on in their feelings and their emotions. So it's

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Speaker 1: this kind of duality, this dual processing thing that's happening

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Speaker 1: in real time. Like I'm trying to figure out what

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Speaker 1: the fuck is she thinking? But literally what is she thinking?

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Speaker 1: You know, like not critically, like curiously, what is she thinking?

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Speaker 1: And why and why are we here today and yesterday

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Speaker 1: we were there? And now emotionally what is her experience now?

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Speaker 1: What is she feeling now? And for me, that's it's

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Speaker 1: been a yeah, it's been a big step out of

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Speaker 1: the theory of all of this that I've spent so

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Speaker 1: long on and bits and pieces of you know, real

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Speaker 1: life and reality, but now where it's like, oh, I'm

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Speaker 1: at the cold face of this and as an experience

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Speaker 1: it is definitely not the same as the theory.

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Speaker 3: What harps is it like to manage because you need

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Speaker 3: to manage you and your overwhelmed in a moment where

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Speaker 3: where then you put them at the forefront, Like that's

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Speaker 3: a that's a bit dynamic.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, well as being you know, at first, everyone,

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Speaker 1: I'm fine, but I'm pretty fucked at the moment.

349
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Speaker 2: Like I'm tired.

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Speaker 1: I'm tired, you know, I'm about had to delay my

351
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Speaker 1: PhD stuff a little bit, but I just got by

352
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Speaker 1: the way everyone. I've got feed This doesn't mean much

353
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Speaker 1: to most people, but I've got feedback from two quite

354
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Speaker 1: good academic journals that two of my papers are a potential,

355
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Speaker 1: so they didn't get what's called a desk reject, which

356
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Speaker 1: about ninety percent of papers get rejected straight up in

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Speaker 1: good as you know, Bobby in good and probably TIF

358
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Speaker 1: in good journals.

359
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Speaker 2: So that's good.

360
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Speaker 1: But yeah, so at the moment, I'm trying to finish

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Speaker 1: this thing that I've been chipping away at forever, and

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to obviously Mum and Dad in my priority

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Speaker 1: like flat out, so nothing else, you know, if I

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Speaker 1: had to move there and stop everything six months, that's

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Speaker 1: what I do, right, So trying to navigate that, trying

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Speaker 1: to manage my own energy, Like I'm going up to

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Speaker 1: see them tomorrow and I'm literally going up to have lunch,

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Speaker 1: you know, And so there's depending on the traffic, four

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Speaker 1: to five hours driving to spend ninety minutes with them,

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Speaker 1: you know, or two hours, and that's fine too. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So it's the answer is I'm not great at it.

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Speaker 1: The answer is I'm learning, and I just, at the

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Speaker 1: risk is sounding cheesy, I'm trying to lead with love

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Speaker 1: and see what happens, try not to have a breakdown.

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Speaker 1: Yeah that probably sounded super sloppy, pologize everyone that's not

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Speaker 1: enterstanding at all.

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Speaker 3: I think it's important because I think it's I mean,

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Speaker 3: you say it to me often a version of this

379
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Speaker 3: is it like this is now when it matters, and

380
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Speaker 3: it goes to show us in a world where there's

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Speaker 3: solutions and information and data and how to do this

382
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Speaker 3: and how to get better. And then there's the reality

383
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Speaker 3: of it's like, it's always going to be hard, though,

384
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Speaker 3: and we're going to be messy when we get in

385
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Speaker 3: the middle of that, no matter how many PhDs and

386
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Speaker 3: how much thegory we've on board about it.

387
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Speaker 2: And also think about this.

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Speaker 1: Let's say Bobby goes to me, Hey, Craig, I'm really

389
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Speaker 1: dealing with I'm fucking I feel overwhelmed, and then later

390
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Speaker 1: you say to me, Hey, Craig, I feel overwhelmed. I

391
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 1: could have a conversation with Bobby that's really quite valuable

392
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Speaker 1: and therapeutic and helpful to him. I have the same

393
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Speaker 1: conversation with you. Totally misses the mark. So this is

394
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Speaker 1: the thing. Even if we can recognize the state or

395
00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 1: the feeling or the emotion or the whatever, there is

396
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:05,719
Speaker 1: no single answer because Bobby's answer won't be yours and

397
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Speaker 1: so on. Yeah, so how are you going in the

398
00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:10,640
Speaker 1: background there, Bobby, You're right.

399
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just just learning about all the stuff. You well,

400
00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:23,119
Speaker 2: just just I think pensive overwhelm is about five minutes away,

401
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 2: so we're good.

402
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Speaker 1: See if you can put it off till about I

403
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,200
Speaker 1: don't know, one to thirty our times, six thirty your time.

404
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,360
Speaker 2: I'm about it. I'm putting it in your calendar six

405
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 2: thirty one. Overwhelmed. That's that's how it's getting. We have

406
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:44,240
Speaker 2: to we have to time, budget time, allocate it for overwhelm. Yeah.

407
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Speaker 2: Who's got time for overwhelmed nowadays?

408
00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:46,800
Speaker 3: Oh?

409
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 2: Fuck it?

410
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:52,320
Speaker 1: Just yeah, just schedule it. Yeah, eight o'clock, June seven, breakdown.

411
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Speaker 2: Yeap, Jack done, all right, Self care accomplished. Thanks, thanks hops.

412
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Speaker 2: I'm just I'm just less and into what you're going

413
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Speaker 2: through with your parents. And you know, my mom is

414
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:06,920
Speaker 2: not in a good place. She's in remission from cancer,

415
00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,879
Speaker 2: but now she has a bunch of other things that

416
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 2: are quite serious. And you know, hmm. Amy was going

417
00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 2: to come home with me two days ago, but she

418
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Speaker 2: didn't because she has to stay out there because I

419
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Speaker 2: have things that I have to be in person for

420
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Speaker 2: out here. So now she's in Brooklyn, and it's just

421
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:33,800
Speaker 2: interesting do it Where you said do things with love,

422
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Speaker 2: I think that's all you can do. Sometimes it's like,

423
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Speaker 2: how do I do this with love? Because I feel

424
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Speaker 2: a tremendous amount of conflict and guilty with my mom

425
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Speaker 2: because she's she's old and she really needs help and

426
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:54,040
Speaker 2: we're making sacrifices to help her and do whatever we

427
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Speaker 2: can to have Amy there, me here, but she there's

428
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,960
Speaker 2: a lot of resentment that I feel I have because

429
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Speaker 2: I mean, she was not a great mother. That's that's

430
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Speaker 2: putting it mildly. Growing up, Yes, and now that you're

431
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Speaker 2: seeing cognitive decline, there are certain attributes that she can't

432
00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:24,560
Speaker 2: mask as well, and they're coming out and it's like, oh, okay,

433
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:29,200
Speaker 2: there you are, I remember you. Like, So she has

434
00:25:29,320 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 2: spent the past I don't know, oof the past fifteen

435
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:38,240
Speaker 2: years trying to be very sweet and you know, like

436
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:42,440
Speaker 2: make amends for everything, and that's been a that's that's

437
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,200
Speaker 2: been a winding road. Sometimes it's been better than others.

438
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:49,760
Speaker 2: But now now there's parts of her peeking out through

439
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:54,160
Speaker 2: the surface, and it's hard for me to deal with it. Yeah,

440
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 2: that is tough. Without getting into it, and it's like, wow,

441
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 2: that's that's not a nice person coming out, and like,

442
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,280
Speaker 2: what do you do? Because sometimes I get quite angry.

443
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,480
Speaker 2: It's like, just you just got to take a moment,

444
00:26:09,520 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 2: you got to recalibrate, and you got to do this

445
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:15,240
Speaker 2: with love. Like it's okay to feel what you're feeling.

446
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:19,840
Speaker 2: First of all. I think trying to trying to repress

447
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:24,399
Speaker 2: it causes it to come out in ugli or dysfunctional ways.

448
00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:28,760
Speaker 2: But take it, own it and move forward with love. Anyway.

449
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,480
Speaker 2: My wife, like Amy, is amazing at that she's taking

450
00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:36,919
Speaker 2: care of another person who's getting quite on along in

451
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:43,239
Speaker 2: years and she's able to say, Okay, this person is

452
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 2: who they are, But how do I show up lovingly? Anyway?

453
00:26:48,760 --> 00:26:51,719
Speaker 2: I think that is that is a beautiful attribute. And

454
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:53,120
Speaker 2: sometimes people you can do.

455
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,640
Speaker 1: I think that what you're doing is incredibly hard, and

456
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:03,000
Speaker 1: you know, sometimes times, God bless them old people. And

457
00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:05,239
Speaker 1: I mean that respectfully everyone. I mean old. I mean

458
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 1: eighty My parents are eighty six, right, eighty seven this year,

459
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,920
Speaker 1: And some of the stuff that comes out at times

460
00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:19,040
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, you know, but my inner voice goes, hey,

461
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 1: most of your life has been in the ballpark of

462
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:27,400
Speaker 1: fucking amazing, right, so shut up. Secondly, you talk about

463
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 1: all this shit all the time, Well, now there's the

464
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 1: opportunity for you to do the shit, to be the shit.

465
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:36,160
Speaker 1: Like otherwise, I'm just a voice in the wind that's

466
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:39,639
Speaker 1: talking bullshit. And as I say to people all the time,

467
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: what I care about most is what you're doing when

468
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:46,640
Speaker 1: no one's looking or giving you applause or and there's

469
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:49,919
Speaker 1: just that where you go, Yeah, I can could I

470
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: in some instances find a reason to feel sorry for

471
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 1: myself if I want it.

472
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:56,200
Speaker 2: What does that help me?

473
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:56,399
Speaker 1: No?

474
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:57,360
Speaker 2: Does that help them?

475
00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 1: No? Does it change the situation? No?

476
00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:00,479
Speaker 2: Does it produce a good outcome?

477
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:02,360
Speaker 1: No? All right, so let's not do that.

478
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 2: Let's do it.

479
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,000
Speaker 1: Not do it one because it's dumb, and two because

480
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:07,919
Speaker 1: you don't want to be that person and you want to,

481
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:11,159
Speaker 1: as we said, leave with love. So yeah, dude, I

482
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: feel for you, and I you know, like this is weird,

483
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: but you know, since we met all those years ago,

484
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 1: you've always kind of been that little sometimes lost brother

485
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:30,240
Speaker 1: where you know, I know how uh disconnected you can

486
00:28:30,280 --> 00:28:34,080
Speaker 1: feel from people, you know, because you're you're not typical.

487
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:36,119
Speaker 1: You're not typical, You're not the same. I don't I

488
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:39,200
Speaker 1: know fucking thousands of people. I don't know one person

489
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 1: like you. I don't know one person who's I go, oh,

490
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 1: this person really reminds me of Bobby. And I know

491
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 1: that there's a lot of you know, I mean, we're

492
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: just here, so mus well, stay here. But there's you know,

493
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:54,600
Speaker 1: there's a lot of pain in you. And I know

494
00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,200
Speaker 1: that you mask that. I see that, I see you

495
00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: just you know, you get to a point of a

496
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 1: conversation where you're like, right, let's do a left turn

497
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 1: and talk about Dix or whatever it is. You know

498
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: me too, you know where you go, fuck, let's do

499
00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 1: something funny. Well, that's true, that's more me. Let's be honest.

500
00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: That's me.

501
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you're I'm the fucking big brother with

502
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:21,840
Speaker 1: no morals. But yeah, you know, it's just that we

503
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:24,680
Speaker 1: just cope the way that we cope. Sometimes it's deflection,

504
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 1: sometimes it's humor. Sometimes it's pointing a finger back and

505
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,240
Speaker 1: going nah, fuck you, which is probably not a good recommendation,

506
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: but yeah, I think sometimes on this show, you know,

507
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 1: it's all well and good to go. Well, in this situation,

508
00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 1: we should probably try a bit of this and sprinkle

509
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,160
Speaker 1: a bit of that on and you know, here's four

510
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:48,240
Speaker 1: things you can try. Well maybe maybe sometimes though I

511
00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:50,800
Speaker 1: think you're just The thing is to just sit in

512
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:52,600
Speaker 1: the middle of the shit and feel what you feel

513
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: and see what comes up, and see what you can

514
00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:58,320
Speaker 1: figure out, rather than what any of us genie I

515
00:29:58,400 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 1: are thrown at you, because I think that's as cliche

516
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:08,040
Speaker 1: as it sounds. I think experiences and interactions and life

517
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 1: is the best classroom. Like just going through a shit

518
00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,600
Speaker 1: is where you learn, you know. I don't think you

519
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: can learn about grief without going through grief. You know,

520
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 1: you just learn the theory of grief. Go through grief.

521
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:22,720
Speaker 2: Motherfucker. That is different.

522
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:26,200
Speaker 1: That is so far from those seven points I read

523
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:29,120
Speaker 1: in that book, those five stages of grief.

524
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 2: Those this the.

525
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,720
Speaker 1: Fuck and hell this is nothing like because one is

526
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 1: just a kind of a theoretical framework, which theoretical frameworks

527
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 1: have their place. But I cannot explain the shit that

528
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,720
Speaker 1: I'm feeling. So you and your theories fuck off, you know,

529
00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:49,880
Speaker 1: and you just kind of work through it a bit. Yeah,

530
00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 1: So a tip, do you not because you were going

531
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,160
Speaker 1: to map maybe have to jump out? Are you still good?

532
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 3: I do no longer need to.

533
00:30:57,760 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 1: Oh, perfect right, well say something mind blowingly wise, were you?

534
00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 1: Because Bobby and I haven't fucking silk over.

535
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:07,800
Speaker 3: Here, just as you've been talking a mull over that

536
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:12,080
Speaker 3: idea around what we how we approach or what we

537
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:18,959
Speaker 3: do with the recognizing the pain or the herd and

538
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 3: feel like that idea of how do you feel what

539
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 3: you feel without and not make it bigger, but allow

540
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 3: it to be there and not suppress it and do

541
00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:31,960
Speaker 3: something healthy with it. Because because I was talking to

542
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 3: a guest earlier this week and around that concept of

543
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:41,280
Speaker 3: when we don't express things, When we don't don't express

544
00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:46,400
Speaker 3: our feelings or what's inside and we suppress that, it's toxic,

545
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 3: we get sick. It's like that if there's dark emotions there,

546
00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 3: if we have hurt and pain, like I kept a

547
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:57,960
Speaker 3: secret for thirty years and didn't speak up. So I'm

548
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 3: really passionate about it. But in saying that is also

549
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:04,800
Speaker 3: a way to not hold it and make it heavy

550
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 3: and to not project it onto other people. So as

551
00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 3: you talk about all of this, I'm just I'm thinking

552
00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:12,720
Speaker 3: about that.

553
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, that works for us.

554
00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:20,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, I also think about you know, when you're talking

555
00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 4: to someone and they're going through something, and you recognize

556
00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 4: the thing that they're going through in the moment mentally

557
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:33,800
Speaker 4: and emotionally, that it isn't real objectively, it is subjectively

558
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:35,440
Speaker 4: the experience is real for them.

559
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 1: Like I watch my mum take a zero out of

560
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:44,280
Speaker 1: ten event or issue and it becomes a ten out

561
00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:47,440
Speaker 1: of ten problem. But from the outside looking in, I

562
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 1: don't think anyone else would think that, but Mum does

563
00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 1: in the moment. And so when I was young and dumber,

564
00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:58,880
Speaker 1: I would try to go, Mum, you just like you're

565
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: just creating something out of nothing, There is no issue,

566
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:06,680
Speaker 1: you just invent Well. Not surprisingly, that didn't fucking help,

567
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 1: But that didn't give her like some light bulb moment

568
00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 1: of clarity and self awareness, right, So then I had

569
00:33:16,160 --> 00:33:19,560
Speaker 1: to learn to acknowledge what was actually going on, but

570
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 1: respect what was going on for mum. And what was

571
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 1: going on for Mum was this is a major problem,

572
00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:31,960
Speaker 1: and with this major problem comes anxiety and fear. And

573
00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:36,320
Speaker 1: so I'm respecting the emotional state and the feeling and

574
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 1: the personal reality that she is inhabiting, and I'm speaking

575
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:45,760
Speaker 1: to that person. I'm not speaking to the external issue.

576
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 1: Because if you look through the lens of empathy, and

577
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 1: you know what they call in psychology self other awareness.

578
00:33:55,960 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 1: You have this different experience versus Oh, Craig, the fucking

579
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:03,800
Speaker 1: fixes here, Hey, Greg, the fix a fuck off? Get

580
00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 1: in the car. You know we don't need that guy.

581
00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 1: You with me, Bobby.

582
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:14,280
Speaker 2: Totally. I feel like this is one of the biggest

583
00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 2: problems in relationships, and it's a massive cause of suffering

584
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:23,760
Speaker 2: for others and ourselves. Is the inability to see past

585
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:28,400
Speaker 2: our own thought processes, biases, and where we are in

586
00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:32,200
Speaker 2: the present moment and just sit with someone not based

587
00:34:32,239 --> 00:34:35,920
Speaker 2: on fixing their situation, but what is it like to

588
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 2: be that person in the moment. I just want to

589
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:41,759
Speaker 2: point something out because I was thinking about this in

590
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 2: the call today. I was thinking about you on my

591
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 2: way to an event because I was listening to your

592
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:56,000
Speaker 2: show with Cam and I've witnessed vicariously on a few

593
00:34:56,000 --> 00:35:00,840
Speaker 2: of your shows as of late, you challenge your own

594
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 2: perspective and thought process and kind of not moving beyond it,

595
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:11,160
Speaker 2: still holding it, but also considering what else might be

596
00:35:11,280 --> 00:35:15,000
Speaker 2: true and meeting your guests there, and I thought, wow,

597
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 2: you know, it's amazing to see like Harps like on

598
00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 2: a show in real time growing because you were doing

599
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:29,200
Speaker 2: it with Cam And I'm not going to get into

600
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,920
Speaker 2: where I how, but I've heard you do that on

601
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 2: a couple of other shows I've experienced to do that

602
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 2: with me, and I'm thinking, I just want to point

603
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:39,480
Speaker 2: that out because I don't know if you realize it

604
00:35:39,600 --> 00:35:43,239
Speaker 2: or you're noticing this, but I am seeing you as

605
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:48,799
Speaker 2: a person like my dear friend growing Yeah, even at

606
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:53,480
Speaker 2: your advanced stage. Ha ha, there it is, there, it is.

607
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:58,160
Speaker 1: Fuck, thank god you did that. I was getting so uncomfortable.

608
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:05,480
Speaker 1: Oh relief, But this is what I think, Like, you

609
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 1: know how people have to be right some people, and

610
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:14,360
Speaker 1: sometimes I've been that that people. And when I'm unemotional

611
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 1: as I can be, and I'm as objective as I

612
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 1: can be and I'm as self aware as I can be,

613
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 1: I look.

614
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 2: Back over the last say forty years of.

615
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:26,080
Speaker 1: Grown upness, and I go, how many times have you

616
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 1: made a mistake or how many times have you got

617
00:36:28,719 --> 00:36:31,399
Speaker 1: something wrong? I'd say, oh, fuck, I really don't know,

618
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:35,760
Speaker 1: but like very small to very big, probably multiple times

619
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:37,960
Speaker 1: a day. Well let's go, well that's five, let's go

620
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 1: forty years. Let's go two hundred times, three hundred and

621
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 1: sixty five days. You know, whatever, it's thousands or tens

622
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 1: of thousands of times, and I just go, well, of

623
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:51,839
Speaker 1: course I'm still getting things wrong, probably at the same

624
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:57,800
Speaker 1: rate or maybe higher. And so I think the having

625
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:04,080
Speaker 1: enough awareness and humility and courage, which I do not

626
00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:07,759
Speaker 1: always have, but to be able to go this is

627
00:37:07,840 --> 00:37:11,400
Speaker 1: what I really fucking think. But I could be wrong,

628
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: because I've been wrong many times. It's like you and

629
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,560
Speaker 1: I grew up in a pretty religious paradigm part of

630
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 1: our lives anyway, and so we had certain beliefs in

631
00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 1: data DA and I still have certain beliefs. But is

632
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 1: there a chance I'm wrong? Of course about some of it,

633
00:37:27,719 --> 00:37:30,360
Speaker 1: all of it, a bit of it, of course. So

634
00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:38,160
Speaker 1: my faith or my belief doesn't have to be wired

635
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:42,399
Speaker 1: into certainty or knowledge. It's like, well, of course there's

636
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:46,480
Speaker 1: you know, So I think that I actually think being

637
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:50,799
Speaker 1: okay with being wrong is just liberating.

638
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:51,840
Speaker 3: You know.

639
00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:55,240
Speaker 2: I think it makes life so much easier for you,

640
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 2: well by you, I mean us, Yes, yes, it's strength

641
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 2: things relationships, and I think I believe it expands your

642
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:08,840
Speaker 2: capacity for thought because you don't have to let go

643
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:13,120
Speaker 2: of your point of view in order to embrace somebody

644
00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:18,040
Speaker 2: else's point of view and know that both might be

645
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:24,160
Speaker 2: wrong correct somewhere in between, or it doesn't matter because

646
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:28,359
Speaker 2: that is their reality, and it is their reality infringing

647
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:31,360
Speaker 2: upon their life in a negative way or anybody else's.

648
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,239
Speaker 2: Is it depriving them from a fundamental right? If the

649
00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 2: answer is no, you're just talking about differences in perspective.

650
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:40,560
Speaker 2: And if everybody has the same perspective, the vast majority

651
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:43,319
Speaker 2: of us are redundant, aren't we. So I think it's

652
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:47,719
Speaker 2: like in NLP they call it different positions like first, second, third,

653
00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 2: and fourth. I think that's a powerful mental exercise where, Okay,

654
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 2: what is my point of view? Because if I'm going

655
00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 2: to be with you, I have to be anchored with me.

656
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 2: What do I believe? Okay, now here's my point of view.

657
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,960
Speaker 2: How can I step over to your side of the

658
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:09,919
Speaker 2: table and see the world through your eyes as much

659
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:13,880
Speaker 2: as possible? So let me take the perspective of Craig.

660
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 2: And then third position would be Tiffany, if I was

661
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:23,719
Speaker 2: sitting at this table and I was observing this conversation,

662
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:27,799
Speaker 2: what would be my point of view there? And then

663
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:34,399
Speaker 2: stepping even back one level beyond that, universally, what could

664
00:39:34,480 --> 00:39:37,680
Speaker 2: be interpreted from this and I think when you go

665
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,319
Speaker 2: through those different dvantage points, One, it mitigates a lot

666
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:46,000
Speaker 2: of anxiety and reactivity too, it connects you empathy, and three,

667
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:50,640
Speaker 2: I think it expands your capacity for thought and adaptability,

668
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:55,880
Speaker 2: which is a quintessential component of resilience. Yeah, love it,

669
00:39:56,160 --> 00:39:56,480
Speaker 2: love it.

670
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 1: I think I'm going to go to YouTube. I feel

671
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:04,799
Speaker 1: like a lot of times we want to be right

672
00:40:04,960 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 1: because the thing that we believe is a form of

673
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:13,600
Speaker 1: identity for us. It's like part of our identity is

674
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 1: tied into you know, like I used to anyway, I

675
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,759
Speaker 1: won't bang on about me, but do you feel like

676
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:24,319
Speaker 1: that ever? Like, oh, I'm this person or people see

677
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:26,440
Speaker 1: me as that person, so I've got to be that.

678
00:40:26,920 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: And also I want to be right because I want

679
00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: people to think I'm smart. And you know, it's like

680
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:35,759
Speaker 1: or you know, when people talk about who I am.

681
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:38,920
Speaker 1: I am a Christian, I am a vegetarian, I am

682
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:42,320
Speaker 1: a tennis player, I am a whatever, I'm a Manchester

683
00:40:42,480 --> 00:40:46,000
Speaker 1: United supporter, I am like we talk about something that

684
00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 1: isn't actually us and we make an im statement before it. Yeah,

685
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,479
Speaker 1: So I think it's really easy to get trapped into

686
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 1: that thing if you don't want to, especially if you

687
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:58,040
Speaker 1: believe something for twenty years.

688
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think just one an answer and certainty.

689
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,520
Speaker 3: And it's how we on one hand, we sit here

690
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,640
Speaker 3: and we always saying everyone's different. My answer is not

691
00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 3: your answer. Everyone needs something different. But then there's the

692
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:16,919
Speaker 3: other part of us that goes, this is what I've learned,

693
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 3: and this is how it is, and this is what

694
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:21,560
Speaker 3: I believe. And we have to remember that you're holding

695
00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:24,600
Speaker 3: those two things and you're speaking to a world of

696
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:28,440
Speaker 3: people that have that are that are different. So that

697
00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:30,640
Speaker 3: thing we believe and we said we have to realize

698
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:36,279
Speaker 3: is also extremely flawed for a lot of people. Yes, yes,

699
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:36,880
Speaker 3: and it's hard.

700
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:43,479
Speaker 1: Well, I've taught things to groups, like to audiences where

701
00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 1: now I'm like so embarrassed that I taught that. I'm like,

702
00:41:46,719 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 1: I've said things to a thousand people in a room

703
00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:52,959
Speaker 1: that bullshit, and now I like, oh fuck, I hope

704
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 1: nobody remembers that day.

705
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:57,040
Speaker 2: It was a while ago. I hope they don't remember that.

706
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,440
Speaker 1: I said that, because I know I was actually I

707
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 1: thought I was right talking about whatever it was, and

708
00:42:03,120 --> 00:42:06,960
Speaker 1: now I know I wasn't right, like factually scientifically, like

709
00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 1: you know, or I wasn't totally right. Is there anything

710
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:12,719
Speaker 1: that you used to teach Bobby or talk about with

711
00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:15,640
Speaker 1: a level of certainty that you now go? What the fuck?

712
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:19,960
Speaker 2: Was I thinking? Yeah, nearly eighty percent of what I

713
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:23,200
Speaker 2: used to teach, because that's the key word there, right.

714
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:27,200
Speaker 2: It's not that I believe this and I thought it

715
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:31,839
Speaker 2: was useful and I conveyed it. It's I taught that

716
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 2: with so much certainty because I strongly believed this is

717
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:41,439
Speaker 2: not how I am, this is how the world is. Wow.

718
00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 2: And that's a major blind spot. And I think what

719
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:48,440
Speaker 2: Tiff was talking about earlier with reflecting after the fact

720
00:42:48,520 --> 00:42:52,279
Speaker 2: on emotional states and responses is critical because when we

721
00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:55,600
Speaker 2: don't do that, when we don't acknowledge an emotion, it

722
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 2: comes out in so much uglier ways. For me, it

723
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:02,719
Speaker 2: was certainty and judgment about how people should live when

724
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,840
Speaker 2: I was in my twenties, like about how people should work,

725
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:08,279
Speaker 2: which was pretty much all the time, and think about

726
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:10,800
Speaker 2: nothing else because everything else is a feud to waste

727
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:15,840
Speaker 2: of time or I had a guest on well, I

728
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:19,480
Speaker 2: guess this is our show, so this show years back.

729
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:23,200
Speaker 2: I forgot his name, and he pointed out how we

730
00:43:23,200 --> 00:43:26,440
Speaker 2: were having a similar conversation, how one of my behaviors

731
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,279
Speaker 2: is highly narcissistic. Now, he did not say that I

732
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:34,520
Speaker 2: am a narcissist. He just said that my behavior patterns

733
00:43:34,520 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 2: were narcissistic. And it comes down to I think the

734
00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:41,799
Speaker 2: example was if I say I'm going to clean out

735
00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:46,200
Speaker 2: the dishwasher and then Amy comes home and I forgot

736
00:43:46,239 --> 00:43:50,279
Speaker 2: to clean out the dishwasher. Yes, I mentioned earlier that

737
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:54,480
Speaker 2: one of the emotional states that is problematic for me

738
00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:57,880
Speaker 2: is when I feel I have failed someone. And what

739
00:43:58,239 --> 00:44:00,920
Speaker 2: I would do in that funny story about work not

740
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:03,200
Speaker 2: too funny, what I would do is I would get

741
00:44:03,239 --> 00:44:07,719
Speaker 2: into oh my god, I'm horrible. I would just completely

742
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:12,400
Speaker 2: come undone and self loath. And he's like, okay, So

743
00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 2: now your wife not only has to deal with the

744
00:44:16,200 --> 00:44:19,400
Speaker 2: fact that after a long day and you were supposed

745
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,920
Speaker 2: to do something, you broke a promise. Not intentionally, but

746
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:25,120
Speaker 2: you broke a promise. She also now has to deal

747
00:44:25,120 --> 00:44:28,879
Speaker 2: with your emotions about it. So now it's all about you.

748
00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 2: That's that's narcissistic behavior. You might feel horrible and communicate

749
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:39,279
Speaker 2: that you feel horrible. What she really needs is, yes,

750
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,640
Speaker 2: I drop the ball on that, And this is how

751
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:45,760
Speaker 2: I'm going to make sure this doesn't happen again, because

752
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:48,080
Speaker 2: you've got a lot of shit on and when you

753
00:44:48,120 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 2: asked me to clear out the dishwasher and I agree

754
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:54,280
Speaker 2: to it, you probably should have the confidence that it's done.

755
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:56,520
Speaker 2: So the other day at work, real fast this was

756
00:44:56,880 --> 00:45:00,840
Speaker 2: not great. So I was trying, I want to remember

757
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,640
Speaker 2: an acronym of an event that I got accepted to

758
00:45:04,680 --> 00:45:07,640
Speaker 2: speak at, and I'm communicating with one of my partners

759
00:45:08,280 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 2: and I forgot the name, and I was like, she

760
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:13,759
Speaker 2: is going to be so disappointed in me. She's not

761
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 2: going to know who I'm talking about. And she's like,

762
00:45:16,120 --> 00:45:20,280
Speaker 2: WHOA what is this? I don't remember? And thinking about

763
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:23,879
Speaker 2: her disappointment in me forgetting the acronym of the organization,

764
00:45:24,719 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 2: I start like trying to copy and paste the acceptance

765
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:30,880
Speaker 2: letter of the signature, and as I'm doing that, I'm

766
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:34,280
Speaker 2: struggling to copy and paste and I didn't even realize

767
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:36,480
Speaker 2: I said this. It must have been a Tourette's moment,

768
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:42,880
Speaker 2: but I was like, you are so stupid, and I

769
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:46,279
Speaker 2: didn't realize I had my voice dictation button on. So

770
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:49,520
Speaker 2: the message I sent to my colleague was, hey, I

771
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:56,520
Speaker 2: got accepted for both of these submissions. You are so stupid. Hey,

772
00:45:56,560 --> 00:46:00,359
Speaker 2: oh that is great. That is great. Yeah, I hope

773
00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:05,239
Speaker 2: you going through hell right now. Not if you're in HR.

774
00:46:05,360 --> 00:46:07,759
Speaker 2: It's not great now because it was obvious, there was

775
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:10,279
Speaker 2: no context why I would say that. But she was like,

776
00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:14,120
Speaker 2: explain yourself, what do you mean I'm so stupid? I

777
00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:17,160
Speaker 2: was like, what what do you mean? You're stupid? And

778
00:46:17,239 --> 00:46:21,680
Speaker 2: I looked and I realized voice dictation was on. Now

779
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:25,360
Speaker 2: I wasn't talking to her, I was talking to me,

780
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:30,360
Speaker 2: and I didn't even realize I said that all because

781
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 2: of that pattern, Like I should know this acronym. It's

782
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 2: a stupid little thing. But I blew it up in

783
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:41,320
Speaker 2: my mind. And then I said something really unkind to myself,

784
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,560
Speaker 2: sent it over, which she for a second could have

785
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 2: interpreted as aimed at her. It's extremely destructive to not

786
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:52,840
Speaker 2: deal with your emotions and your triggers.

787
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:58,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, wow, dude, that is But I had done

788
00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:01,480
Speaker 1: do that to yourself, done to that either. You know,

789
00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:05,320
Speaker 1: you're a little battler, but you're right, you're a little

790
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 1: ussy batla.

791
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 2: But the thing is, I didn't realize I did it.

792
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:12,319
Speaker 2: It's not like I consciously said it. Mus it's it's kind.

793
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:13,960
Speaker 2: I don't want to blame it on Touret's but it

794
00:47:14,040 --> 00:47:16,799
Speaker 2: was like a terrest moment. I had no idea that

795
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:20,480
Speaker 2: I ever uttered that. Even after the fact, no clue.

796
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 2: When I looked at the message, I was astonished. I

797
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:27,880
Speaker 2: was like, really, I said that about myself in that

798
00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:31,759
Speaker 2: moment and sent that over. Actually, that's not great.

799
00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 1: I so want you to have a live on the

800
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:38,640
Speaker 1: stage Turett's moment, which is very unfair of me. But fuck,

801
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:39,240
Speaker 1: ID love.

802
00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:43,839
Speaker 2: That all that that that'll never happen because stage is

803
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:50,080
Speaker 2: that environment is the most conducive to controlling your terrest's symptoms.

804
00:47:50,480 --> 00:47:53,880
Speaker 2: You're putting out a ton of physical energy with complete

805
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:57,040
Speaker 2: intense mental focus. That is the last place I would

806
00:47:57,040 --> 00:47:57,279
Speaker 2: do that.

807
00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:01,640
Speaker 1: There's this kid must have made and it was years ago. Now,

808
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:03,920
Speaker 1: who was on Australian Idol. Do you know a singer

809
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:09,359
Speaker 1: called Delta Gudrum Bobby now okay, so very well known

810
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:12,920
Speaker 1: Australian singer, great singer, bye bah blah. Anyway, she was

811
00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:16,040
Speaker 1: one of the judges and this young dude had all

812
00:48:16,160 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 1: kinds of fucking savage ticks and Tourette's and busy. You know,

813
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 1: it's busy, and then when he sang, it all went

814
00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:29,799
Speaker 1: away and he could sing like an angel. So anyway, huh,

815
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:36,320
Speaker 1: so good, so good. So he sings and he's fucking amazing,

816
00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 1: and Delta comes up to give him a hug, and

817
00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:43,879
Speaker 1: Delta's giving him a hug, and he goes on.

818
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,399
Speaker 4: National television Delta's Hot, Delta's Hot.

819
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:53,240
Speaker 1: And it was just the best. It was the best

820
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 1: because he was like seventeen or something, and I don't know,

821
00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:59,359
Speaker 1: she was probably twenty eight and gorgeous, and it was

822
00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:02,319
Speaker 1: just my go that's the best thing ever. And like

823
00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:08,279
Speaker 1: people Jersey, she took it great. She was great. Yeah,

824
00:49:08,360 --> 00:49:10,759
Speaker 1: everybody loved it. Everybody knew what was going on.

825
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 2: You know.

826
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:15,600
Speaker 1: It was kind of like, oh my god, but also

827
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:19,279
Speaker 1: hilarious and also sweet. So I wonder what that little

828
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:20,879
Speaker 1: dude's name is and where is that now?

829
00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:23,160
Speaker 2: To you?

830
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:26,400
Speaker 1: If any final thoughts or wisdom that you want to

831
00:49:26,400 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 1: impart with us to bullfheads or the non buffheads in

832
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:30,760
Speaker 1: our audience.

833
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:33,800
Speaker 3: Nothing here, harps. I might just drop into Overwhelm a

834
00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 3: few minutes before Bobby.

835
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:42,160
Speaker 1: Actually, yeah, okay, Bobby's got seven minutes, seven minutes away,

836
00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:45,680
Speaker 1: seven minutes away from overwhelmed, so enjoy that. Maybe get

837
00:49:45,719 --> 00:49:46,799
Speaker 1: yourself a drink.

838
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:50,600
Speaker 2: Minutes. Sex is going to be rough, I know what's common.

839
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:59,319
Speaker 1: Yeah. So Bobby's podcast is called the Self Help Antidote.

840
00:50:00,480 --> 00:50:00,880
Speaker 2: Uh.

841
00:50:01,120 --> 00:50:03,280
Speaker 1: Tis podcast is called Roll with the Punches.

842
00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 2: Uh.

843
00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:10,799
Speaker 1: Bobby can be found on LinkedIn, and he has a

844
00:50:10,840 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 1: website called is it Robert Capuccio dot com?

845
00:50:15,080 --> 00:50:17,759
Speaker 2: Yeah? Coincidentally enough, Yeah, I.

846
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 1: Couldn't remember if it was fucking pony Boy or Robert.

847
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:25,839
Speaker 1: I think that's us, Tiff, that I forget anything for you.

848
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:30,000
Speaker 1: Tiff enjoys water sports and meeting people, but not anymore

849
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 1: because she's got the fucking she's got the goat, she's

850
00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:36,840
Speaker 1: got the fucking cooda, she's got the don't worry about that.

851
00:50:36,920 --> 00:50:41,319
Speaker 1: She's got the number one fucking boy in town, much

852
00:50:41,400 --> 00:50:47,760
Speaker 1: to everyone's surprise, and that, oh support something so funny

853
00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:51,760
Speaker 1: to say nine of my audience would be like, you're

854
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,040
Speaker 1: the best ten percent of I'm going to send you

855
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,600
Speaker 1: a fucking email. I can't. I can't. I'll tell you off, heir,

856
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:02,359
Speaker 1: But I know listeners, if we didn't have, like you know,

857
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 1: all those people who send me emails that I totally deserve.

858
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 1: By the way, I could tell you, but I can't.

859
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:13,320
Speaker 2: How should have a blooper's link so you could share

860
00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:17,040
Speaker 2: it with the audience, And then, because it's a blooper's link,

861
00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:20,239
Speaker 2: anyone that's offended, but they click on it anyway, they've

862
00:51:20,280 --> 00:51:21,680
Speaker 2: only got themselves to blame.

863
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:24,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and fuck you?

864
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:25,560
Speaker 2: Yeah good?

865
00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:32,000
Speaker 1: All right? What are they both next? No? And see

866
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:32,920
Speaker 1: you both next time.