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Speaker 1: This is what the flus I'm the and it's Monday,

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Speaker 1: twenty seventh of October. Today Brett and Justin will be

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Speaker 1: doing a deep dive interview with Adam Schwab, CEO and

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Speaker 1: co founder of Luxury Escapes. But before that, here are

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Speaker 1: the top three business news stories from Australia and around

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Speaker 1: the world. After a bullish eighteen months, gold price has

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Speaker 1: suffered their biggest one day crash since COVID, dragging down

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Speaker 1: the share price of major mining companies on the ASX.

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Speaker 1: After the crash, gold prices were down by almost seven percent,

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Speaker 1: while silver tumbled more than eight percent. In other news,

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Speaker 1: Open Ai announced the launch of Atlas, their new AI

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Speaker 1: powered search browser built to rival Google Chrome. Fifteen minutes

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Speaker 1: after the announcement, Google shares plummeted by one hundred billion dollars.

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Speaker 1: And finally, Westpack have agreed to assex twenty million dollar

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Speaker 1: fine for misconduct within the Westpac owned RAMS homelow network.

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Speaker 1: Following investigations, the RAMS mortgage broking franchise has effectively been

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Speaker 1: shut down. That's it from me today. I'll pass it

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Speaker 1: over to bretton Justin for their in depth and entertaining conversation.

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Speaker 2: With Adam Foxam. Today we are very excited to be

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Speaker 2: joined by Adam Schraub, co founder and CEO of Luxury Escapes.

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Speaker 2: Adam has built one of Australia's most successful travel brands

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Speaker 2: from the ground up, taking a leap from a legal career,

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Speaker 2: surviving some of the most difficult years in travel, and

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Speaker 2: now leading a global business that connects millions of people

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Speaker 2: to luxury ghetaways. In our conversation today, we're going to

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Speaker 2: go deep into how he's thought about risk, culture and growth,

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Speaker 2: but also what luxury travel might look like in the

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Speaker 2: next ten years. Trobby, Welcome to What the Flux in conversation.

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Speaker 3: This is a massive one. My goal was to one

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Speaker 3: day get on yourself finally done it. It's done it

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Speaker 3: about eight years, but made it.

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Speaker 2: You've been a huge ambassador for us as well, so

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Speaker 2: big thank you for promoting What the Flux to all

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Speaker 2: your podcast listeners.

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Speaker 3: We appreciate it well. I think your listeners would love

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Speaker 3: to know that you were one of our very early

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Speaker 3: employees at a business we called My Table that was

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Speaker 3: frankly a terrible business, but not because of you. You

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Speaker 3: were the shining light. We actually sold that business to

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Speaker 3: gapin has yet catch you sold it to Menulogue, so

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Speaker 3: possibly the greatest result for the worst business in Australia.

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Speaker 2: Amazing. We're going to get into that, don't worry. So

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Speaker 2: we took us through your career. As I said, you

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Speaker 2: started as a lawyer. Where's it gone since then? Obviously

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Speaker 2: to greater heights.

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Speaker 3: So it was a lawyer literally about one hundred meters

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Speaker 3: where we're sitting right now in a firm called Free

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Speaker 3: Hills that's turned for another firm since then. We then,

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Speaker 3: me and my co founder guy called Jeremy Sham started

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Speaker 3: a backpacker apartments business, one of the least glamorous businesses

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Speaker 3: you could ever imagine, And if you think it's not glamorous,

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Speaker 3: it's even worse than you think. We literally put it

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Speaker 3: together the furniture we were moving. We wanted to move

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Speaker 3: tenants to a different apartment, like literally moving sack of

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Speaker 3: old potato. So it was. It was about as unglamorous

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Speaker 3: you could expect, but certainly taught us some perseverance and grit.

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Speaker 3: We then com pivoted to a corporate apartment's business, a

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Speaker 3: bit more of a stable business, still unglamorous, still hard work,

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Speaker 3: and still very unscalable. So it started at twenty four,

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Speaker 3: did out til twenty nine and bought and sold some

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Speaker 3: properties and had this million dollar sort of win for

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Speaker 3: from buying and selling apartments that we were renting ourselves,

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Speaker 3: and we so, what can we do here? We were

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Speaker 3: sort of two thousand and eight, two thousand and nine

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Speaker 3: Web two point zero sort of kicking off, and we

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Speaker 3: started that business called my Table that you were a business,

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Speaker 3: fantastic employee of horrendous business. And also started a business

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Speaker 3: called zupon, which became deals dot com dot Are You,

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Speaker 3: which became essentially sort of a predeces of Luxury Escape.

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Speaker 3: So had it sort of this great for way in

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Speaker 3: to learn the caper two years of deals dot com,

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Speaker 3: which is really a business based on group on in

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Speaker 3: the States, sort of marketing business for small business, and

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Speaker 3: it was an interesting business to run. We learned a lot.

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Speaker 3: We learned how to treat customers, we learned how to

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Speaker 3: work with vendors, we learned how to work with staff.

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Speaker 3: We went from zero staff to thirty thirty five, and

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Speaker 3: then we bought a bunch of businesses and we realized

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Speaker 3: pretty quickly that the experienced stuff was okay, but travel

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Speaker 3: was a much better business, much higher we call AOV

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Speaker 3: average order value I think you've talked out on the show,

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Speaker 3: and great brand. So we could take this luxury Escapes

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Speaker 3: brand to customers and they really liked it and hotels

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Speaker 3: loved working with us. We found this what you can

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Speaker 3: call a flywheel or a virtuous cycle, which is greating,

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Speaker 3: great value for customers, so great discounts on amazing holidays,

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Speaker 3: great curation, and we we're rather to make lots of

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Speaker 3: money for our hotel partners as well. So creating this

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Speaker 3: really rare win win in commerce. And when we started business,

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Speaker 3: we knew nothing about travel. We'd never stayed a fast

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Speaker 3: our resort like we'd stayed at like overtels or whatever.

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Speaker 3: We never stayed at like the high end places. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: we certainly didn't know how travel, and that was an

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Speaker 3: advantage in the end because we had zero industry knowledge.

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Speaker 3: We kind of fumbled our way through, created a new

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Speaker 3: sector in a way, and have kind of built a

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Speaker 3: travel business on the back of our complete ignorance and stupid.

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Speaker 2: In So, did you offer some deals for travel within

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Speaker 2: deals dot com, dou and that's how you realized the

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Speaker 2: luxury escapes business exactly.

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Speaker 3: So we people come to us actually, and we had

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Speaker 3: a guy called Mark who I went to Union with

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Speaker 3: as a good friend of mine. And this guy Mark

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Speaker 3: was probably the best negotiator in Australia. So he would

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Speaker 3: rock up to a a Bintan T shirt and thongs

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Speaker 3: to Italian hotel and do a million old deal. And

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Speaker 3: what made him so good was he put himself in

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Speaker 3: the shoes of the hotel. He'd also put himself into

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Speaker 3: the shoes of the customer, So do both. That's really rare,

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Speaker 3: and we've got a team that does this now, incredible

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Speaker 3: and he sort of was the first to do that

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Speaker 3: and did an unbelievable job, which was working hard, and

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Speaker 3: Josh was working hard, and I was sort of there

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Speaker 3: and all was at SFR. We were sort of all

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Speaker 3: over the place, and we sort of built this incredible

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Speaker 3: team of generalists initially and then as you get better

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Speaker 3: and better, you because you start hiring specialists. And we

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Speaker 3: hired our amazing CTO Shi nine years ago and left Amazon,

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Speaker 3: came back and built our development team from twenty five

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Speaker 3: people to one hundred and thirty people now, so we're

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Speaker 3: really a tech driven business now more than a travel business.

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Speaker 4: Was there ever a stage once you'd made that decision

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Speaker 4: to go all in on travel, that you really doubted

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Speaker 4: or had any uncertainty about the direction that you decided

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Speaker 4: to go down.

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Speaker 3: It was actually the opposite. We took way too long

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Speaker 3: to do what you like. What you used to do

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Speaker 3: was a sensible thing. Yeah, but it's really hard when

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Speaker 3: you're when you're in the thick of it. And the

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Speaker 3: first year we did it, we did a deal with

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Speaker 3: the Catch of the Day. You guys catch a day

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Speaker 3: tragically rest in peace, West Farmers. Before that was an

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Speaker 3: incredibly commerce business. It was the brand. I used to say,

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Speaker 3: We're like a catch to day for travel. And now

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Speaker 3: everybody's gotten about catching. People know us. But back in

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Speaker 3: the day we looked up to Gabi and Hesi who

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Speaker 3: ran catches, these sort of oracles of e comment as

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Speaker 3: they were we had to deal with. We sold them out.

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Speaker 3: We had these product businesses, we had experience, and we

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Speaker 3: were just a complete can I say shit show on

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Speaker 3: the show? What we were? A complete shit show, a

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Speaker 3: bunch of different stuff. When we tried to list at

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Speaker 3: one point and investors basically laughed us and said, why

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Speaker 3: the hell you You guys liked three businesses. While we

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Speaker 3: we love this travel thing, we hate this stuff like

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Speaker 3: experience is okay, we hate this product stuff. Temple Webs

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Speaker 3: did a great we couldn't quite get to what not hated,

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Speaker 3: so we did a great deal of Gavin Hazy. We

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Speaker 3: became travel only in twenty seventeen, so it took us

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Speaker 3: really caught it four years since Luxury Escapes officially came

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Speaker 3: into being, so we deals to come before that lucture

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Speaker 3: of SCAP twenty and thirteen travel only twenty seventeen. It

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Speaker 3: took us four years to kind of do what you

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Speaker 3: just said in the sentence, because we were just pretty

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Speaker 3: stupid in venice, and the first year of it was

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Speaker 3: actually not great because you have what's called discynergies or

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Speaker 3: dis economies of scale, where we were had a shared

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Speaker 3: back end. When you go to travel only, you suddenly

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Speaker 3: have pretty similar costs but obviously less revenue in the

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Speaker 3: short term. So it took us a year of kind

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Speaker 3: of pain to get to where we need to get

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Speaker 3: to stage one, and then we got travel kind of

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Speaker 3: settled by twenty nineteen. Did us private equity process back

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Speaker 3: in two thousy nineteen COVID happened, Thank god, because the

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Speaker 3: thisiness is far more avaiable now. But twenty twenty we

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Speaker 3: started building a marketplace essentially, so not just our sort

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Speaker 3: of famous flash deals that people know and love. We

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Speaker 3: started building a bit of a mini book dot com

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Speaker 3: in a way, and that's now about half our business.

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Speaker 3: And we've grown sort of three x since COVID in

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Speaker 3: terms of revenue, probably ten x in profitability, two extemps

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Speaker 3: of staff developments, three x four xs of the team,

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Speaker 3: So we've really transformed the business since twenty twenty. So

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Speaker 3: it's kind of had look at our career, it's been

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Speaker 3: like six or seven different chapters or pivots, and each

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Speaker 3: one building on the learnings of the one before, but

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Speaker 3: then very different. And now I've settled in being a

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Speaker 3: travel only business. We understand travel a lot more. Now

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Speaker 3: we're probably the biggest seller of hotels for leisure in Australia. Now,

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Speaker 3: if you asked me ten years ago, I'd say I'm

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Speaker 3: just laugh at you, because nobody in the right mine

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Speaker 3: would have thought that. But I had chipped away, started

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Speaker 3: to understand competitive vantage and sort of built our way

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Speaker 3: to a business that we never would have dreamed of

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Speaker 3: ten years ago.

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Speaker 2: You touched on COVID and how you were going through

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Speaker 2: that listing process during COVID when the world was collapsing,

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Speaker 2: were you also thinking, shit, this might be the end

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Speaker 2: of luxury escapes as well, or did you have a

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Speaker 2: vision that COVID will land will be back? Like what

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Speaker 2: did that look like for you?

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Speaker 3: I'm generally, even my podcast, maybe you wouldn't think that,

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Speaker 3: but a generally a pretty relaxed time business. We don't.

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Speaker 3: I don't, and just to an extent as well, But

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Speaker 3: I tend to not get overly optimistic or pessimistic. I

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Speaker 3: generally think things tend to work themselves out. COVID has

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Speaker 3: always got to end. I was saying that from pretty

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Speaker 3: early in COVID, But the first maybe the first week

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Speaker 3: was a little bit nerve wracking, but I was never

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Speaker 3: I never thought it would I thought I think we

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Speaker 3: all thought were over. The three months probably should have been,

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Speaker 3: but it wasn't. But probably within three four months we

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Speaker 3: knew to be fine. We need to cash, Like survival

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Speaker 3: goes go from profit to cash, can you maintain cash?

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Speaker 3: And we've got We're really lucky. Got an MPs of

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Speaker 3: seventy three, probably on the highest in commerce full stop

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Speaker 3: let alone travel, which sends to have a lower MPs.

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Speaker 3: So we've got a lot of customer love and we

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Speaker 3: sell a non unit. We sell a unique, non commoditized product,

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Speaker 3: so people were much more willing to keep their purchase

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Speaker 3: on credit on foot rather than if you're buying a

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Speaker 3: booking dot Com or quantas air ticket, it's commoditized was

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Speaker 3: we'll buy it again later. You can't buy out deals again,

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Speaker 3: so they're unique. So we were lucky that almost all

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Speaker 3: our customers were happy to keep their packages on hold

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Speaker 3: or transferred to credit and buy something in Australia, so

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Speaker 3: our cash balance didnt actually drop it all during COVID,

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Speaker 3: although we were losing money when you wo'll be able

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Speaker 3: to survive. We didn't want to do a diluted capital

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Speaker 3: raise early in COVID. Like pretty much everyone, even the

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Speaker 3: great travel businesses of the airbnbs, the web jets, the

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Speaker 3: flight centers, had to really diluted capital raises very early

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Speaker 3: in COVID. We were lucky we're at private for one

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Speaker 3: and we had that unusual non commoditized product range, so

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Speaker 3: we did a cap raise at very first. We're bootstrapped

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Speaker 3: or twenty twenty two did a raige with the amazing

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Speaker 3: guys up year twelve who did a really fair deal

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Speaker 3: and Campbell's been on by board has been incredible. So

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Speaker 3: we were able to avoid the dolution the pretty much

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Speaker 3: every our travel company had. And we also grew our team.

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Speaker 3: So every other travel business sacked either a little or

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Speaker 3: a lot of people during COVID, we grew our team.

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Speaker 3: So that's just the benefit luck of being private and

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Speaker 3: having this weird cash profile. So COVID was invertcom was

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Speaker 3: really unlucky for travel but really lucky for us. We

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Speaker 3: were able to sort of caught four or five x

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Speaker 3: value value of the business due to being this is

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Speaker 3: really fortunate position.

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Speaker 4: And for the Flex family's benefit, where is Luxury Escapes

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Speaker 4: at now all these years past that, how big is

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Speaker 4: the team to the extent you can share with revenue

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Speaker 4: at bookings?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so we I looked at our or we did

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Speaker 3: a twenty fourteen were called a path find a perspective.

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Speaker 3: So this was just ridiculous that we thought we could

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Speaker 3: list at that time, but we did any and I

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Speaker 3: was actually reading through that just a few days ago,

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Speaker 3: and we had three hundred staff back then. We've only

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Speaker 3: we've actually got six twenty, so the staff size has

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Speaker 3: actually increased that much since twenty five. We're probably if

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Speaker 3: you go back then, we're probably that Back then the

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Speaker 3: travel bus one hundred million bucks, TV were about one

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Speaker 3: point three billion. Now it's just about thirty and x

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Speaker 3: in termat and since COVID we're about three to four

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Speaker 3: x top one profits many more multiple that won't disclose

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Speaker 3: profits specifically, but you can go to actick and probably

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Speaker 3: find it if you want to. But we're we're actually

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Speaker 3: in the find financial review recently, so we're hoping to

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Speaker 3: do we only we budgeted fifty meal this year. We're

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Speaker 3: hoping to significantly beat that. We're trading well ahead of

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Speaker 3: that now in terms of EBIT, and yeah, we go

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Speaker 3: revenue first. This finitchuse so about forty percent you're on year,

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Speaker 3: which is a lot for US US a bit lower,

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Speaker 3: so we budget a sort of a twenty percent level.

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Speaker 3: We've had a pretty nice tale when this year, good

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Speaker 3: things come to an end. So we're paranoid optimists. We

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Speaker 3: want to do well. We're always really worried about what

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Speaker 3: could knock us about, and not that we'd sit up

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Speaker 3: or not thinking about it. We plow ahead, but we're

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Speaker 3: always very cognizant of what can go wrong, and we've

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Speaker 3: really shifted the business and this is a lot my

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Speaker 3: co host has really driven this. As a bad Ecgreans,

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Speaker 3: we really focused on how do we build competitive avantage?

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Speaker 3: So as a business, you guess would try and get

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Speaker 3: product market fit, and you guys talk about this on

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Speaker 3: your pod a lot, but go from product market fit

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Speaker 3: to competitive advantage is a big jump. Hamilton Helmer talked

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Speaker 3: a lot about this, and acquired podcasts talked about this.

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Speaker 3: How to build brand and what he builds brand and

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Speaker 3: you know about that heavy build scale economies again a

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Speaker 3: pretty obvious one for us. How do we build switching

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Speaker 3: costs is a really big one. We launched two loyalty

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Speaker 3: program and actually one's called Lux Plus. It's getting to

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Speaker 3: one hundred thousand members that pay two fifty bucks per

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Speaker 3: person per year. And these members have far better engagement

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Speaker 3: with us. They're buying sort of fifty percent more stuff

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Speaker 3: than non members. It's behavior economics in real life. If

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Speaker 3: you look at cardam and to Worsking, you guys talking

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Speaker 3: about them on the show, it is real life think.

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Speaker 3: It's low and fast, real life pavor economics. We've also

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Speaker 3: launched a program called Society, which is our version of

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Speaker 3: Quantus Frek and Flyer, which has been incredible as well.

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Speaker 3: So you earn status credits when you bunk, so you

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Speaker 3: go from Bronze to Silver to Goal to Platinum and

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Speaker 3: get lots of really great stuff. And you're getting points

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Speaker 3: that you can earn and burn. And we'll hopefully release

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Speaker 3: a credit card in the next few months or the

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Speaker 3: next three or four months as well to earn points,

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Speaker 3: which is pretty topical. Guys, you've talked about the RBA

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Speaker 3: changes every credit card, slashing the pointing get will be

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Speaker 3: the most generous credit card in the trade by long way.

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Speaker 3: So we want to create a loyalty every other loyalty.

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Speaker 3: And this is they're almost a victim of their own success.

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Speaker 3: Quantus Frequent Flyer, Velocity is such good programs that and

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Speaker 3: Amex as well. To extent, they're just trying, how do

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Speaker 3: we we don't need to be so generous, we can

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Speaker 3: actually become less generous because that customers are so wedded

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Speaker 3: to us. We're taking approach where a challenger loyalty program,

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Speaker 3: we're going to be the most generous lawty, generous lawty

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Speaker 3: program in the world. We're going to become more and

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Speaker 3: more generous rather than less and less generous as we

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Speaker 3: get better and better at it.

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Speaker 2: Interesting trouble we want to ask you. We ask five

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Speaker 2: questions to all of our guests on the show. So,

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Speaker 2: if you weren't leading luxury escapes, what's a job that

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Speaker 2: you'd secretly or not so secretly love to try? Apart

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Speaker 2: from podcasting, which you already try.

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Speaker 3: Producer of the Flot of the Flux will probably be

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Speaker 3: out there on the list, probably writing something not for profits,

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Speaker 3: doing a sort of not for profit business, if that

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Speaker 3: makes sense. So divindend, is the money in your pocket

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Speaker 3: got to be something I'd love to do?

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Speaker 2: Is there any specific area that you'd be interested in?

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Speaker 3: Probably something around corporate governance that's a bit separate, but

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Speaker 3: probably something around kids like you. Look at guy raz

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Speaker 3: he's got how I built this? And he always asks

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Speaker 3: is a luck or skill? And in my view it

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Speaker 3: is not luck us It's like one hundred and ten

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Speaker 3: percent luck. And Jess and I have been so incredibly

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Speaker 3: lucky in our JOm like in every sense, like every

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Speaker 3: step of the way we means to lucky and this

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Speaker 3: is like luck compounding on lucky. So not just not

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Speaker 3: just being lucky to be born to a middle class

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Speaker 3: family in Australia. Then what you do to compound that

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Speaker 3: luck is double tripping. So it's like it's not even

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Speaker 3: like a fifty fifty, it's like more than a hundred

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Speaker 3: percent luck. So but there's a lot of people who

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Speaker 3: don't have this luck, and how do I use like

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Speaker 3: I've had to help people who have and have that

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Speaker 3: would be something I'd love to do. How what actually

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Speaker 3: that materializes in I don't know yet. I've always thought

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Speaker 3: by fifty five, I'd like to be sort of focusing

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Speaker 3: on that, unless on the for profit stuff. But you've

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Speaker 3: got to have a degree of capital be able to

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Speaker 3: do that. So that's involved in said we've got ten

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Speaker 3: more years to try and create as much varger as

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Speaker 3: we can and then hopefully how do you do and

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Speaker 3: you can't get you so well? And who dies rich

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Speaker 3: DICE's grace Like that's that's sort of a guy we'd

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Speaker 3: love to do and hopefully can get there.

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Speaker 4: Is there a leader inside business or outside of business

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Speaker 4: that has inspired you most in your life?

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Speaker 3: It's hard to be one. Specifically, if we go to

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Speaker 3: the obvious, the buffets and all those guys, that's true.

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Speaker 3: I've listened to most a Quiet episodes. There were so

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Speaker 3: many amazing founders and people who create value. Actually the

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Speaker 3: one lets just get his name right.

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Speaker 4: But you have a big build up now.

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Speaker 3: It was his first business, Chuck Feenie. I'm not sure

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Speaker 3: if you've heard of degree, but he also created something

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Speaker 3: else you know. Also, I'll put this question.

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Speaker 4: Later around what else is he created other than duty free?

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Speaker 4: I've got no idea.

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Speaker 3: What Wasl's biggest private equy firms called General Atlantic? Oh? Really,

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Speaker 3: basically General Antic gives us money to charity essentially, So

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Speaker 3: Chuck Fanny gave all his money away, so he Bakshi

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Speaker 3: before he died. And this is like tens of billions dollars.

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Speaker 3: So you look at him and created this incredible duty

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Speaker 3: free business, which is pretty impresive. You remember that. But

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Speaker 3: he also created GA which is an unbelievable propat equity firm,

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Speaker 3: So you look at him. It's pretty rare people have

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Speaker 3: two acts like that, Like a lot of people have

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Speaker 3: one act, and sometimes a business will have multiple acts

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Speaker 3: like Microsoft and Apple. But it's pretty rare person has

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Speaker 3: two incredible acts and he's done that.

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Speaker 2: Very cool. We've touched a lot on kind of the

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Speaker 2: COVID period. But were there any specifics, failures or setbacks

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Speaker 2: that you now look back as like a key turning

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Speaker 2: point in either your career or in luxury escapes as

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Speaker 2: a business.

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Speaker 3: It's been really two moments that were existential in our career.

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Speaker 3: First one was we were running the apartment's business. I

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Speaker 3: want me to the name, but a big developer who

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Speaker 3: was very vertical to built the buildings. They kept the

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Speaker 3: property management rights. They also had the cook Body Corporate

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Speaker 3: and they basically just we had a bunch of apartments.

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Speaker 3: They basically just lied to own, completely fraudulent. It should

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Speaker 3: have gone to jail, but no, no trade jail. But

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Speaker 3: they basically lied to these and said we're doing something,

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Speaker 3: we won't do it. And we went to VCAT. I

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Speaker 3: had fifty differ aplications like coming on the weekend and

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Speaker 3: to fill all these applications. We went to VCAT. We

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Speaker 3: won and they couldn't brought us out. We contacted as

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Speaker 3: many eight owners as we could, we couldn't get all

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Speaker 3: of them. Every only we spoke to gave us the

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Speaker 3: property managment rights. So as soon as we showed them

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Speaker 3: the knew these guys are lying. These guys now like

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Speaker 3: billionaires or whatever, but such as life. But we had

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Speaker 3: we lost that VCAT hearing business over. I'm back to

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Speaker 3: being a lawyer or back or whatever. So that was

401
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Speaker 3: one huge moment, and I was having sleepless night. It's

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Speaker 3: pretty rare I get stressed. I was stressed there because

403
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Speaker 3: that was a billion dollar business trying to crush us illegally.

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Speaker 3: Credit to VCAT. We got a great member who clearly

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Speaker 3: saw through these guys straight away and literally saved us.

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Speaker 3: They had to withdraw the notices. We could lease other apartments.

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Speaker 3: We were saved. We actually know that we were saved.

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Speaker 3: We pivoted the business from backpacker to corporate and that

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Speaker 3: was sort of created what became Lutu Escape essentially. The

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Speaker 3: other time was two thousand and probably tenty twelve. Deals

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Speaker 3: had always made money. We're a boot shop. We had

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Speaker 3: to make money. But we bought a bunch of businesses

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Speaker 3: and they had some debts with the integration costom wire

414
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Speaker 3: with thought and we were having this cash crunch. So

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Speaker 3: we got to December and January used to be our

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Speaker 3: worst months. Now January's their best month, but back then

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Speaker 3: it was our worst months and we're having what's called

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Speaker 3: a classical liquided crunch. So even though we'd always been profitable,

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Speaker 3: all these debts were you and we were literally running

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Speaker 3: out of cash. So we have to put money in

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Speaker 3: all the shelves, put Alan in. Mark the sales guy,

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Speaker 3: did this free deal, like we couldn't get hold of

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Speaker 3: someone this Vietnamese resort. He went enter a trade show,

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Speaker 3: found this guy somehow signed this deal. Saved us and

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Speaker 3: the loans as well. So we've got over that credit

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Speaker 3: crunch and we were off to the races straight after that.

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Speaker 3: That was another existential moment we came within probably days

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Speaker 3: of running it, and there's almost every business has had

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Speaker 3: this because to get it, to build a great business,

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Speaker 3: you've got to sort of you've got limited capital, you

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Speaker 3: to you're on the edge, and we generally we're pretty concerned.

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Speaker 3: We weren't on the edge other than this one time

433
00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:32,840
Speaker 3: where we didn't tend to go on the edge. Just

434
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:34,640
Speaker 3: we bought this business that had all these debts we

435
00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:37,560
Speaker 3: didn't know about. We just expanded too quickly, and we've

436
00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:39,640
Speaker 3: been much more conservative since then. So that's even during

437
00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:41,800
Speaker 3: CO That's why probably why we got through COVID because

438
00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:46,080
Speaker 3: in build conservatism. So those two instances were definitely extential,

439
00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:50,080
Speaker 3: definitely within days of dying, essentially, and both times made

440
00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:51,080
Speaker 3: us far far stronger.

441
00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,800
Speaker 4: Perfect question for you, is there one or a few

442
00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:56,040
Speaker 4: daily habits or rituals that set you up for your day.

443
00:16:56,920 --> 00:16:58,480
Speaker 3: I get up pretty early, so I tend to be

444
00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:00,560
Speaker 3: around five o'clock. I try and get to sleep. I

445
00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:02,680
Speaker 3: do some sort of excise every day. I've started running,

446
00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:04,480
Speaker 3: and I had a broken leg skiding with your boss.

447
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:06,680
Speaker 3: That's now a cup so I can start running again.

448
00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:09,399
Speaker 3: I'll go to PTE or or whatever. I play golf,

449
00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:10,840
Speaker 3: and then I'm patting to get into the office and

450
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:12,520
Speaker 3: work from the office sort of most days or every day.

451
00:17:12,520 --> 00:17:14,200
Speaker 3: I want. There's that many rituals, but I'm tending to

452
00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:16,800
Speaker 3: do something every morning, something exercise wise. And I don't

453
00:17:16,840 --> 00:17:18,280
Speaker 3: know fast as well, so I don't need till like

454
00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:21,080
Speaker 3: twelve top thirty one o'clock, so I can't excite.

455
00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:22,040
Speaker 2: No coffees as well.

456
00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:24,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, I drink water really and I don't need meat,

457
00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:26,040
Speaker 3: and I don't drink alcohol. I don't smoke, so I'm

458
00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,280
Speaker 3: pretty much boring. Guy on ear I want to write

459
00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:30,639
Speaker 3: an article for aboutw before it died, taking all this

460
00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:32,439
Speaker 3: stuff and saying part of the reason we're all put

461
00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:34,960
Speaker 3: a footstrap the business because Jess and I both we

462
00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:36,960
Speaker 3: never took drugs, weever smoked, we had all this. I

463
00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:40,000
Speaker 3: think how much money you waste smoking, taking drugs, drinking coffee.

464
00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:42,000
Speaker 3: It's like tens of thousands dollars. That was the money

465
00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:43,600
Speaker 3: we used to start our first business. And I wrote

466
00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:45,680
Speaker 3: this article and just goes, maybe look like such a loser.

467
00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:49,120
Speaker 3: I'm never really there's never like Beny to that stuff. Yeah.

468
00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:51,639
Speaker 3: So I'm hyperactive enough without it. So it's last time

469
00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:53,160
Speaker 3: I need as any kind of artificial stimulant.

470
00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:54,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and she'll be last one.

471
00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:54,720
Speaker 3: For you.

472
00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:57,439
Speaker 2: What's the best investment that you've ever made? And it

473
00:17:57,440 --> 00:17:59,320
Speaker 2: could be in money, could be in time, could be

474
00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,399
Speaker 2: in your energy as well, just investment. More broadly, I think.

475
00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:03,800
Speaker 3: You look at life and I think lots of people

476
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:05,080
Speaker 3: say this in scott At the Way says it's the

477
00:18:05,119 --> 00:18:07,240
Speaker 3: three most important things you do is where you live,

478
00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:09,080
Speaker 3: who you live with, and what you obviously live. Here

479
00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:11,760
Speaker 3: in Melbourne, I met my beautifulfe Leslian ten fifteen years

480
00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:13,879
Speaker 3: ago in the UK, randomly in a pub, but there

481
00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:17,160
Speaker 3: before I was leaving. Without her ability to tolerate my risk,

482
00:18:17,200 --> 00:18:19,280
Speaker 3: there's no way would have sort of done what we've done.

483
00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:20,919
Speaker 3: A lot of people would never have sort of liked

484
00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:23,600
Speaker 3: that we had a business who rolled everything on this

485
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:25,600
Speaker 3: new thing. So you need a partner's got a similar

486
00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,560
Speaker 3: level of risk tolerance and values and all that kind

487
00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:30,639
Speaker 3: of stuff. So that's been a great decision. I was

488
00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:33,520
Speaker 3: having two amazing kids, and I've said a great business

489
00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:35,760
Speaker 3: partner in jazz for more than twenty years now, with

490
00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:39,640
Speaker 3: really similar values and really similar commercial goals. Both very

491
00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:42,080
Speaker 3: not short term greeting at all. Both don't spend much

492
00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:44,080
Speaker 3: money on ourselves. I being able to take virtually no

493
00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:46,800
Speaker 3: salaries a whole existence, and if you get if I

494
00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:48,680
Speaker 3: had a life partner and a business partner with different

495
00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:50,639
Speaker 3: sort of morals and goals, that wouldn't have worked. But

496
00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:53,120
Speaker 3: that's been really important choosing our part and obviously working

497
00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:55,320
Speaker 3: with an amazing team and hiring people like Shy, people

498
00:18:55,320 --> 00:18:56,639
Speaker 3: like JD, people like that, and people have been with

499
00:18:56,720 --> 00:19:00,000
Speaker 3: us for sir ten plus years. He's pretty been great decisions.

500
00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:02,359
Speaker 2: Amazing Trobby, great to have you on the pod. We'll

501
00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:03,679
Speaker 2: have to get you on again, you'll have to come

502
00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:05,160
Speaker 2: in for an episode as well to do the five

503
00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:06,320
Speaker 2: minute bite sized news.

504
00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:08,160
Speaker 3: Well, I'm waiting to one of you guys on holiday again.

505
00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:09,840
Speaker 3: Hopefully I'll actual escape and I'll come in to place

506
00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:10,480
Speaker 3: the other Trobby.

507
00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:11,720
Speaker 2: Thanks so much for joining us on the pod.

508
00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:12,480
Speaker 3: Amazing guys,