1 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:08,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fear and Greed. One on one. I'm Sean Alma. 2 00:00:08,560 --> 00:00:10,440 Speaker 1: Every week I sit with a business leader and find 3 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 1: out everything I can about their world. Last week I 4 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: shared the first half of my interview with Westpac CEO 5 00:00:15,920 --> 00:00:18,560 Speaker 1: Anthony Miller. Today we dive into the second half of 6 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 1: the conversation, which was recorded in front of a live 7 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 1: audience hosted by the Trans Tasman Business Circle. Okay, you 8 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 1: mentioned your submission to the Economic roundtable that's coming up 9 00:00:32,720 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: next month. The very first point Westpac may was on housing. 10 00:00:38,159 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: Tell me how do we solve the housing crisis? 11 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 2: First of all is a very hard question. I think 12 00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 2: a couple of things. One is there's a tremendous amount 13 00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:57,920 Speaker 2: of alignment right across community, government or layers of government, regulators, business, union, 14 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:00,360 Speaker 2: et cetera. That we've got to solve this and it 15 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 2: cannot be and we cannot be the number one country 16 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 2: in the world if we don't solve this challenge. Everyone 17 00:01:06,240 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 2: in Australia should feel and have the ability to say, 18 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,960 Speaker 2: if I can, I will be able to buy a property. 19 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 2: You know that we give them that hope and at 20 00:01:17,360 --> 00:01:21,440 Speaker 2: the moment, the worry is that that is not something 21 00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 2: that we're delivering on. So I think it's great that 22 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,120 Speaker 2: everyone's aligned around it. What we need to do is 23 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:31,280 Speaker 2: just really go after those approval processes. Many of the 24 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 2: initiatives and many of the ideas that have been promoted 25 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 2: around housing over the course of the last five plus 26 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:41,440 Speaker 2: years have really focused a lot more on the demand side, 27 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:43,479 Speaker 2: and what we really need to do is to focus 28 00:01:43,520 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 2: a lot more on the supply side and getting more 29 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 2: houses at the right price point into the marketplace. And 30 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:57,600 Speaker 2: so approval processes in many ways are too slow, too inconsistent. 31 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 2: There's other things we reckon. Meant you could, for example, 32 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:05,560 Speaker 2: remove the upfront costs that's imposed upon the developer and 33 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:09,000 Speaker 2: the builder and back end those costs so that they're working. 34 00:02:09,040 --> 00:02:13,359 Speaker 2: Capital train for the developer is something that is solved 35 00:02:13,480 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 2: when the project is completed, as opposed to challenged and 36 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:21,520 Speaker 2: imposed upon them day one. And so what we think 37 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:24,880 Speaker 2: is the priorities, how do we build more houses, more 38 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,880 Speaker 2: properties at the right price point and thus start to 39 00:02:28,880 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 2: solve the supply challenge for Australia. 40 00:02:31,320 --> 00:02:33,640 Speaker 1: But does a big bank have a role in that? 41 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:37,360 Speaker 1: And your building example, I recently did a building and 42 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:41,800 Speaker 1: there were eight payments which I withdrew from my bank 43 00:02:42,040 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 1: and gave to my builder. After the builder I put 44 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:46,840 Speaker 1: the money up front and then they got paid in 45 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: eight payments. So there is an approval regulatory issue, But 46 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 1: there's also a role for the banks too, isn't it. 47 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:57,359 Speaker 2: I think that's right. I think also particularly for the developer, 48 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:02,639 Speaker 2: if the large amount of up front costs and approval 49 00:03:02,840 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 2: costs that they have to pay is back ended when 50 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 2: the project's completed, the working capital drain on them is reduced. 51 00:03:10,639 --> 00:03:13,440 Speaker 2: That means they therefore don't need to seek as many 52 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 2: early stage payments from you the owner the developer, and 53 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 2: so therefore it reduces the demand upon them. And then 54 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 2: of course as a bank, we can and would be 55 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,440 Speaker 2: able to contribute to helping them solve any other working 56 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:30,720 Speaker 2: capital needs that they might have. But the very fact 57 00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 2: that the cash drain on the company is not realizable 58 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 2: until the project is completed safely just means it's a 59 00:03:39,880 --> 00:03:44,600 Speaker 2: much more attractive and a much safer proposition for any lender. 60 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 2: And so therefore that's how we would and it does 61 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 2: complement what we promote. 62 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 1: Okay, housing fixed tax reform next one JST start there. 63 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:01,920 Speaker 1: It's a very very difficult political player doing anything to 64 00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 1: the GST, and no political party since how I'd introduced 65 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: it has really been able to do anything broad in it, 66 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 1: increase it. What's your take on tax reform and should 67 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: the GST be included. I'm not going to ask you 68 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:17,400 Speaker 1: directly whether you think it should be higher or broader, 69 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 1: but if we're going to have a tax reform debate, 70 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:22,480 Speaker 1: do we need to talk about the GST as part 71 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:22,680 Speaker 1: of that. 72 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 2: Well, I think, first of all, tax reform just catalyzes 73 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 2: so much emotion and so much engagement right across the community, 74 00:04:34,440 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 2: and so when we thought about our submission to the 75 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:42,400 Speaker 2: Productivity round Table, I just thought it's sort of going 76 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:45,920 Speaker 2: to somewhat distract and dilute the focus on things that 77 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:50,359 Speaker 2: can be implemented and can be done now to start 78 00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:56,679 Speaker 2: talking about substantive and significant tax reform. And so therefore 79 00:04:56,680 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 2: our submission was very much focused on a very readily implementable, 80 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:06,279 Speaker 2: often discussed and therefore could be quite quickly implemented bracket 81 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 2: creep measure. All of the other areas that you want 82 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:14,279 Speaker 2: to deal with from a tax reform perspective, whether it 83 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:17,479 Speaker 2: be GST broadening it, What do you do in terms 84 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:23,560 Speaker 2: of taxing, investment versus income. All of those things have 85 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:27,599 Speaker 2: so many knock on effects for the economy that we 86 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:31,200 Speaker 2: just think that that will just create too much distraction 87 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:37,279 Speaker 2: and not be a realistically implementable set of reforms. And 88 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 2: therefore don't let it crowd out what you can achieve 89 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 2: by sitting around the table at that round table working 90 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:46,520 Speaker 2: on all these other things that are very much implementable 91 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:49,920 Speaker 2: that will improve productivity and help Australia growth. So I'd 92 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,400 Speaker 2: like to see tax reform, definitely want to see a 93 00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:56,440 Speaker 2: debate around what we might do, but I would pull 94 00:05:56,480 --> 00:06:00,799 Speaker 2: it a little bit away from the productivity table because 95 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 2: it's so complicated, it is so emotional, it is so hard, 96 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:08,799 Speaker 2: and it has a risk of diluting and distracting everyone 97 00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 2: who are there to do a really good job for Australia. 98 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 1: I'm not going to let you off the hook on 99 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:14,360 Speaker 1: that one, because we will come back to the economic 100 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:18,720 Speaker 1: ground table, right, but just park that an on tax reform, 101 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:25,160 Speaker 1: supernovation tax three million dollars unrealized taxing, unrealized gains for example, 102 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:26,719 Speaker 1: a good idea, bad idea. 103 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:27,680 Speaker 2: Are there other. 104 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: Issues that the banks, the government, regulators should be thinking about. 105 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 2: So the tax on superinnovation and that three million dollars 106 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:44,360 Speaker 2: threshold unrealized gains. Eighty five thousand people out of our 107 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:49,400 Speaker 2: twenty five million population are impacted by that. And look 108 00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:55,719 Speaker 2: at the language, the frustration, the emotion, the attention it's gathered. 109 00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 2: And so therefore it makes my point well for me, 110 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 2: imagine if we start talking about other areas where more 111 00:07:05,040 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 2: than eighty five thousand people are impacted, it's just to 112 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:13,960 Speaker 2: be too distracting unless we have an agreed program and 113 00:07:14,240 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 2: effort around fundamental top to bottom tax reform. In relation 114 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 2: to that tax, one can understand that the government is 115 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 2: trying to find new sources of revenue. And if I 116 00:07:26,440 --> 00:07:30,600 Speaker 2: think about the original premise for Superinnuation in Australia was 117 00:07:31,080 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 2: we need to help Australians paye Australians working save for 118 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:41,200 Speaker 2: their retirement so that because we cannot afford the pension 119 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 2: that they should have and are a title to. And 120 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 2: this was decided in the late eighties and early nineteen nineties, 121 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 2: and so Superinnuation was set up to help pay earners 122 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 2: build a nest egg so that they did not become 123 00:07:57,600 --> 00:08:00,440 Speaker 2: a burden on the public person when they retired. It 124 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 2: was not set up for people who have more than 125 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 2: ten million dollars in a self managed super fund to 126 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:12,280 Speaker 2: provide them with an incremental tax advantage investment program. And 127 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:16,520 Speaker 2: so therefore, while I think we should ask questions around 128 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 2: unrealized gains, and while I think we should ask questions 129 00:08:19,360 --> 00:08:24,440 Speaker 2: around potentially indexing that three million dollar level, the fact 130 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:28,120 Speaker 2: is is that you can understand why they're looking at 131 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 2: it because the original program and commitment for superannuation was 132 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 2: to help paye tax and pay is safe for their 133 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:42,440 Speaker 2: future retirement, not to inspire an aggregation of investment capital 134 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:44,839 Speaker 2: because of certain tax advantage. 135 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:49,840 Speaker 1: Okay, we won't go any more on time. We will actually, 136 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 1: I mean, because bracket creep is one of your You 137 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:57,719 Speaker 1: don't support bracket creep, but you do not support. 138 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:04,600 Speaker 2: We think that the impact of bracket creep is one 139 00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 2: which should be addressed by having an indexation of two 140 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:12,040 Speaker 2: point five percent per year. We think the way that 141 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:16,560 Speaker 2: would work will complement the monetary policy setting of the 142 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 2: time at that time. And so therefore, indexing two point 143 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:25,520 Speaker 2: five percent per year each year is a rigor that 144 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 2: brings certainty and consistency that everyone can rely upon and 145 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 2: in a way protects against an increase in the average 146 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:41,560 Speaker 2: amount of tax that people pay as we go forward, 147 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:45,480 Speaker 2: because what happens is when people think and fuel and 148 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 2: it's observable that we're paying too much income TAXI proportion 149 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 2: of income as an average. People talk about tax cuts, 150 00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:57,240 Speaker 2: and we do have tax cuts, but they're done in 151 00:09:57,280 --> 00:10:02,559 Speaker 2: an ad hoc somewhat politicized way, and we would say, well, 152 00:10:02,679 --> 00:10:04,600 Speaker 2: is that really the right way to do it. So 153 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:08,280 Speaker 2: the way we think about it is that that bracket creep, 154 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:13,600 Speaker 2: that bracket indexation each year is just a rigor that works, 155 00:10:13,600 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 2: and there's also budget neutral when you think about it. 156 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:18,720 Speaker 1: So that's part of your submission to the Economic Roundtable 157 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 1: that's on nine twenty first of August. Another idea that 158 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 1: you've had, which I think is really fascinating is having 159 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:29,480 Speaker 1: a target of a million people in regional Australia by 160 00:10:29,600 --> 00:10:35,080 Speaker 1: twenty thirty thereabouts. And I read your submission and I 161 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 1: read the FIN review today and the FIN Review didn't 162 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: quite say what your submission said. So I'm not sure 163 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:40,319 Speaker 1: which is right and which is wrong. But the FIN 164 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,120 Speaker 1: suggested that hope for subsisions. I'm sure your submission's right, 165 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:45,840 Speaker 1: but the FIN may have extra information perhaps, but the 166 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 1: idea of actually using some sort of incentive to get 167 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 1: people to the regions. 168 00:10:49,800 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, we think that regional Australia is one of 169 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:59,079 Speaker 2: the great unlocks or opportunities that we can and should 170 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:03,559 Speaker 2: be pursuing. A third of Australia's GDP sits in regional Australia, 171 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:09,120 Speaker 2: so it's a big contributor. The way we were thinking 172 00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 2: and championing it is that it has a role to 173 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:14,319 Speaker 2: play in solving a number of other challenges. So, for example, 174 00:11:15,080 --> 00:11:19,880 Speaker 2: if you think about house prices and house prices in 175 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:24,000 Speaker 2: city median is well north of million dollars, house prices 176 00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:28,400 Speaker 2: median house prices in regional Australias approximately six hundred thousand dollars. 177 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:33,440 Speaker 2: And so therefore, if I think about people who have 178 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 2: a median household income in Australia's about one hundred thousand dollars, 179 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 2: the mortgage is five to six times your income. Subject 180 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:45,440 Speaker 2: to expense verification. The houses that suit median income household 181 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:47,599 Speaker 2: levels in Australia is five hundred to six hundred and 182 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 2: fifty thousand dollars. So going into region and putting more 183 00:11:51,920 --> 00:11:53,959 Speaker 2: people into region is part of the way that we 184 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 2: might start to solve the household problem, the house ownership issue. 185 00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:01,720 Speaker 2: The other is the country is very focused on populating 186 00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:04,480 Speaker 2: Northern Australia and having a lot more activity in Northern 187 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 2: Australia for various geopolitical and defense reasons. And so again 188 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 2: it feels like that's consistent with the national agenda is 189 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 2: to go after improving regional Australia, in particular Northern Australia, 190 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:17,720 Speaker 2: and so we feel like it has a role to 191 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:20,320 Speaker 2: play in solving a number of challenges that are in 192 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 2: front of us. And as I say, the idea is 193 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 2: to get more people into those regional centers, and I 194 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 2: think the way we do that is there has to 195 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:32,760 Speaker 2: be something incentives. I think it should be the case 196 00:12:32,800 --> 00:12:36,840 Speaker 2: that a nurse, a teacher who's willing to go to 197 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 2: a remote regional town should get some reward for taking 198 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:43,920 Speaker 2: on that challenge and then helping us grow and graduate 199 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:45,439 Speaker 2: our community to the next level. 200 00:12:46,720 --> 00:12:48,520 Speaker 1: So I'm about to throw it to the floor, but 201 00:12:49,160 --> 00:12:51,480 Speaker 1: I do want to ask about Donald Trump and Tariff's 202 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:55,040 Speaker 1: and operating in that type of environment, and not so 203 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 1: much about Donald Trump per se and feel free. But 204 00:12:58,040 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: it's more the uncertainty factor. 205 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:05,320 Speaker 2: Certainly it's a remarkable environment that we operate in at 206 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,880 Speaker 2: the moment. But again from where I said, I feel 207 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 2: like we should be reflecting on this is a chance 208 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:14,680 Speaker 2: for us. So the uncertainty and the volatility that we 209 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:19,920 Speaker 2: currently are seeing and feeling because of what's going on 210 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:24,000 Speaker 2: in the United States stands in stark contrast to the 211 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 2: re elected government, our consistency and continuity of leadership in Australia. 212 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 2: And so are we thinking about how we all of 213 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:35,520 Speaker 2: a sudden represent the place that you should bring your 214 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 2: capital and you should bring your talent too, And so 215 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:42,760 Speaker 2: are we thinking about how actually this is our comparative advantage, 216 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 2: which is good, efficient, effective regulation, and we should be 217 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 2: attracting capital and talent to this country to help us 218 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 2: grow and grow with all those ambitions that we've laid out. 219 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 2: I do also think though, with the and we've seen 220 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,160 Speaker 2: this pattern now. I think we saw it in twenty 221 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:01,240 Speaker 2: sixteen to twenty twenty and we're seeing it now, is 222 00:14:01,280 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 2: that there's always this announcement, there's always this headline. I 223 00:14:05,000 --> 00:14:08,520 Speaker 2: think it's important that we don't react to it and 224 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 2: wait until all those other things that take place, which 225 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 2: is proper engagement at the right levels of government the 226 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:23,000 Speaker 2: right levels between two countries, and inevitably, something more rational 227 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 2: and if you will, more manageable seems to be coming out. 228 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 2: So our instinct, our recommendation, and how we think about 229 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:33,320 Speaker 2: it is don't react to the headline, but trust that actually, 230 00:14:33,600 --> 00:14:38,360 Speaker 2: in almost all instances you've seen some commercial, sensible outcome. 231 00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 2: And we should also be very honest with ourselves. Is 232 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 2: that the US is the lowest tariff imposing country, or 233 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:48,000 Speaker 2: one of the lowest in the world, and has been 234 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:52,120 Speaker 2: for a long time. It has, if you will, driven 235 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:56,560 Speaker 2: global growth and inspire development in many other countries around 236 00:14:56,600 --> 00:15:00,240 Speaker 2: the world. And so therefore for them to stand back 237 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 2: now and say, well, how come I import everything from 238 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 2: you and I can't export anything to you. How come 239 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 2: that's sustainable? It's not sustainable. And so we need to 240 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 2: just take a step back, leave aside your thoughts on politics, 241 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 2: and just recognize that country is allowed to say, actually 242 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 2: it's slightly asymmetrical, and i'd like to see a little 243 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 2: bit more equivalence. And so that's part of what's driving 244 00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:25,840 Speaker 2: what's going on. And so if you think about it 245 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,040 Speaker 2: and stay rational, you can see, actually there is a 246 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 2: way through this because a more equal, more balanced arrangement 247 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 2: between the United States and other countries is something that 248 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 2: we should welcome. We just got to get there. I'd 249 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:38,960 Speaker 2: rather do it in a different way, but we just 250 00:15:38,960 --> 00:15:39,640 Speaker 2: got to get there. 251 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:43,480 Speaker 1: But you're still having an effective tariff rate of let's 252 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 1: say ten percent, ten to twelve percent. That's worse than 253 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:49,040 Speaker 1: an effective tax rate of two to five percent. 254 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 2: That's right. I mean, yes, the math doesn't lie equally. 255 00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 2: A ten percent tariff rate and is train a dollar. 256 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 2: We can let that go down three, six, seven percent, 257 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:05,400 Speaker 2: and so all of a sudden, the net impact is 258 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 2: a two to three percent impact on your margin here. 259 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 2: And the challenge then for you is to go and 260 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:11,880 Speaker 2: find that two to three percent in terms of your 261 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 2: margin and your production. So I think it's just too 262 00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 2: easy to say, oh, whoe me ten percent. There are 263 00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:22,360 Speaker 2: many other things that we can and we'll be able 264 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 2: to do to ameliorate that. Clearly, if it's fifty percent 265 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:29,480 Speaker 2: or seventy five percent, that's a completely different paradigm because 266 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 2: that's not trying to equivalent, that's not trying to find 267 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 2: more balance. That's actually saying I do not want to 268 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 2: do business with you. And as I understand, it. They 269 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 2: want to do business with everyone, So it's just a 270 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 2: question then of working out what is the right balance 271 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 2: between the two countries or the two entities, as the 272 00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 2: case may be. 273 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 1: We're going to pause there and take a quick break 274 00:16:51,800 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 1: back in a moment. This is Fearing Greed one on 275 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,960 Speaker 1: one with Westpac CEO Anthony Miller. So do we have 276 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:12,160 Speaker 1: microphones in the room? Does anyone have a question? It's 277 00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:13,760 Speaker 1: one of the back there right next to you there. 278 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:19,200 Speaker 3: Thank you, Anthony Sanchiaguto from HPF Health. Really good to hear, 279 00:17:19,520 --> 00:17:23,399 Speaker 3: very candid and straight shooting answers. My questions to you 280 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:26,440 Speaker 3: is about AI really heartwarming to see how you are 281 00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 3: approaching it pragmatically, not just what the opportunities but challenges 282 00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:32,959 Speaker 3: as well and sending that signal to the market by 283 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:37,199 Speaker 3: appointing someone. But in terms of leadership shadow, what are 284 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:39,919 Speaker 3: you doing personally in your everyday life to use AI. 285 00:17:40,920 --> 00:17:43,800 Speaker 2: So I've got a couple of my favorite models which 286 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:48,480 Speaker 2: I use and I've started and do and just trying 287 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 2: to find Michelle. My chip staff is terrific operator. We 288 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:55,359 Speaker 2: are using it more and more in terms of reviewing 289 00:17:55,400 --> 00:18:00,159 Speaker 2: and assessing and preparing reports. What I've also found and 290 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:06,080 Speaker 2: quite invigorating is looking at all of the case studies 291 00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 2: of what others are doing about it, and what's consistent 292 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 2: in terms of those successful outcomes or utilization of AI 293 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:20,360 Speaker 2: was people having the courage to go for something very 294 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,520 Speaker 2: bold and putting down we're just going to move to 295 00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:26,280 Speaker 2: that point. We're going to have it all done by AI. 296 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 2: We're not going to just use it a little bit. 297 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:31,639 Speaker 2: We're going to use it one hundred percent. And so 298 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 2: what we are need and what we're thinking we need 299 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:38,359 Speaker 2: to do is actually make sure that we set that 300 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:42,520 Speaker 2: environment up that we provide our leaders and our employees 301 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:46,560 Speaker 2: who are using the tool, provide them with an environment 302 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 2: and provide them with a permission to go for it 303 00:18:50,119 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 2: and to experiment, and provided they don't put the bank 304 00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 2: at risk, which we know they cannot because of what 305 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 2: we've put in place. See what we can achieve. And 306 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 2: as I say, I'm trying to be much bolder and 307 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,440 Speaker 2: what I'm doing it for. I have noticed that I've 308 00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:09,919 Speaker 2: got a director on my board here today, and I 309 00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 2: didn't want to tip off that I was actually hoping 310 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:17,199 Speaker 2: to write my next board report using AI. But what 311 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 2: I'll do is I'll submit a board paper in the 312 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 2: next period of time and no one will know and 313 00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:26,399 Speaker 2: we'll see see how everyone reacts after the board meeting. 314 00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:29,040 Speaker 2: So that's just Markie over here. 315 00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:33,800 Speaker 1: So Scott Farquhar from Atlastian's giving a speech at the 316 00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:35,720 Speaker 1: National Press Club today and I read it this morning 317 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:39,480 Speaker 1: and he said every CEO should use AI in their 318 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: personal life if they want to use it in their business. 319 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:44,360 Speaker 1: And it's kind of like the Ripper of Modock. Why 320 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 1: was he good at newspapers because he read them every morning. 321 00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 1: It's kind of his theory is the same, which is interesting. 322 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:52,879 Speaker 2: So I have two apps that I constantly on a 323 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,920 Speaker 2: sort of in some respects I wander now way even 324 00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,959 Speaker 2: have a Google search engine. You know, the two applications 325 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:03,479 Speaker 2: I have just helped solve so much in such a 326 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:07,920 Speaker 2: thoughtful and helpful way. It's just quite powerful. 327 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 4: Thank you, good afternoon. Our favorite topic is always AI 328 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:17,919 Speaker 4: and real estate, and I'm a bias agent. I have 329 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:22,000 Speaker 4: a question for you. How is Westpac Leave ranging AI 330 00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:27,360 Speaker 4: or data analytics to better understand property market or buyer 331 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 4: behavior and how do you see that evolving over the 332 00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:31,679 Speaker 4: next few years. 333 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:36,400 Speaker 2: We great question. I think we've been long term invested 334 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 2: in the idea of data data analytics and importantly trying 335 00:20:43,040 --> 00:20:47,960 Speaker 2: to make sure that as we engage with our customers 336 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 2: what they're doing and the things they're doing, that we 337 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:56,200 Speaker 2: can see patterns, and we can see patterns which men 338 00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 2: say to us, you know what, this customer is probably 339 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 2: interested in buying a property. We should make sure they're 340 00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:06,800 Speaker 2: aware of our interest in supporting them in that endeavor. Equally, 341 00:21:07,200 --> 00:21:11,800 Speaker 2: what we're using that particular insight and analytic capability is 342 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 2: this customer looks like it may want to transfer money 343 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:24,680 Speaker 2: from Westpac to this fund or this other destination, and 344 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 2: we're deeply concerned about the integrity and merits of that 345 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:33,719 Speaker 2: end destination, and so we're using it to protect our customers. 346 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,880 Speaker 2: And where for example we've been pleased with what we've 347 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:45,359 Speaker 2: seen from how the AI tool helps our bank is 348 00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:49,720 Speaker 2: in our scams and fraud area, where customers call in 349 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:53,560 Speaker 2: and our call center operator is dealing with someone who's 350 00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:56,479 Speaker 2: very upset or very anxious that they may have been 351 00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 2: scammed or that they've lost their money, and it's a 352 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:05,720 Speaker 2: highly emotional, noisy, very intense call. Our call center operator 353 00:22:05,920 --> 00:22:11,600 Speaker 2: has an AI tool who is helping them understand if 354 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 2: the person's use that word that could mean this, So 355 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:18,200 Speaker 2: therefore ask this question. And what that tool is doing 356 00:22:18,280 --> 00:22:21,080 Speaker 2: is making sure our call center operator gets to the 357 00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:26,640 Speaker 2: right place with the customer faster and more consistently than 358 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 2: it has in the past, and that has meant that's 359 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:34,000 Speaker 2: given us a great deal of satisfaction. And importantly, what 360 00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 2: we've been able to do is scams continue to grow, 361 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:40,760 Speaker 2: and that's a battle we must win. More people are 362 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:44,640 Speaker 2: calling in worried about scams. We haven't had to increase 363 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,840 Speaker 2: the number of call center employees because the power of 364 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 2: this AI tool is meant we can solve more safely 365 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:56,240 Speaker 2: and consistently without adding people. So therefore there's some real 366 00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 2: value that we're seeing today in that way. 367 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:02,720 Speaker 5: Hi, lads, and you're here from the airfar. Thank you 368 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:07,200 Speaker 5: for a great discussion so far. Ryan Stokes today raised 369 00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:10,840 Speaker 5: concerns about a sharp rise in claims for mental wellbeing. 370 00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 5: Do you share his concerns and do you back his 371 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 5: call for a national legislation which would essentially state that 372 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 5: no compensation should be payable to an employee if their 373 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 5: injury was caused because of reasonable management. 374 00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 2: I certainly think Ryan very articulately and thoughtfully set out 375 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:36,760 Speaker 2: one of the biggest challenges that we are all facing, 376 00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:44,879 Speaker 2: which is the mental health wellbeing challenge inside the workplace 377 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:49,439 Speaker 2: and outside the workplace. I certainly acknowledge that some of 378 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:53,439 Speaker 2: what Ryan is suggested makes a lot of sense. Have 379 00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:57,600 Speaker 2: you said that? I just don't think it's as simple 380 00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 2: as that. As well, it is the case that I 381 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,960 Speaker 2: think things like are we getting the balance of work 382 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 2: from home work in the office are we getting and 383 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,480 Speaker 2: are we working enough in investing in our managers and 384 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:15,359 Speaker 2: leaders so that they are far more effective in how 385 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:20,160 Speaker 2: they manage and lead their teams and thus help employees 386 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,280 Speaker 2: who are if you will, challenged to them, if confronted, 387 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,120 Speaker 2: may react in a way that means you know, they 388 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 2: feel unsafe or that they invoke some protection such as 389 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:36,119 Speaker 2: mental health, etc. So I feel like what we should 390 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:38,760 Speaker 2: be talking about is what are all the things we 391 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 2: need to be doing and investing in in the workplace 392 00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 2: to try and minimize this, And then, of course, once 393 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,959 Speaker 2: you've done all you can to minimize it, then you 394 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 2: can start to look at some other actions which Ryan 395 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:56,399 Speaker 2: is promoting, which I think are very thoughtful and definitely 396 00:24:56,440 --> 00:24:58,359 Speaker 2: have a role, But I think is work to be 397 00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:00,919 Speaker 2: done before you start to invoke those kind of responses. 398 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 6: Thanks Anthonyarell Hoopo on the board of the Ethics Center. 399 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 6: One brief question and a related session question to build 400 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 6: on Endeiros. Are you seeing more of your son now 401 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:16,760 Speaker 6: than when you when you first moved back during the pandemic. 402 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:22,680 Speaker 2: I was wondering about that in your new job. So yes, 403 00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:25,119 Speaker 2: we had it, saw a lot of each other in 404 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:27,159 Speaker 2: that first year and then he moved to Brisbane and 405 00:25:27,200 --> 00:25:30,879 Speaker 2: so but he's moved to Brisbane and he spends a 406 00:25:30,920 --> 00:25:32,400 Speaker 2: lot of time with my mum and dad. So that's 407 00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,679 Speaker 2: created a reinforced connection across the family which is very 408 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:38,520 Speaker 2: too lovely. Thanks the A. 409 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,960 Speaker 6: It's in relation to the productivity debate the act you 410 00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 6: raised a report recently outlining the contribution of improving management 411 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 6: and leadership and the leadership culture in Australia could contribute. 412 00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,560 Speaker 6: To my mind, it was a bit quickly dismissed by 413 00:25:56,560 --> 00:26:00,439 Speaker 6: the Business Council, giving us quite a track called of 414 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 6: research that shows in Australia we think we're better managers 415 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,199 Speaker 6: and leaders than we actually are. And I'm wondering from 416 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:11,159 Speaker 6: your business and the businesses that you see into what's 417 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:13,840 Speaker 6: the capacity you could see that we could get an 418 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:18,359 Speaker 6: uplift from improving that training, education and the overall culture 419 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:19,040 Speaker 6: for leadership. 420 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:22,520 Speaker 2: Thanks, thank you for the question, and it's a great one. 421 00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 2: One of the five priorities for the company that we've 422 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 2: set and the teams one hundred percent behind, is employee 423 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:34,439 Speaker 2: and so we have a goal, our aspiration is to 424 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,000 Speaker 2: make Westpact the number one employee proposition in this market, 425 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:40,879 Speaker 2: and we have a long way to go. We do 426 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,359 Speaker 2: a lot of really good things. There's a lot of 427 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:45,199 Speaker 2: things I want to do, but there's a lot of 428 00:26:45,240 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 2: things that I have to graduate the financial performance of 429 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:51,199 Speaker 2: the company to be able to support my ambition and 430 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 2: our ambition for making it the number one place, because 431 00:26:54,720 --> 00:26:56,600 Speaker 2: I don't think I can be the number one bank 432 00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:01,240 Speaker 2: unless I have the number oneployee proposition and I have 433 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,200 Speaker 2: the best people giving me their best every single day. 434 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:09,120 Speaker 2: What we are focused on now, which is something we 435 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:13,240 Speaker 2: can do now, is to work on our leaders, our 436 00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:17,800 Speaker 2: managers and making them better leaders and better managers. It 437 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,600 Speaker 2: has been the case in the past that you are 438 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:24,239 Speaker 2: a domain expert, you get promoted and thus you are 439 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,159 Speaker 2: the manager. But you may be a demain expert, but 440 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 2: not a very good manager, and we have never really 441 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 2: given it the weight it should be given. And I 442 00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,800 Speaker 2: say that not just as it plays to Westpact, but 443 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:42,040 Speaker 2: to all of Australia. And so the thing we should 444 00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 2: also instead is that, you know, American companies, multinational companies 445 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 2: do invest a lot more in their executive development, their 446 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:53,679 Speaker 2: manager's development, how they become not just the leader of 447 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 2: the domain, but if you will, the chaperone the custody, 448 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,119 Speaker 2: and how they help people, help they coach people. And 449 00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:02,640 Speaker 2: that is something that we're going after and we want 450 00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:07,280 Speaker 2: to improve on. And so I think the ACT has 451 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 2: a point to make, which is that we should be 452 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:15,159 Speaker 2: investing in management capability leadership capability just as much as 453 00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:18,400 Speaker 2: we're investing in anything else. And sort of around out 454 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:22,040 Speaker 2: the AI topic. The way I keep thinking about it 455 00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:24,359 Speaker 2: is for every dollar I'm going into AI, I've got 456 00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:26,399 Speaker 2: to be investing in my people, and I've got to 457 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,159 Speaker 2: be investing in the managers and leaders of my people 458 00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 2: if we're going to realize the full potential of that tool. 459 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:35,400 Speaker 2: Thanks Anthony for your time. 460 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,480 Speaker 7: Ria Berwood, I just wanted to ask you, and I'm 461 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 7: curious about your perspective having been international and in Australian banking. 462 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:46,440 Speaker 7: Can you draw any learning or have you got any 463 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 7: observations with what's happening with the cash flow and the 464 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 7: business performance in Australia right now due to economic and 465 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:59,000 Speaker 7: mic market dynamics comparing that to what's been happening with 466 00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:03,200 Speaker 7: the agribusiness in Australia and cash flow constraints due to 467 00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:04,720 Speaker 7: long term climate issues. 468 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:13,160 Speaker 2: No. No, the challenges that we see and I reflect 469 00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:15,480 Speaker 2: here the numbers that we have and we do as 470 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:20,400 Speaker 2: a quarterly snapshot that helps us understand the cash flow 471 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 2: and the cash flow position of small, medium and large 472 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 2: commercial enterprises. You know, the pressure points that are impacting 473 00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:36,200 Speaker 2: them are cost of labor, energy costs, cost of servicing 474 00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:40,920 Speaker 2: and meeting regulatory challenges that are in front of them, 475 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:46,240 Speaker 2: and then also the cost of getting materials and the like. 476 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 2: And so that is the fundamental drivers of challenges that 477 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 2: we see in small businesses and commercial enterprises. In a 478 00:29:55,800 --> 00:30:00,960 Speaker 2: few areas. You might argue that some of the climate 479 00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:05,600 Speaker 2: challenge is impacting on businesses and you might say that actually, 480 00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:12,120 Speaker 2: could we and should we have cheaper power today which 481 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:15,239 Speaker 2: would help a lot of businesses. And it's because of 482 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 2: an incongruent, inconsistent approach to power generation, power storage and 483 00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,800 Speaker 2: transmission investment, that we're not quite where we want to 484 00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,840 Speaker 2: be as a country. That could be one connection that 485 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 2: we could establish there, but other than that. 486 00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:40,960 Speaker 1: No, that's the second half of my interview with Westpac 487 00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 1: CEO Anthony Miller. Anthony was proudly hosted by the Trans 488 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,240 Speaker 1: Tasman Business Circle. The thirty three years, the Circle has 489 00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:51,000 Speaker 1: been the region's leading stakeholder engagement platform, connecting senior leaders 490 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:54,960 Speaker 1: across business, government and community in Australia, New Zealand, Singapore 491 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,960 Speaker 1: and beyond. With over two hundred and fifty high impact 492 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:03,160 Speaker 1: engagements annually, the Circle strategic Conversations strengthens public private collaboration 493 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:07,160 Speaker 1: and deepens cross border partnerships. Privately owned and proudly independent, 494 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: the Circle is powered by a team of senior professionals 495 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 1: dedicated to delivering meaningful, high trust experiences. I hope you've 496 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:16,840 Speaker 1: enjoyed the conversation. Today, remember to hit follow on the 497 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:20,240 Speaker 1: podcast and subscribe to Fear and Greed's free daily newsletter 498 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,480 Speaker 1: at fearangreed dot com. Today you I'm Schanaoma and this 499 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,720 Speaker 1: is Fear and Greed one on one