WEBVTT - Erin Patterson says doctors and her own kids are wrong

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<v Speaker 1>From The Australian. Here's what's on the front. I'm Claire Harvey.

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<v Speaker 1>It's Thursday, June twelfth, twenty twenty five. China and the

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<v Speaker 1>United States have hammered out a trade deal and both

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<v Speaker 1>sides are claiming a win. But Chinese factories are closing

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<v Speaker 1>and its exports to the US have tumbled. The Australians

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<v Speaker 1>correspondent Will Glasgow is reporting today on the truth behind

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<v Speaker 1>both sides spin on this fragile truce.

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<v Speaker 2>The Crown alleges Aaron Patterson.

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<v Speaker 1>Lied to more than a dozen people, including police, child

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<v Speaker 1>protection workers, doctors and nurses, about feeding leftovers from a

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<v Speaker 1>fatal mushroom lunch to her children. Patterson, who's fighting a

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<v Speaker 1>triple murder charge, says that's not true, and she also

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<v Speaker 1>says her kids and doctors are wrong about their recollections

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<v Speaker 1>of that fatal day. That's today's story. Crown Prosecutor Nanette

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<v Speaker 1>Rogers sc is digging into every moment of the days

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<v Speaker 1>after Aaron Patterson's mushroom lunch in July twenty twenty three,

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<v Speaker 1>which left three elderly relatives dead and one seriously ill.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson is pleaded not guilty to three counts of murder

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<v Speaker 1>and one of attempted murder. On Wednesday in the Victorian

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<v Speaker 1>Supreme Court, Rogers spent hours putting to Patterson what she

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<v Speaker 1>allegedly told doctors, nurses, police and her children.

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<v Speaker 2>At the time.

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<v Speaker 1>We've used voice actors to bring you the words spoken

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<v Speaker 1>in court by Nanette Rogers and Aaron Patterson again and again.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson says the other witnesses are wrong in their recollections

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<v Speaker 1>of what she said to them at the time, like

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<v Speaker 1>Chris Webster, the doctor on duty at leand Gatha Hospital.

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<v Speaker 3>Rus Webster's evidence was that when you first presented to

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<v Speaker 3>lean Gatha Hospital, he asked you where you got the mushrooms,

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<v Speaker 3>and his evidence was that you said Woolworths.

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<v Speaker 4>I agree that I said Woolworths, but I disagree what

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<v Speaker 4>the question was. That wasn't the question I remember him asking.

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<v Speaker 4>He's mistaken the content of his question.

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<v Speaker 1>Pattison says Webster actually asked where did you get the ingredients.

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<v Speaker 1>Doctor Veronica Foot gave evidence that two and a half

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<v Speaker 1>hours later, Patterson told her she'd bought some of the

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<v Speaker 1>mushrooms from Safeway in Land Gaffer and some dried mushrooms

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<v Speaker 1>from a Chinese grocer in Melbourne months earlier, in April.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest you had some time to think about your

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<v Speaker 3>story in that intervening period. Correct or incorrect?

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect?

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<v Speaker 3>You added a detail to this account concerning the mushrooms

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<v Speaker 3>from the Chinese grocer, I suggest incorrect.

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<v Speaker 1>Next, Patterson told doctor Laura Muldoon she had used dried

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<v Speaker 1>dehydrated mushrooms. Possibly Sheitaki or Porcini and bought them at

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<v Speaker 1>a Chinese grocery store in Oakley or Glen Waverley.

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<v Speaker 4>Possibly I did tell her those things.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest it was a lie that you told her

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<v Speaker 3>that you had used dried dehydrated mushrooms bought at a

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<v Speaker 3>Chinese grocery store in Oakley or Glen Waverley.

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect.

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<v Speaker 1>Muldoon told the jury Patterson said she came to hospital

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<v Speaker 1>because she thought she had food poisoning.

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<v Speaker 4>I didn't say that until I got to Lean Gatha.

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<v Speaker 4>I thought I had gastro.

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<v Speaker 1>A Health Department official Sally Anne Atkinson then began asking

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson questions about the ingredients for the lunch she has

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<v Speaker 1>told the jury. Patterson told her she'd bought the mushrooms

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<v Speaker 1>in one of three suburbs of Melbourne. Patterson says Atkinson

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<v Speaker 1>got the details wrong.

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<v Speaker 4>I didn't say Mount Waverley, I said Glen Waverley.

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<v Speaker 1>She said Atkinson was wrong to claim that Patterson described

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<v Speaker 1>the mushrooms as smelling funny.

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<v Speaker 4>No, I don't think I said smelled funny. My memory

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<v Speaker 4>has always just been that it was a very strong

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<v Speaker 4>or pungent smell. She's wrong about that word.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson agreed she didn't return sally on Atkinson's call on

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<v Speaker 1>August two or answer a text message she sent. She

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<v Speaker 1>said she told I Canson the names of streets in

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<v Speaker 1>the Melbourne area where she might have bought the mushrooms.

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<v Speaker 1>Bart said she had no memory of the actual purchase

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<v Speaker 1>and no bank record of the transaction. On August five,

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<v Speaker 1>when being interviewed by police, Patterson told them she had

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<v Speaker 1>been very very helpful to the Department of Health as

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<v Speaker 1>they tried to investigate the source of the poisoning.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest you weren't quote very very helpful to the

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<v Speaker 3>department at all.

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<v Speaker 4>I was trying to be that was untrue.

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<v Speaker 3>In fact, you sent them on a wild goose chase

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<v Speaker 3>trying to locate this Asian grocer correct or incorrect?

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect?

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<v Speaker 3>And I suggest that the reason that you didn't answer

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<v Speaker 3>some of those texts from her was because you did

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<v Speaker 3>not want to be pressed for details about the Asian

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<v Speaker 3>grocery store, because that story was not true. It was

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<v Speaker 3>a lie that you used dried mushrooms from an Asian

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<v Speaker 3>grocer correct or incorrect.

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect.

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<v Speaker 3>You lied about the source of the death cap mushrooms

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<v Speaker 3>because you knew you were guilty of having deliberately poisoned

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<v Speaker 3>your four lunch guests.

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect.

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<v Speaker 1>And what was Patterson telling health professionals about her children.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson has said she served the children leftover beef Wellington

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<v Speaker 1>with the mushrooms and pastry scraped off the I feel

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<v Speaker 1>at stake on the Sunday night. In a police interview,

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson's son said, Mum said it was leftovers. Police asked

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson's daughter how she knew that their Sunday night dinner

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<v Speaker 1>was leftovers from the lunch. She told police Mum told me,

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<v Speaker 1>But Patterson disagreed that she told the kids these were

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<v Speaker 1>leftovers from the lunch.

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<v Speaker 4>I only remember telling the kids on the Sunday that

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<v Speaker 4>it was leftovers. I don't remember telling them anything about

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<v Speaker 4>them being lunch leftovers.

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<v Speaker 3>You told various people at Liam gath the hospital that

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<v Speaker 3>you'd fed leftovers of the Beef Wellington with mushrooms and

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<v Speaker 3>pastries scraped off to your children.

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<v Speaker 4>I did.

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<v Speaker 2>A nurse Kylie Ashton gave evidence.

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<v Speaker 1>Aaron Patterson said on her first visit to the hospital

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<v Speaker 1>on the Monday morning that the children had eaten leftovers

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<v Speaker 1>from the Beef Wellington.

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<v Speaker 2>Patison denied this.

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<v Speaker 4>There were no conversations about the children eating leftovers in

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<v Speaker 4>that first presentation.

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<v Speaker 2>Patterson agreed.

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<v Speaker 1>She told another nurse the children had no symptoms and

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<v Speaker 1>hadn't eaten any mushrooms, and she told doctor Chris Webster

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<v Speaker 1>that she didn't want the children to be stressed or

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<v Speaker 1>panicked by getting pulled out of school.

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<v Speaker 3>I want to suggest that surely the last thing you

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<v Speaker 3>would have been thinking about, if you thought genuinely that

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<v Speaker 3>your children had potentially eaten a fatal poison, that you'd

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<v Speaker 3>be worrying about whether they'd be panicked or stressed about

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<v Speaker 3>being pulled out of school.

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<v Speaker 4>I didn't think they'd eaten a fatal poison because it

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<v Speaker 4>was made clear to me that the issue was mushrooms

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<v Speaker 4>and they had not eaten the mushrooms.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest that you lied to each of these medical

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<v Speaker 3>personnel about your children eating leftovers of the beef Wellington.

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<v Speaker 3>Agree or disagree? Disagree. I suggest that you were reluctant

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<v Speaker 3>to have the children medically assessed. Agree or disagree.

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<v Speaker 4>Initially I was, but before not for too long. I

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<v Speaker 4>agreed they needed to come in, and I arranged for that.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest that you were initially reluctant because you knew

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<v Speaker 3>they had not eaten leftover beef Wellington from the lunch.

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect.

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<v Speaker 3>You knew that their lives were not at risk. Correct

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<v Speaker 3>or incorrect?

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect?

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<v Speaker 1>The court's already heard that Webster said to Patterson the

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<v Speaker 1>children needed to come in, that they could be scared

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<v Speaker 1>and dead or alive.

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<v Speaker 3>You loved your children, correct, I still love them. When

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<v Speaker 3>Dr Webster told you at ten am that the children

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<v Speaker 3>could die, you must have realized it was really necessary

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<v Speaker 3>to get them to the hospital.

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<v Speaker 4>I suggest I didn't think that it was a real

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<v Speaker 4>risk at that time.

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<v Speaker 3>And you did not take immediate steps to make that happen. Correct.

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<v Speaker 4>That's correct.

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<v Speaker 3>In fact, you did not call Simon Patterson until more

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<v Speaker 3>than an hour later. Correct.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't know how long it was.

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<v Speaker 1>Child Protection work at Katrina Crips spoke to Patterson on

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<v Speaker 1>August one.

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<v Speaker 3>You told her that when you served the meal, you

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<v Speaker 3>dished up all of the plates and put tu aside

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<v Speaker 3>for the children. Did you say that to Miss Crips

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<v Speaker 3>on the first of August twenty twenty three.

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<v Speaker 1>No.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest that you did tell Miss Crips that you'd

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<v Speaker 3>put aside two beef wellingtons for your children on two plates.

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<v Speaker 3>Agree or disagree disagree? I suggest that you were trying

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<v Speaker 3>to convey to Miss Creeps that you had prepared this

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<v Speaker 3>meal not only for the lunch guests and yourself, but

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<v Speaker 3>also for your children. Agree or disagree disagree.

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<v Speaker 1>Rogers wanted to know if Patison thought she had food poisoning,

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<v Speaker 1>and she knew her relatives wheel, why would she feed

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<v Speaker 1>her children parts of the same meal on the Sunday night.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest that you told well over a dozen people,

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<v Speaker 3>including your son and daughter, health professionals, child protection workers, police,

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<v Speaker 3>and a friend, that you'd fed your children the same

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<v Speaker 3>meal that you had served at lunch on twenty nine

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<v Speaker 3>July twenty twenty three.

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<v Speaker 4>I was pretty clear it was the meal minus the

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<v Speaker 4>mushrooms in pastry, so not the same.

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<v Speaker 3>But yes, in terms of you making representations to people

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<v Speaker 3>that you fed your children the leftovers from the lunch.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest that that was a deliberate lie correct or incorrect?

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<v Speaker 4>Incorrect.

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<v Speaker 3>You knew that what you fed your children on Sunday

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<v Speaker 3>evenings did not contain death cap mushrooms. Agree or disagree,

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<v Speaker 3>it didn't contain any mushrooms. You repeatedly told police you

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<v Speaker 3>had scraped the mushrooms off in an attempt to explain

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<v Speaker 3>why the children were not sick. Agree or disagree.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't think I repeatedly told them, but I did

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<v Speaker 4>tell them.

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<v Speaker 3>You told a number of people you had scraped the

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<v Speaker 3>mushrooms off correct, correct, And I suggest that was an

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<v Speaker 3>attempt to explain why your children were not sick. No,

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<v Speaker 3>you told the lie about feeding leftovers from the beef

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<v Speaker 3>Wellington to your children, I suggest because it gave you

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<v Speaker 3>some distance from a deliberate poisoning.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't see how it could, but I disagree anyway.

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<v Speaker 1>Later, when asked about her claims to have previously foraged

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<v Speaker 1>for mushrooms, including porcini and shittaki, Pattison also took issue

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<v Speaker 1>with the children's own evidence. She said she'd picked mushrooms

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<v Speaker 1>while out on walks with the kids. When asked if

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<v Speaker 1>his mum or dad had ever picked a mushroom. Patterson's

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<v Speaker 1>son told police not that I know of. When Nanette

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<v Speaker 1>Rogers asked her why her daughter had told police they'd

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<v Speaker 1>never seen her pick mushrooms, Patterson said her daughter was

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<v Speaker 1>wrong about that. Patterson also said her children were wrong

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<v Speaker 1>in their recollection of why they were absent from the lunch.

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<v Speaker 1>She said her daughter had asked to go to a

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<v Speaker 1>movie instead, and she said that the daughter was wrong

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<v Speaker 1>when she told police that Patterson had said the lunch

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<v Speaker 1>was to talk about adult stuff. She said her son

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<v Speaker 1>was wrong when he told police the lunch was just

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<v Speaker 1>for the five adults.

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<v Speaker 2>Rogers put it.

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<v Speaker 1>To Patterson that she deliberately excluded the children because she didn't.

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<v Speaker 2>Want them anywhere near the poisoned food.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson denied that, coming up one big question about a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of little beef Wellington's. Why were they individual beef

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<v Speaker 1>Wellington's anyway. The recipe are in Patterson used was from

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<v Speaker 1>Nagi Mayhashi's cookbook recipe Tin Eats, but that recipe includes

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<v Speaker 1>one large piece of beef which is wrapped in mushrooms

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<v Speaker 1>and pastry and baked, then sliced into individual serves. Patterson

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<v Speaker 1>made individual Wellington's, which she described as looking like pasties.

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<v Speaker 3>Your evidence to this jury is that you use individual

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<v Speaker 3>I fill at stakes because you could not source a

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<v Speaker 3>single long I fill it log.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I couldn't find one anywhere else. That's right.

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<v Speaker 3>I suggest that that's not true. I suggest you could

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<v Speaker 3>have sourced a whole I fill it portion from one

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<v Speaker 3>of the various supermarkets or Butcher's in Leanngatha or Crumbarough.

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<v Speaker 4>I may have been able to, but I don't know.

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<v Speaker 3>But you chose I suggest individual portions. I feel it

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<v Speaker 3>because you wanted to serve individual portions of beef Wellington incorrect.

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<v Speaker 1>Patterson told the jury that she recalled once putting mushrooms

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<v Speaker 1>from an Asian grocery store into her dehydrator.

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<v Speaker 4>Because I remember I remember after using the dehydrator quite

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<v Speaker 4>a few times and noticing how crisp things were when

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<v Speaker 4>they came out after quite a number of hours. I

0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:24.480
<v Speaker 4>remember feeling the mushrooms in the tupperware container and they

0:12:24.480 --> 0:12:27.640
<v Speaker 4>weren't like that. They were quite rubbery, so I thought

0:12:27.640 --> 0:12:30.040
<v Speaker 4>perhaps some air had got in, so I whacked them

0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:32.360
<v Speaker 4>in the dehydrator for a couple of hours. That's my

0:12:32.440 --> 0:12:36.440
<v Speaker 4>memory anyway, and when did you do that? Sometime between

0:12:36.480 --> 0:12:38.280
<v Speaker 4>when I bought them and when I used them, I

0:12:38.320 --> 0:12:38.880
<v Speaker 4>don't know when.

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<v Speaker 3>How many times?

0:12:40.679 --> 0:12:41.400
<v Speaker 4>How many times?

0:12:41.440 --> 0:12:43.480
<v Speaker 3>What did you put them in the dehydrator?

0:12:43.840 --> 0:12:44.440
<v Speaker 4>Just the ones?

0:12:45.160 --> 0:12:47.440
<v Speaker 3>I suggest that you told Sally and Atkinson that you

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<v Speaker 3>did not initially use the mushrooms from the Asian grocer

0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:53.600
<v Speaker 3>because you were worried they would be too overpowering. Yeah.

0:12:53.600 --> 0:12:55.360
<v Speaker 4>I think I did say that if.

0:12:55.240 --> 0:12:57.920
<v Speaker 3>They were overpowering, surely you would have been worried about

0:12:57.920 --> 0:13:00.440
<v Speaker 3>them being too overpowering or strong for the beef war Wellington.

0:13:01.040 --> 0:13:03.360
<v Speaker 4>No, I didn't think that. I thought it was the perfect.

0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:05.160
<v Speaker 3>Dish for them to put in your special meal.

0:13:05.520 --> 0:13:08.960
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:12.520
<v Speaker 1>Patterson previously told the court she planned to have gastric

0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:15.760
<v Speaker 1>bypass surgery to help her more effectively manage her weight,

0:13:16.320 --> 0:13:18.480
<v Speaker 1>and that she felt she'd need assistance in getting the

0:13:18.559 --> 0:13:21.720
<v Speaker 1>kids to and from school while she recovered from the procedure,

0:13:22.400 --> 0:13:24.880
<v Speaker 1>but she claimed she was embarrassed to admit that to

0:13:24.960 --> 0:13:29.239
<v Speaker 1>her guests. Patterson told the jury a pre surgery assessment

0:13:29.360 --> 0:13:32.160
<v Speaker 1>was booked for September twenty twenty three at a Melbourne

0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:33.880
<v Speaker 1>cosmetic dermatology clinic.

0:13:35.240 --> 0:13:37.880
<v Speaker 3>Now that you've had a chance to read that material. Firstly,

0:13:38.000 --> 0:13:40.640
<v Speaker 3>do you accept that the Enriched Clinic does not offer,

0:13:40.920 --> 0:13:43.360
<v Speaker 3>and has never offered, gastric bypass surgery?

0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:43.960
<v Speaker 4>Yes?

0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:46.839
<v Speaker 3>Do you accept that the Enriched Clinic does not offer,

0:13:46.880 --> 0:13:50.199
<v Speaker 3>and has never offered pre surgery assessments relating to gastric

0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:51.280
<v Speaker 3>bypass surgery?

0:13:51.559 --> 0:13:51.920
<v Speaker 2>I do.

0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:55.160
<v Speaker 3>And Thirdly, do you accept that the Enriched Clinic only

0:13:55.200 --> 0:13:58.720
<v Speaker 3>conducts examinations and procedures related to the skin and its

0:13:58.800 --> 0:14:00.640
<v Speaker 3>appendages such as hair, are nails.

0:14:00.840 --> 0:14:01.040
<v Speaker 4>I do.

0:14:09.360 --> 0:14:11.959
<v Speaker 1>The trial continues on Thursday. You can read all the

0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:14.600
<v Speaker 1>latest from our reporters on the ground in more Well,

0:14:14.720 --> 0:14:18.319
<v Speaker 1>John Ferguson and Ellie Dudley right now at the Australian

0:14:18.480 --> 0:14:19.640
<v Speaker 1>dot com dot au