WEBVTT - Friday Face Off: Inside the Libs Leadership Spill

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<v Speaker 1>Our country is in trouble. The Labor government has failed

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<v Speaker 1>and the Liberal Party has lost its way.

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<v Speaker 2>The knives are out the leader. The spill is on.

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<v Speaker 1>Because we're running out of time and Australia is worth

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<v Speaker 1>fighting for.

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<v Speaker 2>Today, Liberal MP Angus Taylor will challenge Susan Lee for

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<v Speaker 2>the leadership and a party room showdown at nine am.

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<v Speaker 2>Their colleagues scrambling to pick sides as the face off looms.

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<v Speaker 3>This cannot go on. If it goes on, there'll be

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<v Speaker 3>nothing left of the Liberal Party by the next election.

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<v Speaker 3>To effectively knife the Liberal Party's first female leader in

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<v Speaker 3>under a year, it's actively, in my view, unacceptable.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Daniel James, and you're listening to seven AM today

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<v Speaker 2>Contributing editor at The New Daily, Amy Remikus on Taylor's chances,

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<v Speaker 2>the gender question, and whether a leadership change can save

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<v Speaker 2>the Liberal Party. It's Friday, February thirteen. Amy, How is

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<v Speaker 2>the last twenty four hours planned out? I mean, what

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<v Speaker 2>has Angus Taylor said about his reasons for challenging now?

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<v Speaker 4>The last twenty four hours have been a pretty big mess,

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<v Speaker 4>mostly because Angus Taylor was pushed to doing this leadership challenge.

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<v Speaker 5>Now it was a real shit to get.

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<v Speaker 4>Off the pot moment for the Liberal Party where Susan

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<v Speaker 4>Lee basically was saying, if you're going to challenge me,

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<v Speaker 4>challenge me. Now Susan Lee is hanging on to her

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<v Speaker 4>job but only just surviving today's Liberal Party room meeting

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<v Speaker 4>without a leadership spill. It was only when he came

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<v Speaker 4>out on Thursday morning that he said yes, I am

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<v Speaker 4>going to challenge for the leadership, and that included a

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<v Speaker 4>very snazzy social media video that he did, complete with

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<v Speaker 4>very you know, swelling, swelling orchestral music behind it.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm dedicated to serving you, the Australian people and giving

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<v Speaker 1>you I.

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<v Speaker 2>Thought it was very much a case of good job

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<v Speaker 2>Bang as well done.

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<v Speaker 5>Yeah, yeah, good job Bang is well done.

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<v Speaker 4>Fantastic He put that out and then we started seeing

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<v Speaker 4>a lot of his supporters joining him in quitting the

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<v Speaker 4>shadow cabinet.

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<v Speaker 1>Jess and I made the decision that there's no more

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<v Speaker 1>talking about it, no more whispers, no more talking about ourselves.

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<v Speaker 2>We are getting this on some of our colleagues that

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<v Speaker 2>they think she should be given until the budget.

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<v Speaker 4>I don't think delivering a budget and reply is going

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<v Speaker 4>to save us in this crisis.

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<v Speaker 3>It's for those reasons that this morning I tended my

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<v Speaker 3>resignation to Susan Lee as to the leader of Liberal Party,

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<v Speaker 3>Susan Lee.

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<v Speaker 4>The happiest person maybe was Victorian Senator Sarah Henderson, who

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<v Speaker 4>was almost glowing with happiness as she announced that the

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<v Speaker 4>leadership spill would happen, which dates back to when Sarah

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<v Speaker 4>Henderson didn't get a shadow Cabinet position and basically has

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<v Speaker 4>sworn vengeance ever since.

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<v Speaker 3>I am just going to say at the moment that

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<v Speaker 3>I cannot support the way things are with Susan Lee

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<v Speaker 3>as leader. It sounds like you're not supporting her positions leader. Well,

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<v Speaker 3>I can't back in the way things are pete and

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<v Speaker 3>I've got to be.

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<v Speaker 4>So you're seeing a lot of petty vengeances being played out.

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<v Speaker 4>But the interesting thing for political watches is that Ankus

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<v Speaker 4>Taylor hasn't actually mapped out anything that he would do

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<v Speaker 4>different to Susan Lee. His platform is that he wants

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<v Speaker 4>to protect Australia's way of life and focus on the economy.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, at the end of the day, what we're

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<v Speaker 1>seeing is household standards of living collapsing in front of

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<v Speaker 1>our eyes.

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<v Speaker 4>And if you've listened to Susan Lee for the last

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<v Speaker 4>nine months. That is pretty much all she's been saying

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<v Speaker 4>that she wants to maintain Australia's way of life. Right now,

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<v Speaker 4>Australians are struggling even more with the cost of living crisis.

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<v Speaker 4>This is Labour's We don't have any policies from the party,

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<v Speaker 4>so we can't say if Angus Taylor's policies would be

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<v Speaker 4>any different. He's just saying we need a decisive leader

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<v Speaker 4>and that's going.

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<v Speaker 3>To be me.

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<v Speaker 2>Like you said, Susan Lee hasn't been given a full

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<v Speaker 2>year in the job nine months. Some of her supporters

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<v Speaker 2>just said that she hasn't been given a fair crack

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<v Speaker 2>at the top job. In your view, Amy, has she

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<v Speaker 2>been given a fair go?

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<v Speaker 4>It's hard to answer because I mean, okay, she probably

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<v Speaker 4>hasn't been given a fair go, but I'm not sure

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<v Speaker 4>if anybody could in that party. But she didn't have

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<v Speaker 4>any authority when she stepped into the leadership. She didn't

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<v Speaker 4>have any policies, she didn't have any direction. And guess

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<v Speaker 4>there have been times when it's been out of co control,

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<v Speaker 4>like the tantrums that we've seen from the National Party.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, there was Australia's worst terrorist attack, she's been

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<v Speaker 4>dealing with all of that. It was also her decision

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<v Speaker 4>to politicize that attack, that horrendous attack, by demanding Parliament

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<v Speaker 4>be recalled, by demanding all of this legislation that then

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<v Speaker 4>led to the latest breakup with the coalition because of

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<v Speaker 4>rushed laws that she originally had called on the Prime

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<v Speaker 4>Minister to do. And then you have to look back

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<v Speaker 4>and say, well, Susan Lee has been in the Parliament

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<v Speaker 4>for a long time, she has been a senior member

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<v Speaker 4>of that parliament for a long time. She is also

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<v Speaker 4>responsible for the direction of the Liberal Party, and so

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<v Speaker 4>is Angus Taylor. So you can't say that they haven't

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<v Speaker 4>been able to change course because the architects of the

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<v Speaker 4>last six years of Liberal Party policy, and you know

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<v Speaker 4>that this decline that we've seen in the vote are

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<v Speaker 4>the same people who are telling you now that they

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<v Speaker 4>can take the Liberal Party in a different direction.

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<v Speaker 2>So despite all that, though, it's not really a great

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<v Speaker 2>look to knife the first female leader the Liberal Party

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<v Speaker 2>has ever had, especially given the problems that the party

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<v Speaker 2>has with women. Did gender play a role in this decision?

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, it's hard to look at the Liberal Party

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<v Speaker 4>and say that gender didn't play a role in the decision.

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<v Speaker 4>I think that the fact that it has only been

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<v Speaker 4>nine months gender does play a role in that there's

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<v Speaker 4>a lot of people in the Liberal Party who were

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<v Speaker 4>never going to vote for Susan Lee, who have not

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<v Speaker 4>actually wanted her to have any time, or wouldn't even

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<v Speaker 4>afford her the grace, and her being a woman would

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<v Speaker 4>play into that. Not saying that you know that they

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<v Speaker 4>that's their only reason, but it's certainly one of the

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<v Speaker 4>reasons I think that they feel so comfortable in moving

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<v Speaker 4>this quickly against Susan Lee. I think though, the bigger

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<v Speaker 4>problem for Susan Lee was when you hand women the

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<v Speaker 4>hospital pass of a failing job, or a failing party

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<v Speaker 4>or a failing organization, it always seems to be the

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<v Speaker 4>woman who's meant to clean up the mess and then

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<v Speaker 4>when it all, you know, inevitably implodes, that ends the

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<v Speaker 4>woman's career. That is not unique to the Liberal Party,

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<v Speaker 4>but Susan Lees had her own issues in that any

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<v Speaker 4>principle or policy that she has previously supported in her

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<v Speaker 4>time in Parliament, she has turned her back on in

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<v Speaker 4>this quest for the leadership, and that has meant that

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<v Speaker 4>she has lost allies, she has lost the foundation of

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<v Speaker 4>principle to be able to guide the party, and she's

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<v Speaker 4>lost authority. She never had it walking into the leadership.

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<v Speaker 4>So this is really it was inevitable that we would

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<v Speaker 4>reach this point.

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<v Speaker 2>So what she tipped in Amy is Anger's going to win.

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<v Speaker 4>Look, you can never know, as Malcolm Turnbull once said

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<v Speaker 4>that the only person that you can actually trust in

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<v Speaker 4>a leadership spill is the one telling you that they're

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<v Speaker 4>absolutely not going to vote for you. So you know,

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<v Speaker 4>and these are tight numbers. They haven't really changed since

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<v Speaker 4>May when they first did this. She only won by

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<v Speaker 4>a couple of votes then, and it's only going to

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<v Speaker 4>be a couple of votes now.

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<v Speaker 5>There's been a changeover in the Senate.

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<v Speaker 4>Some of Susan Lee's supporters like Holly Hughes are no

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<v Speaker 4>longer there. They've been replaced by Angus Taylor supporters like

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<v Speaker 4>Jess Collins. But that doesn't mean that Angus Taylor absolutely

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<v Speaker 4>has its sewn up. I would say it's the most

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<v Speaker 4>likely outcome, but it's still going to be close, I think,

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<v Speaker 4>and I don't think it's actually going to solve any

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<v Speaker 4>of the Liberal's fundamental problems, which is, what is the

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<v Speaker 4>Liberal Party in twenty twenty six, what does it stand for,

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<v Speaker 4>what direction is it heading in? And who does it

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<v Speaker 4>want to vote for it? Because at the moment, the

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<v Speaker 4>answer to all of those questions are very.

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<v Speaker 2>Unclear coming up. Can a leadership change fix the Liberal

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<v Speaker 2>Party's problems? Amy The Liberal leadership may in dispute, but

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<v Speaker 2>what is not in dispute is that the Liberal parties

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<v Speaker 2>in distrates. Will it change in leadership go any way

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<v Speaker 2>to solving the problems?

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<v Speaker 4>I would say on the face of it, no, I

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<v Speaker 4>don't think that people know who Angus Taylor is, and

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<v Speaker 4>I don't think that people were necessarily marking the Liberal

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<v Speaker 4>Party down because of Susan Lee. I think they were

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<v Speaker 4>marking the Liberal Party down because of the Liberal Party.

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<v Speaker 5>And that's not just been in this last nine months.

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<v Speaker 4>That's been at the twenty twenty five election and then

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<v Speaker 4>the twenty twenty two election, and again Angus Taylor hasn't

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<v Speaker 4>offered up any changes of how he would take the

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<v Speaker 4>fundamental problem of that tension between what is left of

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<v Speaker 4>the moderate wing the Liberal Party who want to win

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<v Speaker 4>inner city seats that the Teals hold, and then the

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<v Speaker 4>national right of the Liberal Party, which are very focused

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<v Speaker 4>on just fighting off one nation. So unless you find

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<v Speaker 4>some way to solve that problem of how the Liberal

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<v Speaker 4>Party appeals to the city while also trying to face

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<v Speaker 4>off against one nation, then you are not going to

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<v Speaker 4>see any material change in how people view the Liberal Party.

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<v Speaker 2>It's no secret that despite their Happy Families press conference

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<v Speaker 2>on Sunday, it was only Sunday.

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<v Speaker 5>Press bakers for lifetime.

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<v Speaker 2>Nationals leader David Little Proud wants Susan Lee gone. Despite

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<v Speaker 2>what he said in the press conference. What does this

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<v Speaker 2>change in leadership do if it happens due to the coalition.

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<v Speaker 4>Well, I think David Little Proud will probably work a

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<v Speaker 4>little easier with Angus Taylor than he has with Susan

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<v Speaker 4>Lee because it will calm down a lot of the

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<v Speaker 4>rabid conservatives within the National Party. But again, that doesn't

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<v Speaker 4>mean that that solves the Liberals problem, because if Angus

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<v Speaker 4>Taylor is going to be looking after the Nationals and

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<v Speaker 4>making sure that they get their policy positions in place,

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<v Speaker 4>then that means that any Liberal who wants to win

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<v Speaker 4>or hold on to an inner City seat can pretty

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<v Speaker 4>much just kiss that chance goodbye. I also think that

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<v Speaker 4>this idea that Angus Taylor is going to be able

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<v Speaker 4>to communicate better to people who are flirting with one

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<v Speaker 4>Nation than Barnaby Joyce and Pauline Hanson is a bit

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<v Speaker 4>of wishful king. Angus Taylor has never been a great communicator.

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<v Speaker 4>Jim Chalmers in the Parliament this week equipped that Angus

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<v Speaker 4>Taylor had been born with a silver foot in his mouth.

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<v Speaker 3>The Member four Hume was born with a silver foot

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<v Speaker 3>in his mouth, mister speaker.

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<v Speaker 4>Now, just when we thought that they couldn't go any

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<v Speaker 4>law and it got a very big laugh, not just

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<v Speaker 4>from the Labor benches but also from Angus Taylor's own

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<v Speaker 4>colleagues because.

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<v Speaker 5>It rings true.

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<v Speaker 4>So you've already got the attacks that Labor is lining

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<v Speaker 4>up here, which is going to hurt those inner city

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<v Speaker 4>liberals as well as you know, the alter suburban liberals,

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<v Speaker 4>which is this is a misogynistic move by the Liberal

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<v Speaker 4>Party to get rid.

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<v Speaker 5>Of their first female leader in under a year.

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<v Speaker 4>That makes it a lot easier for the Labor Party

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<v Speaker 4>to carry out this battle in this current political climate

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<v Speaker 4>because it's not somebody you know coming down on a

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<v Speaker 4>woman leader. It's man against man, and that's a lot

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<v Speaker 4>easier political fight to have.

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<v Speaker 2>And finally, Amy, it's been an incredibly dramatic few weeks

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<v Speaker 2>for the coalition and I guess I won't say for

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<v Speaker 2>the country. We saw the breakup, then the makeup. Now

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<v Speaker 2>this is this the end of the chaos?

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<v Speaker 4>Amy, No, I'd say that we'll be talking many, many,

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<v Speaker 4>many more times about the chaos within the Liberal Party.

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<v Speaker 4>It's just it's not something that they can arrest with.

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<v Speaker 5>A change of leadership.

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<v Speaker 4>You just have to look at the polling and you know,

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<v Speaker 4>people like a Redbridge group caused Samaras who are saying, well,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, the Liberal Party are not reaching women, they're

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<v Speaker 4>not reaching people in the regions, they're not reaching young people.

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<v Speaker 5>None of this is new.

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<v Speaker 4>This has been a problem for the Liberal Party for

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<v Speaker 4>years now and they have not arrested the slide. And

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<v Speaker 4>I don't think that someone like Angus Taylor, who has

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<v Speaker 4>been an architect of Liberal Party policy that has got

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<v Speaker 4>them to this place. I don't see how well anything

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<v Speaker 4>is going to change now that he's going to be

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<v Speaker 4>directing Liberal Party policy moving forward.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, Ami, it looks like we're going to be speaking many, many,

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<v Speaker 2>many more times in the near to distant future. So

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<v Speaker 2>thank you so much for your time anytime. Also in

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<v Speaker 2>the news, New South Wales Premier Chris Mins says he

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<v Speaker 2>won't apologize to the Muslim community after police were filmed

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<v Speaker 2>disbanding a prayer session at Monday's mass protest against the

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<v Speaker 2>Israeli president. The New South Wales Police Commissioner has apologized

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<v Speaker 2>after condemnation for Muslim groups and the Grand Mufty of Australia,

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<v Speaker 2>but only for any offense that may have been taken.

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<v Speaker 2>The sheikh leading the prayer has described police actions as

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<v Speaker 2>unhinged and aggressive. A Reserve Bank Governor Michelle Bullach has

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<v Speaker 2>lashed out at National Senator Matt Canavan. Canavan accused her

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<v Speaker 2>of gaslighting millions after she said the economy was quote

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<v Speaker 2>doing okay when their lived experience is terrible. Billick said

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<v Speaker 2>she was not gaslighting anyone, saying she only stated that

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<v Speaker 2>certain parts of the economy are doing well. I'm Daniel James.

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<v Speaker 2>You've been listening to seven Am. We'll be back tomorrow.