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Speaker 1: This is a man who lives in Thevernard just down

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Speaker 1: the road. Thevernard is the port of Sjuna if you like,

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Speaker 1: It's just four kilometers away. It's essentially almost housing between

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Speaker 1: so Juna and Thebinard. Bit of scrub on the way,

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Speaker 1: but not much, and before too long it probably will

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Speaker 1: be one big stretch of houses all the way along there.

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Speaker 1: But I caught up with this man. Have a listen.

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Speaker 1: I'm here with a man who's on the council, the

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Speaker 1: Sajuna Council, Mario Nichols. But Mario has made it clear

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Speaker 1: to me he's going to talk as a resident of

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Speaker 1: the town and Severnard, which is just nearby, and not

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Speaker 1: in his capacity as a counselor. Mariott. Thanks for your time. Now.

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Speaker 1: I'm here because we know there are issues in the town,

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Speaker 1: and certainly have been over the last few months over summer,

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Speaker 1: but it's been going on essentially since the casualist debit

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Speaker 1: card disappeared.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's Shoy. Thanks Matthew. You have a for one

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Speaker 2: and bred in his town to do in my life.

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Speaker 2: Fifty eight years old son has gone.

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Speaker 1: For a lot of social issues.

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Speaker 2: Back in twenty sixteen, we had introduction of the casts

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Speaker 2: debit card. Throw a lot of lobbying with politics that

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Speaker 2: was introduced. That card come in and it sorted out

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Speaker 2: to generals problems a big time, like the social problems

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Speaker 2: that we have here, the domestic violence and the alcohol

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Speaker 2: and the gambling, quarantine money for families to spend on food,

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Speaker 2: clothing and stuff like that. The current government made it

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Speaker 2: as an election promise back in twenty twenty two that

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Speaker 2: they would have bolished the card. That happened and since then, crime,

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Speaker 2: domestic violence, everything in the genesis sought out of control.

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Speaker 2: It's actually quite sad myself, having lived in this town

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Speaker 2: all my life to see it, like with the young

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Speaker 2: kids and that that are not getting fed properly, and

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Speaker 2: you can see that they're victims of violence, domestic violence

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Speaker 2: within their own homes and whatnot. And the removal of

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Speaker 2: the card, along with another program which was called mutual

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Speaker 2: obligations or returning home to get your doule payments or

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Speaker 2: your pension payments, that was abolished by a prior government,

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Speaker 2: the liberal government at the time, that also had quite

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Speaker 2: an impact upon the town, where upon people never had

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Speaker 2: to return, never had to return back the country to

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Speaker 2: get their pension entitlement. Within that we've created a perfect

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Speaker 2: circle of entitlement within the town where people got one

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Speaker 2: hundred percent of their money, they could spend it how

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Speaker 2: they want on alcohol, pokies, and it's always the kids

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Speaker 2: that miss out.

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Speaker 1: And that's the issue, isn't it. Because that money was available,

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Speaker 1: it was all going for those things, for alcohol and poky's, gambling, whatever's,

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Speaker 1: and not on food, not on clothing, not on the

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Speaker 1: necessities of life, and especially with kids. Yep, that's right.

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Speaker 2: And then the catch is debit card come along and

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Speaker 2: a quarantine are stand to be quoted on this? I

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Speaker 2: think it would have quarantined something like eighty percent of

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Speaker 2: that money where it had to be spent on food.

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Speaker 2: The system had its flaws. I will argue that there

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Speaker 2: are probably a lot of people and people say to

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Speaker 2: me that probably didn't need to be on the card.

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Speaker 2: But the people that are not not having got issues

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Speaker 2: with alcohol and gambling addictions, they wouldn't noticed that they

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Speaker 2: were on.

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Speaker 1: The card anyway.

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Speaker 2: So as far as I'm concerned, we only have something

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Speaker 2: like eleven people in.

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Speaker 1: Town at the moment that are on the.

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Speaker 2: Card because it is still here, but it's voluntary, So

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Speaker 2: it needs to be made compulsory across the board.

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Speaker 1: Because you can't pick and choose, can you. That's the

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Speaker 1: other thing? How can you do that?

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Speaker 2: Well, it almost becomes a scrimmatric. This bloke's on that bloat,

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Speaker 2: it's not on up. Why if those two people were

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Speaker 2: talk it does that becomes a discriminatory thing. We've got

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Speaker 2: to try and help vulnerable people manage their money for

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Speaker 2: the betterment of their life.

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Speaker 1: The big problem, one thing I've really started to understand

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Speaker 1: you're over the last couple of days, is that we're

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Speaker 1: trying to put our system on to Indigenous people and

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Speaker 1: we've known for centuries really that that hasn't worked.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree. I'll be quick important out that it's

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Speaker 2: not entirely indigenous. It's a broad spectrum of people within it.

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Speaker 2: All indigenous is are a fair proportion of the problem,

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Speaker 2: no doubt. Yes, I do sometimes wonder I've gone up

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Speaker 2: with the original people all my life and been out

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Speaker 2: in the scrub with them when they're on what they

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Speaker 2: call their country, and it is their country. From that

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Speaker 2: point of view, that the happiest race of people. Where

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Speaker 2: you start throwing alcohol in a marshall probably the that

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Speaker 2: we have in place for them is effectively killing off.

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Speaker 2: At the moment, I consider two generations of people, because

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Speaker 2: we've got the generation now the older people, the mums

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Speaker 2: and dads involved in all this alcohol and pokey and

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Speaker 2: gambling addictions, and the ones that are shuffering from it

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Speaker 2: are their kids.

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Speaker 1: It's quite sad. And of course, as we know, it

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Speaker 1: don't matter who you are. Kids learn from.

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Speaker 2: Parents, yes, that's short, they do. They learn in any

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Speaker 2: good kids upbringing. It comes, but you're dead right, Matthew,

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Speaker 2: from their parents. And look, we resolve the motion in

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Speaker 2: council the other day that we strongly applicate for the

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Speaker 2: return of income management.

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Speaker 1: So that passed five votes to three. That what the

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Speaker 1: council talk with the federal government about bringing.

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Speaker 2: The Oh well, we as a counsel now are going

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Speaker 2: to go lobbying hard. As another lobby group, I would

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Speaker 2: say that we strongly support. We've got to really look

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Speaker 2: at really installing income management in one way, shape or

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Speaker 2: form back into so we have it now, it's not compulsory.

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Speaker 2: It needs to be made compulsory. Now too shy and

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Speaker 2: help people out because we're just assuring a race of

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Speaker 2: people here at the moment.

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Speaker 1: I've noticed Intgina, there's so many different welfare government agencies.

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Speaker 1: There's you know, the Far West Original Corporation and it

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Speaker 1: goes from there. There's a stack of them. What do

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Speaker 1: they all do? Because surely you could you could get

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Speaker 1: by with one looking after a whole heap of things,

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Speaker 1: couldn't you.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it is a question that I asked myself, and

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Speaker 2: I know I've asked it lots of times of people.

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Speaker 2: I would dearly love someone to give me a list

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Speaker 2: of all the agencies in town, write down what the

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Speaker 2: agency is called and what they actually do, because I'm

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Speaker 2: puzzled by it all myself. I do honestly think and

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Speaker 2: people do say that I think a lot of these

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Speaker 2: agencies need to be on country where people come from,

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Speaker 2: because I think we have these agencies here and the

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Speaker 2: tracts people out of their country. They want to be home,

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Speaker 2: they don't want to be here.

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Speaker 1: So you're saying on the ap wyelands around the yellowter.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And it's not only that. I think we've even

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Speaker 2: got a lot of indigenous here out of Western Australia

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Speaker 2: because they don't have pakags in real West Australia. A

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Speaker 2: lot we do have in smaller towns here in South Australia.

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Speaker 2: So I'm led to believe a lot of people here

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Speaker 2: from West Australia here for that one reason is gambling

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Speaker 2: and because they don't have to go back to the

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Speaker 2: address to receive their entitlements, they stay here. So all

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Speaker 2: we've done is created a vicious circle that until we

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Speaker 2: look at ways of trying to break the circle and

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Speaker 2: helpless people by returning some of the services back on country,

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Speaker 2: I really don't think we're going to get anywhere. And

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Speaker 2: like I said, I'm fifty nine years old. I've literally

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Speaker 2: all my life, I've probably been very observant of stuff like,

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Speaker 2: at least in the last forty years, the town now

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Speaker 2: in the last chance, the move of the car worse

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Speaker 2: it's ever been.

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Speaker 1: So in your view, that's got to come back. That's

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Speaker 1: that's the bottom line here.

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Speaker 2: Oh look it is it's a no brainer. The problem

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Speaker 2: we have right now. I think everyone realizes that this

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Speaker 2: this card is a no brainer, but it's it's caught

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Speaker 2: up in political football right now. And because the Labor

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Speaker 2: government removed it, and I think now they probably realize

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Speaker 2: that they probably need eat some humble pie on it.

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Speaker 2: And reinstall it. But politically they aren't going to say

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Speaker 2: that because the Liberal government will probably say, we'll see

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Speaker 2: our soldiers told you so, we're gonna We've got an

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Speaker 2: election coming up in you probably quit me on this matth.

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Speaker 2: You'll be March.

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Speaker 1: That's in a year.

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Speaker 2: So I think we're going to hopefully, and fingers crossed

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Speaker 2: for the community and for the people, we're going to

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Speaker 2: see some change because it's just assuring a race of

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Speaker 2: people here. I've grown up in this town and I

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Speaker 2: can see what goes on Maria.

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Speaker 1: Just yesterday walking around town talking to business people, there

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Speaker 1: were some who were saying, look, it's not a problem.

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Speaker 1: You get these problems everywhere, yet they get stuff pinched.

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Speaker 1: But stuff gets pinched everywhere. It gets pinched in the

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Speaker 1: city shop lifting certainly true, right, we've got our issues

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Speaker 1: in Rundell Mallerblade. But others who just told me it's

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Speaker 1: just horrendous. They're scared for their stuff, they've got a

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Speaker 1: locked doors, that it's unsafe, young workers in their shops

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Speaker 1: seeing things they shouldn't see, and do with situations they

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Speaker 1: shouldn't have to deal with. What's the answer that when

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Speaker 1: you've got businesses who can't agree.

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Speaker 2: Look, the answers are in and what we're talking about.

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Speaker 2: There was a whole heap of letters which I think

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Speaker 2: Matthew's read. These letters that were put together by the

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Speaker 2: community address to anyone who may care to read them

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Speaker 2: or to whom it may concern. Those letters got a

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Speaker 2: lot of traction and I think have got a lot

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Speaker 2: of airplay final media and has gone in the federal politics.

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Speaker 2: People questioning the authentic authenticity of these letters. I know

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Speaker 2: people have said to maybe what template was ever used

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Speaker 2: to these letters? But there is no template, But you

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Speaker 2: can probably well argue there is because every business has

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Speaker 2: the same problem.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think that's exactly it. And having read them,

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Speaker 1: they are all different. They're not following to me, they're

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Speaker 1: not following a template, but they're talking about the same problem.

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Speaker 1: So there's going to be similarities.

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Speaker 2: They are. They are a lot. There's a roadhouse in

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Speaker 2: town and I've actually witnessed myself out the roadhouse. It's

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Speaker 2: just been revamped from a shell fence eye to a

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Speaker 2: colt ex fenceize there's a whole group of young people

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Speaker 2: that go into that shop. And it happened on a

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Speaker 2: twice three times daily basis where they're going that stuff

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Speaker 2: and they steal food out of the pie warmers and that,

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Speaker 2: and why are they're doing that. They're hungry. It's because

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Speaker 2: their parents have blown all their money. They've got no money,

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Speaker 2: they're hungry. About twenty years ago, stealing in town was

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Speaker 2: where someone was steal a football or a pair of

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Speaker 2: football works out the sports store, or toys out the

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Speaker 2: news agency or something like that. But but normally now

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Speaker 2: most of the food tests and I was teending to

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Speaker 2: be most of the theft in town now from young people.

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Speaker 2: It is food because they're hungry.

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Speaker 1: And there's just no money going around. That's terrible, there's

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Speaker 1: no money. Mario, really great chatting with you. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for your time today and well hopefully it helps. Thanks

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Speaker 1: Maria Nichols, who is a resident and longtime resident of

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Speaker 1: sojournan Thebanard and also on the council, although his views,

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Speaker 1: as he said at the start, not reflecting any council position,

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Speaker 1: just his own personal opinion