1 00:00:05,790 --> 00:00:08,520 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear & Greed Business Interview. I'm Sean Aylmer. 2 00:00:08,789 --> 00:00:11,070 Sean Aylmer: Not all of us watch TV each night or listen 3 00:00:11,070 --> 00:00:13,559 Sean Aylmer: to the radio each morning or pick up a newspaper, 4 00:00:13,830 --> 00:00:17,700 Sean Aylmer: but 82% of Australians leave home every day for work, 5 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:20,189 Sean Aylmer: for the shops, for the school run. It goes part 6 00:00:20,190 --> 00:00:23,070 Sean Aylmer: of the way towards explaining why outdoor advertising is such 7 00:00:23,070 --> 00:00:26,759 Sean Aylmer: a big business in Australia. And it's everywhere: billboards on 8 00:00:26,759 --> 00:00:30,000 Sean Aylmer: highways, posters at bus stops, digital screens in shopping centers, 9 00:00:30,389 --> 00:00:32,700 Sean Aylmer: even ads on the sides of buildings. It's all part 10 00:00:32,700 --> 00:00:35,429 Sean Aylmer: of the outdoor advertising ecosystem and a powerful way for 11 00:00:35,430 --> 00:00:39,270 Sean Aylmer: business to reach consumers in their everyday environments. The Outdoor 12 00:00:39,270 --> 00:00:43,200 Sean Aylmer: Media Association, or OMA, is the peak national industry body 13 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:47,489 Sean Aylmer: representing most of Australia's outdoor media display companies. Elizabeth McIntyre 14 00:00:47,820 --> 00:00:50,370 Sean Aylmer: is the chief executive of the OMA. Elizabeth, welcome to 15 00:00:50,370 --> 00:00:51,000 Sean Aylmer: Fear & Greed. 16 00:00:51,450 --> 00:00:53,489 Elizabeth McIntyre: Thank you for having me. It's wonderful to be here. 17 00:00:54,150 --> 00:00:56,670 Sean Aylmer: How big is the industry, Elizabeth? What are we talking about? 18 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:00,270 Elizabeth McIntyre: Oh, it's a 1. 2 billion industry. And as you've 19 00:01:00,270 --> 00:01:05,219 Elizabeth McIntyre: mentioned, because you can't unsubscribe and we're unmissable, it's growing 20 00:01:05,219 --> 00:01:07,590 Elizabeth McIntyre: all the time, and I think we're probably going to 21 00:01:07,590 --> 00:01:11,069 Elizabeth McIntyre: be the last broadcast medium. And it's a medium that 22 00:01:11,069 --> 00:01:14,400 Elizabeth McIntyre: we take very, very seriously, and I think that's the 23 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:17,970 Elizabeth McIntyre: reason for most of the growth. You mentioned all the 24 00:01:17,970 --> 00:01:21,899 Elizabeth McIntyre: different varieties of outdoor and out of home, but I'm 25 00:01:21,900 --> 00:01:26,219 Elizabeth McIntyre: sure people probably aren't even aware, it includes Petro convenience, 26 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:32,100 Elizabeth McIntyre: cafes, gymnasiums. All of those, and airports, are all included 27 00:01:32,100 --> 00:01:35,459 Elizabeth McIntyre: in our out- of- home and outdoor journeys every day. 28 00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:40,200 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So tell me, compared to ... Well, we read horror 29 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:45,360 Sean Aylmer: stories about (inaudible) , and I, having been in newspapers 30 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:47,819 Sean Aylmer: for many years, know those stories very well. I mean, 31 00:01:47,820 --> 00:01:50,010 Sean Aylmer: audio in a sense is okay, though I'm not so 32 00:01:50,010 --> 00:01:54,210 Sean Aylmer: sure about radio. Why is outdoor doing better relative to 33 00:01:54,210 --> 00:01:54,960 Sean Aylmer: those guys? 34 00:01:55,560 --> 00:01:58,499 Elizabeth McIntyre: Look, I think people are realizing the value of outdoor 35 00:01:58,500 --> 00:02:02,730 Elizabeth McIntyre: and out- of- home, and the many different formats that 36 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:05,340 Elizabeth McIntyre: the medium comes in. I think a lot of people 37 00:02:05,340 --> 00:02:07,860 Elizabeth McIntyre: think that they know out- of- home and they sort 38 00:02:07,860 --> 00:02:11,580 Elizabeth McIntyre: of do refer, as you have done yourself, to billboards 39 00:02:11,820 --> 00:02:15,570 Elizabeth McIntyre: and buses and transit and trains and things like that. 40 00:02:15,570 --> 00:02:18,389 Elizabeth McIntyre: But it really is at so many different touch points 41 00:02:18,389 --> 00:02:22,108 Elizabeth McIntyre: now of people's journeys, whether it's to work or just- 42 00:02:22,199 --> 00:02:24,719 Elizabeth McIntyre: out of- home, and we are really at all of 43 00:02:24,719 --> 00:02:28,260 Elizabeth McIntyre: those different touch points. And I think what it is allowing 44 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:32,160 Elizabeth McIntyre: brands and advertisers to do is to be able to 45 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:35,250 Elizabeth McIntyre: use a lot of those different formats along the way 46 00:02:35,550 --> 00:02:39,299 Elizabeth McIntyre: to not only, I guess, tell a story, some people 47 00:02:39,299 --> 00:02:42,630 Elizabeth McIntyre: don't like that phrase, but it also allows different formats 48 00:02:42,660 --> 00:02:46,440 Elizabeth McIntyre: to go into deeper depths of what the brand is 49 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:47,280 Elizabeth McIntyre: trying to convey. 50 00:02:48,270 --> 00:02:50,219 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so just explain that. Because when I see an 51 00:02:50,220 --> 00:02:54,000 Sean Aylmer: outdoor advertisement; except when I'm putting petrol into my car, 52 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,039 Sean Aylmer: so I'm watching something. I get that; but if I'm 53 00:02:56,040 --> 00:02:57,990 Sean Aylmer: driving on a freeway and I look up and there's a 54 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:01,979 Sean Aylmer: branded advertisement or something or other, I'm only seeing it 55 00:03:01,979 --> 00:03:02,879 Sean Aylmer: very briefly, aren't I? 56 00:03:03,270 --> 00:03:06,060 Elizabeth McIntyre: Well you sure are, but your brain is obviously capturing 57 00:03:06,060 --> 00:03:08,790 Elizabeth McIntyre: that information. And then what might happen is you might 58 00:03:08,790 --> 00:03:11,699 Elizabeth McIntyre: see that on a freeway and then you might be 59 00:03:11,700 --> 00:03:14,309 Elizabeth McIntyre: on that same freeway behind a bus that might sort 60 00:03:14,309 --> 00:03:17,038 Elizabeth McIntyre: of on a bus back capture another message, and then 61 00:03:17,038 --> 00:03:21,120 Elizabeth McIntyre: you might go into a Petro convenience or something, or 62 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:23,730 Elizabeth McIntyre: a shopping center. And all along the way, you are 63 00:03:23,730 --> 00:03:27,720 Elizabeth McIntyre: getting that brand reinforced and that message around that particular 64 00:03:28,169 --> 00:03:32,130 Elizabeth McIntyre: item reinforced in a different way. But what that does 65 00:03:32,429 --> 00:03:35,639 Elizabeth McIntyre: from sort of a neuro impact factor is increase that 66 00:03:35,639 --> 00:03:38,430 Elizabeth McIntyre: recognition in your brain every single time. So it's having 67 00:03:38,430 --> 00:03:40,350 Elizabeth McIntyre: that impact that you can't ignore. 68 00:03:41,190 --> 00:03:44,580 Sean Aylmer: Okay. Digitization seems to have ... I know little about this 69 00:03:44,580 --> 00:03:48,690 Sean Aylmer: area, Elizabeth, so bear with me. But certainly digitization seems 70 00:03:48,690 --> 00:03:50,700 Sean Aylmer: to have been a bit of a boon for outdoor. 71 00:03:51,299 --> 00:03:53,129 Elizabeth McIntyre: Yes, and I guess if we look at sort of 72 00:03:53,190 --> 00:03:56,880 Elizabeth McIntyre: what digital has done to, I guess, our revenue over the 73 00:03:56,880 --> 00:04:00,420 Elizabeth McIntyre: last decade, is increase it from, say, 70% to now 74 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:06,119 Elizabeth McIntyre: 74% in 2023. But I think there's two aspects of 75 00:04:06,150 --> 00:04:10,709 Elizabeth McIntyre: digitization. One is obviously the investment that our members have 76 00:04:10,709 --> 00:04:13,589 Elizabeth McIntyre: undergone for the industry, which is all the digital signs 77 00:04:13,590 --> 00:04:16,859 Elizabeth McIntyre: that you're seeing and all of that, the asset ownership of 78 00:04:16,860 --> 00:04:21,480 Elizabeth McIntyre: that. And it allows obviously more ads to circle through. 79 00:04:21,928 --> 00:04:24,089 Elizabeth McIntyre: But then there's another aspect as well, which is around 80 00:04:24,089 --> 00:04:28,409 Elizabeth McIntyre: programmatic. And what that allows advertisers and brands to do 81 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:32,279 Elizabeth McIntyre: is to drop their ads at a certain program when 82 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:34,950 Elizabeth McIntyre: they're going to drop their ads. So for example, we've 83 00:04:34,950 --> 00:04:38,880 Elizabeth McIntyre: had some really sophisticated campaigns around temperature. So when temperature 84 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:42,870 Elizabeth McIntyre: in certain areas is over 30 degrees, they can advertise 85 00:04:43,290 --> 00:04:45,810 Elizabeth McIntyre: ice creams or hoses or things like that. 86 00:04:45,810 --> 00:04:46,110 Sean Aylmer: Oh, wow. 87 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:49,800 Elizabeth McIntyre: But also, in the mornings, for example, in the mornings, 88 00:04:50,010 --> 00:04:53,370 Elizabeth McIntyre: maybe everyone's more, I guess, keen to find out where 89 00:04:53,370 --> 00:04:56,488 Elizabeth McIntyre: their nearest coffee brand is going to be selling. And 90 00:04:56,490 --> 00:04:59,670 Elizabeth McIntyre: so you can have that sort of morning versus afternoon 91 00:05:00,089 --> 00:05:04,198 Elizabeth McIntyre: advertising schedule, and it's a lot more targeted to that 92 00:05:04,199 --> 00:05:05,428 Elizabeth McIntyre: particular demographic. 93 00:05:06,149 --> 00:05:15,270 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Elizabeth. We'll be back in a minute. I'm 94 00:05:15,270 --> 00:05:21,509 Sean Aylmer: speaking to Outdoor Media Association's CEO, Elizabeth McIntyre. How do 95 00:05:21,509 --> 00:05:23,730 Sean Aylmer: I know whether it works? This is a totally leading 96 00:05:23,730 --> 00:05:25,830 Sean Aylmer: question because I know you're soon introducing a new audience 97 00:05:25,830 --> 00:05:29,550 Sean Aylmer: measurement system, MOVE. Tell me about that and how you 98 00:05:29,550 --> 00:05:31,380 Sean Aylmer: can measure audience for outdoor. 99 00:05:32,490 --> 00:05:36,178 Elizabeth McIntyre: Well, look, measuring for outdoor has been complicated in the 100 00:05:36,178 --> 00:05:39,570 Elizabeth McIntyre: past because it is a complicated medium. Whilst it's very 101 00:05:39,570 --> 00:05:42,839 Elizabeth McIntyre: simple to absorb, as you've seen, it comes in so 102 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:46,140 Elizabeth McIntyre: many different formats; from classic, which we sort of call 103 00:05:46,140 --> 00:05:50,130 Elizabeth McIntyre: static, to your digital, to, as I've already mentioned, all 104 00:05:50,130 --> 00:05:53,639 Elizabeth McIntyre: the different formats from retail through to bus backs and 105 00:05:53,639 --> 00:05:54,810 Elizabeth McIntyre: transit and everything else. 106 00:05:54,928 --> 00:05:54,988 Sean Aylmer: Yeah. 107 00:05:55,020 --> 00:05:59,009 Elizabeth McIntyre: So it's been different to find a common ground in 108 00:05:59,010 --> 00:06:01,650 Elizabeth McIntyre: which we can sort of measure that as a standardization 109 00:06:01,650 --> 00:06:04,470 Elizabeth McIntyre: across the industry. So that's made it difficult in the 110 00:06:04,470 --> 00:06:08,640 Elizabeth McIntyre: past. But we know and we're about to launch MOVE, 111 00:06:08,940 --> 00:06:11,849 Elizabeth McIntyre: which has really sort of looked at calibrating a whole 112 00:06:11,849 --> 00:06:14,758 Elizabeth McIntyre: lot of separate data points. And it's probably the most ... 113 00:06:14,759 --> 00:06:18,990 Elizabeth McIntyre: Well, it will be the most sophisticated and advanced software 114 00:06:18,990 --> 00:06:21,360 Elizabeth McIntyre: in the world for measuring outdoor and out- of- home, 115 00:06:21,540 --> 00:06:24,839 Elizabeth McIntyre: which we're really excited about. But to answer your first 116 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:26,760 Elizabeth McIntyre: part of that question is, " How do you know it 117 00:06:26,790 --> 00:06:31,349 Elizabeth McIntyre: works?", well, we know it works because we've done various 118 00:06:31,349 --> 00:06:35,969 Elizabeth McIntyre: brand studies around the presence that brands have, and even 119 00:06:35,969 --> 00:06:39,570 Elizabeth McIntyre: with other mediums that you've mentioned, they need to advertise 120 00:06:39,570 --> 00:06:42,299 Elizabeth McIntyre: on out- of- home and outdoor to ensure that they 121 00:06:42,300 --> 00:06:45,570 Elizabeth McIntyre: get the traffic, whether that be to their websites, to 122 00:06:45,570 --> 00:06:49,409 Elizabeth McIntyre: their television stations, or to their radios. We know that out- of- 123 00:06:49,410 --> 00:06:53,459 Elizabeth McIntyre: home and outdoor partners so well with other mediums, and 124 00:06:53,459 --> 00:06:56,490 Elizabeth McIntyre: that's what really builds the traffic as well as the brand. 125 00:06:57,570 --> 00:06:59,159 Sean Aylmer: Okay. I'm just going to go back to MOVE there. 126 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:01,890 Sean Aylmer: So how are you going to do that? I mean, as much 127 00:07:01,890 --> 00:07:02,880 Sean Aylmer: as you can say. 128 00:07:03,719 --> 00:07:06,389 Elizabeth McIntyre: So look, what we've done, and this is ... MOVE has 129 00:07:06,389 --> 00:07:09,178 Elizabeth McIntyre: been in development now for nearly four years, and what 130 00:07:09,178 --> 00:07:12,209 Elizabeth McIntyre: it really has taken into account is taken a lot 131 00:07:12,209 --> 00:07:16,590 Elizabeth McIntyre: of first census data. We synthesized our population where we 132 00:07:16,590 --> 00:07:20,700 Elizabeth McIntyre: actually tracked 4, 000 people with their permission. Then we 133 00:07:20,700 --> 00:07:26,130 Elizabeth McIntyre: overlaid that with movement, logistics, VLC, how people travel, and 134 00:07:26,130 --> 00:07:28,079 Elizabeth McIntyre: we've sort of had all of this data that's come 135 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:31,140 Elizabeth McIntyre: together. And what it will be able to do is 136 00:07:31,140 --> 00:07:36,210 Elizabeth McIntyre: measure advertising signs, which we now have over 130, 000 signs 137 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:40,650 Elizabeth McIntyre: in regional areas and place- based locations, which haven't been 138 00:07:40,650 --> 00:07:44,669 Elizabeth McIntyre: measured before. And really, in terms of granular data, this 139 00:07:44,670 --> 00:07:48,420 Elizabeth McIntyre: is going to be able to tell advertisers and brands 140 00:07:48,420 --> 00:07:51,120 Elizabeth McIntyre: to be able to target, for example, who is on 141 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:54,390 Elizabeth McIntyre: a train station, platform 3 at Wynyard, at 7: 30 142 00:07:54,390 --> 00:07:57,660 Elizabeth McIntyre: in the morning, what their spend is, where they're going, 143 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:02,670 Elizabeth McIntyre: what their affiliation to certain activities is. And we know 144 00:08:02,670 --> 00:08:05,219 Elizabeth McIntyre: that this is going to work because it's going to 145 00:08:05,219 --> 00:08:08,970 Elizabeth McIntyre: allow that data granularity without being invasive, and we're going to 146 00:08:08,970 --> 00:08:11,220 Elizabeth McIntyre: be the only medium that's able to do that. 147 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,640 Sean Aylmer: Okay. Where does that put us on the world stage? 148 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:17,340 Sean Aylmer: I mean, it sounds great. Is this kind of something 149 00:08:17,340 --> 00:08:19,050 Sean Aylmer: that we're adopting from elsewhere? 150 00:08:19,830 --> 00:08:24,239 Elizabeth McIntyre: We're not. This would be one of the biggest software 151 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:27,570 Elizabeth McIntyre: develops in terms of measuring out- of- home, and it 152 00:08:27,570 --> 00:08:31,050 Elizabeth McIntyre: will be a first and absolute gold standard for the 153 00:08:31,050 --> 00:08:35,190 Elizabeth McIntyre: world in what we introduce. What's important though is that 154 00:08:35,190 --> 00:08:38,250 Elizabeth McIntyre: you do have other regions in the world, particularly in 155 00:08:38,250 --> 00:08:41,969 Elizabeth McIntyre: Southeast Asia, where the numbers are there and the advertising 156 00:08:41,969 --> 00:08:44,970 Elizabeth McIntyre: revenue is there, but they're not necessarily moving it. So 157 00:08:44,970 --> 00:08:48,809 Elizabeth McIntyre: I think there's an important distinction between, I guess, revenue 158 00:08:48,809 --> 00:08:51,750 Elizabeth McIntyre: on a global scale and then how we measure that. 159 00:08:51,929 --> 00:08:54,540 Elizabeth McIntyre: And in some regions, as you can appreciate, the measurement 160 00:08:54,540 --> 00:08:57,961 Elizabeth McIntyre: isn't necessarily as important as the advertising revenue. 161 00:08:57,961 --> 00:09:03,120 Sean Aylmer: Okay. So where to for outdoor from here? You've got 162 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,838 Sean Aylmer: this great new tool. You said that you were confident 163 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:08,819 Sean Aylmer: earlier on. You were saying you're confident that it will 164 00:09:09,090 --> 00:09:13,348 Sean Aylmer: outlast other broadcast methods. What do you think is in store 165 00:09:13,349 --> 00:09:14,460 Sean Aylmer: for the next five years or so? 166 00:09:15,450 --> 00:09:17,969 Elizabeth McIntyre: Look, I think for the medium, it's really around ... We 167 00:09:17,969 --> 00:09:21,840 Elizabeth McIntyre: take the responsibility very seriously of being a broadcast medium. There's 168 00:09:21,840 --> 00:09:24,240 Elizabeth McIntyre: a lot of things that we do to self regulate. 169 00:09:24,690 --> 00:09:27,210 Elizabeth McIntyre: I'm not sure whether the audience is aware, but we 170 00:09:27,570 --> 00:09:30,929 Elizabeth McIntyre: do not advertise any sort of fatty or high sugary 171 00:09:30,929 --> 00:09:36,119 Elizabeth McIntyre: foods 150 meters from any school in Australia venue. And 172 00:09:36,119 --> 00:09:39,720 Elizabeth McIntyre: that's the sort of advantage that our measurement system is 173 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:42,660 Elizabeth McIntyre: able to give us. We can sort of draw those 174 00:09:42,660 --> 00:09:45,809 Elizabeth McIntyre: fences around those areas. So I think for us, it 175 00:09:45,809 --> 00:09:52,170 Elizabeth McIntyre: is really around capitalizing on being a broadcast medium, ensuring 176 00:09:52,170 --> 00:09:55,319 Elizabeth McIntyre: that people are now able to, I guess, link the 177 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:59,160 Elizabeth McIntyre: fact that there's a presence that wasn't necessarily being able 178 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:02,280 Elizabeth McIntyre: to measure. Because in the past, and currently, we just 179 00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:05,608 Elizabeth McIntyre: measure capital cities. So MOVE will be able to now 180 00:10:05,610 --> 00:10:08,458 Elizabeth McIntyre: bring into the regional element as well as a lot 181 00:10:08,460 --> 00:10:11,520 Elizabeth McIntyre: more seasonal data, and as I've mentioned before, this granular 182 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:13,740 Elizabeth McIntyre: data. So for us, we see it as a really 183 00:10:13,740 --> 00:10:16,620 Elizabeth McIntyre: big opportunity to grow. But also, I guess for the 184 00:10:16,620 --> 00:10:20,338 Elizabeth McIntyre: general public, it's something that is not invasive. And as 185 00:10:20,340 --> 00:10:24,270 Elizabeth McIntyre: I've mentioned before, we take our role in the built 186 00:10:24,270 --> 00:10:28,019 Elizabeth McIntyre: environment very, very seriously. We believe that we add to 187 00:10:28,020 --> 00:10:32,340 Elizabeth McIntyre: that atmosphere and creativity, and we certainly want to amplify 188 00:10:32,340 --> 00:10:33,660 Elizabeth McIntyre: that going forward. 189 00:10:34,290 --> 00:10:36,120 Sean Aylmer: Elizabeth, thank you for talking to Fear & Greed. 190 00:10:36,900 --> 00:10:38,040 Elizabeth McIntyre: Thank you so much for having me. 191 00:10:38,700 --> 00:10:41,730 Sean Aylmer: That was Elizabeth McIntyre, Chief Executive of the Outdoor Media 192 00:10:41,730 --> 00:10:44,639 Sean Aylmer: Association. This is the Fear & Greed Business Interview. Join us 193 00:10:44,639 --> 00:10:47,580 Sean Aylmer: every morning for the full episode of Feer & Greed, daily 194 00:10:47,580 --> 00:10:50,250 Sean Aylmer: business news for people who make their own decisions. I'm Sean 195 00:10:50,250 --> 00:10:51,750 Sean Aylmer: Aylmer. Enjoy your day.