WEBVTT - #477 Mastering the Game: Stella Petrou Concha on owning your career path 0:00:04.920 --> 0:00:10.640 Welcome to the mentor. I'm Marke Boris Stellar petro Conco. 0:00:10.760 --> 0:00:12.800 Welcome to the mentor. How are you going well? 0:00:12.840 --> 0:00:14.120 Thanks Mark, Thanks for having me. 0:00:14.840 --> 0:00:18.160 You're the founder and HEO of the Rio Group and 0:00:18.640 --> 0:00:20.239 you're an author. Will talk about stuff a bit later 0:00:20.239 --> 0:00:21.680 and doing lots of other things. But look at it. 0:00:23.120 --> 0:00:26.079 What does the Rio group do or what's Rio do? 0:00:26.840 --> 0:00:29.400 There's nothing that will putting down steel, is it? No? 0:00:29.920 --> 0:00:32.440 No, no no, But have been usd the question multiple times. 0:00:32.840 --> 0:00:36.320 We're a national recruitment, professional services and executive search firm 0:00:36.720 --> 0:00:40.160 Eastern Seaboard, Western Seaboard, Southern Seaboard of Australia. 0:00:40.280 --> 0:00:42.560 And not the Northern Sea Board, not yet, not yet. 0:00:42.760 --> 0:00:44.720 I'm not sure what sort of recruitment we do up there. 0:00:44.960 --> 0:00:47.600 Yeah, so recruitment of what that? What are we talking 0:00:47.600 --> 0:00:47.920 about you? 0:00:48.440 --> 0:00:58.120 White collar, finance, insurance, technology, business services, admin, staff, admin's staff, anything, 0:00:58.160 --> 0:01:00.040 white collar marketing. 0:01:00.760 --> 0:01:04.319 Right, and white collar is interesting term these days. White collar. 0:01:05.080 --> 0:01:07.000 Hopefully it's not going to get counseled for saying it, 0:01:07.040 --> 0:01:12.520 but is white collar? What does that relatively speaking? Say? 0:01:12.640 --> 0:01:14.520 Maybe competit? Blue collar? What do we mean by. 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:17.520 White collar professional? So people that generally have done a 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:20.800 degree and they've got some form of professional experience in 0:01:20.880 --> 0:01:24.400 a functional area like accounting. And then obviously you've got 0:01:24.440 --> 0:01:28.040 you know, your clerical which is not driven by yet admin. 0:01:28.560 --> 0:01:31.920 Yeah, so it would include admin people, yes. 0:01:31.880 --> 0:01:34.080 But that's not the predominant focus of what we do. 0:01:34.480 --> 0:01:38.280 Right. For example, you know, if I have a finance 0:01:38.360 --> 0:01:41.479 department and I need accountants to work in the finance department, 0:01:42.160 --> 0:01:46.080 some like your business Rear group, you would be recruiting 0:01:46.120 --> 0:01:49.480 people into my business that can actually assist in say 0:01:49.600 --> 0:01:54.920 accountspiyable data's management CFOs, that sort of stuff. 0:01:55.000 --> 0:01:55.320 Correct. 0:01:55.440 --> 0:02:00.280 Yeah, I have wandered, like in today's world, does that 0:02:01.320 --> 0:02:05.680 your model work with the way people tend to employed 0:02:05.720 --> 0:02:08.680 people in some of those roles, not all of those roles, 0:02:08.720 --> 0:02:10.960 but in some of those roles, say, out of the Philippines, 0:02:11.600 --> 0:02:14.040 how do you how does that affect your business or 0:02:14.080 --> 0:02:15.120 does it not affect your business? 0:02:15.400 --> 0:02:18.200 It doesn't really affect our business when you look at 0:02:18.240 --> 0:02:22.880 the total macroeconomic life cycles. So large organizations will outsource 0:02:22.960 --> 0:02:26.040 to large providers in the Philippines or in India, and 0:02:26.200 --> 0:02:28.360 then you know, you might lose some of the recruitment 0:02:28.400 --> 0:02:30.919 in that clerical level, but certainly not in any sort 0:02:30.919 --> 0:02:34.760 of you know, more value add level, so anything above 0:02:34.840 --> 0:02:39.000 say one hundred k, you know it's all local, but 0:02:39.120 --> 0:02:42.639 that that tends not to work sometimes. So what we find, 0:02:42.880 --> 0:02:45.359 and what we've seen with many large as sexes, is 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:47.959 that they'll outsource. They'll do that for four years, and 0:02:48.000 --> 0:02:49.679 then they'll come back and they'll in source. And it 0:02:49.800 --> 0:02:52.320 just depends on who the CFO is because as you 0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:56.320 turn executives at the top end, you turn the strategy, 0:02:56.720 --> 0:03:00.079 and when the strategy changes, the execution plan changes. So 0:03:00.240 --> 0:03:03.600 what we find is that recruitment, we pick up recruitment 0:03:03.639 --> 0:03:05.239 along the way. So you know, we've just got to 0:03:05.280 --> 0:03:08.000 be agile and understand. You know what's happening in the market, 0:03:08.080 --> 0:03:10.799 who's outsourcing, who's insourcing, and you know what are the 0:03:10.919 --> 0:03:12.760 changes that are happening within an organization. 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:14.720 That's what of makes sense too, like you, because if 0:03:14.720 --> 0:03:18.440 I'm a new CFO, and these things happen in cycles. 0:03:18.480 --> 0:03:21.760 But if I'm a new CFO of originally large company, 0:03:21.840 --> 0:03:24.760 first thing I want to do is build my strategy. 0:03:25.800 --> 0:03:28.079 And by the way, generally speaking, the strategy before me 0:03:28.200 --> 0:03:31.119 is never any good. We're not good enough. And I'll 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:35.080 put in my strategy and then the early period, I 0:03:35.200 --> 0:03:36.920 want to make sure that everybody's sitting in front of 0:03:36.960 --> 0:03:38.960 me or somewhere near me so that I can get 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:41.880 my strategy executed, because it's about not about building strategy 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:44.760 that's not that hard, but the execution piece is really hard. 0:03:45.080 --> 0:03:48.240 So getting local people to help you get it executed 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:52.280 up and running, so to speak, is probably pretty important. 0:03:52.280 --> 0:03:54.760 And then I might schedule period in my CFO ship 0:03:55.280 --> 0:03:57.760 where everything's running smoothly, and then I might start to think, hang, 0:03:57.840 --> 0:04:00.720 I've got to reduce cost so that I'm like, Okay, 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:03.560 now I've got it up and running. My cycle is 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:06.240 now going to maybe shift few of the costs outsourced, 0:04:06.240 --> 0:04:08.720 a few of the costs of somewhere else, usually at 0:04:08.760 --> 0:04:11.840 the admin level. And because I have been through these 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:15.000 processes myself, not as a siefhoe but in businesses that 0:04:15.080 --> 0:04:16.839 I own or I watched the CEFO do this stuff. 0:04:17.040 --> 0:04:18.960 So that's a good point. You make a really good point, 0:04:19.440 --> 0:04:21.320 quite an interesting point. But it's an interesting point for 0:04:21.360 --> 0:04:26.680 someone who might be an employee because their life cycle 0:04:27.720 --> 0:04:31.440 usually depends upon the life cycle or the individual who's 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:34.560 employing them or who they're ultimately reporting into. 0:04:35.160 --> 0:04:36.560 Correct that's what creates the opportunity. 0:04:36.680 --> 0:04:39.120 Yeah, and that's a two way thing. If you do 0:04:39.240 --> 0:04:41.080 nothing about it, if you're the employee and you do 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:43.040 nothing better, or if you're not aware of it, and 0:04:43.120 --> 0:04:46.560 if you're not watching what's going on, you could get 0:04:47.640 --> 0:04:49.840 disadvantaged by that. But if you are aware of it, 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:53.960 you can become advantage by that in lots of different ways. 0:04:54.839 --> 0:04:58.000 Can I just go back? That's just had nothing to 0:04:58.040 --> 0:05:00.160 do with your business, but I just always interesting talk 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:01.960 about from my point of view, So if we could 0:05:02.040 --> 0:05:05.240 just go back a bit, You've got a whole heap 0:05:05.240 --> 0:05:08.160 of things that you do. Like you involved in academia, 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:12.440 you write books. It looks like you, you know, you 0:05:13.320 --> 0:05:15.800 do the self mastery framework, which is something you want 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:19.320 to explore. And you know people at Google says your 0:05:19.360 --> 0:05:21.680 TikTok better they get you to talk to their staff. 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:26.840 I presume because I know that Google often Matter and 0:05:27.120 --> 0:05:29.280 Matter actually often brings people in to talk to the 0:05:29.360 --> 0:05:33.120 staff from out as part of their education programs. As 0:05:33.160 --> 0:05:35.440 one of the offerings that people like matter. I guess 0:05:35.480 --> 0:05:38.320 Google does it do people like meta do? I want 0:05:38.320 --> 0:05:40.520 to talk about those a little bit later, but I 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:43.800 want to find out how did you become this person. 0:05:45.279 --> 0:05:48.039 You know, what's your story? Where did you come from? Yeah? 0:05:48.080 --> 0:05:51.680 Yeah, yeah, Well look I'll start with where I am now, 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:53.440 and then I'll just quickly and I'll take you back 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:56.200 to kind of the seed. I've been in the recruitment 0:05:56.240 --> 0:06:01.640 game for about twenty years, interviewed thousands and thousands of executives. 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:05.279 Across my time, but not in your present form. 0:06:06.040 --> 0:06:08.960 In my present form, I am a full time CEO 0:06:09.120 --> 0:06:11.200 of this agency. I've got a couple of other businesses. 0:06:11.200 --> 0:06:15.080 I've got my academic positions, my board positions, and you know, 0:06:15.480 --> 0:06:17.679 somewhere in between everything, I do a bit of recording 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:20.400 and a little bit of content production. But that's the 0:06:20.480 --> 0:06:22.480 capacity that I've been able to grow over the last 0:06:22.480 --> 0:06:24.679 twenty years. But no, my full time job is CEO 0:06:24.720 --> 0:06:25.360 of group. 0:06:25.720 --> 0:06:29.400 Before that, the how'd you become CEO of rare Group? 0:06:29.480 --> 0:06:31.520 And why did you decide to form this group? 0:06:34.120 --> 0:06:37.560 You know your questions. Let me finish. 0:06:38.520 --> 0:06:40.560 Now I'm in charge of you. You're used to being 0:06:40.600 --> 0:06:44.640 in charge. So today, oh no, the apprentice is coming 0:06:44.720 --> 0:06:47.400 in today. You have to answer the questions. 0:06:47.600 --> 0:06:51.600 No, no, no, But look where it all started. 0:06:51.839 --> 0:06:56.200 Was I wanted to be a doctor, like a medical doctor. 0:06:56.320 --> 0:06:59.480 Yes I did, and I knew from a very young 0:06:59.520 --> 0:07:01.160 age that was what I want to do in my life. 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:03.000 And they used to call me doctor Goose, even as 0:07:03.040 --> 0:07:04.159 young as five years old. 0:07:04.480 --> 0:07:08.000 Doctor Goose Goose at home, you meet at. 0:07:07.920 --> 0:07:10.800 Home, right, I'm Greek. My grandmother used to call me 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:15.520 gordrul Lamore and that got shortened to Goose, and right 0:07:15.600 --> 0:07:18.880 through school. My nickname at school, you know, year five, 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:21.760 year sixty seven was doctor Goose, and it was very 0:07:21.880 --> 0:07:23.960 clear to me that that was going to be my vocation. 0:07:27.520 --> 0:07:31.680 I did do a medical science as undergraduate. I did 0:07:31.760 --> 0:07:35.600 finish my internship year at Westmeat Private Hospital, a Westmeat 0:07:35.600 --> 0:07:38.880 public hospital. Sorry, and I did not like it. I 0:07:39.040 --> 0:07:43.800 chose the wrong degree, and so I retrained myself as 0:07:43.800 --> 0:07:47.920 a psychotherapist and then I started a business in Balmain 0:07:48.000 --> 0:07:53.440 called Mind Connection, and that psychotherapy practice treated people at 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:56.000 the level of their mind. So I was treating sick people, 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:59.600 different types of sicknesses, but from a different perspective. And 0:07:59.760 --> 0:08:01.480 I was charging one hundred and eighty bucks an hour. 0:08:01.840 --> 0:08:03.920 And went to the bank to get a loan to 0:08:03.960 --> 0:08:05.880 buy house, and they wouldn't give me a loan because 0:08:05.880 --> 0:08:08.400 I was a sole operator I was a small business 0:08:08.440 --> 0:08:10.760 owner and I couldn't get ahead. And I thought, you know, 0:08:10.920 --> 0:08:12.480 how am I going to pay off this degree? What 0:08:12.560 --> 0:08:15.040 am I going to do? I can't get ahead here, 0:08:15.240 --> 0:08:16.480 so I need to go get a job. So I 0:08:16.560 --> 0:08:18.920 closed that business down in Balmain and I went and 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:21.680 got a job. And see, I had this degree, this 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:27.440 clinical degree, and this incredible bedside experience and a clinical mind, 0:08:27.960 --> 0:08:31.440 and then I had experience as a business owner in psychotherapy, 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:34.240 and I didn't know where to go to get a job. 0:08:34.600 --> 0:08:36.319 And I was forced to get a job because back 0:08:36.400 --> 0:08:38.439 then we were talking twenty years ago, it was difficult 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:40.679 to get a loan and I wanted to get a loan. 0:08:40.840 --> 0:08:44.040 I wanted to buy a house. So I got a 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:48.319 job at Johnson and Johnson Jane Jack as a medical rep. 0:08:48.400 --> 0:08:50.760 So they went, well, you know this, girl, I've got. 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:53.880 All I've got is an internship year, is clinical experience, 0:08:53.960 --> 0:08:56.480 and then this business. So really, I'm twenty five and 0:08:56.520 --> 0:08:59.760 I'm still a rookie. I still haven't got any experience. 0:09:00.160 --> 0:09:02.360 I'm in massive debt, massive. 0:09:02.080 --> 0:09:06.400 Massive debt, and has and you need debt, nah, like. 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:09.040 The business, you know said a lot of money into 0:09:09.080 --> 0:09:17.920 that business, and so get this job and I'm repping, 0:09:18.000 --> 0:09:19.840 and I thought, you know, there's going to be more 0:09:19.880 --> 0:09:22.760 to life than this. I've got this you know, academic background, 0:09:23.520 --> 0:09:26.360 and then I somehow fell into recruitment. And what I 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:28.559 realized when I got into recruitment, because it's kind of 0:09:28.600 --> 0:09:31.400 like a series of failures, like job one failure, You're 0:09:31.400 --> 0:09:33.040 never going to be a doctor. You don't even like it. 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:35.839 It was far too process driven for me. Job to 0:09:36.120 --> 0:09:39.480 clinical psychotherapist. Start your own business, that's exactly what I am. 0:09:39.559 --> 0:09:42.240 I'm you know, kind of an entrepreneur, but couldn't make 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:44.320 any money in it and was forced to leave because 0:09:44.360 --> 0:09:48.199 of the situation of the time job number three Johnson 0:09:48.200 --> 0:09:52.080 and Johnson Medical repping wasn't using my brain, wasn't really contributing, 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:55.280 not really selling products basically yeah, selling you know, knocking 0:09:55.520 --> 0:09:58.640 doctor's doorsteps and having kind of those sorts of conversations 0:09:59.120 --> 0:10:01.120 wasn't going to be only did it for two years 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:03.680 and then fell into recruitment, and I didn't as a recruiter. 0:10:04.360 --> 0:10:09.360 As a recruiter, so finance recruitment and I was good 0:10:09.400 --> 0:10:09.599 at it. 0:10:09.760 --> 0:10:13.199 But that's so out there, it's so weird. How did 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:18.160 someone whoever it was the recruiting companies say, Okay, your 0:10:18.400 --> 0:10:21.040 job will be recruiting for finance companies or for companies 0:10:21.040 --> 0:10:24.199 who need financial people. How do they pick that like you? 0:10:24.600 --> 0:10:27.000 So recruitment's a sales job. So all you need is 0:10:28.280 --> 0:10:31.200 very very strong at KIM and up here. You've got 0:10:31.240 --> 0:10:33.160 to be able to read people. You've got to be 0:10:33.160 --> 0:10:35.199 able to ask questions. You've got to be able to 0:10:35.280 --> 0:10:38.400 make deductions on what people tell you, and you've got 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:41.959 to understand ecosystems. So you've got to say, well, if 0:10:42.000 --> 0:10:44.560 this person has this kind of layer and this type 0:10:44.600 --> 0:10:46.880 of skill, you've got to be able to match them 0:10:47.000 --> 0:10:50.400 to strategy, culture and functional needs of organizations. And if 0:10:50.440 --> 0:10:52.760 you can get those two right, you're in business. And 0:10:52.880 --> 0:10:55.400 within a very very short period of time in this organization, 0:10:55.559 --> 0:10:59.000 I became their Asia Pacific number one recruiter. I was 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:01.480 really good at it. And what made me good at it, 0:11:01.600 --> 0:11:06.000 I think was my medical background. How's that because I 0:11:06.200 --> 0:11:09.040 was able to treat each one of my candidates as 0:11:09.080 --> 0:11:13.439 a patient. So I asked them questions like employee. You know, 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:15.360 the people I was into me, the people that wanted 0:11:15.400 --> 0:11:17.520 to leave their jobs, the people that needed a new job. 0:11:17.679 --> 0:11:20.240 Yeah, the person you're going to place that's correct, and 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:21.200 asking them. 0:11:23.240 --> 0:11:25.760 More psychotherapeutic questions like why are you here right now? 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:28.520 What's brought you to this space? Why don't you like 0:11:28.600 --> 0:11:34.520 your job? Deeper than profiling, much deeper than profiling, I 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:38.880 would say, going deep into their value and belief motivations. 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:44.040 And that created some really beautiful work. And then the 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:48.679 GFC hit and I was still doing very well, but 0:11:48.840 --> 0:11:52.319 my boss was made redundant. Then my boss's boss was 0:11:52.360 --> 0:11:55.160 made redundant, and then my boss's boss's boss was made redundant, 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:59.040 and I thought, oh my god, what's going on? And 0:11:59.120 --> 0:12:00.920 they were all females, and I ended up being the 0:12:01.000 --> 0:12:04.600 last female in this organization back in two thousand and nine, 0:12:06.280 --> 0:12:08.880 and I turned to my fiance at the time, who's 0:12:08.920 --> 0:12:11.400 now my husband. I said to him, I actually don't 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:13.599 think I can keep working here because I want to 0:12:13.640 --> 0:12:15.560 get married, I won't have a baby. I don't feel 0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:17.400 that this is the environment that's going to allow me 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:20.560 to do that. Would you be interested in going into 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:21.160 business with me? 0:12:21.360 --> 0:12:22.160 And what was he doing? 0:12:22.800 --> 0:12:25.040 So he was a small business owner himself. He had 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:27.880 a couple of businesses. He actually had five businesses, and 0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:31.040 he goes, Okay, Babel, I don't know anything about recruitment, 0:12:31.080 --> 0:12:32.360 but if this is what you want to do for 0:12:32.440 --> 0:12:34.600 the rest of your life, let's give it a crack. 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:38.120 So I resigned. He sold his last business to John 0:12:38.200 --> 0:12:40.559 Houston actually had an important export business. He sold it 0:12:40.640 --> 0:12:46.280 to John Cuson. Yeah, that's correct, and so I sat 0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:50.040 out my noncompete and then in twenty ten together we 0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:52.880 launched Reo Group. He had zero experience in recruitment. I 0:12:53.000 --> 0:12:56.000 had two, and somehow, fifteen years later, we are. 0:12:57.800 --> 0:13:00.079 How important do you think it is? Do you you 0:13:00.120 --> 0:13:03.800 think it is in hindsight having had the experience as 0:13:03.840 --> 0:13:07.040 a because that's a hard cell. Working for the pharmaceutical 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:09.320 companies that they going around to doctors. That's a hard 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:11.440 sell because you know, as you walk out the door, 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:15.240 the next one, why is it walks in? And whoever 0:13:15.280 --> 0:13:18.920 it is, they'll walk in and the doctor's being inundated 0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:22.760 by the surface. So how important was in hindsight was 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:26.559 that selling? I hate the words selling? Was that relationship 0:13:26.600 --> 0:13:27.960 building experience? 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:34.000 I would say what that taught me was hard core 0:13:34.640 --> 0:13:39.000 cold introductions. It was so cold. They gave you little 0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:42.080 training and they said, here, you've got your clinical work papers, 0:13:42.120 --> 0:13:44.800 go and rock up to that doctor down on Victoria Street. 0:13:44.880 --> 0:13:46.760 You go and you introduce yourself. You let them know 0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:48.640 who you are, and you've got to tell them about 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:50.640 your drug and we're going to monitor you and we're 0:13:50.640 --> 0:13:53.000 going to see how much of your drug gets written 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:55.520 in that location, in that brick. 0:13:56.480 --> 0:13:56.800 And so. 0:13:58.400 --> 0:14:00.600 Medicin's Australia have changed the rules. Now it's all changed. 0:14:00.600 --> 0:14:02.680 I mean we're talking twenty years ago, because you really 0:14:02.720 --> 0:14:07.040 should not be using sales techniques to push drugs, but 0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:10.160 that's what we were doing. So what they taught me 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:13.360 was how to be fearless and how to accept the 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:17.319 fact that you are going to walk in that doctor 0:14:17.480 --> 0:14:19.960 is going to say I'm not interested. Please please don't. 0:14:20.480 --> 0:14:25.800 You're just a rap. You will feel disrespectfed, disrespected. Your 0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:27.280 academic background will be. 0:14:28.960 --> 0:14:30.720 Over looked, dismissed, overlooked. 0:14:31.480 --> 0:14:36.280 You are a glorified coffee runner and you had to 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:37.200 manage that yourself. 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:42.920 It goes off and wonder about that. So your cold calling, 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:44.960 I mean I presume you just ringing the doctor the 0:14:45.000 --> 0:14:45.760 medical center up. 0:14:46.040 --> 0:14:46.760 No, you just walk in. 0:14:46.840 --> 0:14:49.680 There's no calls, no calls, a walk in this walk. 0:14:50.040 --> 0:14:54.640 So you sit down there waiting for your turn, as 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:56.840 in pretending that you're having a consultation or no, no, no, 0:14:57.120 --> 0:14:57.360 You go. 0:14:57.480 --> 0:14:59.440 Up and you go up to the receptionists, tell them 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:01.520 who you are. They'll put you in line and you 0:15:01.560 --> 0:15:02.280 sit there in your way. 0:15:02.400 --> 0:15:04.320 Oh really, yeah, it's. 0:15:04.920 --> 0:15:07.880 And then you've got maybe thirty seconds at the at 0:15:07.920 --> 0:15:09.960 the counter to have a conversation with the doctor if 0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:12.240 they let you. And you know, these poor. 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:14.120 Doctors, I have so much at the county. You don't 0:15:14.160 --> 0:15:16.360 go into the comment sometimes if they like it, you did, 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:21.800 but they liked you you did. Otherwise you're talking on 0:15:21.880 --> 0:15:22.800 the talking on the run. 0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:25.760 So what's great training? 0:15:25.880 --> 0:15:27.160 So I was going to say, what did you learn 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:29.920 from that thirty seconds then that people could use today? 0:15:29.960 --> 0:15:32.040 I mean, what are the sort of fundamentals you got 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:34.080 out of that in terms of either getting into the 0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:37.000 room so you can have a longer conversation or at 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:39.040 least getting them to give you an email address or something. 0:15:39.160 --> 0:15:40.880 I don't know. What do you try to do? 0:15:41.280 --> 0:15:44.960 Is this? You've got to do the volume. Not every 0:15:45.080 --> 0:15:47.440 call that you make, not every strike that you make, 0:15:47.560 --> 0:15:51.440 is going to land. So you've got to do the volume. 0:15:51.480 --> 0:15:54.160 And it's that traditional sales funnel. The volume tells us 0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:58.400 that so long as you're doing enough, you know the funnel, 0:15:59.200 --> 0:16:02.200 then it's some point it's going to drop into a sale, 0:16:02.320 --> 0:16:05.920 let's say, or something will convert. But if your volume 0:16:05.960 --> 0:16:08.400 of leads or your volume of activity, if if it 0:16:08.480 --> 0:16:11.600 isn't high enough, if you're not touching enough people, then 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:13.680 you're not going to convert. So what that taught me 0:16:14.560 --> 0:16:17.440 was just do the volume. This is not about quality. 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:21.160 This is about volume and see over time. What volume 0:16:21.240 --> 0:16:25.080 does is it permits the opportunity for quality to become 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:28.440 available to you. You've got to earn the right to 0:16:28.520 --> 0:16:30.520 have a quality conversation. You can't just go in and 0:16:30.560 --> 0:16:32.400 have a quality conversation. No one's going to trust you. 0:16:32.800 --> 0:16:34.240 You've got to earn that right. And how do you 0:16:34.320 --> 0:16:36.600 earn that right. You've got to do the hours, you've 0:16:36.600 --> 0:16:38.800 got to do the calls, you've got to do the work. 0:16:39.200 --> 0:16:42.800 The volume, and that usually informs an opportunity. You know, 0:16:43.040 --> 0:16:45.800 you touch that doctor y. You know, for us in recruitment, 0:16:45.840 --> 0:16:49.040 you touch that client enough times after three or four touches, 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:52.080 so like, okay, I like you. I'll give you a 0:16:52.160 --> 0:16:55.080 moment and at that point you've earned the right to 0:16:55.200 --> 0:16:56.360 have the right conversation. 0:16:57.320 --> 0:17:04.119 That's really interesting. So the concept of hard work or 0:17:04.200 --> 0:17:06.720 being prepared to do things over and over and over 0:17:06.720 --> 0:17:13.800 again is to some extent statistically controlled by just normal 0:17:13.880 --> 0:17:16.600 conversion rates. So don't expect are you saying, don't expect 0:17:16.680 --> 0:17:19.480 to be I'm going to convert ten out of ten. 0:17:19.880 --> 0:17:21.800 I'm going to go against the grain. Most people aren't 0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:24.200 going to convert one out of ten the general rules. 0:17:24.400 --> 0:17:26.440 Some really good people might convert one and a half 0:17:26.480 --> 0:17:28.600 out of ten or one point eight out of ten. 0:17:29.040 --> 0:17:30.520 But I'm going to do ten out of ten. Therefore'm 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:32.199 going to instead of doing one hundred points, I'm going 0:17:32.240 --> 0:17:34.600 to going to do ten appointments. You can't go against 0:17:34.640 --> 0:17:37.760 the trends, you can't go against the stats. So you've 0:17:38.280 --> 0:17:42.360 got to work with the stats. So that just means therefore, 0:17:43.440 --> 0:17:46.560 don't be shitty, and don't be disappointed if you choose 0:17:46.600 --> 0:17:50.200 this environment. Don't be shitty. Don't be disappointed if because 0:17:50.240 --> 0:17:52.520 you've got to do one hundred calls a week or 0:17:52.560 --> 0:17:54.480 one hundred visits a week, or whatever the case may be, 0:17:54.560 --> 0:17:55.720 and you might have to do it for a whole 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:59.120 year or two years or three years just to get 0:17:59.200 --> 0:18:03.040 your rep wrap up, your reputation up, and also your 0:18:03.080 --> 0:18:07.720 contacts up and your sort of flow flow state rhythm rhythm. 0:18:07.880 --> 0:18:10.400 Yeah, you've got to build it. You know, there's there's 0:18:10.400 --> 0:18:12.520 a lot of there's a law around this. You've got 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:15.200 to you've got to work with the law l A 0:18:15.400 --> 0:18:15.960 W or l o. 0:18:16.119 --> 0:18:17.480 R l a W. 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:20.240 You've got to the laws of the world, right, Yeah, 0:18:20.720 --> 0:18:20.879 you know. 0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:25.360 There is a because you know there's some people say 0:18:28.200 --> 0:18:30.480 the l O I E in other words, it's sort 0:18:30.480 --> 0:18:33.080 of folkloric that you just got to do lots of 0:18:33.119 --> 0:18:36.359 volume to get cut through in other words, and and 0:18:36.480 --> 0:18:39.080 that's sort of like it can be a bit folk lourish. 0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:41.720 But you're saying it's sort of like a law of 0:18:42.160 --> 0:18:45.840 the universe. It's like nearly a statistical law. You're you 0:18:45.960 --> 0:18:48.240 will not be the statistics of people who are interested 0:18:48.280 --> 0:18:50.359 in your product. It doesn't matter how good you are 0:18:50.720 --> 0:18:53.199 at it. You might you might, you might get at 0:18:53.240 --> 0:18:57.159 the upper end of the statistical range, but you're not 0:18:57.200 --> 0:18:59.280 going to sort of outperform it by ten times. 0:18:59.520 --> 0:19:01.719 No, you're not a superhuman. 0:19:01.359 --> 0:19:03.480 Unless you do can do ten times as many meetings. 0:19:04.000 --> 0:19:06.920 I saw a meme on LinkedIn recently on Federer, he 0:19:07.000 --> 0:19:11.040 said that he only lands fifty two percent of his serves. 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:15.520 The other forty eight percent he fails, and yet he 0:19:15.720 --> 0:19:17.880 is one of the best tennis players of all time. 0:19:17.960 --> 0:19:20.600 And the message in that is he is not perfect. 0:19:20.720 --> 0:19:22.720 Fifty two percent of the time he lands, at forty 0:19:22.720 --> 0:19:25.560 eight percent of the time he doesn't. And so even 0:19:26.200 --> 0:19:31.760 our greatest athletes aren't landing every time. So why would 0:19:31.760 --> 0:19:34.159 it be any different for a corporate Why would it 0:19:34.160 --> 0:19:37.960 be any different for anyone just in the standard work environment? 0:19:38.119 --> 0:19:40.000 Has that got Has that got something to do with 0:19:40.080 --> 0:19:45.840 the in reflective sense, something to do with the target 0:19:46.119 --> 0:19:48.600 the person or targeting and you're in the case of 0:19:48.600 --> 0:19:52.200 the example just gave us the doctor or the medical practitioner. 0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:55.840 Has it got something to do with the attention span 0:19:55.960 --> 0:19:58.680 of individuals? Is that got something to do with understanding 0:19:58.720 --> 0:20:01.399 and respecting how busy they just how busy they are? 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:04.680 Has it got somebody to do with understanding or being 0:20:04.720 --> 0:20:09.440 aware of the ability to cut through when somebody is 0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:12.399 really busy in a busy environment like a day, surgery 0:20:12.480 --> 0:20:15.440 or whatever the case may be. What do you think 0:20:15.480 --> 0:20:18.399 that's got to do with Because it doesn't necessarily we 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:20.560 shouldn't necessarily reflect on ourself saying oh bloody ell, I 0:20:20.640 --> 0:20:22.840 was hopeless. I couldn't get through it. To the individual, 0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:26.240 it's probably more about the individual. It's more about understeing 0:20:26.240 --> 0:20:26.720 the individual. 0:20:27.400 --> 0:20:31.040 I think it's a few things. I think that first 0:20:31.080 --> 0:20:35.119 of all, it's attitude within the individual. There needs to 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:40.600 be an underlining, underlining attitude of growth mindset call it. 0:20:40.760 --> 0:20:43.240 They have to have a positive relationship with failure. But 0:20:43.400 --> 0:20:46.639 second to that, they have to have a positive relationship 0:20:46.720 --> 0:20:47.199 with failure. 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:51.600 What does that mean? A preparedness to fail? 0:20:53.040 --> 0:20:58.240 As humans, we move away from failure. Failure is painful 0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:01.440 and we tend to move to it's pleasure, so we 0:21:01.880 --> 0:21:04.840 like the nectar of life. The thing is with failure, 0:21:05.040 --> 0:21:07.720 failure and growth are symbiotic in nature. They go together. 0:21:08.160 --> 0:21:11.640 So you can't have growth without failure. And if we're 0:21:11.760 --> 0:21:14.800 going to talk about landing success, then what underpins that 0:21:14.920 --> 0:21:18.400 is growth. So if you can't have growth without failure, 0:21:20.520 --> 0:21:23.080 and this is a universal law, so you know, you 0:21:23.160 --> 0:21:25.159 can't grow your muscles without going to the gym and 0:21:25.240 --> 0:21:29.840 having them tear. You have to tear your muscle. Failure 0:21:29.960 --> 0:21:31.600 take it, you have to take it to failure. So 0:21:31.720 --> 0:21:35.120 you can say everything in life, failure informs growth. 0:21:35.520 --> 0:21:37.960 The thing is it stimulates, it. 0:21:38.080 --> 0:21:42.680 Stimulates, it informs it. It's a pathway. The thing is 0:21:42.760 --> 0:21:45.520 with that is is that because our psychology moves towards 0:21:45.560 --> 0:21:48.440 pleasure and we don't have a very good relationship with failure, 0:21:48.960 --> 0:21:50.920 what it does is that when we do fail, we 0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:57.000 tend to experience negative human emotions like shame, blame, guilt, fear, anxiousness, 0:21:57.440 --> 0:22:00.160 and all of those negative human emotions which exist within 0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:02.800 the ego tend to be a barrier for us to 0:22:03.480 --> 0:22:05.480 go ahead and go I know I'm going to fail 0:22:05.520 --> 0:22:07.800 at this, but I'm going to do it anyway. Like 0:22:07.920 --> 0:22:10.280 I'm here talking to you, I've never spoken to you before. 0:22:10.440 --> 0:22:13.120 This could be a failure. I could say something I shouldn't, 0:22:13.480 --> 0:22:15.760 but I've never done it before. So I've given myself 0:22:15.840 --> 0:22:20.040 permission today whenever I do something that I've never done before, 0:22:20.760 --> 0:22:23.960 allow myself the opportunity to fail, because only in that 0:22:24.240 --> 0:22:27.000 failure am I going to be able to reflect and 0:22:27.840 --> 0:22:31.360 take the learning. So the positive relationship with failure means 0:22:31.400 --> 0:22:34.000 that it gives me a pathway to go, Well, I'm 0:22:34.040 --> 0:22:35.359 not going to be I'm not going to nail it. 0:22:35.480 --> 0:22:37.280 I'm not going to nail it every time. Maybe fifty 0:22:37.320 --> 0:22:39.200 percent I might al it. So it's okay if you 0:22:39.280 --> 0:22:41.520 don't know it today. And what happens is is then 0:22:41.560 --> 0:22:46.400 when you have that type of attitude, it creates space 0:22:46.960 --> 0:22:51.040 for confidence because you can't have you're not born with 0:22:51.480 --> 0:22:55.879 No human is born with confidence. Confidence cultivates through the 0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:59.920 space of detachment from your ego. You can't fake confidence. 0:23:00.040 --> 0:23:03.119 Confidence is natural, It comes deep within. You can create 0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:06.120 confidence in a functional area. For example, I've done four 0:23:06.160 --> 0:23:09.720 thousand hours of recruitment, you've done four thousand hours of podcasting. 0:23:09.760 --> 0:23:12.639 You're good at it, okay, But that doesn't mean you're 0:23:12.680 --> 0:23:15.680 deeply confident. Still very capable people have a lot of 0:23:15.760 --> 0:23:22.119 self doubt. Capability and confidence are different things, although they 0:23:22.200 --> 0:23:26.680 get misconstrued often in corporate or in life general. So 0:23:27.080 --> 0:23:31.360 coming back to failure, having a positive relationship with failure 0:23:31.920 --> 0:23:35.400 allows us to try things and understand that it's very 0:23:35.520 --> 0:23:37.280 possible that you're not going to be that good at it. 0:23:37.800 --> 0:23:40.960 But only through trying do you have a pathway of 0:23:41.040 --> 0:23:43.920 self reflection and learning. And when you learn, you grow, 0:23:44.280 --> 0:23:47.320 and when you grow, your capacity grows. When your capacity grows, 0:23:47.480 --> 0:23:51.120 life affords you more. When life affords you more, more happens, 0:23:51.800 --> 0:23:55.520 more opportunities, more taps on the shoulder, more fun, more pleasure. 0:23:56.320 --> 0:23:59.000 And so we're not really talking about that cycle that 0:23:59.080 --> 0:24:01.320 often there's a little on growth mindset, and you hear 0:24:01.400 --> 0:24:06.360 it from some of these big you know speakers, academic speakers, 0:24:06.400 --> 0:24:09.480 but actually at a functional area, you know, a a 0:24:09.680 --> 0:24:11.840 in a real give me, give me the real truth, 0:24:12.280 --> 0:24:14.600 show me how it's done. That's what we're not really 0:24:14.680 --> 0:24:18.119 talking about. And on top of that, you are not 0:24:18.320 --> 0:24:22.800 rewarded for failure. Our reward systems, rem and Benz systems 0:24:22.840 --> 0:24:25.760 are rewarded on success. And so there's a bit of 0:24:25.800 --> 0:24:26.320 a trick here. 0:24:27.359 --> 0:24:28.600 So I want to go to the brain and to 0:24:28.600 --> 0:24:30.720 come back because I actually want to talk about a 0:24:30.720 --> 0:24:33.440 little bit more about the detachment as well. Yeah, your 0:24:33.640 --> 0:24:36.800 your proposition about detaching, and I want to know what 0:24:36.920 --> 0:24:39.399 that means because it's easy for someone to say it, 0:24:40.160 --> 0:24:42.720 but what does actually mean to an individual who's listening, 0:24:43.320 --> 0:24:46.760 who thinks, okay, well, how do I detaches from these things? 0:24:46.840 --> 0:24:49.240 So that I can sort of it mean it's amount 0:24:49.240 --> 0:24:50.840 of just saying I don't care, I don't give you 0:24:50.840 --> 0:24:54.960 a shit. What is it. What is what is actual detachment? 0:24:55.600 --> 0:24:58.000 And where does it start to start off about? Does 0:24:58.080 --> 0:25:00.920 the stuff from being aware of what detach minutes and 0:25:01.040 --> 0:25:04.639 then just practicing it. But I want to go, I've 0:25:04.640 --> 0:25:05.760 got to go the break. I'll go to the bank 0:25:05.760 --> 0:25:07.480 and kind it come straight back. And that that's the 0:25:07.520 --> 0:25:09.200 stuff I wanted to sort of dig into. Then I 0:25:09.280 --> 0:25:10.920 want to sort of also, if you don't mind, is 0:25:11.280 --> 0:25:14.680 talk about your book? Does your book talk about these things? 0:25:14.800 --> 0:25:17.600 Self mastery too? Is this what self mastery is about? 0:25:18.560 --> 0:25:21.240 Is understanding these concepts? So going to go and break. 0:25:29.440 --> 0:25:31.320 I'm back from the break, and he was still a Petro. 0:25:31.680 --> 0:25:33.680 I would like to sp I prefer to call you petrol, 0:25:33.840 --> 0:25:36.840 but it doesn't matter. We'll call it petro conca. And 0:25:38.119 --> 0:25:41.800 we've been talking about this pretty amazing stuff in terms 0:25:41.840 --> 0:25:46.160 of to use a broad term that everybody over uses. 0:25:46.200 --> 0:25:49.040 But mindset and mindsets made up lots of different structures. 0:25:49.359 --> 0:25:52.879 No mindset, I know you don't function one area. 0:25:53.119 --> 0:25:54.960 But I'm just going to talk about it for the 0:25:55.040 --> 0:25:58.919 sake of this audience. What would otherwise normally be considered mindset, 0:25:58.960 --> 0:26:02.840 But it's so many substructures within that conversation on its 0:26:02.880 --> 0:26:06.080 own it's crazy. But in terms of mindset or how 0:26:06.160 --> 0:26:11.080 to shape your thoughts relative to potential failure, relative to 0:26:11.600 --> 0:26:14.240 just keep going and keep knocking on doors at a 0:26:14.320 --> 0:26:18.320 very fundamental level, and with failure always occurring or occurring 0:26:18.359 --> 0:26:21.119 a lot of the time, or no success occurring, perhaps 0:26:21.119 --> 0:26:22.920 the probably better way putting it, It doesn't have to 0:26:22.960 --> 0:26:25.879 be failure, because failure is a good way, maybe a 0:26:25.960 --> 0:26:28.119 better way looking at it is. And you tell me 0:26:28.200 --> 0:26:31.120 what you think is instead of thing about us something 0:26:31.160 --> 0:26:32.600 as a failure, And when don't we think about it 0:26:32.720 --> 0:26:36.960 is just wasn't successful? Yeah, I didn't succeed? So what 0:26:38.320 --> 0:26:40.720 if I failed? I feel a lot worse if I 0:26:40.800 --> 0:26:43.800 say should I failed? That seems to me to be 0:26:43.880 --> 0:26:46.840 a lot worse as a word that we always use 0:26:47.359 --> 0:26:49.680 as opposed to saying I didn't succeed on that occasion? 0:26:50.920 --> 0:26:55.840 How do we and you talked about detaching ourselves. They're 0:26:55.880 --> 0:26:58.119 not physically attached to something. What do you mean by 0:26:58.200 --> 0:27:00.560 that detachment? Is it a a sense? 0:27:03.800 --> 0:27:06.200 Give me the just I'm going to answer that question. 0:27:06.400 --> 0:27:08.760 Just give me the space to answer it fully. Okay, 0:27:09.000 --> 0:27:11.280 I've got a layer a little bit walk through it. 0:27:11.480 --> 0:27:19.920 Let me walk through it self. Doubt. Why do people 0:27:19.960 --> 0:27:22.520 have self doubt? What a successful people have self doubt? 0:27:23.160 --> 0:27:25.320 Why do some people have confidence and other people don't 0:27:25.359 --> 0:27:25.920 have confidence? 0:27:26.040 --> 0:27:26.520 Or a peer too? 0:27:26.840 --> 0:27:29.879 Or a peer too? Okay? These were questions I started 0:27:29.920 --> 0:27:31.960 to ask myself a few years ago before I wrote 0:27:32.000 --> 0:27:34.159 my book, because I saw a lot of it in 0:27:34.200 --> 0:27:40.840 the people that I was interviewing. From my psycho psychotherapeutic background, 0:27:41.080 --> 0:27:44.320 what we know to be true is that your ego, 0:27:44.840 --> 0:27:47.240 which is the construct of your mind based on your 0:27:47.320 --> 0:27:50.320 values and beliefs, it's the lens by which you navigate 0:27:50.359 --> 0:27:54.399 your life, is also the voice in your head. Do 0:27:54.480 --> 0:27:56.440 you have a voice in your head? Do I talk 0:27:56.480 --> 0:27:56.920 to your day? 0:27:57.640 --> 0:27:58.280 Sure of yeah? 0:27:58.440 --> 0:28:01.600 Sometimes? Okay, you've mastered it, right, But for a lot 0:28:01.640 --> 0:28:03.840 of people, they haven't mastered it. And that voice in 0:28:03.920 --> 0:28:06.560 their head, which is their ego, the voice of their ego, 0:28:07.240 --> 0:28:09.960 says things to them that they shouldn't. It says things like, 0:28:10.119 --> 0:28:11.840 you're not going to make it, no one's going to 0:28:11.960 --> 0:28:16.600 like you, you look ugly, you're fat, etc. Okay, And 0:28:17.280 --> 0:28:20.440 so I call my voice in my head Tammy. I've 0:28:20.480 --> 0:28:23.480 given her a voice, so the name, Yeah, I've given 0:28:23.520 --> 0:28:25.480 her a name. Sorry, So I spoke to Tammy this morning. 0:28:25.520 --> 0:28:27.119 I told Tammy just to stay in the car so 0:28:27.480 --> 0:28:31.600 Stella could be present with Mark today. So the ego 0:28:32.359 --> 0:28:35.640 is created over time. It takes about twenty one years 0:28:35.720 --> 0:28:38.840 for the ego to become fully evolved. The Mazzi development 0:28:38.920 --> 0:28:42.400 stages of psychologist says that between zero and seven, your 0:28:42.520 --> 0:28:44.840 values and beliefs are created, and then from seven till 0:28:44.880 --> 0:28:46.600 twelve you go through a modeling period and then your 0:28:46.640 --> 0:28:49.120 relationship period where you're fully formed at a mind level. 0:28:49.520 --> 0:28:52.080 But the most important period of time is zero to seven. 0:28:52.360 --> 0:28:54.360 And what happens during that time is your parents or 0:28:54.400 --> 0:28:57.080 the people that you are. You know that you raised you. 0:28:57.560 --> 0:29:00.440 They gift you your values and your beliefs. So if 0:29:00.480 --> 0:29:02.960 you were born into a particular religious sector, if you 0:29:03.080 --> 0:29:07.080 were born into a particular culture, your parents got divorced, 0:29:07.200 --> 0:29:11.080 somebody died, whatever happened between zero and seven has imprinted 0:29:11.200 --> 0:29:14.520 on you your values and beliefs. Now, what is a 0:29:14.640 --> 0:29:19.800 value on? What is a belief? A value is for example, money, 0:29:20.960 --> 0:29:23.160 and a belief around money is money doesn't grow on 0:29:23.240 --> 0:29:26.000 trees or easy come, easy go, or everything I touch 0:29:26.080 --> 0:29:30.040 turns to gold. Everyone has a belief system around money. 0:29:30.400 --> 0:29:35.760 Another value is sex. A belief system around sex is 0:29:36.400 --> 0:29:39.320 shouldn't have it before you're married, or if you come 0:29:39.360 --> 0:29:43.320 from a Latin American culture, is it's free, enjoy yourself. 0:29:44.040 --> 0:29:46.400 It's better be enjoyed. Right, It depends on what culture 0:29:46.440 --> 0:29:46.920 you come from. 0:29:47.080 --> 0:29:51.560 Right, although Latin American listeners, let me know, have fun. 0:29:52.840 --> 0:29:54.440 And that is a really I mean, that's quite a 0:29:54.480 --> 0:29:56.920 polarizing example. That's a very good way to describe what 0:29:57.040 --> 0:29:58.960 is a value on what is a belief? And see, 0:29:58.960 --> 0:30:01.600 we've got these belief that sit around our values, and 0:30:01.720 --> 0:30:04.120 that becomes the lens by which we operate in our life. 0:30:04.200 --> 0:30:09.320 And our lens is our ego. Now, coming back to 0:30:09.400 --> 0:30:13.360 your question, you are not your ego. You are not 0:30:13.880 --> 0:30:16.800 the lens by which you operate in your life. That 0:30:17.000 --> 0:30:22.920 lens is changeable. Sometimes that lens doesn't serve you. You see, 0:30:22.960 --> 0:30:28.600 the seed of all negative human emotions comes from the ego. Anger, sadness, guilt, shame, 0:30:29.440 --> 0:30:32.040 the experience of anxiety and depression all comes from this 0:30:32.280 --> 0:30:36.680 part of our mind, our ego, and it's given to you. 0:30:37.880 --> 0:30:41.360 So if something happened to you between that period of time, 0:30:42.440 --> 0:30:45.000 it will could possibly play out in your later years 0:30:45.000 --> 0:30:47.800 of life. An example from a corporate lenses is that 0:30:48.160 --> 0:30:51.720 I'll often get a mid thirties individual that's just about 0:30:51.720 --> 0:30:54.400 to start their executive career and something's happened. There's been 0:30:54.400 --> 0:30:56.600 an altercation at work, the amount of lost their joab 0:30:56.720 --> 0:30:58.920 or there's no connection between them and the CEO, and 0:30:58.960 --> 0:31:00.520 they rock up to my doorster and they're like, I 0:31:00.600 --> 0:31:02.640 think I need a new job. And at that point, 0:31:02.680 --> 0:31:05.240 I'm not asking them questions about their skills. And you know, 0:31:05.600 --> 0:31:07.760 you know you are unable to execute on the strategy 0:31:07.920 --> 0:31:09.800 or you know, how do you manage change and do 0:31:09.880 --> 0:31:12.640 you understand how to create a culture and environment. I'm like, 0:31:13.560 --> 0:31:16.080 tell me about yourself. Let's go back to the beginning 0:31:16.120 --> 0:31:18.920 of your life. And by the way, this is what 0:31:19.040 --> 0:31:22.560 executive search firms do. This is how they profile. They 0:31:22.640 --> 0:31:25.280 go back to the beginning of life because what happens 0:31:25.320 --> 0:31:30.840 then generally creates your leadership style. It generally creates how 0:31:30.880 --> 0:31:35.240 you operate in life. So if you need if you 0:31:35.320 --> 0:31:37.560 are experiencing these things, or if you want to make 0:31:37.640 --> 0:31:39.480 changes in your life, you have to go back to 0:31:39.800 --> 0:31:42.440 this operating model that you've created. It's kind of like 0:31:42.520 --> 0:31:44.280 a pizza base. You've got to pick off the toppings 0:31:44.320 --> 0:31:45.640 that your mum and dad have been given to you. 0:31:46.640 --> 0:31:50.000 So a question for you, actually just a demonstration. Have 0:31:50.120 --> 0:31:54.720 you ever felt sadness or guilt or that feeling of 0:31:55.320 --> 0:31:59.400 anxiety do you have? Have you ever felt any negative 0:31:59.440 --> 0:31:59.920 human emotion? 0:32:00.680 --> 0:32:02.560 Not? Really, I've never been depressed. 0:32:03.280 --> 0:32:06.880 I'm not talking about something clinical. I'm talking about happy. 0:32:07.040 --> 0:32:08.800 Let's go with a positive. If you ever feel happy, I. 0:32:08.800 --> 0:32:12.760 Don't really get happy. The only negative only emotion I 0:32:12.840 --> 0:32:13.560 really it is anger? 0:32:14.280 --> 0:32:14.640 Anger? 0:32:15.320 --> 0:32:18.000 Yes, okay, that's the only one all the rest of. 0:32:18.120 --> 0:32:19.400 All right, So let's work with anger. 0:32:19.440 --> 0:32:19.800 Average. 0:32:19.920 --> 0:32:23.800 Let's work with anger. Okay. Can you perceive when you're angry? Angry? 0:32:24.560 --> 0:32:25.640 Do I know what makes me angry? 0:32:25.760 --> 0:32:27.480 No? Can you perceive it when you're angry? Can you 0:32:27.520 --> 0:32:28.240 say it, I'm angry? 0:32:28.440 --> 0:32:28.640 Yeah? 0:32:28.800 --> 0:32:32.640 Okay. So there's an awareness inside of you that has 0:32:32.720 --> 0:32:34.920 perceived that emotion. 0:32:35.280 --> 0:32:36.920 But to do that I alread to answer a psychiatrist. 0:32:36.920 --> 0:32:38.440 So I went, I did therapy for all this. 0:32:38.680 --> 0:32:43.640 Yeah, good, okay, So we need to teach people how 0:32:43.680 --> 0:32:45.440 to do that for themselves. So the fact is is 0:32:45.520 --> 0:32:47.840 that that anger sits in your ego. But the fact 0:32:47.880 --> 0:32:49.880 that you're aware of it is that there's an awareness 0:32:50.280 --> 0:32:53.320 within you that can perceive that anger. There's a deeper 0:32:53.360 --> 0:32:55.840 awareness and intelligence. So what we're trying to do is 0:32:55.880 --> 0:32:58.200 we're trying to separate the difference between that which is 0:32:58.280 --> 0:33:01.600 ego and that which is your awareness. And when you 0:33:01.680 --> 0:33:04.520 can do that, when you can accept that that which 0:33:04.600 --> 0:33:06.760 is your operating model of life, which is given to 0:33:06.840 --> 0:33:09.680 you from your parents, from your family. First of all, 0:33:10.360 --> 0:33:13.560 you didn't ask for it was given to you, and 0:33:13.760 --> 0:33:17.680 you can change it over time. The aware it means 0:33:17.720 --> 0:33:20.760 that you can detach from that, you can become you 0:33:20.840 --> 0:33:23.440 can sit in your seat of consciousness and be the 0:33:23.800 --> 0:33:26.600 observer of that anger. It is not the same thing. 0:33:26.880 --> 0:33:30.360 You and your ego are not the same thing. So 0:33:30.520 --> 0:33:33.920 coming back to your question, how do you detach? First 0:33:33.960 --> 0:33:35.440 of all, for you to be able to attach, you 0:33:35.560 --> 0:33:39.880 have to be aware. This is just fundamental basic psychology. 0:33:39.920 --> 0:33:44.000 One oh one ego, you do different things. Awareness that 0:33:44.120 --> 0:33:48.080 can observe the feeling. That is actually what we work 0:33:48.120 --> 0:33:51.360 with in psychotherapy and it's what we need to start 0:33:51.440 --> 0:33:56.000 teaching everybody out there. Basic like getting a glass of 0:33:56.080 --> 0:33:57.840 water and having a drink, You've got to be able 0:33:57.880 --> 0:33:59.880 to understand that which is ego versus that which is you, 0:34:00.400 --> 0:34:03.000 and how to detach from that, because if that is 0:34:03.600 --> 0:34:08.239 a parasite in your mind, the worst parasite is a 0:34:08.280 --> 0:34:12.040 negative mind. By the way, If that's if that ego 0:34:12.239 --> 0:34:16.279 is running a system of thinking that is not serving you, 0:34:17.760 --> 0:34:20.880 and you the consciousness, the awareness is enmeshed in that, 0:34:22.320 --> 0:34:25.680 then we have the epidemic that we are experiencing right now, 0:34:25.719 --> 0:34:26.799 which is the mental health one. 0:34:27.400 --> 0:34:30.440 So what would you say to an employer on what 0:34:30.600 --> 0:34:34.000 you just said? What would an employer take from that? 0:34:34.120 --> 0:34:35.839 And what would an employee take for you just said 0:34:36.280 --> 0:34:38.200 so much? Let's start with employer. 0:34:38.560 --> 0:34:39.440 Start with an employee. 0:34:39.440 --> 0:34:42.160 I hate the word, but doesn't matter. I just hate 0:34:42.160 --> 0:34:43.640 the word employer. Sounds terrible, but. 0:34:43.719 --> 0:34:47.160 Well, look, every employee, generally speaking, every employer is also employee. 0:34:47.440 --> 0:34:50.120 Well to me, everybody works for themselves, and I call 0:34:50.160 --> 0:34:52.720 an employee because there's a different sort of reward system 0:34:52.760 --> 0:34:56.279 and there's regulations around it. But employees still work for 0:34:56.320 --> 0:34:58.480 themselves the end of the day. They're giving you their 0:34:58.560 --> 0:35:02.759 time and effort, skills in reach over money, and they 0:35:02.760 --> 0:35:06.600 are employers giving them a seat, space and opportunity in 0:35:06.719 --> 0:35:10.479 return for their time. So that's yeah, anyway, it doesn't 0:35:10.480 --> 0:35:13.960 really matter? Manager, manager, So what would you say to 0:35:14.440 --> 0:35:16.800 a manager of people or someone who wants to recruit 0:35:16.880 --> 0:35:19.520 people into their organization from what you just said? What 0:35:19.600 --> 0:35:21.200 do they need to know? From what you just said? 0:35:22.560 --> 0:35:26.840 First of all, a disengaged workforce costs our global population 0:35:27.200 --> 0:35:30.320 nine trillion US dollars a year. It's about nine percent 0:35:30.360 --> 0:35:31.200 of the global GDP. 0:35:31.400 --> 0:35:32.799 Is that about productivity or. 0:35:32.760 --> 0:35:34.440 Audibly disengage employees? 0:35:34.520 --> 0:35:35.360 What's that mean? So? 0:35:35.440 --> 0:35:39.840 A disengaged employe, according to Gallup survey, is linked to 0:35:40.040 --> 0:35:43.200 individuals that are experiencing any given point in time and 0:35:43.280 --> 0:35:45.400 go sadness, skilled anxiety, and stress. 0:35:45.280 --> 0:35:48.600 Right outside of the office, maybe in their private. 0:35:48.400 --> 0:35:51.680 Life, in their life. Just there's no I really think 0:35:51.760 --> 0:35:55.160 there's such a thing as separation between life and work life. 0:35:55.239 --> 0:35:59.120 I think it's pretty a mesh these days realistically. So 0:35:59.440 --> 0:36:04.120 in life life, those according to Gallop, those that have 0:36:04.520 --> 0:36:10.280 been experiencing those five negative human emotions, anyone or ale, anyone, 0:36:10.960 --> 0:36:13.440 any one of them. I mean, each one has a 0:36:13.520 --> 0:36:17.920 separate line item and has a separate statistic attached to it. 0:36:18.080 --> 0:36:20.560 But if we can kind of grab them as a collective, 0:36:22.400 --> 0:36:27.640 eighty to ninety percent are actively disengaged in their job. 0:36:28.400 --> 0:36:32.399 So if you have an individual that is experiencing these things, 0:36:32.560 --> 0:36:36.040 it's very likely that they will be in some form disengaged. 0:36:36.080 --> 0:36:40.120 In the same report, it's said that people that were 0:36:40.320 --> 0:36:46.280 thriving and happy were seventy to ninety percent engage actively 0:36:46.360 --> 0:36:48.640 engaged in their job. So what we have here is 0:36:48.719 --> 0:36:52.640 a question is a chicken or the egg? As an employer, 0:36:53.440 --> 0:36:55.560 is it my role to make people happy? No? 0:36:56.640 --> 0:36:58.680 Not possibly either, No, not possible either. 0:36:59.160 --> 0:37:01.960 However, is it my role to deliver the strategy? And 0:37:02.080 --> 0:37:04.000 is it my role to deliver to the shareholders the 0:37:04.080 --> 0:37:05.919 P and L? And is it my role to deliver 0:37:06.040 --> 0:37:08.920 what it is in my job description? It? Yes, it is. Okay, Well, 0:37:09.000 --> 0:37:11.880 now what you're dealing with is you're dealing with a 0:37:12.040 --> 0:37:21.120 landscape where people need help. And one in two Australians 0:37:21.440 --> 0:37:23.880 will experience some form of mental health episode in their 0:37:23.960 --> 0:37:27.959 lifetime and one in five Australians experience it at least 0:37:28.120 --> 0:37:32.080 once on a yearly basis. And so you have to 0:37:32.160 --> 0:37:35.240 be dealing with these new inputs. These are the new inputs. 0:37:36.280 --> 0:37:41.040 So we have to teach people employers what just call it, managers. 0:37:40.800 --> 0:37:46.240 Managers and employees. We have to teach people that stress 0:37:46.280 --> 0:37:48.840 that they're experiencing. They can manage it if they know, 0:37:48.960 --> 0:37:51.719 if they learn how. And I'm not talking about exercise 0:37:51.800 --> 0:37:56.920 and meditation and you know, you know, having kind of 0:37:57.080 --> 0:37:59.960 healthy habits. I'm talking deeper than that. I'm talking about 0:38:00.600 --> 0:38:03.520 becoming learning the inputs of becoming your own psychotherapist. So 0:38:03.600 --> 0:38:06.000 you know, Oh, I'm experiencing a bit of fear right now. 0:38:06.080 --> 0:38:07.080 What can I do about this? 0:38:07.880 --> 0:38:08.040 Oh? 0:38:08.120 --> 0:38:10.600 Okay, I can breathe out longer than I breathe in, 0:38:10.719 --> 0:38:14.640 and I can activate my vagus nerve and just decompress 0:38:14.680 --> 0:38:16.160 a little bit, so I can bring that back in. 0:38:16.840 --> 0:38:21.680 It's the individual's responsibility to manage themselves. But we've got 0:38:21.719 --> 0:38:24.840 a collective voice out there, which is my job's crap 0:38:25.000 --> 0:38:27.239 or you know, I don't like my manager. It's two 0:38:27.320 --> 0:38:28.160 sides of the story. 0:38:29.000 --> 0:38:33.359 So but should do employers have any obligation around this? So? Yes, 0:38:33.719 --> 0:38:36.000 So I'm an employer and I've got some people, and 0:38:36.080 --> 0:38:38.879 I can notice that there shoulders are slumped over. It's 0:38:38.880 --> 0:38:40.279 a bit of body language or something like that, and 0:38:40.320 --> 0:38:43.520 they're not. They just don't seem to be themselves. What's 0:38:43.560 --> 0:38:46.239 my obligation? What should I be doing? Shall be saying? You, Okay, 0:38:46.400 --> 0:38:47.080 what was the deal? 0:38:47.719 --> 0:38:52.040 So, I mean, I actually can't say from a legal 0:38:52.080 --> 0:38:54.520 perspective what their obligation is, but yes, they have an 0:38:54.560 --> 0:38:58.759 obligation to run business. Yeah, it's got to roll up 0:38:59.480 --> 0:39:03.840 as a sea. You first got to decide that mental 0:39:03.880 --> 0:39:08.000 well being is a priority, a strategic priority, and therefore, 0:39:08.000 --> 0:39:11.799 if it's a strategic priority, it gets written down as 0:39:13.960 --> 0:39:17.320 something that you're going to invest in. You allocate funds 0:39:17.440 --> 0:39:20.600 to this particular area. Because if you understand that this 0:39:20.800 --> 0:39:23.759 is important, then what happens is is that you won't 0:39:23.800 --> 0:39:25.799 get to a point. It's less likely that you will 0:39:25.840 --> 0:39:28.160 get to a point where you will have a disengaged employee. 0:39:29.760 --> 0:39:34.800 A disengaged employee can be influenced by an engaged manager. 0:39:35.760 --> 0:39:39.040 So the advice to employers out there is invest in 0:39:39.080 --> 0:39:41.520 your managers. Teacher managers how to deal with this. Hrbrid 0:39:41.520 --> 0:39:44.799 Business Review published an article in August of last year 0:39:45.320 --> 0:39:48.040 stating that for us to do this, for us to 0:39:48.239 --> 0:39:52.120 change the connection and the engagement of people in the workforce, 0:39:52.400 --> 0:39:54.120 the one thing that we've got to do is we've 0:39:54.160 --> 0:39:56.920 got to teach our middle managers how to be cognitive 0:39:56.960 --> 0:40:01.600 behavioral therapists. Quite unquote teach them, so CBT teach them 0:40:01.640 --> 0:40:05.360 neuro linguistic programming. And I couldn't believe my ears. I 0:40:05.400 --> 0:40:10.279 couldn't believe what I was reading. Yes, the world has 0:40:10.440 --> 0:40:13.279 changed and we've got to change our skills. The World 0:40:13.320 --> 0:40:16.480 Economic Forum publishes a report every year called Skills of 0:40:16.520 --> 0:40:20.040 the Future. In twenty twenty two, a new skill landed 0:40:20.080 --> 0:40:23.160 on the top ten skills list. That new skill was 0:40:23.280 --> 0:40:28.640 self management self mastery. This year twenty twenty four, six 0:40:28.840 --> 0:40:31.160 out of the top ten skills that we need for 0:40:31.200 --> 0:40:33.680 the future, which is the future for World Economic Forum 0:40:33.760 --> 0:40:37.279 is five years from now, six of the top ten 0:40:37.920 --> 0:40:42.160 were self mastery skills. And so what's happening is is 0:40:42.239 --> 0:40:46.319 that we need to learn this as a hard skill 0:40:46.400 --> 0:40:48.320 like picking up a phone and knowing how to create 0:40:48.360 --> 0:40:51.799 an app or create a podcast. And so I'm out 0:40:51.840 --> 0:40:54.239 to normalize it. My full time job is the see 0:40:54.320 --> 0:40:57.800 of a recruitment agency, but I do this as this 0:40:58.239 --> 0:40:59.160 is my life's work. 0:41:00.800 --> 0:41:03.120 Give me a broad explanation that your life's word meaning 0:41:03.400 --> 0:41:06.279 outside of your business, this is something that you have 0:41:06.440 --> 0:41:11.160 ambitions about making or maybe perhaps not changing, but adopting. 0:41:11.760 --> 0:41:14.879 Yeah. Look, I wrote a book called Stoneheart, Light Heart. 0:41:14.920 --> 0:41:18.839 The Intelligence of Self Mastery, Stoneheart, Light Heart, The Intelligence 0:41:18.880 --> 0:41:23.800 of Self Mastery, and I wrote that book, and that 0:41:23.960 --> 0:41:29.560 book has been recognized by multiple universities, and it also 0:41:29.640 --> 0:41:33.400 got me my honorary fellowship at Western Sydney UNI. And 0:41:35.480 --> 0:41:39.960 the universities are really progressive, actually very progressive. They are 0:41:40.040 --> 0:41:44.200 teaching these ideas now in business school and I'm a 0:41:45.760 --> 0:41:49.080 guest lecturer at many business schools at the moment, teaching 0:41:49.360 --> 0:41:52.320 our younger generation how to master their ego, how to 0:41:52.400 --> 0:41:54.839 detach from their ego, how to build a healthy relationship 0:41:54.880 --> 0:41:57.920 with failure, and how to cultivate confidence. At the end 0:41:57.960 --> 0:42:02.520 of that, I guess the story I can share with 0:42:02.600 --> 0:42:05.160 you with this book and why it's become my life's 0:42:05.480 --> 0:42:08.200 I really think it's, you know, the good work that 0:42:08.239 --> 0:42:11.000 I'm going to do in my life. As I wrote it, 0:42:11.080 --> 0:42:13.600 and an executive from Chart Accounts Australia picked up the 0:42:13.640 --> 0:42:15.799 book and read it and said this is I love 0:42:15.880 --> 0:42:21.320 this book and I'm going to bring this into our community. 0:42:21.760 --> 0:42:23.720 And they've got one hundred and thirty five thousand members 0:42:23.920 --> 0:42:27.640 in Australia globally actually, and so over the last couple 0:42:27.680 --> 0:42:29.640 of years I've been working with them and I do 0:42:30.239 --> 0:42:32.320 so many keynote speeches for them, and they givet my 0:42:32.360 --> 0:42:34.719 book to so many of their members, so many people 0:42:34.760 --> 0:42:37.200 in the audience. And then I was so grateful to 0:42:37.239 --> 0:42:40.520 this guy, who's really, you know, taking this work forward 0:42:40.600 --> 0:42:42.560 with me. And then one day I was at Western 0:42:42.600 --> 0:42:45.040 Sydney UNI and I was doing some work with them, 0:42:45.080 --> 0:42:48.640 and the dean of the business school dear speech, and 0:42:48.719 --> 0:42:50.920 then I was mixed up. I was a keynote, I 0:42:51.000 --> 0:42:52.880 was a guest lecturer, and I did my lecture on 0:42:53.160 --> 0:42:56.080 self mastering. At the end, he came up to me 0:42:56.280 --> 0:42:59.480 and he said, excuse me, I talk to you so yes, 0:43:00.040 --> 0:43:01.600 my name Stella. He goes, I know who you are. 0:43:02.280 --> 0:43:04.480 He goes, I was given your book eight months ago. 0:43:04.920 --> 0:43:08.640 And I said, oh, wonderful. And he says, I need 0:43:08.719 --> 0:43:11.640 to tell you something. He goes, I'm an economist, I'm 0:43:11.680 --> 0:43:13.800 a professor, and I'm the dean of this business school. 0:43:15.120 --> 0:43:20.520 Your book changed my life, said how so? He said, 0:43:22.480 --> 0:43:27.520 all my life I really wondered who I was, and 0:43:28.000 --> 0:43:31.920 your book gave me a pathway to integrate who I 0:43:32.000 --> 0:43:34.520 thought I was and who I was. And now I 0:43:34.680 --> 0:43:37.000 know why I am who I am, and I feel 0:43:37.040 --> 0:43:40.279 so comfortable with that I want to let you know 0:43:40.719 --> 0:43:43.879 that your book is on my bedside table, and every 0:43:43.920 --> 0:43:46.200 time I go overseas with my job, I take your 0:43:46.239 --> 0:43:51.080 book with me. And I started to cry. And I 0:43:51.160 --> 0:43:55.319 started to cry because it was the individual who gave 0:43:55.440 --> 0:43:59.040 me that feedback that made me realize that this is 0:43:59.160 --> 0:44:06.680 my life's work. And so I now create reels on 0:44:06.760 --> 0:44:09.319 this I record, you know, for an hour every week. 0:44:11.120 --> 0:44:13.320 I don't make money from it. You make money from books, 0:44:13.560 --> 0:44:17.279 not even a cent, okay, But I give my time 0:44:17.400 --> 0:44:22.560 now to this area because I believe that in this 0:44:23.600 --> 0:44:27.680 crazy world where people are mentally sick, that they must 0:44:28.120 --> 0:44:32.400 learn this one tool, because I think that he can 0:44:32.560 --> 0:44:33.960 remarkably change. 0:44:34.080 --> 0:44:36.280 Has mastery that one tool. 0:44:36.239 --> 0:44:39.920 Well self master is the umbrella that actually talks to 0:44:40.239 --> 0:44:43.000 mastering the division of you and ego. You've got to 0:44:43.040 --> 0:44:43.480 be able to. 0:44:43.520 --> 0:44:48.400 Do that so putting ourselves away from our ego. So 0:44:48.520 --> 0:44:50.319 sometimes I remember of many years I read a book. 0:44:50.640 --> 0:44:51.799 I can't remember the name of the auth. He as 0:44:51.800 --> 0:44:54.239 a neurologist, but it was he wrote a book with 0:44:54.280 --> 0:44:57.719 an illustrator like a comic strip illustrator, and the book 0:44:57.800 --> 0:45:03.600 was called Neurocomic. And he actually explains in an illustrative 0:45:03.640 --> 0:45:08.880 way with some narrative, how we build a story up 0:45:08.880 --> 0:45:16.759 about ourselves neurologically, in our neurological system, and then that 0:45:16.920 --> 0:45:19.720 story keeps getting affirmed by things we do and people 0:45:19.800 --> 0:45:21.719 that we meet, and we keep building up the story, 0:45:21.760 --> 0:45:23.759 which is, like what you're saying, the ego, that's how 0:45:23.800 --> 0:45:26.279 I am, and we actually think that's the person we are. 0:45:26.880 --> 0:45:31.560 And then when we think about plasticity, the plasticity of 0:45:31.600 --> 0:45:34.800 the brain or the satellitar system within the brain, that is, 0:45:35.719 --> 0:45:38.040 you can actually change who you are as long as 0:45:38.080 --> 0:45:42.200 you recognize that this is just a story about yourself exactly. 0:45:42.600 --> 0:45:46.759 And appeal often say to me, well, you know, once age, 0:45:46.920 --> 0:45:50.960 you weren't a partner of chart accounts. Then you become 0:45:51.000 --> 0:45:53.880 a partner of a law firm. Then you became a developer, 0:45:53.880 --> 0:45:56.960 and then you became a finance business. Biba, now you 0:45:57.000 --> 0:45:59.840 a podcast because I don't have a view on myself 0:46:00.640 --> 0:46:03.200 because I read this book like thirty odd years ago, 0:46:03.880 --> 0:46:06.400 and I knew nothing at that stage, wasn't I was 0:46:06.480 --> 0:46:08.680 just interested. I knew nothing by that stage about plasticity 0:46:08.719 --> 0:46:11.160 and stuff like that. But you're right, I mean I 0:46:11.719 --> 0:46:14.200 was actually becoming quite clear to me in my mind, 0:46:15.520 --> 0:46:19.719 the ability to reinvent yourself. Let's call it is about 0:46:19.800 --> 0:46:23.200 detaching yourself from who you think you are. Yes, you 0:46:23.320 --> 0:46:26.879 call it the ego, let's call it. You know my story? Yes? 0:46:27.239 --> 0:46:29.680 And your parents lay down the plank for your story 0:46:29.719 --> 0:46:31.719 in the beginning. I mean you have done it. You 0:46:31.880 --> 0:46:34.440 were going to be a doctor, and then you're reinventing 0:46:34.480 --> 0:46:37.560 yourself to become a salesperson. Then you reinvent yourself, etc. 0:46:38.840 --> 0:46:42.960 In other words, flexibility. And people often say how do 0:46:43.080 --> 0:46:44.040 I remain relevant? 0:46:45.440 --> 0:46:48.879 Not me? Not how Mark grew ultimate strategic question, how. 0:46:48.840 --> 0:46:53.080 Do you remain relevant as or how can they remain relevant? Well, 0:46:53.120 --> 0:46:56.600 the first thing is to your phraseology is you've got 0:46:56.680 --> 0:46:59.720 to detach yourself from who, your ego or your story 0:47:00.560 --> 0:47:02.360 and look at what stories are relevant out there? What 0:47:02.600 --> 0:47:05.000 are people looking for? You know, what they want to 0:47:05.040 --> 0:47:07.719 talk about? Exactly where they going with stuff? Yes? And 0:47:08.360 --> 0:47:11.239 so I think that's fascinating. So I don't remember the 0:47:11.280 --> 0:47:12.879 name of your book. I know it's in the show notes, 0:47:12.920 --> 0:47:14.120 but could you just tell me the name of your 0:47:14.120 --> 0:47:16.799 book again? And where can people get it? Stoneheart, light Heart, 0:47:16.840 --> 0:47:21.680 the Stone Heart, Lion Heart, light Stoneheart, Lightheart. 0:47:21.400 --> 0:47:24.000 The Intelligence of self mastery and when it can be 0:47:24.080 --> 0:47:31.480 purchased globally from every single book to Angus and Robinson, Amazon, 0:47:31.680 --> 0:47:34.480 It's on Spotify, it's an audio board, it's a digital 0:47:34.680 --> 0:47:36.760 you can get it everywhere. It's sold everywhere. 0:47:36.920 --> 0:47:40.839 And I know you've said this is your life work, 0:47:40.920 --> 0:47:45.799 but outside of your real business, which is matching people up. 0:47:46.239 --> 0:47:50.960 But what about if people ask questions about it? Can 0:47:51.000 --> 0:47:53.479 they get you on a Is there a Facebook page 0:47:53.520 --> 0:47:55.160 or is there an Instagram page where they can? Actually 0:47:55.480 --> 0:47:57.000 you're not going to talk to me individually, but no. 0:47:57.080 --> 0:47:59.520 No, no, no, no, I've got I've got an Instagram 0:47:59.560 --> 0:48:01.880 page with pretty big following. Actually, I've got a TikTok 0:48:01.960 --> 0:48:05.440 page LinkedIn. I publish all of my work on all socials. 0:48:05.960 --> 0:48:09.399 And so where what does that call? Now, you're let's 0:48:09.400 --> 0:48:10.480 call it your Instagram page. 0:48:10.280 --> 0:48:14.000 For example Stella Petro contra Stella dot or just still 0:48:14.360 --> 0:48:15.440 Stella my full. 0:48:15.320 --> 0:48:17.680 Name pe I should say it's p E T R 0:48:17.680 --> 0:48:20.680 O U correct the C O N C H A correct. So, 0:48:21.040 --> 0:48:23.239 because I'd imagine what you're doing with your content is 0:48:23.280 --> 0:48:25.520 you're actually sort of probably asking questions that people haven't 0:48:25.560 --> 0:48:27.440 asked you or may have asked you but you just 0:48:27.480 --> 0:48:29.239 decide in a content says, well that's good one. I 0:48:29.360 --> 0:48:31.520 might just play around with that that whatever that is, 0:48:31.880 --> 0:48:32.640 and do you talk to it? 0:48:32.920 --> 0:48:34.920 Yeah? I talk to it, you know. I get emails 0:48:35.040 --> 0:48:38.800 all all the time from people. My socials are huge, actually, 0:48:39.400 --> 0:48:41.319 and I create content specifically for them. 0:48:41.680 --> 0:48:42.520 And there's no money in it. 0:48:42.600 --> 0:48:44.840 As you say, no, no, no, this is this is 0:48:44.960 --> 0:48:47.840 totally a passion project history anyway. 0:48:47.920 --> 0:48:49.640 So people are going to be looking Instagram for all 0:48:49.719 --> 0:48:52.840 sorts of things. Perhaps if they're got a question, or 0:48:52.880 --> 0:48:56.360 they're feeling a little bit self doubt, or they're whatever 0:48:56.440 --> 0:48:58.680 it is, that's the sort of thing they should be doing. 0:48:58.880 --> 0:49:00.840 I am writing a second book the moment. I'll publish 0:49:00.920 --> 0:49:03.680 it next year called self Mastery at Work. And I'm 0:49:03.760 --> 0:49:07.719 halfway through producing a course that I'm recording at the 0:49:07.760 --> 0:49:11.879 moment so people can do this work in their own 0:49:11.920 --> 0:49:14.640 private time. I'm doing a lot of workshops for large 0:49:14.680 --> 0:49:17.800 listed businesses at the moment. They are training people, are training, 0:49:18.360 --> 0:49:21.080 they're training their staff in this. They're realizing we need 0:49:21.160 --> 0:49:22.919 to train, train, train, train, train. 0:49:23.480 --> 0:49:26.440 Well, big companies and employees, if you're looking for a 0:49:27.200 --> 0:49:31.879 way of improving your your ability to live a better life. 0:49:32.040 --> 0:49:34.480 Not a necessarily happy life, but a better life. And 0:49:34.560 --> 0:49:37.960 it'd be corporations. If you're looking to have a better business, 0:49:38.640 --> 0:49:44.080 get on board with this. Let's call it recognizing understanding mental. 0:49:43.880 --> 0:49:48.360 Health and it's connection to productivity and success in business. 0:49:48.840 --> 0:49:51.080 For success yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever that might be. 0:49:52.239 --> 0:49:56.640 Stella petro Conca, thanks very much. Thanks man, really appreciate it.