WEBVTT - The Bolt Report | 1 October

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<v Speaker 1>This is the Bolt Report.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, good evening and thanks for joining me on The

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<v Speaker 2>Bolt Report. I'm James McPherson. Here's what's coming up tonight.

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<v Speaker 2>The Albanese government has announced they'll fix the cost of

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<v Speaker 2>living crisis by making your morning cup of coffee more expensive.

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<v Speaker 3>More on that in a moment.

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<v Speaker 2>Taxpayers have been forced to bail out yet another aluminium

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<v Speaker 2>smelter as Labor continues to lie about their renewables fantasy.

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<v Speaker 2>And over in the UK, council staff are being taught

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<v Speaker 2>Islam's view on women is the same as Christianity's because

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<v Speaker 2>we'll marry the mother of Jesus wore a hijab. I'll

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<v Speaker 2>cross to London later in the show for that. But first,

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<v Speaker 2>I woke up pretty excited this morning, driving to my

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<v Speaker 2>local cafe to order my latte.

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<v Speaker 3>Extra hot, one sugar.

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<v Speaker 2>I was excited at the prospect of paying slightly less.

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<v Speaker 2>And let's face it, when the cost of anything goes

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<v Speaker 2>down these days, even if only by a few cents, well,

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<v Speaker 2>that's cause for excitement. But my excitement was only heightened

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<v Speaker 2>when I opened my social media and found this message

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<v Speaker 2>from the federal treasurer waiting for me. He wrote, And

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<v Speaker 2>then there was this from Jim Chalmers. Now, I've got

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<v Speaker 2>to admit.

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<v Speaker 2>I was initially skeptical. I mean, how does $ 1. 6 billion

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<v Speaker 2>of banking fees just vanish into thin air when the

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<v Speaker 2>card processors are still charging for their services?

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<v Speaker 3>But hey, it's Dr. Jim Chalmers. He knows what he's doing, right?

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<v Speaker 2>And I haven't written a PhD thesis on the life

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<v Speaker 2>and times of Paul Keating, so what do I really know?

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<v Speaker 2>Andrew Lee was on my social media feed this morning

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<v Speaker 2>as well, waving around a cup of coffee while promising

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<v Speaker 2>the $ 1. 6 billion in fees was quote-unquote going away. And again,

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<v Speaker 2>I was sceptical, but he is the Assistant Minister for

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<v Speaker 2>Productivity and his serious tone, not to mention the dramatic

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<v Speaker 2>musical score in the background, gave me confidence to believe

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<v Speaker 2>all of this, though unlikely, must be true. Ever noticed

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<v Speaker 2>that when you tap your card, The price is slightly

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<v Speaker 2>higher than what the coffee was meant to cost on

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<v Speaker 2>the menu.

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<v Speaker 4>Every year, Australians pay $ 1.

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<v Speaker 5>6 billion in credit card fees. From the 1st of October,

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<v Speaker 5>those fees are going away.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, there you go.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe the Albanese government really is able to make costs

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<v Speaker 2>disappear by simply declaring them disappeared on social media posts. Anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>the Prime Minister said it was all true and he

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<v Speaker 2>wouldn't lie.

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<v Speaker 6>Every time you tap, those little surcharges add up. Right now,

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<v Speaker 6>they're costing Aussies $ 1. 6 billion each and every year. But

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<v Speaker 6>from today, they're banned, saving you money every time you tap.

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<v Speaker 6>So whether you're at the supermarket, paying bills, or buying

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<v Speaker 6>a cup of coffee, the price you see is the

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<v Speaker 6>price you pay.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's what I was being told as I made

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<v Speaker 2>my way to the cafe this morning. The PM and

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<v Speaker 2>his ministers promising that from now on, I'll save around

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<v Speaker 2>10 cents on my cup of coffee, which will go

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<v Speaker 2>a long way to helping offset yesterday's interest rate rise.

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<v Speaker 2>Can you imagine my surprise when I paid for my

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<v Speaker 2>coffee this morning and I didn't save any money at all?

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<v Speaker 2>Because while the cafe is not allowed to charge me

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<v Speaker 2>a card processing fee, they're still having to pay those

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<v Speaker 2>fees themselves. So instead of putting a card processing fee

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<v Speaker 2>on my bill, they just added it to the price

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<v Speaker 2>of my coffee. Who could possibly have seen that coming?

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<v Speaker 2>Turns out the PM and his treasurer confused hiding costs

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<v Speaker 2>with lowering costs. It's not the same thing, which is

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<v Speaker 2>a bit of a worry since they're running the entire economy.

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<v Speaker 2>This guy interviewed on News 24 this morning seemed to

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<v Speaker 2>understand the difference rather better.

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<v Speaker 7>I think it's just built into the price, so I

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<v Speaker 7>don't think it'll change much really, but it's nice that

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<v Speaker 7>I guess we're not hit or feeling it every time,

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<v Speaker 7>so it's more about an emotion when you go to pay.

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<v Speaker 7>rather than an actual financial benefit.

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<v Speaker 3>Too right.

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<v Speaker 2>Elbow was offering us nothing more than an emotional saving,

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<v Speaker 2>the kind of saving you feel in your heart while

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<v Speaker 2>your bank account remains completely unimpressed.

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<v Speaker 3>But it got even worse.

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<v Speaker 2>When my local cafe added the bank's processing fees to

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<v Speaker 2>the price on the menu... Well, it meant that all

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<v Speaker 2>of their menus, not to mention their signage, was immediately wrong.

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<v Speaker 2>So they added the cost of updating all their menus

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<v Speaker 2>and their signage to the price of my coffee as well.

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<v Speaker 2>So now the PM's promise of cheaper coffee had actually

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<v Speaker 2>made my coffee more expensive. By now, I was thinking

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<v Speaker 2>this policy must have originated in Chris Bowen's office.

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<v Speaker 3>But I digress.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, if you can believe it, things got even worse still.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, sometimes when I'm organised, I pay cash for

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<v Speaker 2>my coffee. That way, I avoid the card surcharge altogether.

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<v Speaker 3>But now, I don't even get that.

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<v Speaker 2>Advantage since the bank fees have been added to food

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<v Speaker 2>and drink prices generally. So whether I pay by card

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<v Speaker 2>or by cash, I'm still paying for the card transaction,

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<v Speaker 2>even if I never made one. So now my coffee

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<v Speaker 2>is more expensive.

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<v Speaker 3>And for what?

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<v Speaker 2>So I can subsidise a transaction I never made. So

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<v Speaker 2>an Albanese government policy promising cost of living relief does

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<v Speaker 2>nothing but.

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<v Speaker 3>Bring more cost of living pain. And then it dawned

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<v Speaker 3>on me.

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<v Speaker 2>This is how the Albanese government works. They portray themselves

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<v Speaker 2>as our saviours, promising to rescue us from economic doom,

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<v Speaker 2>usually economic doom that their policies have created. And so

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<v Speaker 2>they rush in with some amazing subsidy or scheme, promising

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<v Speaker 2>it'll take the pressure off. The problem, though, is someone

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<v Speaker 2>has to bear the cost of that policy, and in

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<v Speaker 2>the end, it invariably gets passed back to you and I.

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<v Speaker 2>And so then we end up paying more than we

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<v Speaker 2>used to pay before the Albanese government's most recent grandstanding gesture.

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<v Speaker 2>So we're worse off than before they got involved. And

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<v Speaker 2>you know what happens then? Well, then they portray themselves

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<v Speaker 2>as our saviours, promising to rescue us from this latest

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<v Speaker 2>economic doom that they just created. And so the more

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<v Speaker 2>they rescue us, the more worse off we are. And

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<v Speaker 2>the more worse off we are, the more they rescue us. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>investigations are continuing into the suspected terror attack thwarted by

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<v Speaker 2>brave Jewish passengers on board a flight from Dubai to Israel.

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<v Speaker 2>Passengers overpowered the Amani pilot who allegedly stabbed his co-pilot

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<v Speaker 2>in a reported bid to hijack the plane and crash it.

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<v Speaker 2>US President Donald Trump described how a plumber saved the

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<v Speaker 2>lives of all on board.

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<v Speaker 8>An Israeli plumber never flew a plane, was rarely in planes,

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<v Speaker 8>very rarely flew. An Israeli plumber saw what was happening

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<v Speaker 8>and strong, you know, when you lift pipe all day,

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<v Speaker 8>you're strong. And he saw what was going on and

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<v Speaker 8>he heard the screaming. He was toward the front where

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<v Speaker 8>you had security in the back, you know, you had

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<v Speaker 8>security and you had another flight crew.

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<v Speaker 1>But they didn't have time.

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<v Speaker 8>The plane was going sharply down at an unbelievable angle,

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<v Speaker 8>so sharp that the rudder ripped off the back.

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<v Speaker 7>Of the plane.

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<v Speaker 8>The plane wasn't designed to go at a speed anywhere

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<v Speaker 8>near that. And so it was well beyond its limits.

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<v Speaker 8>And he ripped, with as g-forces as they were, he

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<v Speaker 8>ripped this guy out of the seat, threw him back.

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<v Speaker 8>The crowd got him. The passengers got him.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a pretty incredible story.

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<v Speaker 2>The man then grabbed the controls of the plane and

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<v Speaker 2>levelled it out before pilots who had been off duty

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<v Speaker 2>and sitting up the back of the aircraft took over

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<v Speaker 2>the controls. Now, this plumber, he'd never flown before, but

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<v Speaker 2>he'd reportedly watched episodes of air crash investigations.

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<v Speaker 3>So there you go.

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<v Speaker 2>With the plane saved and the attacker taken into custody,

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<v Speaker 2>officials from Saudi Arabia and from Israel are now interrogating

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<v Speaker 2>him to find out exactly what he'd been planning and

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<v Speaker 2>who else was involved. Now, of course, we've got to

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<v Speaker 2>wait for all the details to emerge, but Benjamin Netanyahu,

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<v Speaker 2>stopping short of calling the hijacking a terror attack, did

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<v Speaker 2>tell The New York Times that those on board had

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<v Speaker 2>prevented another 9-11 and he vowed to find out if

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<v Speaker 2>Iran was behind it.

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<v Speaker 9>Almost all the passengers on the flight were Israelis. During

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<v Speaker 9>the flight, when they approached the country, one of the

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<v Speaker 9>pilots hit the other pilot, and apparently he tried to

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<v Speaker 9>hang the plane on his seat. I spoke with one

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<v Speaker 9>of the Israeli passengers. He told me that the plane

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<v Speaker 9>entered into a vacuum and began to float. He told

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<v Speaker 9>me that there was no way he would be able

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<v Speaker 9>to fly the plane with one of the crew and

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<v Speaker 9>together with the landing crew, while trying to bomb the

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<v Speaker 9>aircraft's wings. Another air force that was in the aircraft

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<v Speaker 9>entered the aircraft's wing and managed to land the aircraft.

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<v Speaker 9>I commend these heroes who discovered courage and courage of heart.

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<v Speaker 9>They saved many lives. They prevented a heavy disaster.

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<v Speaker 3>We'll find out more in the coming days.

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<v Speaker 2>But about the reporting on this, the New York Times

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<v Speaker 2>reported what happened like this. They wrote, a plane flying

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<v Speaker 2>from Dubai to Israel was diverted after an altercation between

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<v Speaker 2>the pilot and the co-pilot. An altercation, just an altercation

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<v Speaker 2>between a couple of unfriendly pilots. When readers complained that

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<v Speaker 2>an altercation between pilots was grossly understating what had happened,

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<v Speaker 2>the New York Times replied with this. Quote, our headlines

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<v Speaker 2>and live coverage contain all the facts we're able to

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<v Speaker 2>confirm as we confirm them. Unlike activists and partisans, we

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<v Speaker 2>don't publish speculation or unverified information. Well, fair enough. But

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<v Speaker 2>hang on a second. Where was that caution when they

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<v Speaker 2>reported this? At least 500 people were killed by an

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<v Speaker 2>Israeli airstrike at a Gaza hospital, the Palestine Health Ministry says.

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<v Speaker 2>Don't publish speculation or unverified information unless it's supplied by

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<v Speaker 2>the Palestine Health Ministry. Of course, US and French intelligence

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<v Speaker 2>later said the hospital explosion was most likely caused by

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<v Speaker 2>a misfired Palestinian missile. So when it looks like a

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<v Speaker 2>possible attack on Israel, well, we can't be too quick

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<v Speaker 2>to speculate. But when it looks like a possible attack

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<v Speaker 2>by Israel, can't speculate fast enough. Well, how many times

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<v Speaker 2>have we been told renewable energy is the cheapest form

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<v Speaker 2>of energy? If that's true, why are taxpayers having to

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<v Speaker 2>subsidise power bills to keep major industries from closing? The

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<v Speaker 2>federal and Tasmanian governments have just announced a $ 200 million

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<v Speaker 2>taxpayer-funded rescue package... for Rio Tinto's Bell Bay aluminium smelter.

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<v Speaker 2>The smelter, which uses more than a quarter of Tasmania's electricity,

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<v Speaker 2>couldn't afford power costs, despite the fact, or maybe because

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<v Speaker 2>of the fact, the state's grid is powered almost entirely

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<v Speaker 2>by renewables. So this is the miracle of cheap renewable energy.

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<v Speaker 2>It's so cheap, we have to help industry to afford it.

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<v Speaker 2>The government says the $ 200 million will protect jobs and

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<v Speaker 2>sovereign manufacturing capability, which I suppose is fair enough. But

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<v Speaker 2>maybe there's another way to protect Australian industry. What if,

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<v Speaker 2>and I'm just spitballing here, we just stop making energy

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<v Speaker 2>artificially expensive? The PM was announcing the bailout for Rio

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<v Speaker 2>Tinto when he was asked how it was that overseas

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<v Speaker 2>fuel prices are responsible for soaring inflation. Now, have a

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<v Speaker 2>listen to his answer and then tell me this. How

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<v Speaker 2>come he understands this principle when it comes to the

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<v Speaker 2>price of fuel, which he doesn't control, but fails to

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<v Speaker 2>understand this principle when it comes to the price of power,

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<v Speaker 2>which is well within his ability to influence?

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<v Speaker 6>I hope you communicate to them the fact that when

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<v Speaker 6>petrol goes up in price, then everything, for example, that

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<v Speaker 6>goes on a supermarket shelf gets carried there on a truck.

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<v Speaker 6>That increases the price. people going to and from work,

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<v Speaker 6>engaging in work, often using their vehicles, that adds to price.

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<v Speaker 6>It has an inflationary impact.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm glad the Prime Minister understands that. But isn't it

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<v Speaker 2>exactly the same with the price of power, which jacks

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<v Speaker 2>up the price of everything else? Although the government takes

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<v Speaker 2>no responsibility for that. Joining me now is One Nation

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<v Speaker 2>MP and former Deputy Prime Minister Barnaby Joyce.

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<v Speaker 3>Barnaby, welcome to the program. Always good to see you.

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<v Speaker 5>Thanks, Matt. Thanks, James.

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<v Speaker 2>The Prime Minister says the Rio Tinto bailout is an investment.

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<v Speaker 2>In Australian industry, I think it's more a very expensive

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<v Speaker 2>cloak to hide government policy failure.

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<v Speaker 5>It is total failure. Look what happened when we had

0:13:29.190 --> 0:13:32.710
<v Speaker 5>terrible coal-fired power stations, James. We had a plastics industry.

0:13:33.010 --> 0:13:35.550
<v Speaker 5>We had a urea industry. We had a glass industry.

0:13:35.809 --> 0:13:38.290
<v Speaker 5>We didn't need bailouts for Tom to go. We didn't

0:13:38.309 --> 0:13:43.470
<v Speaker 5>need bailouts for what's happening in Tasmania. We didn't have

0:13:43.530 --> 0:13:47.010
<v Speaker 5>record insolvencies in small business. We had manufacturing that wanted

0:13:47.030 --> 0:13:49.979
<v Speaker 5>to come to Australia. Not one major manufacturer wants to

0:13:50.000 --> 0:13:52.410
<v Speaker 5>come to Australia now. Not one. It's because you've got

0:13:52.429 --> 0:13:55.400
<v Speaker 5>data centres that call that manufacturing. And this is because

0:13:55.440 --> 0:13:59.220
<v Speaker 5>of the idiotic energy policy that believes that intermittent power

0:13:59.320 --> 0:14:02.619
<v Speaker 5>of windmills and fields of solar panels and hills of

0:14:02.679 --> 0:14:06.690
<v Speaker 5>windmills can actually run an industrial economy. Now, it's driving

0:14:06.710 --> 0:14:08.910
<v Speaker 5>you into the dirt. And if they're honest about it,

0:14:08.910 --> 0:14:11.290
<v Speaker 5>they'll tell you what they're spending in the capacity investment schemes,

0:14:11.630 --> 0:14:15.359
<v Speaker 5>which they won't. It's commercial and confidential, not for publication.

0:14:15.760 --> 0:14:18.600
<v Speaker 5>It's a complete swindle. But here's the good news. When

0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:20.490
<v Speaker 5>One Nation has a say, we'll have a royal commission

0:14:20.500 --> 0:14:23.070
<v Speaker 5>into all this garbage and people can tell us their

0:14:23.090 --> 0:14:25.590
<v Speaker 5>dirty little stories in front of a royal commissioner.

0:14:26.400 --> 0:14:28.880
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean, this is the third such bailout this

0:14:28.940 --> 0:14:32.870
<v Speaker 2>year after $ 2. 5 billion to a facility in New South Wales.

0:14:32.890 --> 0:14:35.670
<v Speaker 2>There was another $ 2 billion to a smelter in Queensland.

0:14:37.130 --> 0:14:40.330
<v Speaker 2>Do you support at the moment providing this money? I mean,

0:14:40.370 --> 0:14:42.979
<v Speaker 2>it is what it is, right? Until if there's a

0:14:43.080 --> 0:14:45.480
<v Speaker 2>one nation government and you can change things, it is

0:14:45.740 --> 0:14:49.140
<v Speaker 2>what it is. So as it currently stands, do you

0:14:49.180 --> 0:14:50.340
<v Speaker 2>support these bailouts?

0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:55.600
<v Speaker 5>We support trying to make sure the workers keep their jobs,

0:14:55.640 --> 0:14:59.450
<v Speaker 5>but they've got to understand this is a severance payment,

0:14:59.490 --> 0:15:02.330
<v Speaker 5>not a bailout, because unless you fundamentally change the price

0:15:02.350 --> 0:15:04.470
<v Speaker 5>of energy, we're just going to wait for the next

0:15:04.510 --> 0:15:07.630
<v Speaker 5>bailout and then the next one. There is no solution

0:15:07.650 --> 0:15:11.440
<v Speaker 5>to this because they have botched the energy sector. And

0:15:11.500 --> 0:15:14.280
<v Speaker 5>unless we get honest about it and go back to

0:15:14.320 --> 0:15:19.290
<v Speaker 5>coal-fired power, go back to what worked, these companies will close.

0:15:19.630 --> 0:15:22.950
<v Speaker 5>They have to. They are unviable. I'll tell you about

0:15:22.990 --> 0:15:26.510
<v Speaker 5>the viability of these companies. Companies like Rio Tinto, who

0:15:26.570 --> 0:15:30.190
<v Speaker 5>very well understand our energy policy, and they're the ones

0:15:30.210 --> 0:15:32.980
<v Speaker 5>who say, we're out of this country. They're crazy. Yeah, correct.

0:15:33.000 --> 0:15:33.300
<v Speaker 3>Correct.

0:15:33.860 --> 0:15:36.760
<v Speaker 2>Alright, AMP said today there's no sign the property price

0:15:36.820 --> 0:15:40.780
<v Speaker 2>falls will stop. They're now expecting housing prices to tumble

0:15:40.820 --> 0:15:42.360
<v Speaker 2>by as much as 15%.

0:15:42.360 --> 0:15:44.380
<v Speaker 3>That's from peak to trough.

0:15:45.080 --> 0:15:47.720
<v Speaker 2>And to add insult to injury, right before crashing the

0:15:47.740 --> 0:15:51.320
<v Speaker 2>property market, we all know the government encouraged more than

0:15:51.320 --> 0:15:56.060
<v Speaker 2>100,000 first home buyers to buy homes with their 5%

0:15:56.060 --> 0:15:58.700
<v Speaker 2>deposit scheme, which means many of those first home buyers

0:15:58.740 --> 0:16:01.420
<v Speaker 2>are going to end up with a mortgage that's worth more.

0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:04.610
<v Speaker 3>Than their house. For his part... The PM didn't seem

0:16:04.640 --> 0:16:05.630
<v Speaker 3>too concerned today.

0:16:06.710 --> 0:16:10.230
<v Speaker 6>The truth is that people are investing when you invest

0:16:10.290 --> 0:16:13.690
<v Speaker 6>in your home. It's an investment in long term. It's

0:16:13.710 --> 0:16:16.120
<v Speaker 6>an investment in the security that comes from a roof

0:16:16.220 --> 0:16:19.080
<v Speaker 6>over your head. And having a security of roof over

0:16:19.100 --> 0:16:21.660
<v Speaker 6>your head enables you to plan with certainty.

0:16:22.860 --> 0:16:24.479
<v Speaker 3>The PM's pretty casual about it.

0:16:24.520 --> 0:16:27.830
<v Speaker 2>Barnaby, should recent home buyers be just as casual?

0:16:29.070 --> 0:16:31.910
<v Speaker 5>Is he just endorsing One Nation's policy that you can

0:16:31.930 --> 0:16:34.540
<v Speaker 5>take money out of super to make payments on your

0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:36.660
<v Speaker 5>house and to keep a roof over your head? It

0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:39.040
<v Speaker 5>sounds very much like he was. I want to congratulate

0:16:39.060 --> 0:16:42.580
<v Speaker 5>the PM on an endorsement of One Nation's superannuation policy

0:16:42.840 --> 0:16:46.060
<v Speaker 5>that allows you to use up to 3%. for three

0:16:46.100 --> 0:16:48.870
<v Speaker 5>years to keep a roof over your head. Thank you, Anthony.

0:16:48.880 --> 0:16:52.490
<v Speaker 5>I appreciate your endorsement. But as far as your other

0:16:52.530 --> 0:16:56.270
<v Speaker 5>policy goes, the 95% debt policy, which is a 5%

0:16:56.270 --> 0:17:00.859
<v Speaker 5>deposit policy, the 95% debt policy, the 95% debt policy

0:17:00.980 --> 0:17:05.240
<v Speaker 5>is now turning into the 100% debt policy, negative equity policy.

0:17:05.619 --> 0:17:07.340
<v Speaker 5>And that means a lot of people are in dire

0:17:07.500 --> 0:17:10.969
<v Speaker 5>circumstances because there is no fat on the bone. And

0:17:11.010 --> 0:17:13.710
<v Speaker 5>I've actually worked in banking for a while. The bank

0:17:13.770 --> 0:17:16.410
<v Speaker 5>will go in to secure their position. They will say,

0:17:16.430 --> 0:17:20.020
<v Speaker 5>I'm sorry, but you're outside your terms of credit and

0:17:20.060 --> 0:17:25.440
<v Speaker 5>you must deliver more money into our account to secure

0:17:25.619 --> 0:17:28.730
<v Speaker 5>your house, and if you don't, we must sell you up.

0:17:29.270 --> 0:17:31.250
<v Speaker 5>And that is what the Labor Party has done. They're

0:17:31.550 --> 0:17:35.070
<v Speaker 5>ludicrous changes to the Capital Gains Act. This has been

0:17:35.090 --> 0:17:38.740
<v Speaker 5>a train wreck, and it shows that people who have

0:17:38.840 --> 0:17:41.700
<v Speaker 5>never run a business should never run the country because

0:17:41.760 --> 0:17:43.520
<v Speaker 5>it ends in a train wreck, which you're seeing before

0:17:43.560 --> 0:17:46.510
<v Speaker 5>your eyes right now. They are actually proud of the

0:17:46.550 --> 0:17:50.570
<v Speaker 5>fact that Australian people are becoming poorer, substantially poorer. If

0:17:50.609 --> 0:17:54.430
<v Speaker 5>you own a house in a capital city, especially Sydney

0:17:54.450 --> 0:17:57.220
<v Speaker 5>and Melbourne, to be frank, you are becoming poorer thanks

0:17:57.240 --> 0:17:58.300
<v Speaker 5>to Labor Party policy.

0:17:59.450 --> 0:18:02.770
<v Speaker 2>All right, I spoke last night about pro-Palestine groups planning

0:18:02.890 --> 0:18:05.780
<v Speaker 2>what they're calling vigils for Gaza to be held Wednesday,

0:18:05.840 --> 0:18:08.620
<v Speaker 2>which will be the third anniversary of the October 7

0:18:08.619 --> 0:18:12.240
<v Speaker 2>slaughter of 1,200 Israelis. New South Wales Premier Chris Minns

0:18:12.280 --> 0:18:15.919
<v Speaker 2>today expressed his frustration at not being able to stop

0:18:16.260 --> 0:18:21.000
<v Speaker 2>these events. He said it's very difficult because of repeated

0:18:21.080 --> 0:18:23.980
<v Speaker 2>Supreme Court and High Court decisions around the implied freedom

0:18:24.000 --> 0:18:28.070
<v Speaker 2>of political communication for us to shut down static protests,

0:18:28.140 --> 0:18:31.750
<v Speaker 2>particularly once they describe it as a silent vigil. We'll

0:18:31.810 --> 0:18:36.709
<v Speaker 2>see if it is a silent vigil. Barnaby, I have

0:18:36.730 --> 0:18:39.510
<v Speaker 2>a problem with this because, OK, the law is a problem, but...

0:18:39.930 --> 0:18:43.929
<v Speaker 2>Isn't it the responsibility of politicians to legislate and to

0:18:44.020 --> 0:18:46.719
<v Speaker 2>create laws so that we don't end up with situations

0:18:46.780 --> 0:18:50.900
<v Speaker 2>like we're likely to end up with later on next week?

0:18:51.460 --> 0:18:53.770
<v Speaker 2>If One Nation was in government, what would you do

0:18:53.810 --> 0:18:54.750
<v Speaker 2>about stuff like this?

0:18:55.890 --> 0:18:58.070
<v Speaker 5>What we've done in One Nation is we've been brave

0:18:58.109 --> 0:19:01.010
<v Speaker 5>enough to talk about the specific issue that's at hand,

0:19:01.430 --> 0:19:04.640
<v Speaker 5>which is Islamic fundamentalism. This is... This is the issue

0:19:04.680 --> 0:19:10.090
<v Speaker 5>that has caused the murder, the massacre at Bondi. And

0:19:10.190 --> 0:19:15.530
<v Speaker 5>so it wasn't Presbyterian fundamentalism or Anglican fundamentalism or Buddhist fundamentalism.

0:19:15.570 --> 0:19:18.550
<v Speaker 5>It was Islamic fundamentalism. And so you have to have

0:19:18.590 --> 0:19:22.190
<v Speaker 5>the bravery to say exactly what it is. And this

0:19:22.260 --> 0:19:24.800
<v Speaker 5>is something that's actually lacking in the Labor Party. And

0:19:24.820 --> 0:19:27.580
<v Speaker 5>I'll give a classic example in the Royal Commission that's

0:19:27.600 --> 0:19:31.280
<v Speaker 5>currently at foot. Why hasn't Wassam Haddad been called before

0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:36.330
<v Speaker 5>the Royal Commission to explain his views about about anti-Semitism.

0:19:36.790 --> 0:19:40.100
<v Speaker 5>Why are not some of the fundamentalist Islamic figures that

0:19:40.119 --> 0:19:43.399
<v Speaker 5>we all know who they are before that commission? I'd

0:19:43.420 --> 0:19:47.109
<v Speaker 5>say it's because they terrify the Labor Party and therefore

0:19:47.130 --> 0:19:50.160
<v Speaker 5>they don't have the capacity to call it for what

0:19:50.180 --> 0:19:54.220
<v Speaker 5>it is. Now, this segues very much into what Premier

0:19:54.240 --> 0:19:56.649
<v Speaker 5>Minns says, but if Premier Minns, does he want to

0:19:56.670 --> 0:19:59.290
<v Speaker 5>go out and say, look, I think the Royal Commission

0:19:59.350 --> 0:20:02.590
<v Speaker 5>should be broadened so that we can get absolutely into

0:20:02.609 --> 0:20:06.910
<v Speaker 5>what is happening in the sort of subculture of large

0:20:06.930 --> 0:20:08.580
<v Speaker 5>sections of Sydney and other areas.

0:20:09.340 --> 0:20:09.640
<v Speaker 3>I have.

0:20:10.000 --> 0:20:13.140
<v Speaker 5>You have to be careful when you start utilising any

0:20:13.180 --> 0:20:16.540
<v Speaker 5>mechanism that the Labor Party can later utilise to censor

0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:19.840
<v Speaker 5>what's happening in Australia, because they're doing that with... They've

0:20:19.900 --> 0:20:22.139
<v Speaker 5>done it with the hate speech laws. They'll do it

0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:25.730
<v Speaker 5>with the online media laws. The Labor Party love the

0:20:25.790 --> 0:20:28.730
<v Speaker 5>idea of censoring and shutting things down. They'll always start

0:20:28.750 --> 0:20:32.570
<v Speaker 5>with a virtue and finish with censorship. So you've got

0:20:32.609 --> 0:20:36.470
<v Speaker 5>to really think about it, about what you're actually doing.

0:20:36.890 --> 0:20:39.709
<v Speaker 5>But if you want to deal with legislation, make it specific.

0:20:40.030 --> 0:20:43.970
<v Speaker 5>That if you say these things against the Jewish people,

0:20:44.040 --> 0:20:47.600
<v Speaker 5>if that If that is what you are doing, that

0:20:47.660 --> 0:20:52.420
<v Speaker 5>is illegal. Absolutely. Thank you very much. That is illegal

0:20:52.720 --> 0:20:54.220
<v Speaker 5>and we will call you to account for that.

0:20:54.660 --> 0:20:55.900
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I couldn't agree more.

0:20:55.920 --> 0:20:57.740
<v Speaker 2>All right, before I let you go, I want to

0:20:57.760 --> 0:21:00.800
<v Speaker 2>quickly play you a comment from the Prime Minister earlier today.

0:21:00.859 --> 0:21:05.439
<v Speaker 2>He was responding to the Greens leader, David Shoebridge, criticising Labor.

0:21:05.460 --> 0:21:07.740
<v Speaker 2>I just took note of the way the PM characterised

0:21:08.180 --> 0:21:09.500
<v Speaker 2>your party, One Nation.

0:21:09.540 --> 0:21:10.000
<v Speaker 3>Have a listen.

0:21:11.160 --> 0:21:15.359
<v Speaker 6>It was somewhat concerning, I think, that At a time

0:21:15.400 --> 0:21:17.960
<v Speaker 6>where we see a rise of a far right-wing party,

0:21:19.010 --> 0:21:24.530
<v Speaker 6>Senator Shoebridge took the opportunity to actually criticise Labor.

0:21:24.550 --> 0:21:27.790
<v Speaker 2>I was just watching you, Barnaby, as we played that

0:21:27.890 --> 0:21:29.810
<v Speaker 2>clip and I saw you roll your eyes and shake

0:21:29.850 --> 0:21:32.630
<v Speaker 2>your head. Does that one easy calling One Nation far

0:21:32.710 --> 0:21:34.889
<v Speaker 2>right tell us something about One Nation or does it

0:21:34.950 --> 0:21:36.550
<v Speaker 2>tell us something about the Prime Minister?

0:21:36.570 --> 0:21:39.770
<v Speaker 5>It shows how concerned he is about losing his own job.

0:21:39.790 --> 0:21:42.260
<v Speaker 5>That's what it shows us. The Australian people are not

0:21:42.320 --> 0:21:45.150
<v Speaker 5>far right. The Australian people... Our polling is a reflection

0:21:45.170 --> 0:21:47.209
<v Speaker 5>of the views of the Australian people. I think it's

0:21:47.230 --> 0:21:50.670
<v Speaker 5>disgraceful that he calls that, you know, 20% to 30%

0:21:50.670 --> 0:21:54.379
<v Speaker 5>of Australians far right. Are they all extremists at the

0:21:55.359 --> 0:21:58.520
<v Speaker 5>balding here at Yarraba? Are the people who are now

0:21:58.560 --> 0:22:01.140
<v Speaker 5>voting for One Nation, they're not... What they are, they're

0:22:01.160 --> 0:22:03.900
<v Speaker 5>sick of you, Mr Albanese, and they're sick of the socialists,

0:22:03.920 --> 0:22:06.639
<v Speaker 5>because that's actually what you are. There are no labourers

0:22:07.290 --> 0:22:09.180
<v Speaker 5>on the frontbench of the Labor Party. There are no

0:22:09.680 --> 0:22:12.050
<v Speaker 5>labourers on the frontbench of the Labor Party. They are

0:22:12.070 --> 0:22:15.790
<v Speaker 5>not the Labor Party. They are the Socialist Party. They

0:22:15.810 --> 0:22:20.770
<v Speaker 5>are socialists. And socialism is an incredibly bad form of

0:22:20.830 --> 0:22:24.070
<v Speaker 5>government that is driving our economy into the dirt. That

0:22:24.109 --> 0:22:26.730
<v Speaker 5>is the debate that I wish to have with Mr Albanese.

0:22:27.710 --> 0:22:30.290
<v Speaker 5>I think people know me pretty well. They know others.

0:22:30.850 --> 0:22:34.530
<v Speaker 5>Pauline Hanson is straight down the barrel, actually. You know,

0:22:34.609 --> 0:22:38.149
<v Speaker 5>Aunty Pauline doesn't care if you get a little bit

0:22:38.220 --> 0:22:40.800
<v Speaker 5>upset because it's coming from a good place. She's trying

0:22:40.820 --> 0:22:44.080
<v Speaker 5>to tell you how to pull the country back out

0:22:44.119 --> 0:22:47.080
<v Speaker 5>of the corner of my heart's end. And I'm sure

0:22:47.100 --> 0:22:48.439
<v Speaker 5>people know me. I don't think you see me as

0:22:48.619 --> 0:22:53.010
<v Speaker 5>fascist or racist, but I'm certainly a conservative and I

0:22:53.010 --> 0:22:55.890
<v Speaker 5>want to remove socialism from our government in Australia.

0:22:55.910 --> 0:22:56.010
<v Speaker 8>Yeah.

0:22:56.890 --> 0:22:58.830
<v Speaker 3>Barnaby Joyce, it's great to chat.

0:22:59.270 --> 0:23:02.230
<v Speaker 2>Next week, Andrew Bolt is back in the chair and

0:23:02.290 --> 0:23:04.270
<v Speaker 2>I'm sure he would love it if you did your

0:23:04.290 --> 0:23:06.970
<v Speaker 2>segment with Andrew Bolt next week outside the Bolt Inn.

0:23:07.130 --> 0:23:10.120
<v Speaker 3>I'm sure he would totally appreciate that. So I appreciate

0:23:10.140 --> 0:23:11.080
<v Speaker 3>you joining me tonight.

0:23:11.160 --> 0:23:14.540
<v Speaker 5>Thank you, Mark. Lots of support is here too. Thank you.

0:23:15.240 --> 0:23:15.620
<v Speaker 1>Very good.

0:23:15.820 --> 0:23:18.200
<v Speaker 3>Thanks, Barnaby. Appreciate it. All right, we're going to go

0:23:18.240 --> 0:23:18.700
<v Speaker 3>to a break.

0:23:18.720 --> 0:23:21.359
<v Speaker 2>When we come back, the Australian Electoral Commission is worried

0:23:21.380 --> 0:23:24.610
<v Speaker 2>that AI deep fakes in political ads could be putting

0:23:24.650 --> 0:23:28.830
<v Speaker 2>Australian democracy in danger. Alex Antic will join me after this.

0:23:33.180 --> 0:23:35.619
<v Speaker 2>Welcome back to the program. The Australian Electoral Commission, the

0:23:35.640 --> 0:23:39.050
<v Speaker 2>body in charge of overseeing federal elections, has warned that

0:23:39.210 --> 0:23:44.370
<v Speaker 2>AI-generated deep fakes of politicians are putting democracy in danger. Yep,

0:23:44.590 --> 0:23:48.790
<v Speaker 2>apparently AI images like these, where small businesses mocked the

0:23:48.830 --> 0:23:51.730
<v Speaker 2>Prime Minister as a business partner after he hiked capital

0:23:51.760 --> 0:23:54.899
<v Speaker 2>gains taxes in May, well, these images are a threat.

0:23:55.670 --> 0:23:58.800
<v Speaker 3>To Anthony Albanese or to the electoral process? I'm not sure.

0:23:59.240 --> 0:24:02.200
<v Speaker 2>In a submission to the Parliamentary Inquiry into Artificial Intelligence,

0:24:02.640 --> 0:24:16.929
<v Speaker 2>the AEC said, And then they added this. AI is

0:24:16.970 --> 0:24:20.940
<v Speaker 2>increasing the speed, scale and complexity of threats to electoral integrity.

0:24:21.420 --> 0:24:24.460
<v Speaker 2>And if the legal and regulatory regime does not keep pace,

0:24:24.940 --> 0:24:29.969
<v Speaker 2>may put at risk Australians' trust in democracy and... So

0:24:30.010 --> 0:24:31.949
<v Speaker 2>in light of all of this, the AEC says it

0:24:31.990 --> 0:24:37.600
<v Speaker 2>wants to impose mandatory labelling of AI-generated election ads. Joining

0:24:37.619 --> 0:24:39.820
<v Speaker 2>me now is Liberal Senator and President of the South

0:24:39.859 --> 0:24:41.740
<v Speaker 2>Australian Liberal Party, Alex Antic.

0:24:41.880 --> 0:24:43.899
<v Speaker 3>Alex, welcome to the program.

0:24:43.940 --> 0:24:46.530
<v Speaker 2>Does the Australian Electoral Commission have a point here?

0:24:48.630 --> 0:24:51.260
<v Speaker 10>Well, James, look, I mean, I think the one thing

0:24:51.300 --> 0:24:53.100
<v Speaker 10>we can say from the outset that we don't need

0:24:53.359 --> 0:24:56.940
<v Speaker 10>in our election cycle and is any more regulation, probably

0:24:56.980 --> 0:24:59.720
<v Speaker 10>in our parliament, I have to say, you know, is

0:24:59.760 --> 0:25:03.360
<v Speaker 10>the first point of call. But look, I mean, all

0:25:03.380 --> 0:25:07.159
<v Speaker 10>of those images you just showed are blatantly, clearly, obviously

0:25:08.020 --> 0:25:11.189
<v Speaker 10>generated by AI or whatever. And this is not actually

0:25:11.230 --> 0:25:13.750
<v Speaker 10>a new phenomenon. I mean, the ability to Photoshop things

0:25:13.850 --> 0:25:18.930
<v Speaker 10>and The ability to have on election posters dark-looking photos

0:25:19.030 --> 0:25:22.690
<v Speaker 10>of the opposition, whichever party you're coming from, is a

0:25:23.290 --> 0:25:26.630
<v Speaker 10>routine thing. I mean, both sides do it. It's been

0:25:26.670 --> 0:25:28.859
<v Speaker 10>going on for a long period of time. But I

0:25:28.900 --> 0:25:34.929
<v Speaker 10>do find it interesting how... consistently critical the machinery of

0:25:34.970 --> 0:25:38.409
<v Speaker 10>government is about online content and social media at a

0:25:38.450 --> 0:25:41.860
<v Speaker 10>time where, you know, it seems to be like there

0:25:41.880 --> 0:25:43.500
<v Speaker 10>are a whole heap of other issues that should be

0:25:43.540 --> 0:25:46.680
<v Speaker 10>being tackled. I mean, it's probably a little bit cute

0:25:46.700 --> 0:25:49.280
<v Speaker 10>to suggest it, but we've got a trillion dollar debt

0:25:49.380 --> 0:25:52.660
<v Speaker 10>and the fastest fall in living standards all over the world.

0:25:52.900 --> 0:25:54.440
<v Speaker 1>I'm not sure whether or not.

0:25:54.960 --> 0:25:59.950
<v Speaker 10>Very obviously government AI-generated content like that, with exceptions, obviously,

0:26:00.710 --> 0:26:02.930
<v Speaker 10>are the highest priority for the machinery of government at

0:26:02.950 --> 0:26:03.270
<v Speaker 10>the moment.

0:26:04.050 --> 0:26:05.530
<v Speaker 3>I absolutely agree with you.

0:26:05.869 --> 0:26:08.130
<v Speaker 2>And the funny thing is, I don't seem to remember

0:26:08.630 --> 0:26:11.210
<v Speaker 2>the Australian Electoral Commission, and maybe I'm wrong, but I

0:26:11.230 --> 0:26:13.879
<v Speaker 2>don't remember them being concerned about AI fakes when the

0:26:13.920 --> 0:26:17.700
<v Speaker 2>Labor government was campaigning against nuclear power at the last

0:26:17.780 --> 0:26:21.859
<v Speaker 2>election with images like these. That apparently didn't raise any

0:26:21.920 --> 0:26:24.200
<v Speaker 2>concerns about democracy being under threat.

0:26:26.430 --> 0:26:29.300
<v Speaker 10>Yeah, those are perhaps a little more obvious than not.

0:26:29.340 --> 0:26:31.480
<v Speaker 10>The technology has changed. Look, I think on one level,

0:26:31.820 --> 0:26:36.720
<v Speaker 10>there is room for continuing to monitor evolving technology. And

0:26:36.740 --> 0:26:39.500
<v Speaker 10>I've often thought that this tech would come up. Some

0:26:39.540 --> 0:26:42.020
<v Speaker 10>of the AI generator stuff now is pretty hard to

0:26:42.080 --> 0:26:44.930
<v Speaker 10>tell from reality, but certainly none of the examples you've

0:26:44.950 --> 0:26:47.649
<v Speaker 10>shown there would require legislative intervention.

0:26:47.690 --> 0:26:48.510
<v Speaker 1>I wouldn't have thought.

0:26:48.730 --> 0:26:52.030
<v Speaker 10>I'd just be inclined to have the AEC managing elections

0:26:52.590 --> 0:26:55.209
<v Speaker 10>in the more basic sense than worrying about this.

0:26:55.890 --> 0:26:59.129
<v Speaker 2>Just before we move on, what's the greater threat to democracy?

0:26:59.270 --> 0:27:03.030
<v Speaker 2>Is it the AEC trying to regulate what images are

0:27:03.070 --> 0:27:05.910
<v Speaker 2>allowed to be shown online? Or is it the danger

0:27:05.970 --> 0:27:08.440
<v Speaker 2>of fake images being shown online? Which is the bigger

0:27:08.480 --> 0:27:08.960
<v Speaker 2>problem here?

0:27:09.920 --> 0:27:11.119
<v Speaker 10>Well, one of the things that occurred to me when

0:27:11.160 --> 0:27:13.660
<v Speaker 10>I saw this story today was, you know, the very

0:27:13.760 --> 0:27:16.479
<v Speaker 10>difficulty you have with, you know, with.

0:27:16.340 --> 0:27:18.020
<v Speaker 1>Governments having so much intervention.

0:27:18.080 --> 0:27:21.480
<v Speaker 10>We see that with These digital duty of care laws

0:27:21.500 --> 0:27:24.359
<v Speaker 10>that have been proposed. It seems like every time we

0:27:24.400 --> 0:27:26.879
<v Speaker 10>turn up to Canberra, we're being asked to rubber stamp

0:27:26.900 --> 0:27:31.640
<v Speaker 10>something which would give bureaucrats more power in the electoral process.

0:27:31.660 --> 0:27:35.320
<v Speaker 10>So as a general principle, I think keeping the bureaucracy,

0:27:35.340 --> 0:27:38.310
<v Speaker 10>the unelected, with their hands out of the process as

0:27:38.390 --> 0:27:41.490
<v Speaker 10>much as is humanly possible is paramount.

0:27:42.320 --> 0:27:45.859
<v Speaker 2>All right, the Coalition has promised to scrap laws favouring

0:27:46.020 --> 0:27:49.679
<v Speaker 2>union-backed firms for government contracts and to bring back the

0:27:49.740 --> 0:27:53.120
<v Speaker 2>Australian Building and Construction Commission, which the Albanese government disbanded

0:27:53.290 --> 0:27:56.950
<v Speaker 2>in 2023. I think it's funny how the Labor government

0:27:56.970 --> 0:28:00.909
<v Speaker 2>always paints itself as the saviours from discrimination, but when

0:28:00.930 --> 0:28:04.209
<v Speaker 2>it comes to issuing government contracts, the way the government

0:28:04.270 --> 0:28:07.409
<v Speaker 2>seeks to discriminate in favour of the union movement has

0:28:07.430 --> 0:28:08.940
<v Speaker 2>just been quite shameless, hasn't it?

0:28:10.119 --> 0:28:12.140
<v Speaker 10>Yeah, look, I mean, this is, you know, it feels

0:28:12.160 --> 0:28:14.979
<v Speaker 10>like we're talking about this every single, you know, election cycle,

0:28:15.040 --> 0:28:18.109
<v Speaker 10>every single day. But it is a true point. I mean,

0:28:18.200 --> 0:28:20.250
<v Speaker 10>you know, these things have got to be done on merit.

0:28:20.310 --> 0:28:24.050
<v Speaker 10>And Jane's quite right about that. It cannot be the

0:28:24.090 --> 0:28:27.530
<v Speaker 10>case that, you know, as a general principle, that we're

0:28:27.550 --> 0:28:29.730
<v Speaker 10>not getting the best workers for the best job, the best,

0:28:29.880 --> 0:28:30.130
<v Speaker 10>you know.

0:28:30.190 --> 0:28:32.379
<v Speaker 1>Involvement for the job.

0:28:32.420 --> 0:28:35.220
<v Speaker 10>So as a general principle, yes, I think it's absolutely

0:28:35.300 --> 0:28:38.200
<v Speaker 10>right to say that there needs to be some overview

0:28:38.280 --> 0:28:38.580
<v Speaker 10>on that.

0:28:38.760 --> 0:28:41.180
<v Speaker 1>And look, I would say, again, I mean, it goes.

0:28:41.080 --> 0:28:45.220
<v Speaker 10>Broader than that. The regulatory environment now for some of this,

0:28:45.340 --> 0:28:49.080
<v Speaker 10>you know, particularly the building and construction, you know, world,

0:28:49.120 --> 0:28:51.200
<v Speaker 10>if you can imagine a world where there's as much

0:28:51.260 --> 0:28:53.790
<v Speaker 10>demand for housing as there is at the moment in

0:28:53.810 --> 0:28:56.070
<v Speaker 10>a world in which it's never been more difficult to

0:28:56.150 --> 0:28:59.469
<v Speaker 10>actually build and construct, that sort of tells you the

0:28:59.490 --> 0:29:02.090
<v Speaker 10>story about where we're up to. I think you could

0:29:02.110 --> 0:29:03.830
<v Speaker 10>almost go to an election with a plan to just

0:29:03.870 --> 0:29:07.580
<v Speaker 10>spend an entire term repealing laws and Full stop. And

0:29:08.000 --> 0:29:11.960
<v Speaker 10>you would find a lot of, I guess, fans of that.

0:29:12.220 --> 0:29:15.360
<v Speaker 10>I certainly would. Labor have spent the last four years

0:29:15.960 --> 0:29:18.540
<v Speaker 10>rushing laws through, guillotining them through. I keep coming back

0:29:18.560 --> 0:29:20.620
<v Speaker 10>to this example, but if you look at the digital

0:29:20.680 --> 0:29:23.110
<v Speaker 10>ID laws, which are set to fundamentally change the way

0:29:23.150 --> 0:29:26.010
<v Speaker 10>in which Australians live, that entire debate in the Senate

0:29:26.030 --> 0:29:27.830
<v Speaker 10>was guillotined. No one was allowed to speak to it

0:29:27.870 --> 0:29:31.410
<v Speaker 10>and just pushed through. So, I mean, they have rammed

0:29:31.630 --> 0:29:34.310
<v Speaker 10>laws through, and I think it does give cause to

0:29:34.330 --> 0:29:36.210
<v Speaker 10>look at repealing a whole raft of them, this included.

0:29:37.090 --> 0:29:39.070
<v Speaker 2>I spoke at the top of the show about how

0:29:39.250 --> 0:29:43.120
<v Speaker 2>angry small businesses... owners are about the Albanese government's claims

0:29:43.140 --> 0:29:47.000
<v Speaker 2>that the ban on card surcharges coming into effect today

0:29:47.060 --> 0:29:49.460
<v Speaker 2>is somehow a cost of living measure. One of those

0:29:49.540 --> 0:29:52.830
<v Speaker 2>business owners, Peter Pappas, who owns some Greek restaurants here

0:29:52.850 --> 0:29:55.750
<v Speaker 2>in Sydney, he had this to say about the surcharge ban.

0:29:55.770 --> 0:29:56.110
<v Speaker 3>Have a listen.

0:29:57.250 --> 0:30:00.430
<v Speaker 11>That couple of cents in our case, for example, adds

0:30:00.490 --> 0:30:03.340
<v Speaker 11>up to well over $ 100, 000 a year. We seem to

0:30:03.380 --> 0:30:05.740
<v Speaker 11>be the punching bag for the state and federal government

0:30:06.040 --> 0:30:08.980
<v Speaker 11>in terms of increasing taxes. They say we are the

0:30:09.020 --> 0:30:11.640
<v Speaker 11>backbone of the economy, the small business owner. Why are

0:30:11.660 --> 0:30:14.180
<v Speaker 11>we being punished? Inflation is up. Interest rates are up.

0:30:14.680 --> 0:30:16.780
<v Speaker 11>Energy costs are up. And now you've got to pay

0:30:16.820 --> 0:30:17.820
<v Speaker 11>more for your coffee.

0:30:19.540 --> 0:30:21.700
<v Speaker 2>Alex, I said at the top of the show, everything

0:30:21.740 --> 0:30:25.220
<v Speaker 2>this government does to make things better ends up making

0:30:25.260 --> 0:30:26.940
<v Speaker 2>things worse every single time.

0:30:27.870 --> 0:30:29.730
<v Speaker 10>Yeah, and this, of course, he's absolutely right. This is

0:30:29.750 --> 0:30:31.469
<v Speaker 10>going to fall on the small business owner to wear

0:30:31.530 --> 0:30:33.770
<v Speaker 10>this cost. And somewhere along the line, that will get

0:30:34.050 --> 0:30:36.190
<v Speaker 10>returned to the consumer. You can guarantee to unless you

0:30:36.230 --> 0:30:37.900
<v Speaker 10>pay cash, which is always a good thing to do

0:30:37.960 --> 0:30:40.600
<v Speaker 10>as well. But look, I mean, I think the same

0:30:40.800 --> 0:30:42.120
<v Speaker 10>principle applies here as well.

0:30:42.140 --> 0:30:42.700
<v Speaker 1>This is just.

0:30:43.300 --> 0:30:47.000
<v Speaker 10>Another example of the machinery of government and the government

0:30:47.020 --> 0:30:50.450
<v Speaker 10>of the day not understanding what is actually causing the

0:30:50.890 --> 0:30:54.090
<v Speaker 10>cost of living crisis. I mean, look, we would always

0:30:54.150 --> 0:30:56.590
<v Speaker 10>hope that you could get a better deal at the cafe,

0:30:56.730 --> 0:30:58.820
<v Speaker 10>and as long as that's supporting small businesses, which this is.

0:30:58.800 --> 0:30:59.120
<v Speaker 5>Not, but.

0:30:59.750 --> 0:31:02.000
<v Speaker 10>You know, as I said, we're a trillion dollars in debt.

0:31:02.380 --> 0:31:04.920
<v Speaker 10>There have been, you know, to the extent of 30%

0:31:04.920 --> 0:31:09.300
<v Speaker 10>increases in insurance, in energy costs across the board. And

0:31:09.320 --> 0:31:11.000
<v Speaker 10>this is what the government comes up with. I mean,

0:31:11.040 --> 0:31:13.280
<v Speaker 10>I think largely this is performative and it's pulling the

0:31:13.320 --> 0:31:15.490
<v Speaker 10>wrong lever for small business. There's no question about that.

0:31:15.510 --> 0:31:16.890
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, absolutely.

0:31:17.350 --> 0:31:19.070
<v Speaker 2>And by the way, if you pay cash, you're still

0:31:19.130 --> 0:31:21.570
<v Speaker 2>getting hit with these charges because now it's been added

0:31:21.610 --> 0:31:23.510
<v Speaker 2>to the menu. So whether you pay with cash or

0:31:23.530 --> 0:31:26.990
<v Speaker 2>your card, you still end up subsidising these costs.

0:31:27.060 --> 0:31:27.190
<v Speaker 8>So.

0:31:27.840 --> 0:31:30.660
<v Speaker 2>You're even worse off than we ever were before. It

0:31:30.880 --> 0:31:31.640
<v Speaker 2>just never ends.

0:31:31.720 --> 0:31:34.080
<v Speaker 3>Alex Antica, I appreciate you joining me this evening. Thanks

0:31:34.100 --> 0:31:34.420
<v Speaker 3>so much.

0:31:35.080 --> 0:31:35.700
<v Speaker 10>Yeah, thanks, James.

0:31:36.870 --> 0:31:37.650
<v Speaker 3>All right, stick around.

0:31:37.730 --> 0:31:41.980
<v Speaker 2>After the break, Communications Minister Annika Wells makes Time magazine's

0:31:42.080 --> 0:31:43.580
<v Speaker 2>top 100.

0:31:42.940 --> 0:31:45.920
<v Speaker 3>Most influential rising stars.

0:31:46.440 --> 0:31:50.470
<v Speaker 2>And Australian politicians are world leaders in giving speeches.

0:31:50.070 --> 0:31:51.310
<v Speaker 3>Written by AI.

0:31:51.330 --> 0:31:55.070
<v Speaker 2>Does that make our pollies incredibly efficient or incredibly lazy?

0:31:55.090 --> 0:32:01.250
<v Speaker 2>I'll ask my panel about that after the break. It's

0:32:01.290 --> 0:32:03.590
<v Speaker 2>a strange thing, you know. The more this government is

0:32:03.690 --> 0:32:08.210
<v Speaker 2>loathed at home, the more it's loved overseas. Last month,

0:32:08.370 --> 0:32:12.130
<v Speaker 2>the Prime Minister was given a Global Citizen Award and today,

0:32:12.290 --> 0:32:16.740
<v Speaker 2>Time magazine named Communications Minister Annika Wells one of the

0:32:16.780 --> 0:32:22.209
<v Speaker 2>world's top 100 most influential rising stars. No, not for

0:32:22.310 --> 0:32:26.590
<v Speaker 2>influencing her colleagues to take maximum advantage of taxpayer-funded travel allowances.

0:32:26.610 --> 0:32:30.620
<v Speaker 2>They don't need any encouragement there. Annika Wells was recognised

0:32:30.660 --> 0:32:33.560
<v Speaker 2>for being, and I quote, one of the most significant

0:32:33.640 --> 0:32:37.469
<v Speaker 2>voices in a growing global movement to reframe the relationship

0:32:37.490 --> 0:32:38.489
<v Speaker 2>between technology.

0:32:38.940 --> 0:32:39.270
<v Speaker 3>and the.

0:32:39.220 --> 0:32:42.810
<v Speaker 2>Wellbeing of our children, which is a long-winded way of

0:32:42.870 --> 0:32:46.770
<v Speaker 2>saying she's shown communication ministers around the world with censorious

0:32:46.830 --> 0:32:47.910
<v Speaker 2>instincts how to.

0:32:47.890 --> 0:32:48.930
<v Speaker 3>Disguise them better.

0:32:49.690 --> 0:32:52.350
<v Speaker 2>If you can believe it, Annika Wells' nomination as one

0:32:52.390 --> 0:32:56.410
<v Speaker 2>of the world's top 100 up-and-coming influencers came from none

0:32:56.470 --> 0:33:01.450
<v Speaker 2>other than Julia Gillard, who wrote,' Future generations will look

0:33:01.540 --> 0:33:07.020
<v Speaker 2>back on her landmark changes as courageous and trailblazing.' kind

0:33:07.040 --> 0:33:09.240
<v Speaker 2>of the way we all look back on Gillard's changes

0:33:09.300 --> 0:33:13.050
<v Speaker 2>to the Sex Discrimination Act. Personally, I think this award

0:33:13.110 --> 0:33:16.930
<v Speaker 2>for our social media banning, algorithm hating, harmful content destroying

0:33:16.950 --> 0:33:20.260
<v Speaker 2>communications minister is well deserved. I just think it comes

0:33:20.300 --> 0:33:24.420
<v Speaker 2>at the wrong time. It should have been given in 1984.

0:33:25.360 --> 0:33:28.590
<v Speaker 2>It's instructive, is it not? When the communications minister starts

0:33:28.640 --> 0:33:30.890
<v Speaker 2>telling us it needs to control what we can see,

0:33:31.330 --> 0:33:34.610
<v Speaker 2>what we can say, what we can access online, we

0:33:34.650 --> 0:33:35.490
<v Speaker 2>all respond with.

0:33:35.430 --> 0:33:39.270
<v Speaker 3>Alarm, while the global elites, they give her an award.

0:33:39.880 --> 0:33:43.920
<v Speaker 2>Joining me now is PR counsel, Christy McSweeney, and Bondi

0:33:43.980 --> 0:33:45.920
<v Speaker 2>Partners senior advisor, Peter McGowan.

0:33:45.940 --> 0:33:49.060
<v Speaker 3>Welcome to you both. Christy, where do we even start

0:33:49.120 --> 0:33:49.740
<v Speaker 3>with this award?

0:33:51.850 --> 0:33:56.710
<v Speaker 4>Look, I actually really admire Julia Gillard for her post-political dignity.

0:33:56.790 --> 0:34:00.040
<v Speaker 4>She's sort of breaking my faith in her conduct here,

0:34:00.130 --> 0:34:04.880
<v Speaker 4>nominating Annika Wells for this award. Look, it's produced mountains

0:34:04.920 --> 0:34:09.410
<v Speaker 4>and mountains of wonderful talkfest transcripts. But if you speak

0:34:09.430 --> 0:34:14.299
<v Speaker 4>to anybody in the media technology industry, the legislation in

0:34:14.340 --> 0:34:18.319
<v Speaker 4>and of itself when introduced in Parliament was threadbare, ill

0:34:18.380 --> 0:34:21.200
<v Speaker 4>thought out and with no concept of how it could

0:34:21.340 --> 0:34:26.020
<v Speaker 4>actually be implemented and it still hasn't worked. So wonderful

0:34:26.260 --> 0:34:30.120
<v Speaker 4>to receive accolades for an idea, but.

0:34:30.340 --> 0:34:31.300
<v Speaker 3>It doesn't work.

0:34:31.660 --> 0:34:34.580
<v Speaker 4>It hasn't worked and the government still has no plan

0:34:34.780 --> 0:34:35.900
<v Speaker 4>for it to work.

0:34:37.000 --> 0:34:39.940
<v Speaker 2>Hey, imagine what will happen when she actually makes it work.

0:34:39.980 --> 0:34:43.320
<v Speaker 2>She'll get a Nobel Peace Prize or something, I imagine. Peter,

0:34:43.620 --> 0:34:46.500
<v Speaker 2>the thing I hate about this is, you know, Albanese

0:34:46.540 --> 0:34:50.489
<v Speaker 2>gets a Global Citizen Award and now this for Annika Wells.

0:34:51.310 --> 0:34:52.150
<v Speaker 3>They get all these awards.

0:34:52.210 --> 0:34:54.630
<v Speaker 2>It's just going to encourage their worst instincts. It's going

0:34:54.650 --> 0:34:56.770
<v Speaker 2>to encourage them to keep going. We just want them

0:34:56.790 --> 0:34:57.430
<v Speaker 2>to stop.

0:34:58.810 --> 0:35:02.549
<v Speaker 12>I don't think they need any international encouragement to wreck

0:35:02.590 --> 0:35:04.810
<v Speaker 12>the country anymore, James.

0:35:05.680 --> 0:35:05.839
<v Speaker 5>Look.

0:35:06.590 --> 0:35:09.720
<v Speaker 12>Annika Wells wouldn't be in the top half of competent

0:35:09.760 --> 0:35:13.500
<v Speaker 12>ministers in the ministry, and that's saying something. She's been

0:35:13.540 --> 0:35:17.180
<v Speaker 12>in witness protection for more than a year following, of course,

0:35:17.620 --> 0:35:22.920
<v Speaker 12>the issues surrounding her claims and her excesses on sporting

0:35:23.640 --> 0:35:26.960
<v Speaker 12>events and the like. She didn't have a great deal

0:35:27.840 --> 0:35:31.290
<v Speaker 12>to do with negotiating the passage of the legislation through

0:35:31.310 --> 0:35:35.230
<v Speaker 12>the Senate, which only the Liberal Party and the Coalition,

0:35:35.270 --> 0:35:39.170
<v Speaker 12>I should say, got it through. So look, it's a

0:35:39.270 --> 0:35:40.489
<v Speaker 12>tin pot award.

0:35:41.190 --> 0:35:42.049
<v Speaker 3>Everybody would see it.

0:35:42.090 --> 0:35:43.830
<v Speaker 12>So straight to the pool.

0:35:43.590 --> 0:35:46.109
<v Speaker 3>Room with it. Well, I reckon you would.

0:35:46.150 --> 0:35:49.190
<v Speaker 2>You'd frame the Time magazine cover, or she probably won't

0:35:49.210 --> 0:35:51.720
<v Speaker 2>be on the cover, but page, and you would definitely

0:35:52.320 --> 0:35:53.319
<v Speaker 2>put it in the pool room. And if you don't

0:35:53.360 --> 0:35:55.020
<v Speaker 2>have a pool room, you'd get a pool room, I think,

0:35:55.060 --> 0:35:57.600
<v Speaker 2>if you're in time. For the past couple of weeks,

0:35:57.760 --> 0:36:00.920
<v Speaker 2>this government hasn't stopped warning us. You know, AI poses

0:36:01.000 --> 0:36:05.120
<v Speaker 2>major threats to humanity. Here's the PM when he was

0:36:05.320 --> 0:36:05.859
<v Speaker 2>at the UN.

0:36:07.250 --> 0:36:13.850
<v Speaker 6>Recently, an artificial intelligence agent infiltrated an Australian government website.

0:36:14.570 --> 0:36:16.160
<v Speaker 3>This is unacceptable.

0:36:16.780 --> 0:36:19.200
<v Speaker 6>And it is why Australia has been leading the way

0:36:19.680 --> 0:36:26.040
<v Speaker 6>in establishing Australian standards for AI. Standards to ensure that

0:36:26.200 --> 0:36:29.549
<v Speaker 6>AI will work and deliver for people, not the other

0:36:29.590 --> 0:36:30.190
<v Speaker 6>way around.

0:36:31.250 --> 0:36:32.950
<v Speaker 3>I've just got one question, guys.

0:36:33.010 --> 0:36:35.810
<v Speaker 2>How do we know Albanese's speech there on the dangers

0:36:35.850 --> 0:36:40.259
<v Speaker 2>of AI wasn't written by AI? Because analysis from The

0:36:40.460 --> 0:36:44.900
<v Speaker 2>Economist has found that Australian politicians are more likely to

0:36:44.960 --> 0:36:49.270
<v Speaker 2>read AI-generated speeches than MPs anywhere else in the English-speaking world.

0:36:50.300 --> 0:36:53.700
<v Speaker 2>It's estimated that over the past 12 months, more than 20%

0:36:53.700 --> 0:36:58.700
<v Speaker 2>of speeches in our parliament were AI-generated or AI-assisted. The

0:36:58.760 --> 0:37:01.819
<v Speaker 2>only positive is that at least our MPs delivered their

0:37:01.960 --> 0:37:06.359
<v Speaker 2>AI-generated speeches better than this Canadian politician, Bill Oliver, who

0:37:06.410 --> 0:37:08.210
<v Speaker 2>forgot to edit out the AI prompts.

0:37:09.590 --> 0:37:13.009
<v Speaker 13>One of the dangers associated with creating advocacy offices is

0:37:13.030 --> 0:37:17.650
<v Speaker 13>that citizens often develop expectations that exceed the powers actually

0:37:17.730 --> 0:37:22.940
<v Speaker 13>granted them. to those offices. Here's a more natural flowing

0:37:22.980 --> 0:37:25.730
<v Speaker 13>version of that section that reads like a legislative speech

0:37:25.810 --> 0:37:27.169
<v Speaker 13>rather than a series of short points.

0:37:29.690 --> 0:37:32.660
<v Speaker 2>I just cannot watch that too many times. Chris, the

0:37:32.800 --> 0:37:35.739
<v Speaker 2>AI generated speeches, is this efficiency on the part of

0:37:35.800 --> 0:37:37.420
<v Speaker 2>our MPs or just sheer laziness?

0:37:39.090 --> 0:37:41.410
<v Speaker 4>Well, if we look at what the government's actually done

0:37:41.550 --> 0:37:44.040
<v Speaker 4>about AI, first of all, they've created an office of

0:37:44.140 --> 0:37:48.460
<v Speaker 4>AI with no AI policy. It's an infrastructure coordination with

0:37:48.500 --> 0:37:51.860
<v Speaker 4>the states to get the large companies that want to

0:37:51.880 --> 0:37:55.850
<v Speaker 4>build data centres about energy and power and water. Again,

0:37:56.090 --> 0:37:59.590
<v Speaker 4>nothing to do with AI. So when we talk about AI,

0:37:59.630 --> 0:38:03.340
<v Speaker 4>when our politicians talk about AI... No wonder they're using

0:38:03.390 --> 0:38:06.920
<v Speaker 4>AI to generate their speeches. They don't know anything about it.

0:38:07.660 --> 0:38:10.520
<v Speaker 4>The technology community turns up to Parliament and tries to

0:38:10.580 --> 0:38:15.359
<v Speaker 4>speak to them and the eyes glaze over. Technology has

0:38:15.420 --> 0:38:20.569
<v Speaker 4>accelerated so far beyond what the government is capable of understanding,

0:38:20.630 --> 0:38:24.690
<v Speaker 4>which is why we have nothing. We have no AI policy,

0:38:25.190 --> 0:38:28.650
<v Speaker 4>no matter how hard the Prime Minister tries to say

0:38:29.070 --> 0:38:34.320
<v Speaker 4>that building data centres is knowledge AI and not just infrastructure.

0:38:34.700 --> 0:38:37.160
<v Speaker 4>No wonder they are using it to write their speeches.

0:38:37.200 --> 0:38:39.759
<v Speaker 4>They don't have any other choice. They've got no information

0:38:39.800 --> 0:38:41.440
<v Speaker 4>or understanding on AI.

0:38:42.120 --> 0:38:45.580
<v Speaker 2>Peter, what's the difference between an AI generated speech and

0:38:45.660 --> 0:38:47.400
<v Speaker 2>a speechwriter generated speech?

0:38:49.790 --> 0:38:55.890
<v Speaker 12>Firstly, the AI is a robotic providing of tech, so

0:38:56.160 --> 0:39:02.819
<v Speaker 12>you come across as programmed. A speechwriter, yeah, sure, you

0:39:02.840 --> 0:39:06.200
<v Speaker 12>can read out the entire speech that somebody's written for you,

0:39:06.239 --> 0:39:10.339
<v Speaker 12>but mostly it's a collaborative effort and almost all speechwriters

0:39:10.360 --> 0:39:13.310
<v Speaker 12>I've ever known want that. They don't want you just to,

0:39:14.110 --> 0:39:16.370
<v Speaker 12>read it out as you wish. They want to talk

0:39:16.410 --> 0:39:20.220
<v Speaker 12>about style and so on. So, look, the greatest currency, James,

0:39:20.280 --> 0:39:24.910
<v Speaker 12>in politics is authenticity. And no wonder we think so

0:39:24.969 --> 0:39:28.290
<v Speaker 12>many of them are, of course, remote and distant and

0:39:28.370 --> 0:39:32.219
<v Speaker 12>garrulous and unable to communicate Do you think Pauline Hanson

0:39:32.680 --> 0:39:35.120
<v Speaker 12>ever has an AI text prepared speech?

0:39:35.160 --> 0:39:35.799
<v Speaker 14>Of course not.

0:39:36.030 --> 0:39:39.330
<v Speaker 12>She speaks from the heart and speaks genuinely and directly

0:39:39.410 --> 0:39:39.830
<v Speaker 12>on issues.

0:39:39.870 --> 0:39:41.330
<v Speaker 3>And that's what people want.

0:39:41.989 --> 0:39:44.310
<v Speaker 2>I was going to say, if Pauline Hanson is using

0:39:44.430 --> 0:39:48.549
<v Speaker 2>chat GPT, it's totally gone rogue. The Albanese government is

0:39:48.650 --> 0:39:52.090
<v Speaker 2>passing the hat around to state and territory leaders, asking

0:39:52.110 --> 0:39:54.489
<v Speaker 2>them to tip in for a space mission. We need

0:39:54.489 --> 0:39:57.770
<v Speaker 2>160 million bucks to send Australian of the Year Catherine

0:39:57.870 --> 0:40:03.740
<v Speaker 2>Benelpeg to the International Space Station in 2028. Other Australians

0:40:03.760 --> 0:40:05.719
<v Speaker 2>have been to space, but Benelpeg would be the first

0:40:05.780 --> 0:40:10.950
<v Speaker 2>professionally trained Australian astronaut. Acting Chief Minister of the Northern Territory,

0:40:11.010 --> 0:40:14.970
<v Speaker 2>Gerard Maley, said it's reckless and shows the PM's priorities

0:40:15.030 --> 0:40:17.630
<v Speaker 2>are out of touch with Australians. The federal government cannot

0:40:17.670 --> 0:40:20.149
<v Speaker 2>tell Australians there isn't enough money for the things they

0:40:20.190 --> 0:40:24.670
<v Speaker 2>need here on the ground and then spend $ 160 million going.

0:40:24.610 --> 0:40:25.370
<v Speaker 3>To the moon.

0:40:25.550 --> 0:40:27.830
<v Speaker 2>Christy, is it reckless or is this precisely the sort

0:40:27.850 --> 0:40:29.930
<v Speaker 2>of thing we should be encouraging?

0:40:31.410 --> 0:40:34.310
<v Speaker 4>Oh, James, how many moonshots does this government want to

0:40:34.350 --> 0:40:36.049
<v Speaker 4>try and shoot for?

0:40:36.070 --> 0:40:36.589
<v Speaker 3>Very good.

0:40:36.989 --> 0:40:41.540
<v Speaker 4>I mean, aren't they full? I think that, on the

0:40:41.719 --> 0:40:44.779
<v Speaker 4>one hand, I think, wow, how amazing that Australia has

0:40:44.840 --> 0:40:48.640
<v Speaker 4>produced an astronaut, a female astronaut. And a little bit

0:40:48.680 --> 0:40:51.410
<v Speaker 4>of part of me thinks, well, maybe we should take

0:40:51.469 --> 0:40:53.589
<v Speaker 4>away some of the money we give to PNG for

0:40:53.630 --> 0:40:56.190
<v Speaker 4>rugby league teams and defund the AFL a little bit

0:40:56.250 --> 0:40:58.630
<v Speaker 4>and all these male sports so we can give the

0:40:58.670 --> 0:41:02.790
<v Speaker 4>female astronaut a go. and celebrate something in this country

0:41:02.830 --> 0:41:05.670
<v Speaker 4>that is in science and technology. That's a little part

0:41:05.710 --> 0:41:11.650
<v Speaker 4>of me. The other part says, wow, priorities, inflation's hit 4%,

0:41:11.650 --> 0:41:14.650
<v Speaker 4>interest rates are 15 years high, and you're asking the

0:41:14.710 --> 0:41:18.430
<v Speaker 4>states to punt in for something that really has no

0:41:18.650 --> 0:41:23.110
<v Speaker 4>economic return value for Australia. It's a European space agency mission.

0:41:23.450 --> 0:41:23.989
<v Speaker 3>And guess what?

0:41:24.350 --> 0:41:28.270
<v Speaker 4>France just gave them € 3 billion for the last three years.

0:41:29.190 --> 0:41:33.569
<v Speaker 4>It's clearly a European focus, you know, but I can

0:41:33.610 --> 0:41:34.810
<v Speaker 4>see the other side of it.

0:41:35.410 --> 0:41:37.730
<v Speaker 2>We've only got a couple of seconds, Peter. I reckon

0:41:37.790 --> 0:41:39.430
<v Speaker 2>it's a good idea. It'd be inspiring.

0:41:41.530 --> 0:41:42.090
<v Speaker 5>True, James.

0:41:42.110 --> 0:41:44.890
<v Speaker 12>The tragedy is we can't afford it, and in political

0:41:44.950 --> 0:41:48.239
<v Speaker 12>terms it won't happen, but Australia's always been part of

0:41:48.580 --> 0:41:52.420
<v Speaker 12>international consortiums in regard to the square kilometre array in

0:41:52.460 --> 0:41:56.540
<v Speaker 12>Western Australia, a billion dollars, part of the Magellan telescope,

0:41:56.640 --> 0:42:02.569
<v Speaker 12>optical telescope, project in Chile. We've always punched above our weight.

0:42:02.870 --> 0:42:06.150
<v Speaker 12>And this is just another indication of our decline.

0:42:06.750 --> 0:42:07.290
<v Speaker 3>Certainly is.

0:42:07.390 --> 0:42:10.279
<v Speaker 2>Christy McSweeney and Peter McGowan, always enjoy catching up.

0:42:10.410 --> 0:42:12.640
<v Speaker 3>Thanks so much. All right, stick around.

0:42:12.820 --> 0:42:15.160
<v Speaker 2>After the break, we'll head to the UK, where details

0:42:15.219 --> 0:42:17.980
<v Speaker 2>of a suspected terror attack on a Royal Air Force

0:42:18.040 --> 0:42:20.340
<v Speaker 2>base are just getting stranger and stranger.

0:42:20.940 --> 0:42:23.780
<v Speaker 3>And did the Virgin Mary wear a hijab?

0:42:24.320 --> 0:42:28.020
<v Speaker 2>According to a taxpayer-funded course designed to stop Islamophobia, the

0:42:28.060 --> 0:42:28.780
<v Speaker 2>answer is yes.

0:42:29.140 --> 0:42:29.899
<v Speaker 3>That's after the break.

0:42:33.880 --> 0:42:37.200
<v Speaker 2>Well, investigations are continuing into the suspected terror plot at

0:42:37.239 --> 0:42:40.500
<v Speaker 2>a UK Royal Air Force base last week. It seemed

0:42:40.540 --> 0:42:43.740
<v Speaker 2>at first like a major terrorist attack had been thwarted.

0:42:44.330 --> 0:42:47.830
<v Speaker 2>An alert farmer observing strange vehicles and masked men near

0:42:47.850 --> 0:42:51.850
<v Speaker 2>the base contacted authorities and five men were arrested on

0:42:51.930 --> 0:42:56.160
<v Speaker 2>suspicion of explosives offences. And politicians in the UK as

0:42:56.200 --> 0:42:59.160
<v Speaker 2>well as in America were indicating this had all the

0:42:59.219 --> 0:43:02.560
<v Speaker 2>hallmarks of a foreign-sponsored terrorist attack.

0:43:02.600 --> 0:43:03.960
<v Speaker 3>Here's the UK Prime Minister.

0:43:04.980 --> 0:43:09.040
<v Speaker 7>There are strong indications that Iran played a part in

0:43:09.080 --> 0:43:11.710
<v Speaker 7>what happened over the weekend at RAF Fairford.

0:43:12.980 --> 0:43:16.540
<v Speaker 2>OK, but just one question, if that's true, why were

0:43:16.560 --> 0:43:21.290
<v Speaker 2>the five suspects released on bail? Reform UK leader Nigel

0:43:21.330 --> 0:43:23.030
<v Speaker 2>Farage added to the intrigue.

0:43:24.110 --> 0:43:29.689
<v Speaker 14>One of the five himself called the emergency services. Why

0:43:29.730 --> 0:43:32.650
<v Speaker 14>would they do that? These five, and perhaps a few

0:43:32.690 --> 0:43:38.390
<v Speaker 14>others involved, were a dummy run for a proper terrorist

0:43:38.550 --> 0:43:44.069
<v Speaker 14>attack on US forces in at RAF Fairford, and by

0:43:44.270 --> 0:43:48.330
<v Speaker 14>one of the five ringing the emergency services, he was

0:43:48.370 --> 0:43:52.140
<v Speaker 14>testing response times. That is what I believe was going on.

0:43:53.500 --> 0:43:56.200
<v Speaker 2>Joining me now is Spiked Online editor Tom Slater, who

0:43:56.400 --> 0:43:58.160
<v Speaker 2>always knows what's going on.

0:43:58.580 --> 0:44:00.219
<v Speaker 3>Tom, what's going on?

0:44:01.739 --> 0:44:03.800
<v Speaker 1>I wish I could answer that question neatly, James.

0:44:03.860 --> 0:44:06.700
<v Speaker 15>I mean, this story can't decide whether it's an episode

0:44:06.719 --> 0:44:08.530
<v Speaker 15>of Homeland or a carry-on film.

0:44:08.550 --> 0:44:11.589
<v Speaker 1>There's been so many bizarre twists and turns so far.

0:44:11.730 --> 0:44:13.049
<v Speaker 1>You've laid it out perfectly there.

0:44:13.090 --> 0:44:15.800
<v Speaker 15>This has all the hallmarks of a sort of terrorist attack,

0:44:15.930 --> 0:44:18.160
<v Speaker 15>and yet at the same time, You have them released

0:44:18.260 --> 0:44:22.719
<v Speaker 15>on bail, this latest revelation that one of the would-be attackers'

0:44:22.780 --> 0:44:27.850
<v Speaker 15>suspects calls the police on himself and his co-conspirators. And then,

0:44:27.910 --> 0:44:30.799
<v Speaker 15>of course, this comment from Andy Burnham suggesting it's got

0:44:30.840 --> 0:44:33.480
<v Speaker 15>all the hallmarks of something that Iran might have been

0:44:33.500 --> 0:44:34.279
<v Speaker 15>involved with.

0:44:34.980 --> 0:44:36.020
<v Speaker 1>It's very difficult to say.

0:44:36.120 --> 0:44:38.060
<v Speaker 15>One thing that is clear is that we know that

0:44:38.080 --> 0:44:41.810
<v Speaker 15>the Iranians are trying to sponsor attacks like this, which

0:44:41.930 --> 0:44:44.490
<v Speaker 15>are very much about just sort of prodding and pushing

0:44:44.510 --> 0:44:47.310
<v Speaker 15>and trying to create fear. You know, hiring often kind

0:44:47.350 --> 0:44:50.830
<v Speaker 15>of just local ne'er-do-wells to inflict attacks. We've seen that

0:44:50.850 --> 0:44:53.440
<v Speaker 15>against synagogues. Maybe that's something that we're seeing in relation

0:44:53.480 --> 0:44:56.140
<v Speaker 15>to RAF Fairford. But the more that the government is

0:44:56.180 --> 0:44:58.580
<v Speaker 15>kind of cagey about this, the more that we have

0:44:58.620 --> 0:45:01.759
<v Speaker 15>these inexplicable decisions from counter-terror police and others, It's going

0:45:01.780 --> 0:45:03.480
<v Speaker 15>to set more and more hairs running as to what

0:45:03.520 --> 0:45:05.810
<v Speaker 15>the hell went on here. So as much as is possible,

0:45:05.830 --> 0:45:08.109
<v Speaker 15>a bit more openness from the government about what they

0:45:08.150 --> 0:45:10.670
<v Speaker 15>know and what they don't would probably do a lot

0:45:10.690 --> 0:45:12.060
<v Speaker 15>to smooth over concerns over it.

0:45:12.610 --> 0:45:15.830
<v Speaker 2>It's always fascinating to watch what the government in the

0:45:15.989 --> 0:45:18.730
<v Speaker 2>UK want to be open about and what they are

0:45:18.810 --> 0:45:21.469
<v Speaker 2>cagey about. And you learn a lot about their priorities

0:45:21.510 --> 0:45:27.069
<v Speaker 2>and what they... think is important to protect. Taxpayer-funded workshops

0:45:27.390 --> 0:45:30.089
<v Speaker 2>designed to fight Islamophobia are making.

0:45:30.430 --> 0:45:31.720
<v Speaker 3>Some very strange claims.

0:45:31.780 --> 0:45:36.040
<v Speaker 2>A presentation to North Yorkshire Council told staff that Islam's

0:45:36.160 --> 0:45:40.580
<v Speaker 2>attitude to women doesn't conflict with Western values, not at all,

0:45:40.719 --> 0:45:45.020
<v Speaker 2>because Mary, the mother of Jesus, according to this seminar,

0:45:45.620 --> 0:45:48.779
<v Speaker 2>wore a hijab And Jesus had a beard, so there

0:45:48.820 --> 0:45:51.719
<v Speaker 2>you go, he was basically a Muslim. Council staff were

0:45:51.780 --> 0:45:55.120
<v Speaker 2>also told Sharia law was just like Christian doctrine. Tom,

0:45:55.140 --> 0:45:57.600
<v Speaker 2>where do you want to start with this stuff?

0:45:57.640 --> 0:45:59.480
<v Speaker 3>I mean, this is just ridiculous.

0:46:00.880 --> 0:46:02.319
<v Speaker 1>Oh, it is. It's also quite funny.

0:46:02.340 --> 0:46:04.980
<v Speaker 15>If you heard that someone was going around saying that

0:46:05.100 --> 0:46:08.040
<v Speaker 15>there's fundamentally no difference between Islam and Christianity because they've

0:46:08.060 --> 0:46:11.779
<v Speaker 15>also got beards and head coverings potentially. in common is

0:46:11.880 --> 0:46:14.799
<v Speaker 15>such an absurd, almost, some might say, an Islamophobic way

0:46:14.820 --> 0:46:18.000
<v Speaker 15>to talk about this particular issue. There's the rewriting of history,

0:46:18.060 --> 0:46:22.060
<v Speaker 15>the idea that Mary was, in any sense, almost like

0:46:22.100 --> 0:46:24.219
<v Speaker 15>a kind of proto-Muslim woman, despite the fact she was

0:46:24.260 --> 0:46:27.879
<v Speaker 15>walking the earth north of 500 years before Islam. even

0:46:27.920 --> 0:46:30.819
<v Speaker 15>got going just shows how absurd this rewriting history is

0:46:31.469 --> 0:46:33.990
<v Speaker 15>and also this the fundamental point the idea that islam

0:46:34.390 --> 0:46:34.790
<v Speaker 15>hasn't got.

0:46:34.730 --> 0:46:37.990
<v Speaker 1>A problem where misogyny is concerned you need.

0:46:37.950 --> 0:46:41.590
<v Speaker 15>Only look at essentially every muslim majority country where.

0:46:41.350 --> 0:46:43.270
<v Speaker 1>You know at the at the lighter end.

0:46:43.130 --> 0:46:46.930
<v Speaker 15>Women are second-class citizens at the tougher end face horrific

0:46:47.330 --> 0:46:50.870
<v Speaker 15>violence if they stray out of what the morality police

0:46:50.910 --> 0:46:54.210
<v Speaker 15>of that particular nation deemed to be acceptable.

0:46:54.810 --> 0:46:55.380
<v Speaker 1>But the fact.

0:46:55.570 --> 0:46:57.000
<v Speaker 15>I come back to the fact, what this is happening

0:46:57.060 --> 0:46:59.340
<v Speaker 15>in this country is being taxpayer-funded.

0:46:59.900 --> 0:47:00.380
<v Speaker 1>Why?

0:47:00.800 --> 0:47:02.440
<v Speaker 15>If this is about trying to foster a kind of

0:47:02.780 --> 0:47:05.060
<v Speaker 15>multicultural harmony, it strikes me it's going to have the

0:47:05.080 --> 0:47:07.740
<v Speaker 15>exact opposite impact and it's just going to make people

0:47:07.760 --> 0:47:11.310
<v Speaker 15>think this kind of work is just divisive and absurd

0:47:11.350 --> 0:47:11.910
<v Speaker 15>at the same time.

0:47:12.530 --> 0:47:12.890
<v Speaker 3>Indeed.

0:47:12.910 --> 0:47:14.589
<v Speaker 2>All right, before I let you go, Harry and Meghan

0:47:14.610 --> 0:47:18.210
<v Speaker 2>have slammed photographers for lurking around the perimeter of the

0:47:18.290 --> 0:47:20.330
<v Speaker 2>school that they're Kids are attending?

0:47:23.030 --> 0:47:23.710
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, quite.

0:47:23.750 --> 0:47:25.549
<v Speaker 15>I mean, this is one of those things where Harry

0:47:25.590 --> 0:47:28.520
<v Speaker 15>and Meghan, they want to be A-list celebrities, yet they

0:47:28.560 --> 0:47:32.460
<v Speaker 15>don't want any of the unfortunate business that comes with that.

0:47:32.500 --> 0:47:34.840
<v Speaker 15>If they'd have actually stayed in the royal family, if

0:47:34.880 --> 0:47:37.970
<v Speaker 15>they hadn't flounced off so spectacularly, as they would know,

0:47:38.010 --> 0:47:40.230
<v Speaker 15>they would have been guarded against this kind of thing.

0:47:40.250 --> 0:47:41.190
<v Speaker 1>Particularly in Britain.

0:47:41.210 --> 0:47:44.049
<v Speaker 15>There's this kind of agreement between sections of the press

0:47:44.330 --> 0:47:46.670
<v Speaker 15>and the royal family that kids aren't going to be photographed,

0:47:46.690 --> 0:47:48.730
<v Speaker 15>that those things are slightly more... controlled out of a

0:47:48.730 --> 0:47:51.879
<v Speaker 15>sense of kind of deference essentially to the institution but

0:47:51.960 --> 0:47:53.520
<v Speaker 15>you know they want it to be hollywood superstars they're

0:47:53.540 --> 0:47:55.420
<v Speaker 15>going to be treated like hollywood superstars and if they're

0:47:55.440 --> 0:47:57.440
<v Speaker 15>going around especially as they have over the past few

0:47:57.480 --> 0:47:59.859
<v Speaker 15>months just constantly kind of telegraphing their.

0:47:59.800 --> 0:48:02.410
<v Speaker 1>Movements we're moving back to the uk we're probably.

0:48:02.230 --> 0:48:04.069
<v Speaker 15>Going to settle in this kind of area maybe there's

0:48:04.110 --> 0:48:06.490
<v Speaker 15>a film deal in that being filmed in that particular

0:48:06.530 --> 0:48:09.970
<v Speaker 15>area what do you expect when when the global privacy

0:48:10.010 --> 0:48:14.640
<v Speaker 15>tour continues in this sort of fashion uh they can't

0:48:14.680 --> 0:48:16.420
<v Speaker 15>be surprised when people are going to take notice of

0:48:16.460 --> 0:48:17.840
<v Speaker 15>them including the photographers.

0:48:17.700 --> 0:48:20.040
<v Speaker 2>I i got to admit my sympathies are probably with

0:48:20.580 --> 0:48:23.180
<v Speaker 2>uh the sussexes on this one and and everything you

0:48:23.239 --> 0:48:27.040
<v Speaker 2>say is true but at the same time photographers do

0:48:27.100 --> 0:48:29.919
<v Speaker 2>make a decision to uh do that and to bring

0:48:29.940 --> 0:48:32.359
<v Speaker 2>the kids into it when everyone should know they're off

0:48:32.420 --> 0:48:35.379
<v Speaker 2>limits so i don't know on this one i reckon

0:48:35.440 --> 0:48:38.739
<v Speaker 2>i might be in team harry and megan um Gee,

0:48:38.760 --> 0:48:40.460
<v Speaker 2>I hope not many people watch me say that and

0:48:40.500 --> 0:48:41.680
<v Speaker 2>don't remember that.

0:48:41.940 --> 0:48:43.040
<v Speaker 1>There you go.

0:48:43.400 --> 0:48:45.710
<v Speaker 2>Tom, I've got to go. Thanks for catching up tonight.

0:48:46.090 --> 0:48:47.350
<v Speaker 2>That's all I've got time for.

0:48:47.370 --> 0:48:47.770
<v Speaker 3>Stick around.

0:48:47.810 --> 0:48:50.150
<v Speaker 2>Coming up right now hosting the Showery program is my

0:48:50.190 --> 0:48:51.489
<v Speaker 2>good mate, Caleb Bond.