1 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,360 Michael Thompson: Welcome to Ask Fear and Greed, where we answer questions 2 00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:10,600 Michael Thompson: about business, investing, economics, politics and more. I'm Michael Thompson 3 00:00:10,640 --> 00:00:11,840 Michael Thompson: and hello Sean Aylmer. 4 00:00:12,000 --> 00:00:12,640 Sean Aylmer: Hello Michael. 5 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:15,120 Michael Thompson: Sean. Today's question actually combines a few of those that 6 00:00:15,240 --> 00:00:19,079 Michael Thompson: includes politics and economics and housing as well kind of 7 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:23,680 Michael Thompson: comes into this as well. It's about immigration, and obviously 8 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:28,600 Michael Thompson: we've heard a lot about immigration and housing and the 9 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:32,360 Michael Thompson: impact that it has on house prices and infrastructure and 10 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:37,000 Michael Thompson: all of this throughout the election campaign. It has come 11 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:39,839 Michael Thompson: up in each of the election debates as well. All 12 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:43,040 Michael Thompson: boils down to the question for you today, Sean, is 13 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:46,640 Michael Thompson: immigration good or bad for the economy? 14 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:51,839 Sean Aylmer: Ah? Well, probably depends whereabouts you sit in the economy. 15 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:56,800 Sean Aylmer: To be perfectly honest, economists generally say immigration is a 16 00:00:56,840 --> 00:01:00,720 Sean Aylmer: good thing, but it's good for some for others. So 17 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:03,600 Sean Aylmer: let's you mentioned a few things. They're housing. Let's take 18 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:06,520 Sean Aylmer: that because that's one of the arguments that Peter Dutton 19 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:10,560 Sean Aylmer: makes about slowing immigration to help the housing crisis. And 20 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:13,280 Sean Aylmer: there's no doubt fewer people looking for housing in the 21 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:17,039 Sean Aylmer: short term is actually going to help people who you know, 22 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:20,319 Sean Aylmer: sort of locals for one of a better term find 23 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,720 Sean Aylmer: a home, So immigration is bad when you have a 24 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:28,040 Sean Aylmer: housing crisis in the short term. In the short term 25 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:31,520 Sean Aylmer: really important that we add that to it. It's also 26 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:38,120 Sean Aylmer: bad for low paid workers who are trying to kind 27 00:01:38,120 --> 00:01:42,000 Sean Aylmer: of make ends meet, and lots of students come in 28 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:45,720 Sean Aylmer: or immigrants come in and compete for the jobs that 29 00:01:45,720 --> 00:01:51,040 Sean Aylmer: they've got, so that's also potentially a bad thing in 30 00:01:51,120 --> 00:01:55,040 Sean Aylmer: the short term. In the long term, all the economic 31 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:58,520 Sean Aylmer: studies suggest the opposite in the long term and in 32 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:04,120 Sean Aylmer: the medium term actually boosts economic growth. Someone comes into Australia, 33 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:08,920 Sean Aylmer: they spend money, they pay taxes. Maybe the entrepreneurial they'll 34 00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:12,639 Sean Aylmer: start up a food store or something like that. Overall 35 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:17,560 Sean Aylmer: that actually boosts economic output. A lot of immigrants are 36 00:02:17,560 --> 00:02:22,760 Sean Aylmer: incredibly innovative, so they'll bring techniques. Post war, it was 37 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:26,280 Sean Aylmer: the European immigrants. More recent times there's been Asian immigrants 38 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:30,440 Sean Aylmer: who have come and been very entrepreneurial, not just on 39 00:02:30,520 --> 00:02:36,000 Sean Aylmer: their own but within large businesses, but new methodologies to 40 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:38,519 Sean Aylmer: do things really really beneficial. 41 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:42,360 Michael Thompson: And then there's also the skilled migration, where there is 42 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:46,600 Michael Thompson: actually particular skills and occupations and things that are targeted 43 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:49,120 Michael Thompson: for people to come to Australia and help fill a 44 00:02:49,160 --> 00:02:50,239 Michael Thompson: gap that we have here. 45 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:53,880 Sean Aylmer: Right, Yeah, absolutely, and mostly Australian immigration policy has been 46 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:57,160 Sean Aylmer: targeted at skilled immigration in recent years, and so what 47 00:02:57,240 --> 00:03:01,160 Sean Aylmer: we're getting are skilled immigrants doing jobs that locals, for 48 00:03:01,200 --> 00:03:04,480 Sean Aylmer: want a better term, can't do themselves. Now, this is 49 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:07,880 Sean Aylmer: before we get to all the benefits of the multiculturalism 50 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:12,480 Sean Aylmer: and social engagement and kind of connecting with people in 51 00:03:12,520 --> 00:03:15,720 Sean Aylmer: other parts of the world. Things like the aging population. 52 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:19,160 Sean Aylmer: Generally immigrants are younger, so you get more younger people 53 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:21,760 Sean Aylmer: into the country. When you have a country like Australia 54 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,440 Sean Aylmer: where we are aging, more younger people paying taxes is 55 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:29,920 Sean Aylmer: a really good thing. Clearly there's stuff around racism that 56 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:32,919 Sean Aylmer: which is a bad thing, but I think that reflects 57 00:03:33,160 --> 00:03:34,840 Sean Aylmer: locals rather than the immigrants. 58 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:38,640 Michael Thompson: Yeah, it is interesting coming back to the housing thing. 59 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:42,520 Michael Thompson: When we've spoken to Simon kusten Maha, the demographer in 60 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:44,440 Michael Thompson: the past, has talked about this and the fact that 61 00:03:45,040 --> 00:03:47,120 Michael Thompson: when you have people coming into the country that there 62 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:53,200 Michael Thompson: is a very clearly observed trend for new arrivals to 63 00:03:53,240 --> 00:03:56,280 Michael Thompson: settle closer to the center of the city and then 64 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:58,400 Michael Thompson: it just kind of takes that part in that cycle. 65 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:03,040 Michael Thompson: Then people moving out into the suburbs as they start 66 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,880 Michael Thompson: families and things, which is then why there is this 67 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:10,720 Michael Thompson: perception of pushing people out, I suppose of the housing 68 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:12,880 Michael Thompson: market in the inner city, which is again kind of 69 00:04:12,880 --> 00:04:16,120 Michael Thompson: then leads us into the housing debate and the importance 70 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:19,599 Michael Thompson: of higher density in city centers and in suburbs as well, 71 00:04:19,600 --> 00:04:21,120 Michael Thompson: in order just to make sure that there is room 72 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:23,760 Michael Thompson: for everyone and the infrastructure around us to support them all. 73 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:26,520 Sean Aylmer: Yeah, And I think the point there housing is the 74 00:04:26,560 --> 00:04:28,560 Sean Aylmer: tricky one in the short term because when you get 75 00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:31,239 Sean Aylmer: a lot more people coming in you've got a housing crisis. Well, 76 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:33,920 Sean Aylmer: then you've definitely got some problems on your hand when 77 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:36,760 Sean Aylmer: you have lots of immigration. And that's what Peter Dutton's arguing, 78 00:04:36,839 --> 00:04:40,440 Sean Aylmer: and he's correct, you know, arguing that, but very very 79 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:43,280 Sean Aylmer: much a short term issue rather than long term, because 80 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:45,120 Sean Aylmer: in the long term, more people in your economy, the 81 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:45,720 Sean Aylmer: better things are. 82 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:47,880 Michael Thompson: Yeah, and these are big numbers as well. We're talking 83 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:50,599 Michael Thompson: because the Coalition I think is proposing to lower permanent 84 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:53,200 Michael Thompson: migration from one hundred and eighty five thousand people in 85 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:56,359 Michael Thompson: twenty four to twenty five to one hundred and forty 86 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:59,680 Michael Thompson: in twenty five twenty six, and then permanent migration would 87 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:02,039 Michael Thompson: increase after that. These are it is a lot of 88 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:05,600 Michael Thompson: people and there it does have a very significant kind 89 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:10,080 Michael Thompson: of flow on effect. So in conclusion, we've settled that, yes, 90 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:13,719 Michael Thompson: it is important for the economy. It just depends on 91 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:15,919 Michael Thompson: where you are in the economy as to whether it 92 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:17,800 Michael Thompson: has a positive or a negative effect on you. Is 93 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:18,200 Michael Thompson: that right? 94 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,359 Sean Aylmer: I'm going to give further. I think immigration is a 95 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:24,320 Sean Aylmer: great thing. Yeah, I think the more the merrier. I do, though, 96 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:28,599 Sean Aylmer: appreciate that depending where you are in the economy, it 97 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:31,200 Sean Aylmer: can certainly have negative short term effects. 98 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,240 Michael Thompson: Okay, all right, well answered, Thank you Sean, Thank you Michael. Remember, 99 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:36,720 Michael Thompson: if you've got something that you would like to know them, 100 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:40,640 Michael Thompson: please send through your question on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, or 101 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:43,839 Michael Thompson: at fearangreed dot com dot au. I'm Michael Thompson and 102 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:45,239 Michael Thompson: this ask Fear and Greed