Speaker 1: Live on Sky News.
Speaker 2: This is Sharry.
Speaker 3: Good Evening and welcome to the program.
Speaker 4: I'm Danikiti Giorgio filling in this evening for Sharry markson
Speaker 4: coming up on the program. The father who broke down
Speaker 4: on National TV over the housing crisis camps outside the
Speaker 4: PM's cliff top mansion. Everyone deserves a home, albow is
Speaker 4: what he's saying.
Speaker 3: Got to say.
Speaker 4: It's hard to argue with that. The climate wars are
Speaker 4: back done in an elbow. Pressed on whether climate change
Speaker 4: has triggered recent natural disasters?
Speaker 3: Is this what voters seriously care about right now?
Speaker 4: The negative gearing stoush that's dominated the day's headlines.
Speaker 3: Can't wrap your head around what all the fuss is about?
Speaker 4: Will walk you through it, Plus will go live to
Speaker 4: the UK where JK. Rowling is celebrating after a landmark
Speaker 4: UK Court decision said a woman is someone born biologically female.
Speaker 4: But first tonight, voters in this election are more disillusioned
Speaker 4: than ever now. The election campaign is about to enter
Speaker 4: alull over the Easter long weekend, followed by Anzac Day
Speaker 4: next week, which leaves about eight days until election day.
Speaker 3: At the end of all that, and what does it mean?
Speaker 4: Well, voters are largely tuned out because they're on holidays,
Speaker 4: and you mix that in with pre polling opening on Tuesday,
Speaker 4: and it doesn't really leave a lot of time to
Speaker 4: convince undecided voters, and the polls show there are a.
Speaker 3: Lot of them.
Speaker 4: But the question remains, does the average voter right now
Speaker 4: care or even know about the policies on the table
Speaker 4: from the major parties now? The latest polls show that
Speaker 4: Labor is headed for a minority, which is obviously a
Speaker 4: disaster for this country. But I think there's a real
Speaker 4: messaging problem this election campaign and from both sides, because
Speaker 4: voters don't like Albo, but.
Speaker 3: They don't seem to know enough about Dutton either. Still,
Speaker 3: and the.
Speaker 4: Easter long weekend is bad timing for the opposition already
Speaker 4: on the back foot, and Peter Dunnan issued this plea
Speaker 4: to voters today.
Speaker 5: I hope that over Easter people are able to have
Speaker 5: a conversation parents, to grandparents and to grandchildren about what
Speaker 5: the next three years will look like. If mister Elbanezi
Speaker 5: and mister Bant are elected, it will be a sliding
Speaker 5: doors moment for our country, an end to negative gearing,
Speaker 5: higher taxes, higher spending, higher interest rates, the reality of
Speaker 5: the last three years and how hard it's been and
Speaker 5: it doesn't need.
Speaker 1: To be like this.
Speaker 4: And absolutely he's right because labor has left us broke
Speaker 4: and backwards in the last three years. But compare this
Speaker 4: to Anthony alb and Easy today whose glass jaw was well,
Speaker 4: it was on full display yet again as his lies
Speaker 4: were exposed.
Speaker 5: Do you pull out meeting the greens demands on negative
Speaker 5: gearing if you have to.
Speaker 6: Negotiate it, I reel out negotiating with the Greens. That's
Speaker 6: even further for you. I have responded that lots of times.
Speaker 3: Again we get answer.
Speaker 6: We have our housing policy that we are taking forward
Speaker 6: the Greens. I am not negotiating with the Greens. We
Speaker 6: make it very clear. And what's more, the Greens have
Speaker 6: said the one negotiable, theat non negotiable thing that they have,
Speaker 6: by the way, is that they want to support Peter Dutton.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: And this is the issue with this Prime Minister because
Speaker 4: he gets testy and angry when asked questions that he
Speaker 4: simply doesn't like.
Speaker 3: Of course he doesn't want to talk about the.
Speaker 4: Greens because he knows he needs them. There are about
Speaker 4: fourteen seats in this election that are still too close
Speaker 4: to call, and I think it says a lot about
Speaker 4: where he's at because there's only one topic that we
Speaker 4: know he's comfortable.
Speaker 7: With, Peter Dutton.
Speaker 6: Peter Dunt, Peter Dutton, Peter Dutton, Peter Dutton.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it is always about Peter Dutton, isn't it. He's
Speaker 4: so obsessed with Peter Dutton or everything else that really
Speaker 4: actually has nothing to do with the cost of living crisis,
Speaker 4: not housing, not bringing power bills down by two hundred
Speaker 4: and seventy five dollars, not immigration, not security, not defense,
Speaker 4: not anti semitism, and overall I did think that Peter
Speaker 4: Dutton was the stronger performer in the leader's debate last night.
Speaker 4: He was fired up, he was on message, he caught
Speaker 4: elbow on the hop for his lies, and was straight
Speaker 4: to the point on the cost of living crisis.
Speaker 3: But there were no knockout blows.
Speaker 4: And this is the problem right now in this campaign
Speaker 4: because quite frankly, the campaign is boring, it is dull,
Speaker 4: and it's been largely unengaging for undecided voters and is
Speaker 4: reflecting in the polls. Swing and soft voters are the
Speaker 4: cohort who decide elections. And this time around there are
Speaker 4: more of that group than ever before, and Labour's support
Speaker 4: remains much softer than the coalitions more than half of
Speaker 4: its voters, so fifty seven percent say they were only
Speaker 4: soft or leaning toward Labor, compared to thirty eight percent
Speaker 4: of the Liberal and National Party's vote. So it really
Speaker 4: makes interpreting the poll numbers more difficult. But that is
Speaker 4: the cohort that Peter Dutton must now convince because these
Speaker 4: are the voters that can indeed be persuaded.
Speaker 3: And the question is what messages from the leaders.
Speaker 4: Are actually sticking and how many people actually know what
Speaker 4: is on offer. Last night's debate on the Public Broadcaster
Speaker 4: unfortunately largely focused on overseas issues, and the media today
Speaker 4: chose to focus on negative gearing. Now Alberizi is so
Speaker 4: confused on this he couldn't give a straight answer to
Speaker 4: the question about whether he modeled to scrap negative gearing,
Speaker 4: and obviously it's important that his lies are exposed. But
Speaker 4: the reality is is that mum and dad, who are
Speaker 4: struggling at home to put food on the table, I
Speaker 4: would say probably could not give a rats.
Speaker 3: About negative gearing right now.
Speaker 4: It is not the story and This was, in my view,
Speaker 4: the key takeaway from that debate which should worry us all.
Speaker 4: When Anthony Alberzi was asked multiple times when he would
Speaker 4: bring power bills.
Speaker 8: Down, When will we see our power bills come down?
Speaker 6: They are well, what we know is that renewables are
Speaker 6: the cheapest form of power, not because of what we say,
Speaker 6: but because of what the Australian Energy Market operator says
Speaker 6: when the bills come down, and what the market is delivering. See,
Speaker 6: Peter has to have government, state, taxpayer funded. We stick
Speaker 6: with your taxpayer funded, taxpayer funded proposals. What we're dealing
Speaker 6: with here. During the former government, twenty four out of
Speaker 6: twenty eight coal fire power stations announce their closure. We
Speaker 6: need to get supply and certain in energy security. We
Speaker 6: can't wait till the twenty forties a nuclear.
Speaker 8: Just stick with your plan, mister Albinezy, When will the
Speaker 8: bills come down under our plan?
Speaker 6: We know that renewables are the cheapest form of power
Speaker 6: and that is why we are doing that, rolling it out,
Speaker 6: including through gas. Peter Ray's gas gas is now thirteen dollars,
Speaker 6: was thirty dollars. And when we catch cheap when we
Speaker 6: kind off thirteen is cheaper than thirty.
Speaker 8: When do we see the bills come down?
Speaker 3: How many more times do you need to be asked?
Speaker 4: And the answer, oh, thirteen is cheaper than thirty, Well,
Speaker 4: how about two hundred and seventy five dollars? Prime Minister?
Speaker 4: How many times does he need to deflect and dodge?
Speaker 4: What is the question of the election? And this just
Speaker 4: shows Albow seriously has no idea about the cost of
Speaker 4: living crisis, has no idea how to bring power bills down,
Speaker 4: and has no plans to keep the lights on in
Speaker 4: this country and clearly is dead set on plunging us
Speaker 4: into darkness through this renewables only fantasy. Three years ago
Speaker 4: Albow pledged ninety seven times to bring our power bills
Speaker 4: down by two hundred and seventy five dollars.
Speaker 3: We haven't had that relief.
Speaker 4: Instead, power bills have risen by thirteen hundred dollars and
Speaker 4: the Energy market Operator says bills will rise by nine
Speaker 4: percent from July. And that should be enough to make
Speaker 4: Albo a one term. That should have been the focus
Speaker 4: today and this is the message the Coalition needs to
Speaker 4: keep hammering. But as I said, the messaging fills off
Speaker 4: in this campaign. Voters are disengaged and both sides are
Speaker 4: struggling big time with their primary vote. Now, look, I've
Speaker 4: got to say, I think it's got a lot to
Speaker 4: do with the largely controlled settings in which we are
Speaker 4: seeing these leaders in these debates, which are tightly controlled,
Speaker 4: the type press conferences in certain areas long gone. Are
Speaker 4: these days, for example, when you actually see their leaders,
Speaker 4: they're out and about, out in the real world. You
Speaker 4: can't miss these sorts of opportunities when they're out and about,
Speaker 4: and that's how you engage with the real voters. That's
Speaker 4: how you meet the people, that is how you gauge
Speaker 4: the sentiment, and that is how you put your election
Speaker 4: commitments on the front page of the papers. But now
Speaker 4: they're trying to avoid any bad moments and not to
Speaker 4: mention the heightened security. It's all very fake in control
Speaker 4: right now, and it's certainly not going to win over
Speaker 4: the undercided voter in what is a boring campaign. And
Speaker 4: to those who are already confused by the major parties,
Speaker 4: do voters care about the policies or they're easter break
Speaker 4: right now?
Speaker 3: And I think we know the answer.
Speaker 4: Joining us now is Sky News contributor Gary Hardgrave and.
Speaker 3: WA opposition leader Basil Zemplus. Great to have you.
Speaker 4: Both on the show tonight. Thank you so much for
Speaker 4: joining me.
Speaker 3: Gary.
Speaker 4: Look, as I just said, there is a massive soft
Speaker 4: vote right now, one that we haven't seen in many,
Speaker 4: many elections in recent memory. There are a lot of
Speaker 4: undecided voters. Can Peter Dutton get them on side with
Speaker 4: really not a lot of time to go because of
Speaker 4: the public holidays we've got coming up, Deniga.
Speaker 9: The shocking thing is that one in five voters walk
Speaker 9: into a polling booth on a polling day, pick up
Speaker 9: the pencil and say, I don't quite know. So you know,
Speaker 9: there's nothing unusual in this. I've been through multiple federal
Speaker 9: election campaigns over since I was fourteen, so over the
Speaker 9: last fifty years, and these things are getting drawn out
Speaker 9: and tedious in the minds of good people like you,
Speaker 9: and understandably so. But a lot of people still don't
Speaker 9: make their mind up until the last minute. Look, this
Speaker 9: weekend is important for millions, in fact, billions of people
Speaker 9: around the world. This is the weekend of the resurrection.
Speaker 9: This is what people want to talk about this weekend.
Speaker 9: So I'm praying for a political resurrection as well for
Speaker 9: the Liberal Party campaign, because we have to have people
Speaker 9: look very closely at the one question, and that is
Speaker 9: are you better off than you were three years ago?
Speaker 9: Simple answer, no. You talk about the two hundred and
Speaker 9: seventy five dollars off your bill, that's each power bill.
Speaker 9: I don't know what it's like where you are, but
Speaker 9: where I am in Queensland quarterly bills. So there's been
Speaker 9: a dozen of them that I haven't had any relief on.
Speaker 9: As you say, the price has gone up, I am not.
Speaker 9: No one is better off than they were three years ago.
Speaker 9: And the Prime Minister's oblivious to this. It's double talk,
Speaker 9: it's spin, it's controlled, it's rubbish. And Peter Dunn't is
Speaker 9: not Albow that is actually the biggest thing going for
Speaker 9: him in the minds of a hell of a lot
Speaker 9: of people. Albo's got to go. We'll just see what
Speaker 9: happens whether the miracle of Easter transposes into the political world.
Speaker 4: Well, hopefully for that resurrection. As you just said, you're right.
Speaker 4: And the problem is is that voters don't like Albo.
Speaker 4: He is lied one too many times. But on the
Speaker 4: other end, they don't really know a lot about Peter
Speaker 4: dunn't either, and.
Speaker 3: Basil, this is why it's reflecting in the polling.
Speaker 4: Why do you think that parties are struggling so much
Speaker 4: with their primary votes and why is that soft vote
Speaker 4: so big this time?
Speaker 2: Yeah, hard to know him for sure, but clearly there
Speaker 2: is a level of disengagement. And I do agree with
Speaker 2: you the stop start natured of this campaign. Firstly the
Speaker 2: natural disaster that put a stop and put a stop
Speaker 2: to the first start, and then clearly this long weekend
Speaker 2: and then the ANZAC day long weekend, it hasn't been
Speaker 2: particularly useful for people to get their momentum up. There
Speaker 2: is no doubt that the fuel saving has been the
Speaker 2: one big announcement, if you like, from the Liberal and
Speaker 2: coalition that has made a difference and has resonated. And
Speaker 2: so I wonder over the eight days that remain, might
Speaker 2: Peter Dutton go to another measure like that or might
Speaker 2: he have something like that ready to pull out because
Speaker 2: it is going to take something like that, There's no
Speaker 2: doubt the coalition.
Speaker 3: Of the underdogs.
Speaker 4: I agree, and I really like Peter Dutton's messaging on
Speaker 4: that today he said very firmly in his press conference
Speaker 4: he said we're.
Speaker 3: Going to save you money. And with the money that
Speaker 3: we're going to save.
Speaker 4: You, you can go out and you can put it
Speaker 4: towards your groceries. And I just thought that that was
Speaker 4: a really, really smart line. We need to hear more
Speaker 4: of that short, simple and smart messaging.
Speaker 3: But look, let's move on.
Speaker 4: Because a Sydney dad of three kids who recently broke
Speaker 4: down on Q and A about the dire state of
Speaker 4: cost of living and housing, well, he's decided to camp
Speaker 4: outside Albow Mansion and have a look at this.
Speaker 10: I'm here at Elbows four and a half a million
Speaker 10: dollar mansion just during down his one hundred million dollar road.
Speaker 10: We're here on behalf of three and a half a
Speaker 10: million other Australians who are struggling, who are in poverty,
Speaker 10: facing homelessness. All we want is to be heard. All
Speaker 10: we want is for the politicians to listen to us.
Speaker 10: Everybody deserves a home Albow. If you're watching this, if
Speaker 10: you could go to cost of Living Casualties dot com
Speaker 10: dot au and just tell us your story, we'd love
Speaker 10: to hear it, and we'd love to pass it on
Speaker 10: to some of those politicians and just let them know
Speaker 10: how we're really struggling. And I just hope that we
Speaker 10: can make this country a better place to live.
Speaker 4: And on Q and A last month, when he broke
Speaker 4: down about his situation, have a look at these we've got.
Speaker 8: Nowhere to go.
Speaker 10: My family's already been forced out of Sydney for the
Speaker 10: same reasons. I want to know, is the government going
Speaker 10: to cut immigration to match housing availability or are we
Speaker 10: just going to keep going until every regular working Australian
Speaker 10: is homeless.
Speaker 4: You're former treasure Gary, what does it take for Anthony
Speaker 4: Arbernezi to actually answer this question? Because nobody ever voted
Speaker 4: for a big Australia, Yet here we are a big Australia.
Speaker 4: More than one million migrants have come into this country
Speaker 4: and you've got genuine people out there like this man
Speaker 4: who want to know how he's going to get himself
Speaker 4: into housing.
Speaker 3: It's a question he must answer.
Speaker 9: And he's right because that's what Peter Dutton said. Let's
Speaker 9: actually bring in the migrants to match the housing we've
Speaker 9: got available, not try and play catch up. One point
Speaker 9: eight million people are forecast to come to Australia the
Speaker 9: next three years if Albow and the Greens are returned.
Speaker 9: Simple as that one point eight million people. Now, I'm
Speaker 9: all for migration, but we've got a planet in a
Speaker 9: way that we don't create resentment amongst those of us
Speaker 9: who've been here for a longer period of time. And
Speaker 9: that's the problem to niaque. For what purpose is our migration?
Speaker 9: Are we going to bring in the trade skills? We
Speaker 9: need to build the houses before we bring in the
Speaker 9: people who are going to live in the houses. These
Speaker 9: are questions the Prime Minister doesn't want to answer. I
Speaker 9: mean equally, you know, I don't believe at Elbows million
Speaker 9: dollar mansion that this chappy is outside of and good
Speaker 9: on him for doing that. I don't believe he's going
Speaker 9: to get a wind turbine there. And yet people all
Speaker 9: along the Morton Bay coastline, in and around southeast Queensland,
Speaker 9: all along central Queensland, in and around the Darling Downs
Speaker 9: are putting up with these dreadful industrialized wind turbines twenty
Speaker 9: five million dollars a unit, ripping down trees, killing Kohala
Speaker 9: is displacing them all for this renewable rubbish which is
Speaker 9: going to produce about a half of one percent of
Speaker 9: electricity for Queensland. This governor has lost its way. It's
Speaker 9: on the wrong track. It's pretty simple.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's pretty simple. It is.
Speaker 4: When you've got people like this who are forced to
Speaker 4: camp out basil outside of the mansion, you know, it's
Speaker 4: a pretty major indictment on the state.
Speaker 3: Of our times.
Speaker 2: Well it is, and it's an indictment on Labour's housing policy,
Speaker 2: which clearly has not delivered the new homes that it
Speaker 2: said it would. On the messaging like that and the
Speaker 2: amp out and the big sign out the front, I'm
Speaker 2: not doubting the authenticity of it. There's certainly great sympathy
Speaker 2: I think from people right around Australia for anybody who
Speaker 2: finds themselves in that situation. I'm not certain though, if
Speaker 2: it has a major impact on either.
Speaker 3: Of our political leaders.
Speaker 2: And I think those things, although well intentioned, as I say,
Speaker 2: probably very genuine, I'm not sure that they make their
Speaker 2: mark in terms of what they're trying to achieve. There
Speaker 2: is a mechanical failure with our housing policy.
Speaker 3: That's what needs to be fixed.
Speaker 2: And although that brings some attention to the issue, I
Speaker 2: wonder whether it really penetrates.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's certainly a fair comment.
Speaker 4: Let's talk about Peter Dutton's this eleventh hour pledge he's
Speaker 4: made and aspiration to tackle that dreaded bracket creep will
Speaker 4: obviously universally resent.
Speaker 3: Here is what he told the Australian newspaper.
Speaker 5: I want to see us move as quickly as we
Speaker 5: can as a country to changes around personal income tax,
Speaker 5: including indexation. It would be an aspiration of it government
Speaker 5: to achieve that because it provides equity in the tax
Speaker 5: system and it's costly to do so. Some of the
Speaker 5: figures are well over ten billion dollars a year in
Speaker 5: terms of the cost of the budget for that measure,
Speaker 5: and it's not realistic to be able to.
Speaker 8: Commit to that now.
Speaker 4: Gary, I think this is a really bold policy. It's
Speaker 4: about time we had some big vision policy on the table.
Speaker 4: But I guess the other thing is is that is
Speaker 4: it too little too late? I mean, why not say
Speaker 4: this at the start of the campaign? Why say it
Speaker 4: halfway through? Because this election is coming up very quickly
Speaker 4: on May third?
Speaker 3: What's the strategy here?
Speaker 9: And voting starts Tuesday for a lot of people and
Speaker 9: can't come soon enough for plenty of others.
Speaker 3: Look, this is what we did and how it is.
Speaker 9: We paid down Labour's debt. We reminisce now about the
Speaker 9: ninety three billion dollar debt that we inherited in nineteen
Speaker 9: ninety six, So if it was only that small now
Speaker 9: and then we got on to structural reform. Peter Dutton's
Speaker 9: experience in this he was in the ministry working with
Speaker 9: Peter Costello. A lot of this structural reform around the
Speaker 9: tax system, bringing down the absolute amount of tax we're
Speaker 9: paying is really critical. Yes, the GSD came in, but
Speaker 9: personal income tax then gives you the choice to spend
Speaker 9: it as you see fit. You pay tax on that
Speaker 9: consumption and that system. No one is complaining about that anymore,
Speaker 9: and nor should they, because this actually rewards effort. We
Speaker 9: should be earning and keeping more of our money. If
Speaker 9: we want to work harder, work longer, then we should
Speaker 9: be able to keep more of that money. And that's
Speaker 9: the sort of stuff that that that's talking about. And
Speaker 9: I think a lot of people will say, how bloody
Speaker 9: Loujah I reckon?
Speaker 4: Really, well, well, we've needed a conversation like this. We
Speaker 4: yet to have one. Basil, do you think that this
Speaker 4: will resonate with voters?
Speaker 2: I think it will. It's been a sort of a
Speaker 2: cautious and measured approach, hasn't it. Peter Dutton's messaging around
Speaker 2: this has been we've got a fixed labors mess First,
Speaker 2: we've got to restore the budget. Once we've got the
Speaker 2: budget restored, then we will certainly have a look at
Speaker 2: bracket creep because it's holding back entrepreneur it's holding back productivity.
Speaker 2: So I think it's been smart baby steps, get the
Speaker 2: basics fixed and then move to it, but still acknowledging
Speaker 2: that there is some ambition in what they want to do.
Speaker 2: So smart. I think it will resonate. Will it resonate
Speaker 2: with enough? That's going to be the question.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and especially as you said, with pre poll opening
Speaker 4: on Tuesday.
Speaker 3: Now, look, let's talk about the Teals.
Speaker 4: Obviously, the Liberals are going back after those traditionally blue
Speaker 4: ribbon seats that they lost to the Seals, back to
Speaker 4: the Teals back in twenty twenty two. But nine newspapers
Speaker 4: today revealed that voters are being targeted by so called
Speaker 4: push pole calls being conducted by Climate two hundred.
Speaker 3: Imagine getting that one.
Speaker 4: Here's one spooking Zoey Daniels and Goldstein have a listen.
Speaker 11: Since being elected your independent member, Zoe Daniel has advocated.
Speaker 12: For long term economic reform.
Speaker 11: Protecting the environment, for teacher generations, and for me to
Speaker 11: be more compassion and integrity in politics. It's about Zoe Daniel.
Speaker 11: If a federal election was held today, who would receive
Speaker 11: your first preference vote?
Speaker 3: Gary, I would have to hang up the phone.
Speaker 4: If I answered and that was on the other end
Speaker 4: of the line, I'd hang up. But you know, last
Speaker 4: time I checked, that's not what a pole typically sounds like.
Speaker 9: Look, yeah, and I get polder like anybody else, I
Speaker 9: guess from time to time. Look, this is the American
Speaker 9: style politics that Anthony Albert Easy claims the Liberals are
Speaker 9: bringing to Australia. In fact, it's the Labor Party Left
Speaker 9: and the pseudo Greens, including the Greens. I mean the
Speaker 9: Teals are Greens in fancy clothing. These people are working
Speaker 9: as a Troyka Labor, the Teals and the Greens, anything
Speaker 9: to stop Peter Dutton and to change of the track
Speaker 9: Australia is on. So they're bringing these American style approaches
Speaker 9: to this sort of stuff, and I think a lot
Speaker 9: of people are over it. You know, they just actually
Speaker 9: want strong advocates for their area in the Parliament. Wouldn't
Speaker 9: it be great if we had one hundred and fifty
Speaker 9: of them in the House of Reps. That's what we
Speaker 9: would like. And I don't think they need to be
Speaker 9: as tricky as they're trying to be. But they're well
Speaker 9: cashed up and there's a lot of money floating in
Speaker 9: from I think overseas into a lot of this as well.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and also, Basil.
Speaker 4: The call also asks if the constituent would be more
Speaker 4: likely to give their vote to the coalition if the
Speaker 4: L and P distance itself from this.
Speaker 3: Take a listen.
Speaker 11: To what extent do you agree or disagree with the
Speaker 11: following statement. I would be more likely to vote for
Speaker 11: the Liberal Party if a distance itself from the National
Speaker 11: Party and the extreme agenda of its MPs like Barnaby
Speaker 11: Joyce and Matt Cannavan who are posed taking action on
Speaker 11: climate change and want to roll back abortion rates.
Speaker 3: Please, seriously, Basil, correspond to that.
Speaker 2: Well, I leave in one of those seats. I live
Speaker 2: in the federal electorate of Curtain. Tom White is taking
Speaker 2: on Kate Cheney, so I see it play out in
Speaker 2: my letterbox every day. Tom White, by his own admissions,
Speaker 2: is in a real battle. It's very very close, no
Speaker 2: guarantee which way it will go. Both could win the
Speaker 2: seat of Curtin. What I will say is the independence
Speaker 2: the Teals. They claim that one of their monikers is
Speaker 2: doing politics differently. In fact, I think they just do
Speaker 2: politics the way that it's done really well in lots
Speaker 2: of places around the world. But you could argue they
Speaker 2: do it better than the major parties in terms of
Speaker 2: all of the tricks, all of the tactics and all
Speaker 2: of the sorts of things that we've just heard over
Speaker 2: the last few minutes. So they don't really do it differently.
Speaker 2: They know how to play the game and they probably
Speaker 2: play it just about as well as anyone. I will
Speaker 2: say this, I think their nimbleness. I think the fact
Speaker 2: that they are operating largely as individuals but still with
Speaker 2: that coalition of finances behind them enables them to do
Speaker 2: these things just about as well as anybody.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think you're absolutely spot on on that. Basil
Speaker 4: zemplus Gary Hargrave. Nice to speak to you both. Thank
Speaker 4: you so much for jeving me on the Happy East.
Speaker 3: Thank you haabe well.
Speaker 4: Albansi or Dutton, who won last night's leader's debate on
Speaker 4: the ABC. Both had moments of victory and defeat. But
Speaker 4: for me, as I said earlier, the real crux of
Speaker 4: the debate was energy, and I think that that should
Speaker 4: have been the focus today from the media, but it wasn't.
Speaker 3: And that's fine. Negative gearing is important. But here was
Speaker 3: Anthony Alberanesi's ducking and weaving, and I want to play
Speaker 3: it again because it's the.
Speaker 4: Same nothing to see here style response to what is
Speaker 4: a pretty straightforward question, when will power bills start to fall?
Speaker 6: Our plan? We know that renewables are the cheapest form
Speaker 6: of power and that is why we are doing that,
Speaker 6: rolling it out, including through gas Peter Rat's gas. Gas
Speaker 6: is now thirteen dollars. It was thirty dollars and when
Speaker 6: we came when we came off, thirteen is cheaper than.
Speaker 8: When do we see the bills come down?
Speaker 6: Well, what we need to do is to roll out
Speaker 6: renewable to make sure there's energy security, make sure it's
Speaker 6: backed up by batteries, by hydro and by gas.
Speaker 4: Joiny now is National Senator Matt Canavan. Good to see you, Matt,
Speaker 4: Thank you so much for joining me. Look here we
Speaker 4: go again and again OLBO fails to prosecute the case
Speaker 4: for his fanciful renewables only fantasy.
Speaker 3: And who is he kidding here?
Speaker 4: How many more times can he lie about the fact
Speaker 4: that our bills have gone in the other direction?
Speaker 1: Well, look, I think the Australian people have realized that
Speaker 1: that they can't trust the word of Anthony Albanezi. He
Speaker 1: did promise almost one hundred times to cut your power
Speaker 1: bills by two hundred and seventy five dollars in his
Speaker 1: first term, and now he won't even say whether your
Speaker 1: bills are going to go up, down or sideways. Obviously,
Speaker 1: given his promises three years ago, and given him saying
Speaker 1: that renewables are the cheapest form ofst power, the question
Speaker 1: must be asked is why won't he be able to
Speaker 1: say they go down? I mean, if renewable energy is
Speaker 1: so cheap, why can't he commit that by building more
Speaker 1: of it as he wants to, your power bills will
Speaker 1: go down.
Speaker 13: And this.
Speaker 1: Conundrum at the center of Anthony Alberanze's re election campaign
Speaker 1: really goes to the heart of what his government has
Speaker 1: been struggling the last few years. As you say, I
Speaker 1: think cost of living energy, it's the only game in town.
Speaker 1: That's what everybody basically talks to you on the street.
Speaker 1: Whether I'm here in long Reach in Western Queensland people
Speaker 1: talk about that, or in even inner city seats in
Speaker 1: Brisbane and Sydney they talk about the cost of living.
Speaker 1: Everybody in this country is struggling because this government has
Speaker 1: failed to deliver on their promises, fail to deliver lower
Speaker 1: energy prices, and those high energy costs are flowing through
Speaker 1: to the cost of everything, including ultimately our interest rates
Speaker 1: because we don't if we don't look after inflation, interest
Speaker 1: rates go up to Yeah.
Speaker 4: Absolutely, it is the conversation of the election campaign. You know,
Speaker 4: We've got reporters out there every day asking what are
Speaker 4: you most concerned about, and it's always cost of living
Speaker 4: and it's always power bills when they are the key
Speaker 4: issues of this campaign that the messaging needs to be there, Matt.
Speaker 4: The Opposition was forced to apologize last night over this
Speaker 4: Russian base saga.
Speaker 3: Here is what he said.
Speaker 5: You said the Indonesian president had publicly announced this Russian
Speaker 5: request when he had not, So was that a mistake.
Speaker 5: It was a mistake and I'm happy to a bit
Speaker 5: what we got from the Indonesian authorities in the reports
Speaker 5: and the Prime Minister commited on these reports yesterday as
Speaker 5: well was that the sources inside the Proboo government confirmed
Speaker 5: that that was the case.
Speaker 4: Look, I still think that Peter Dutton was right to
Speaker 4: be strong on this from the beginning. I mean, if
Speaker 4: there is indeed a threat to our national security, then
Speaker 4: we need to be able to respond accordingly. But what
Speaker 4: is your thoughts on how Peter Dutton dealt with those developments.
Speaker 1: Well, Peter can accept the truth and there are a
Speaker 1: lot of reports going around. Some of those reports proved
Speaker 1: to be mistaken yesterday. But what is much worse is
Speaker 1: the minimization of the risk of this country of the
Speaker 1: current government in their attempt to throw shade at the
Speaker 1: opposition leader. I mean, what we do know here is
Speaker 1: that Russian and Indonesia have been going growing close together.
Speaker 1: It seems strange to me that the Prime Minister sorry
Speaker 1: hasn't been able to admit that while Indonesia just a
Speaker 1: couple of months ago joined the Bricks Coalition that's the Brazil, Russia, India,
Speaker 1: China and South Africa coalition, which is generally seen to
Speaker 1: be aligned against US interests, a month later, we now
Speaker 1: have these reports or we have reports that a month later,
Speaker 1: Russia was asking to base military aircraft just at fourteen
Speaker 1: hundred klmeters north of Darwin. And so clearly there are
Speaker 1: some issues here developing or to our north and the
Speaker 1: bigger issue for our countries. It doesn't seem it's hard
Speaker 1: to see how the Albanezi governments in any way responded
Speaker 1: to that high threat. They or changed geo political environment.
Speaker 1: They've cut defense spending, they haven't proceeded with the purchase
Speaker 1: of joint strike fighter aircraft, and they've actually sat by
Speaker 1: idly and let Indonesia steal our major, key critical minerals issues.
Speaker 1: And another promise that Anthony Albernezi has made on top
Speaker 1: of his broken promise and energy, was to kick start
Speaker 1: critical minerals in this country. Well, under his watch, we've
Speaker 1: lost our entire nickel industry, one of the key critical
Speaker 1: minerals in electric car batteries, lots of other technologies. We've
Speaker 1: lost almost our whole nickel industry because we've been sitting
Speaker 1: back while Indonesia builds coal fired powerstations with Chinese finance,
Speaker 1: and Anthony Alberanzi consigns our industry or handcuffs them to
Speaker 1: a green agenda, which increases their costs and we've lost
Speaker 1: the market share, lost three thousand jobs in our country.
Speaker 1: That should be the focus of the government. That to
Speaker 1: me is a much bigger issue this sasaga this week.
Speaker 1: It's not what whoever says here and there over twenty
Speaker 1: four hours. It's how we respond to this changed year
Speaker 1: political environment over the years ahead. And I don't think
Speaker 1: the current government has proven that it's got a strong hand,
Speaker 1: a strong focus on that for the security of our nation.
Speaker 3: No, I completely agree with you.
Speaker 4: I mean, look what happened when the Chinese warships were
Speaker 4: conducting live fire drills off the co of our country.
Speaker 4: You know, a couple of weeks ago, there was this
Speaker 4: strange back and forth between Pennywong, Richard Marles and Anthony Abernezi,
Speaker 4: and nobody actually knew what was going on.
Speaker 3: When it's a.
Speaker 4: Matter of national security, it's the same old saga each time.
Speaker 4: Matt Canavan, good to catch up with you. Thank you
Speaker 4: so much for joining me on the show this evening.
Speaker 4: We'll stay with us after the break. I'm packing today's
Speaker 4: negative gearing, stoush, the hurling of insults, somatic word games.
Speaker 3: What is the world all about?
Speaker 4: Stay with us plus exclusive polling reveals Labor minority governments likely,
Speaker 4: but there is there a chance the coalition could turn
Speaker 4: this around.
Speaker 3: That's next. Welcome back.
Speaker 4: Well, one thing that the leader's debate really exposed last
Speaker 4: night was Anthony Albanesi's lies and it is a saga
Speaker 4: that has dominated the headlines today, the negative gearing stoush
Speaker 4: that's got done and alban Ezy trading barbs. Now this
Speaker 4: started with an apparent debate misstep when the leaders were
Speaker 4: grilled and why they are both shying away from heavy
Speaker 4: duty reform on negative gearing and capital gains tax.
Speaker 3: To fix the House in crisis.
Speaker 4: And you, of course remember last year it came to
Speaker 4: light that Labor was modeling this stuff because it was
Speaker 4: a treasurer at the time.
Speaker 14: It is not unusual at all for governments or for
Speaker 14: treasurers to get advice on contentious issues which are in
Speaker 14: the public domain, including in the Parliament. It is not
Speaker 14: unusual for treasurers to do that.
Speaker 4: Then strolled Elbow last night, contradicting all of that, suggesting
Speaker 4: it wasn't modeled by the government at all.
Speaker 6: Was it modeled, It certainly wasn't commissioned by us to
Speaker 6: do so.
Speaker 5: It was modeled by the government. It was public it's
Speaker 5: publicly available. This Prime Minister has a problem with the truth.
Speaker 3: And so Jim Chalmers was then sent in to mop
Speaker 3: up the mess.
Speaker 14: Today, it should be normal practice, It is normal practice
Speaker 14: to seek or receive advice on these issues from time
Speaker 14: to time. We didn't commission modeling. The view from the
Speaker 14: Treasury is that a change to negative gearing wouldn't get
Speaker 14: the sort of improvement that we desperately need to see
Speaker 14: in our economy when it comes to supply, and that's
Speaker 14: why our focus is not on changing that. Our focus
Speaker 14: is on building homes.
Speaker 4: Yes, so now we're just using the word advice instead
Speaker 4: of modeling.
Speaker 3: That'll do it. That'll clarify absolutely everything.
Speaker 4: Joining us now to discuss this is Adam Crichton, the
Speaker 4: Institute of Public Affairs chief economist and senior fellow. Adam,
Speaker 4: good to see you, Thank you so much for joining me. Look,
Speaker 4: this is the story that has dominated the news cycle today.
Speaker 4: But what is your take on what has happened here?
Speaker 13: Well, look, this is obviously something the Labor Party has
Speaker 13: looked at for many years. They've wanted to crack down
Speaker 13: on negative gearing. But as a voter and as an economist,
Speaker 13: I find it very frustrating. I mean this, you know,
Speaker 13: there's no negative gearing policy if you like, if you
Speaker 13: look back, you know through Australian politics, no party has
Speaker 13: introduced negative giving. This is just a fundamental part of
Speaker 13: the way our tax system works.
Speaker 3: It goes back to the.
Speaker 13: Nineteenth thirty six Income Tax Act in fact, and it
Speaker 13: just means that we can write off our losses against
Speaker 13: our income. That's just the way the Australian system works.
Speaker 13: There was a brief period in the eighties where the
Speaker 13: Labor government I think from ninet eighty five to nineteen
Speaker 13: eighty seven they knocked it on the head and actually
Speaker 13: rents went up, so it was actually negative for renters
Speaker 13: at the time. But the reality is this is a
Speaker 13: side show. This is not going to change the reality
Speaker 13: of housing costs for Australians and it's frustrating to see
Speaker 13: this debate dominate. I mean, this is a story from
Speaker 13: six months ago, basically, so just a reminder of how
Speaker 13: boring this election campaign really is.
Speaker 3: Asol.
Speaker 4: That's exactly what I said at the start of the show, Adam,
Speaker 4: I think the campaign's boring. Mum and Dad at home
Speaker 4: who can't pay for their electricity bills, who can't put
Speaker 4: food on the table, do not give a rats right
Speaker 4: now about negative gearing. They worry about how they're actually
Speaker 4: going to pay for things, and that's where the messaging
Speaker 4: is getting off course.
Speaker 3: Look, I want to talk to you about some.
Speaker 4: Polling out today in the Daily Telegraph which suggests that
Speaker 4: minority government is very likely in another back to back
Speaker 4: blow for opposition later Peter Dutton sixty six seats. Now,
Speaker 4: that's what Labor is on track to win. By contrast,
Speaker 4: the Coalition is winning or ahead in fifty five. There's
Speaker 4: one hundred and fifty seats in the all important Lower House.
Speaker 4: So Adam it says that there are about fourteen seats
Speaker 4: now that are looking too close to call. What's your
Speaker 4: feel on where things are heading here?
Speaker 13: Well, look, if you look at the betting markets and
Speaker 13: you look at the poles, it's not looking great for
Speaker 13: the coalition, is it. I mean, that's you know, my
Speaker 13: worst nightmare personally is it's a Labour Greens minority government.
Speaker 13: And frankly that's probably the most likely outcome at the moment.
Speaker 13: I mean, if I was Peter Dutton, and you know,
Speaker 13: I mean I'm not a sopologist, but if I was
Speaker 13: Peter Dutton, you know, I'd be trying to throw some
Speaker 13: grenades out there now. And you know, maybe, for instance,
Speaker 13: say we'll dump net zero and let's have a real debate,
Speaker 13: because ultimately zero is the biggest tax on the Australian economy.
Speaker 13: I mean, forget you know, the Trump tariffs. I mean,
Speaker 13: that's that's just a nothing. I mean, the biggest tax
Speaker 13: on Australian economy is by far and away the net
Speaker 13: zero policy, which is crushing our industry. It's increasing our costs.
Speaker 13: You know, it's you know, it's fatal to our future prosperity.
Speaker 13: But sadly there's no debate about that key issue. And
Speaker 13: you know, if you look around the world, countries are
Speaker 13: saying we can't do it without nuclear power. I mean,
Speaker 13: I think the Coalition needs to be more front footed
Speaker 13: on nuclear power. They keep getting attacked on it. They
Speaker 13: don't speak about it anymore. But frankly, I think we're
Speaker 13: the only G twenty country in the world it does
Speaker 13: not have nuclear power. So it's kind of crazy we don't,
Speaker 13: especially given we have all the uranium. So why doesn't
Speaker 13: the Coalition go on the front foot on this.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we have the minerals on our doorstep, but I
Speaker 4: completely agree, and yeah, I just find it extraordinary that
Speaker 4: it's almost been put a little bit on the back burner,
Speaker 4: this nuclear debate on this for this campaign, and it's
Speaker 4: meant to be the signature policy. But I want to
Speaker 4: ask you, though, what is it saying that the price
Speaker 4: if you look at the primary vote of both parties,
Speaker 4: still it's not great for both. What does it say
Speaker 4: about the number of undecided voters still out there.
Speaker 13: Well, look, I think you're seeing throughout Western countries and
Speaker 13: Australia in particular, declining vote for the major parties because
Speaker 13: people are just dissatisfied with the options that are provided
Speaker 13: by left and right.
Speaker 3: I think it's going to continue.
Speaker 13: I mean, if I was a betting man, I would
Speaker 13: say that in this election you're going to see the
Speaker 13: lowest primary vote in history of the Coalition and also
Speaker 13: the Labor Party. And I don't blame people. I mean,
Speaker 13: I'm going to vote, but you know, I mean my
Speaker 13: first preference is not going to be one of the
Speaker 13: two major parties. If you're a thinking person, why would
Speaker 13: it be. You know, you want someone to do something,
Speaker 13: you want to fix, you know, to fix Australia's downward spiral.
Speaker 13: It's very depressing, you know, we're just we're getting more spending,
Speaker 13: more regulation, and it's because both major parties. In my view,
Speaker 13: it's the fall of compulsory voting. You're just going for
Speaker 13: the median voter who doesn't care, doesn't pay any attention,
Speaker 13: and you get the exact policies that reflect that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we've got to heap of public holidays coming up too,
Speaker 4: so it certainly doesn't help the campaign to try and
Speaker 4: keep people engaged had them. Crichton, nice to see you,
Speaker 4: Thank you so much for joining me on the show
Speaker 4: this evening.
Speaker 3: We're coming up after the break.
Speaker 4: The lawfare continues, a literal state is now suing Donald Trump,
Speaker 4: would you believe?
Speaker 3: And those climate wars, as we just said, they are back.
Speaker 4: Albow and Dunton pressed on climate change and their responsors
Speaker 4: unleash fierce debate.
Speaker 3: That's next welcome back.
Speaker 4: Well, it looks like the climate wars are back because
Speaker 4: last night during the leadership showdown, Albo and Dunton were
Speaker 4: asked whether the natural disasters we've seen recently where the
Speaker 4: result of climate change?
Speaker 3: And here was that exchange.
Speaker 5: I don't know, David, because I'm not a scientist, and
Speaker 5: I can't tell you whether the temperature has risen in
Speaker 5: Fargaminde as a result of climate change, or that the
Speaker 5: water levels are up in Fargaminda's latest flood as a
Speaker 5: result of climate change. And I think the honest answer
Speaker 5: for most people is that they don't.
Speaker 6: Can I talk about the science and be a prime
Speaker 6: minister who backs it out up? The science is very clear.
Speaker 6: Doesn't mean that every single weather event is because of
Speaker 6: climate change. It does mean that the science told us
Speaker 6: that the events would be more extreme and they'd be
Speaker 6: more frequent.
Speaker 4: He loves the science, doesn't he enjoining us now to
Speaker 4: discuss the skinys Contributed to Joe Hildebrand and from GT Communications. Helloa, ready,
Speaker 4: how good is the science?
Speaker 13: Science?
Speaker 3: Says that this is going to be a great segment.
Speaker 3: How good is the science? The science is fantastic. I
Speaker 3: love the science. It's it's like modeling leave in the climate.
Speaker 3: It's like modeling.
Speaker 15: You can get it to say whatever you want. You
Speaker 15: can get Sien I do. I do completely believe in
Speaker 15: climate change. But I'm sympathetic to what Peter Dutton said
Speaker 15: because I have no idea. I mean, I've got you know,
Speaker 15: I know a good Beatles song when I hear one,
Speaker 15: because I can understand that because I know music. But
Speaker 15: I can't I can't tell you whether or not you
Speaker 15: know this science adds up or whatever. So you do
Speaker 15: you just go with whatever people who are smarter than
Speaker 15: you and more expert than you in that particular field
Speaker 15: and say, all right, But of course you've also got
Speaker 15: to have a degree of skepticism as well. We know
Speaker 15: that experts went a bit far during the pandemic and
Speaker 15: just turns out turns out they were actually doing things
Speaker 15: that had no signs behind them at all. But I'm
Speaker 15: not a skeptic. But you can see from the look
Speaker 15: on Albow's face when Peter Dunton said that, he went, gotcha.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well, I just think that people don't care about
Speaker 4: the climate changed, but they've been lied to.
Speaker 3: And I'll tell you why, because you've had al.
Speaker 16: Gore who was like, we are all going to die
Speaker 16: all of the ice caps.
Speaker 15: Well, that is true, everyone is going to them.
Speaker 16: Did well eventually, obviously, But the whole boy who cried
Speaker 16: Wolf scenario where the climate things concended. My take on
Speaker 16: it was lucky enough to hear Jon Lomberg speak a
Speaker 16: couple of years ago in London, and the way he
Speaker 16: puts it is sensible. The climate is changing by nature
Speaker 16: of the fact that we live on Earth, that the
Speaker 16: records are if you put it in context of how
Speaker 16: long the Earth's been around, a bee is proverbial, right,
Speaker 16: So we know that the climate is changing.
Speaker 3: Is there an emergency, absolutely not. Are we all going
Speaker 3: to die in fifteen years? Absolutely not. Is the sea
Speaker 3: going to arise and wipe out?
Speaker 16: You know all of Bronte seen n Sydney.
Speaker 3: Should have said Conte Sydney Beach if you're in Melbourne.
Speaker 4: True, but every natural disaster we have in this country,
Speaker 4: Olbow every time has trotted out this year.
Speaker 3: That's because he's Signe d. It's not his model.
Speaker 15: I don't think it's that, and he's not and he's
Speaker 15: not as bad as some. But I think you are
Speaker 15: right that it is a real problem. And again I
Speaker 15: say this is someone who did a sort of whole
Speaker 15: big series with News Corps. Basically, how we get that.
Speaker 15: The argument over is it real or not is almost secondary.
Speaker 15: The question is what do.
Speaker 8: We do about it?
Speaker 6: How much?
Speaker 15: How much are we prepared to sacrifice our way of life.
Speaker 16: And do Also, the missing piece of this conversation is
Speaker 16: how green is green energy?
Speaker 3: Not green at all. Let's be really bloody clear about that.
Speaker 16: Your tesla, my ex tesla, which I don't miss is
Speaker 16: not green to produce.
Speaker 3: It's not clean to produce.
Speaker 4: You don't hear about the environmental damage too, of all
Speaker 4: the wind turbines and.
Speaker 3: Everything like that getting missed out. It does not go there.
Speaker 4: But I want to move on because the Coalition has
Speaker 4: declared it will eradicate immigration roughts and shunks after a
Speaker 4: top university revealed that half of its foreign students had
Speaker 4: dropped out of their degrees or.
Speaker 3: Failed to rock up altogether.
Speaker 4: Joe, you know, uneds are rightly slamming these phantom students
Speaker 4: to yeah, drop that.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's just astronomical. But look, something needs to
Speaker 3: be done here, sure.
Speaker 15: Absolutely, And it's strange that the Coalition is saying it's
Speaker 15: going to tackle it because they had legislation before the
Speaker 15: Parliament from the government which was actually tackling this, and
Speaker 15: they voted against it. And they voted against it because
Speaker 15: it was part of the government, the Labor government's plan
Speaker 15: to reduce the number of international students, which again the
Speaker 15: Coalition also voted against and then came out with their
Speaker 15: own plan to do to do the exactly the same thing.
Speaker 15: So again it's just and I don't want to join
Speaker 15: the pylon because they're having a bad enough time as
Speaker 15: it is. And it's another example of this campaign and
Speaker 15: the Coalition not knowing where it really sits or stands
Speaker 15: on anything, and it's flipping and flopping.
Speaker 3: I do agree with that. That has been a lot
Speaker 3: of flipping and flopping.
Speaker 4: And I still think the bigger issue here at play,
Speaker 4: in my opinion, is the immigration rate, which we know
Speaker 4: is out of control under.
Speaker 16: Under like foreign students, Yeah, absolutely, and foreign students are
Speaker 16: one cog in that wheel. And I can't disagree with
Speaker 16: anything Joe said. Just universities are such I hate using
Speaker 16: this phrase, but I can't go anywhere else tonight. It's
Speaker 16: just a hot mess. They can't control, they can't clean
Speaker 16: up their own backyard. You've got the situation is a
Speaker 16: University of Queensland was a Q two, so you've got
Speaker 16: that situation going on with their law faculty. The incredible
Speaker 16: work Joanna old Briston has been doing on law faculties
Speaker 16: in general, you've got the falling standards of education, you've
Speaker 16: got campus security for Jewish students, all of these things
Speaker 16: in universities going please give us some more money, and
Speaker 16: the federal government fit in fairness, churning a blind eye
Speaker 16: to all of that. And now I'm not surprised that
Speaker 16: you know, isn't there funding based on how many bums
Speaker 16: they get on sea?
Speaker 3: That's it, right.
Speaker 15: So the messy thing is that international students live a
Speaker 15: huge amount of money for versus that taxpayer would otherwise
Speaker 15: have to pay for. And they spend money in the
Speaker 15: economy as well. So that is a good thing you
Speaker 15: want to keep. There are bogus phantom lines.
Speaker 3: We're almost were always our top.
Speaker 4: But I want, I want, I know, look, I'd love
Speaker 4: to keep talking about immigration, but I actually want to
Speaker 4: talk about this because I think this is hilarious. California
Speaker 4: would you believe is suing Donald Trump over his tariff? Rayjime?
Speaker 4: They're upset, They've had enough. I don't even know if
Speaker 4: you can do this. I don't know what the deal is,
Speaker 4: Jema Butter, what do you think.
Speaker 16: I don't understand that. I also have no sympathy for
Speaker 16: Gavin usim in his government.
Speaker 3: I have no well, I don't forgety of us have
Speaker 3: any sympathy.
Speaker 16: Let's be really, you know the state of California is
Speaker 16: is it a failed state? I don't know, but I
Speaker 16: have no sympathy for them. And can they sue Donald Trump?
Speaker 10: I don't know.
Speaker 3: Well, apparently they can. Apparently they're upset Joe.
Speaker 15: I thought they were still in the same country. I
Speaker 15: don't think is actually succeeded yet. So obviously they feel
Speaker 15: like in Australia, but they feel like they're being hit
Speaker 15: by the fact that, you know, the prices will go
Speaker 15: up in California like they go everywhere else. But you're
Speaker 15: right for any cause against Trump. Davin Newsome is the
Speaker 15: worst poster boy because he's just so thoroughly kind of
Speaker 15: obnoxious and pretentious and unlikable.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I agree, you can't try.
Speaker 17: Well, do get me.
Speaker 4: I'm available a Barbie doll going It was remember when
Speaker 4: we went out to the to the fires dresses Care.
Speaker 15: It was just when he pretended he was on the
Speaker 15: phone to Joe Biden.
Speaker 16: Just just absolutely and yet these people continue to retain
Speaker 16: their position and people vote for them, And I just
Speaker 16: don't know which his worse democracy?
Speaker 3: It's democracy. Well listen whatever the dictator goes a long
Speaker 3: way too. I agree.
Speaker 4: Unfortunately we have run out of time.
Speaker 3: He just got too carried away with climate.
Speaker 4: That's what that was our obsession tonight, with the climate obsession.
Speaker 3: Can you believe it stayed with us after the break
Speaker 3: a landmark UK court ruling on what a woman is? Yeah,
Speaker 3: what a woman is.
Speaker 4: It's a huge victory for common sense and JK Rowling
Speaker 4: is thrilled about it.
Speaker 3: That's next, welcome back.
Speaker 4: Let's turn to the UK now where it took a
Speaker 4: court to rule that a woman is a biological female.
Speaker 3: I mean, can you believe it?
Speaker 4: A court actually had to rule that a bloke who
Speaker 4: puts on a dress and a.
Speaker 3: Wig is not a woman.
Speaker 4: But yet here we are in twenty twenty five and
Speaker 4: here was part of that judgment being handed down.
Speaker 12: The unanimous decision of this court is that the terms
Speaker 12: women and sex in the Equality Act twenty to ten
Speaker 12: refer to a biological woman and biological sex.
Speaker 4: There were celebratory scenes of jubilation after that result came through.
Speaker 3: Chief among them was JK Rowling.
Speaker 4: She said, quote it took three extraordinary tenacious Scottish women
Speaker 4: with an army behind them to get this case heard
Speaker 4: by the Supreme Court, and in winning they've protected the
Speaker 4: rights of women and girls across the UK. Joinny me
Speaker 4: now to discuss this is Tom Slater, editor of Spiked Online. Tom,
Speaker 4: thank you for joining me. What's been the reaction to
Speaker 4: the judgment over there?
Speaker 17: Oh, it's been jubilation, certainly from a lot of the
Speaker 17: gender critical feminists and gay rights campaigners who I've been
Speaker 17: speaking to. I mean, it really does feel like a
Speaker 17: tremendous seismic moment. As you're alluding to in your introduction there,
Speaker 17: it is absurd that we ever had to be in
Speaker 17: a position where a court had to declare that women
Speaker 17: actually exist. But as we all know, in all of
Speaker 17: our Western societies we've been taken down this rabbit hole
Speaker 17: for so long. Many of the people that you can
Speaker 17: see celebrating on the screen there have been fighting a
Speaker 17: very courageous but lonely battle in some cases for more
Speaker 17: than twenty years now, and unfrankly in awe how much
Speaker 17: they've achieved considering what they've been up against. They thought
Speaker 17: this at the grassroots, they thought this in the courts,
Speaker 17: They thought this in the court of public opinion, and
Speaker 17: this feels like whilst one one wants to declare victory
Speaker 17: too quickly, they're a lot closer to winning on this
Speaker 17: issue of common sense and biological sex than they were
Speaker 17: twenty four hours ago.
Speaker 4: Well, you know, it's just been an extraordinarycire rasure of
Speaker 4: women and this is part of the problem here. But
Speaker 4: you've got your Foreign secretary over there, David Lammy, who
Speaker 4: once said that men can grow a cervix. For goodness sake,
Speaker 4: Keir star was saying, it's not right to say that
Speaker 4: only women have a cervix. What sort of wop nonsense
Speaker 4: are they talking about.
Speaker 17: It's incredible the Labor Party really drank the trends call
Speaker 17: aid on this front. I mean, Keir Starmer eventually count
Speaker 17: this very torturous position, which is that you know, most
Speaker 17: women don't have a penis ninety nine point nine percent
Speaker 17: probably not, but there is still one in a thousand.
Speaker 17: You think, how many where did you get to this
Speaker 17: particular position. It's interesting now the Labor Party, now in government,
Speaker 17: previously in opposition, are having to kind of pretend that
Speaker 17: they were always on board with this to begin with.
Speaker 17: Their equalities spokesperson saying that we recognize the ruling. We've
Speaker 17: always supported protections on the basis of sex and sex
Speaker 17: based rights. It's all very we have always a war
Speaker 17: of East Asia. But I think it shows how much
Speaker 17: of this was really propelled, not necessarily by people in
Speaker 17: the Labor Party or people in government being true believers,
Speaker 17: although there are some of those, They were all running
Speaker 17: scared of this ideology. Hopefully, this ruling, even if it's
Speaker 17: a bit cowardly, even if it's a bit of a
Speaker 17: reverse ferrit we'll just give them cover to admit what
Speaker 17: they all knew to begin with, which is there are
Speaker 17: two sexes and that's fundamentally important if you want to
Speaker 17: protect women's rights.
Speaker 3: I mean, who would have thought basic biology.
Speaker 4: Yet again here we are what sort of an impact
Speaker 4: do you think this is now going to have to
Speaker 4: female sports and female only spaces? Do you think is
Speaker 4: this changed the game?
Speaker 13: No?
Speaker 17: Absolutely, If you go through the judgment itself, it makes
Speaker 17: clear that there are going to be knock on effects here.
Speaker 17: We've already seen. Actually some organizations announced kind of plans
Speaker 17: to pursue, for instance, the NHS if it doesn't change
Speaker 17: its guidance, which primarily works on the basis of self
Speaker 17: identification as well as gender recognition certification. We've had the
Speaker 17: British Transport Police, which has already announced that as an
Speaker 17: interim measure it's going to ban trans identified police officers
Speaker 17: from searching women. That this has to happen purely on
Speaker 17: the basis of biological sect or, as it always should
Speaker 17: have been. So there's going to be fights to come.
Speaker 17: But the nature of this ruling, the precedent that it
Speaker 17: sets down, the fact that this is the Supreme Court,
Speaker 17: the highest court in the land. It's going to have
Speaker 17: legal ramifications, but I think also cultural and political ramifications.
Speaker 17: It's suddenly become a lot more acceptable to say what
Speaker 17: has been obvious to all of us to begin with.
Speaker 17: And that's a tremendous victory in its own self, I
Speaker 17: think absolutely.
Speaker 4: And look, I wish that here in Australia we would
Speaker 4: be following suit, but we're certainly a long way behind.
Speaker 4: And look, I want to get your take on reports
Speaker 4: that the Ministry of Defense over there may have banned
Speaker 4: electric vehicles with Chinese parts from parking within two miles
Speaker 4: of military sites due to safety concerns. Tom apparently staff
Speaker 4: at an RAF in Cambridgeshire must park those evs outside,
Speaker 4: explain what's going on here.
Speaker 17: This is really striking. So this report from gb News
Speaker 17: over here talking about how specifically at RAF Witting in Cambridgeshire,
Speaker 17: which includes this cycle the path Finder Building, which is
Speaker 17: believed to kind of house one of the world's largest
Speaker 17: spy facilities, the sort of thing you wouldn't want potentially
Speaker 17: hostile foreign actors to be anywhere near that. They have
Speaker 17: put these restrictions in. It's not all RAF or military sites,
Speaker 17: but by any stretch of the imagination, but does reflect
Speaker 17: a growing nervousness on the part of the state, on
Speaker 17: the part of the government about potential room for espionage.
Speaker 17: But you know, the Labor government have a very muddled
Speaker 17: position on this. On the one hand, they're trying to
Speaker 17: hug China quite close. There's even talk of them approving
Speaker 17: this super embassy that the Chinese Communist Party you want
Speaker 17: to put in the middle of central London, which was
Speaker 17: blocked by the last Conservative government for fear it would
Speaker 17: be a place for espionage and for secret police forces
Speaker 17: and so on to operate from. And yet you can
Speaker 17: still you can still see that the kind of information
Speaker 17: they're getting the kind of advice that they're getting from
Speaker 17: their security services and from their military chiefs is that
Speaker 17: they need to be a lot more cautious. So maybe
Speaker 17: this is the beginning of a more cautious approach than
Speaker 17: we've seen so far from them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, and you can understand why they're certainly
Speaker 3: doing this. You you just don't know.
Speaker 4: But it says a lot about electric veh as well.
Speaker 4: I got to say, Tom Slater, it's nice to catch
Speaker 4: up with you. Thank you so much for joining me
Speaker 4: on the show this evening, and thank you for your company.
Speaker 4: That's all we've got time for. I'll see you tomorrow
Speaker 4: at five pm for my show. But now here is
Speaker 4: Paul Murray in the man Cave.
Speaker 1: From the sky New Center.
Speaker 2: This is Paul Murray Live.
Speaker 7: Hello, ad, Welcome to the show before the long weekend,
Speaker 7: before another long weekend, both of course with incredible importance
Speaker 7: to Christian Australians this weekend and then to all Australians
Speaker 7: next weekend, Happy Easter. And of course this time next
Speaker 7: week I'm going to be living a dream because we
Speaker 7: are going to be in Western Australia. We will be
Speaker 7: on our way to Calgooley and I want you to
Speaker 7: join us next Sunday. Okay, not this but next Sunday night,
Speaker 7: the twenty seven, in Calgooley. If you can make it,
Speaker 7: get yourself there. Ourtown at skynews dot com dot you
Speaker 7: ourtown at skynews dot com dot you love to get
Speaker 7: into the orange dirt. We will do so next weekend,
Speaker 7: looking forward to it. Sixteen days until the federal election.
Speaker 7: Tuesday is when the first votes will be cast. In
Speaker 7: an election where there is a fork in the road,
Speaker 7: there is a way to continue what we are doing
Speaker 7: with the problems we've had over the past three years,
Speaker 7: or a chance, as the opposition will say, to put
Speaker 7: the country back on track. At the am an easy
Speaker 7: well today again just basking in the terribleness of the
Speaker 7: performance that he had last night at the debate.