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Speaker 1: Welcome to Fear and Greed Q and A, where we

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Speaker 1: ask and answer questions about business, investing, economics, politics and more.

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Speaker 1: I'm Uncale Thompson and good morning Adam Lane.

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Speaker 2: Good morning Michael. Adam.

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Speaker 1: Recently, in the last couple of weeks, has been a

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Speaker 1: lot of commentary about, of all things meetings, and it

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Speaker 1: has been driven largely by the bank CEOs too, in

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Speaker 1: particular the new A and Z CEO Nuno Mattos and

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Speaker 1: the new Westpac Newish Westpac CEO Anthony Miller, and talking

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Speaker 1: in particular about some efficiency measures that they are putting

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Speaker 1: in place around meetings and this idea of having shorter

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Speaker 1: meetings and having an agenda for a meeting and to

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Speaker 1: try and kind of value people's time. I understand all

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Speaker 1: of that. I also thought all of that was common

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Speaker 1: sense and already in place. So my question for you today,

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Speaker 1: as a workplace expert, as a leadership coach, as a

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Speaker 1: CEO with many years experience, how a veteran, a veteran

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Speaker 1: of many things, how do we have more efficient meetings?

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Speaker 1: Common sense?

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Speaker 2: It is.

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Speaker 3: But that's the challenge for any business is you have

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Speaker 3: to make sense common you have to explain it. What

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Speaker 3: are you actually looking for what's a smart decision in

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Speaker 3: whatever context you're operating in, And so, of course, you know,

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Speaker 3: I think this sort of behavior, this conduct has to

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Speaker 3: be codified into the understanding of every company as to

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Speaker 3: what they want.

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Speaker 1: So this is good than what these leaders are doing,

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Speaker 1: oh saying it and making the expectations.

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Speaker 3: Spectically, I agree, Yes, I do agree with that Anthony

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Speaker 3: Miller and what he's I think is being referred to

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Speaker 3: as his hustle culture, right, I really like that. I

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Speaker 3: think there is a nature about business that it is

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Speaker 3: a competition, that there is no walk up start to

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Speaker 3: customers buying your product or service, and you've got to

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Speaker 3: go out there and earn it.

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Speaker 2: And that means customer service is not a static thing.

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Speaker 3: So meetings should really be reserved for not discussion, not

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Speaker 3: updates you can read those right, They should be made

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Speaker 3: for decision making. So if you're coming into a meeting,

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Speaker 3: if you're going to ask for people's time, and you

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Speaker 3: remember this from when we used to work together, Michael,

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Speaker 3: that you know I would in my head have already

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Speaker 3: calculated the cost of the meeting.

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Speaker 2: You know, how did you do that?

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Speaker 1: By taking everyone's skir average salary.

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Speaker 3: Give an average salary, divide it down to an hour

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Speaker 3: an hour cost of business in my case including super

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Speaker 3: but you know there's on cost, rent and sign. You

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Speaker 3: can do it every way you like. Let's just say

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Speaker 3: keep it simple. Take the average wage down to an

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Speaker 3: hour and multiply that by the number of the people

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Speaker 3: in the room. So if you have eight people in

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Speaker 3: a meeting, that's eight hours worth of person time. Then

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Speaker 3: you've really got to add in another fifty percent half

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Speaker 3: an hour at least before an hour meeting, because people

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Speaker 3: got to get their heads into it, a lot of

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Speaker 3: people have to do work for it and put other

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Speaker 3: things aside. And after the meeting at least now allow

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Speaker 3: another half hour because there's work to do from the meeting.

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Speaker 3: So one hour meeting times eight people costs far north

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Speaker 3: of nothing. It is basically two hours worth of eight

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Speaker 3: people's time. And that starts to Okay, Well, then this

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Speaker 3: meeting better have a purpose. We better actually do something

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Speaker 3: productive with this time.

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Speaker 1: Okay, So if we start there, as the basic principle,

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Speaker 1: there must be a purpose for this meeting.

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Speaker 2: Yes, what next and an outcome?

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Speaker 3: So basic rules that I like, everyone gets to speak,

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Speaker 3: everyone listens, and leaders speak last. Right, there's some basic dynamics. OK,

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Speaker 3: good news fast, bad news faster. You can't hide stuff

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Speaker 3: in these meetings, and you can't make them just celebrate

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Speaker 3: only the good. Everything has to go to make decisions.

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Speaker 3: Everything else is secondary. Then this is really important too

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Speaker 3: for any unified team. There is no meeting outside the meeting.

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Speaker 3: If you're in the room, you own the decision. And

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Speaker 3: when you are asked by your teammates who decided, the

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Speaker 3: only correct answer is I did, and you stand by

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Speaker 3: that decision.

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Speaker 2: You also therefore have to stand by the mistakes. So

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Speaker 2: I really like those dynamics.

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Speaker 3: We saw Nuno Mattos from anzed He asked for presentations

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Speaker 3: to be cut to five pages and respect everyone's time.

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Speaker 3: We saw westba's Anthony Miller Shorter sharper sessions as part

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Speaker 3: of his broader hustle culture. Jeff Bezos at Amazon, this

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Speaker 3: is one that I really loved. Six pages A template,

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Speaker 3: A pro former template, Michael, can you imagine enjoy it?

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Speaker 3: If you want to bring a decision to a meeting,

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Speaker 3: you've got to prepare, describe the context to challenge the decision,

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Speaker 3: how it'll make life better, and an outcome, and people

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Speaker 3: for the first fifteen minutes of that meeting, do nothing

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Speaker 3: but read it. There's no pre work. You get in

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Speaker 3: the room and you read it, and you make your

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Speaker 3: notes in your questions. The discussion has had and then

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Speaker 3: you go to a decision or you decide there's not

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Speaker 3: enough information they need to go again. So I really

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Speaker 3: like that rigor around how to make their meetings effective.

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Speaker 3: And let's just say Jeff Bezos was a driver, but

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Speaker 3: look at the size of Amazon. That has been one

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Speaker 3: of the most impressive business stories ever.

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Speaker 1: Something clearly works in that case the structure of the meeting. Yes, again,

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Speaker 1: start with a purpose.

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Speaker 3: Purpose okay, definitely got to have an agenda. Where are

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Speaker 3: you going with this thing? And what are the outcomes

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Speaker 3: we're after so that everyone is clear and ready. That

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Speaker 3: should be circulated beforehand. I really like ninomatos directive from

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Speaker 3: at A and Z A gender upfront, outcomes, declared, actions confirmed.

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Speaker 3: I've spoken about Jeff Bezos six page memo and Matos

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Speaker 3: five page presentation restriction, but you know, really it's anything

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Speaker 3: that's going to reflect your company culture and direct you

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Speaker 3: towards the business process and the outcomes that you need.

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Speaker 3: Loosely define the problem analyze it, decide what to do

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Speaker 3: about it, and act.

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Speaker 1: Okay, what about communication then within the meeting and is

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Speaker 1: this where poor communicators can actually fall down?

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Speaker 2: It is, yeah, it is okay.

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Speaker 3: And look it's incumbent on the chair of that meeting

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Speaker 3: or the most senior person in that room. And this

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Speaker 3: is very human, right, particularly when you've got new people

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Speaker 3: into a company, new into a role. You in a

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Speaker 3: meeting forum, everybody's got to be allowed to speak and

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Speaker 3: speak well, like, have the comfort to speak what they

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Speaker 3: need to say, and that can be quite intimidating. So

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Speaker 3: really the chair of that meeting has an obligation to

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Speaker 3: support that discussion, make sure everyone's there on time, get

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Speaker 3: there early, turn off your phone, there is no computer open.

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Speaker 3: You are focused in that meeting to get an outcome.

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Speaker 3: And so really it has to be a respectful environment.

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Speaker 3: You know, you're there for the business's sake, to get

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Speaker 3: an outcome. Respect everyone's point of view, because frequently the

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Speaker 3: best ideas come from lots of different parts of the business,

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Speaker 3: from the front lines and back And as Brene Brown,

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Speaker 3: the Leadership and Vulnerability Experts says, clear is so just

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Speaker 3: communicating that manner It is not for performance theater. As

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Speaker 3: much as we celebrate melodrama in the theater itself and

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Speaker 3: in the weekend edition here at Fear and Greed, Michael,

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Speaker 3: meetings shouldn't.

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Speaker 2: Really be a place for that. They can be very distracting.

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Speaker 3: Beware of humor because that can take you off track

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Speaker 3: and it also can mask really clear communication. And again,

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Speaker 3: once you've made that decision, make sure that everyone is supportive.

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Speaker 3: If there's any niggling doubt in that room, that's the

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Speaker 3: time to get it out because after that meeting, you're

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Speaker 3: going you're all in a line to make that decision happen.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so we've discussed what to do before the meeting,

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Speaker 1: During the meeting, what about afterwards? How do you get

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Speaker 1: how do you actually get the best outcomes out of

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Speaker 1: that meeting?

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Speaker 3: A single owner is always really important. I think that

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Speaker 3: one person owns the outcome and that is made clear

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Speaker 3: the at least.

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Speaker 2: The meeting's end. You know that they know.

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Speaker 3: That they've now got the permission to go ahead on

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Speaker 3: the company's bar and do something.

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Speaker 2: They own it.

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Speaker 3: And when they're reporting back, you know, there's some instances

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Speaker 3: where every twenty four hours is a good reporting cycle.

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Speaker 3: By way of example, if you're dealing with a crisis,

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Speaker 3: a safety incident that certain people may need to know,

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Speaker 3: you know, in a briefing a meeting what is happening

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Speaker 3: and what to do and how they can help. But

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Speaker 3: there needs to be a frequency of reporting decided on

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Speaker 3: as well. I think those clear action items and a

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Speaker 3: single owner are really really helpful.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think you have just delivered us an eight

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Speaker 1: minute masterclass in meeting etiquette and protocols. That a good meeting, Michael,

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Speaker 1: That actually was the most efficient meeting I think we've

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Speaker 1: ever had, Adam right there.

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Speaker 2: Thank you very much. Thank you, Michael.

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Speaker 1: If you've got something that you would like to know

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Speaker 1: and we can deal with these things very efficiently, then

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Speaker 1: send through your question on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, or head

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Speaker 1: along to our website Fearangreed dot com dot au. I'm

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Speaker 1: Michael Thompson and this is Fear and Greed Q and

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Speaker 1: a just