Speaker 1: The public has had a long held fascination with detectives.
Speaker 1: Detective sy a side of life the average person is
Speaker 1: never exposed to. I spent thirty four years as a cop.
Speaker 1: For twenty five of those years, I was catching killers.
Speaker 1: That's what I did for a living. I was a
Speaker 1: homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead,
Speaker 1: I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated.
Speaker 1: The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories
Speaker 1: from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw
Speaker 1: and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some
Speaker 1: of the content and language might be confronting. That's because
Speaker 1: no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged.
Speaker 1: Join me now as I take you into this world.
Speaker 2: Welcome back to the Clink. This is part two of
Speaker 2: my story with Gary Jubulant, and I think you're really
Speaker 2: going to enjoy this second part.
Speaker 1: Gary just ad for a sec when we had the
Speaker 1: and the cameras turned off, didn't we agree? It was
Speaker 1: the Clink and I catch killers.
Speaker 2: Well, I got you on the first episode. Well I
Speaker 2: tried to pull it on the second.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, nah, nah, You're not going to sleep. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I learned, Gary jubilant. Okay, welcome back to part two
Speaker 1: of The Clink and I Catch Killers episode. I was
Speaker 1: ambushed in part one, but all jokes aside, I think
Speaker 1: we've got some worthwhile stuff to talk about.
Speaker 2: Yeah, look, we really do. And look, I'm not going
Speaker 2: to apologize, as you haven't for anything stuff apologize, you know,
Speaker 2: like I swear by it. And I feel that these
Speaker 2: are the conversations that we need to have, and we
Speaker 2: have a platform to have this ability to have these
Speaker 2: conversations in a respectful manner, but a very direct and
Speaker 2: honest conversation. So to ore our listeners out there, I
Speaker 2: think from both of us, I hope you do appreciate
Speaker 2: where we've come from in the angle that we've taken,
Speaker 2: because I feel that it needs to have been spoken of.
Speaker 2: Part two is now and it really is something worth
Speaker 2: listening to. I feel that we're both trying to achieve
Speaker 2: a very similar goal in what we see in what's
Speaker 2: happening in our society, what's happening around the world, even
Speaker 2: you know, whether it be through our youth, our young
Speaker 2: person incarcerations.
Speaker 1: It seems like an angry place at the moment, doesn't it.
Speaker 1: It just has this feel, this vibe.
Speaker 2: It really does, and I think that it's it's scary
Speaker 2: as a father and both of us are of young,
Speaker 2: young persons. You know what, what does the world hold
Speaker 2: for them? You know, we're trying to keep our children.
Speaker 2: I wouldn't say protected as in knowledgeably protected, but definitely
Speaker 2: protected from things that could drag them into certain spaces.
Speaker 1: Well, you want like my thing when I was in
Speaker 1: the cops, like I wanted to make a difference in crime.
Speaker 2: I don't want to hear you talk about the cops anymore. Like,
Speaker 2: let's move forward.
Speaker 1: But well the cops, all right, all you bikis too.
Speaker 2: Lets it was a criminal before I was a biking Okay.
Speaker 1: But what I'm saying, I still want to make a
Speaker 1: difference and what I've learned.
Speaker 2: So Gary Jubilan wants to make a difference. I want to.
Speaker 1: I want to make a difference in the world the crime.
Speaker 1: I've still got passion, I've still got anger. I still
Speaker 1: want to channel it, channel it somewhere. But while I've
Speaker 1: worked out, these people have been making a bigger difference
Speaker 1: in the world of crime than I ever did. With
Speaker 1: guns and the handcuffs. These are the people that we're
Speaker 1: taught restorative justice. We talk about reducing recidivism, putting young kids,
Speaker 1: pointing them in the right direction. Imagine your life, Brent.
Speaker 1: I just thray, this is a hypothetical. If someone there
Speaker 1: and you went through some really rough stuff, if someone
Speaker 1: there was therefore you and pointed you in the right direction,
Speaker 1: could have that that could have made the world the
Speaker 1: difference to you, just one good person.
Speaker 2: And I've always said that. I even say it to
Speaker 2: my children. You know what is your excuse? You have,
Speaker 2: you know, parents that love you, a roof of your head,
Speaker 2: clothes on the back, You've got food on the table,
Speaker 2: You've got a warm bed to sleep in. You're very,
Speaker 2: very I guess, loved within your peers. You've got support
Speaker 2: within your sporting groups. All these wonderful things that are
Speaker 2: there for everybody. What is your excuse to not putting
Speaker 2: it in your best interest? And you know, being one
Speaker 2: percent better every day than what you were yesterday, You
Speaker 2: know what is the excuse? Because I know for me,
Speaker 2: I tried my best sleeping in a football oval middle
Speaker 2: of winter, telling people that you know I had a
Speaker 2: home to go to when I was I didn't, I'd
Speaker 2: go to football training I was a great football I
Speaker 2: had all the opportunities, but I'd wait till everybody had
Speaker 2: taken off. I'd sneak back into the dressing sheds, you know,
Speaker 2: after training in winter, have a quick shower, go and
Speaker 2: get my sleeping bag that I'd stash in, and I'd
Speaker 2: roll it out in the middle of a cricket pitch
Speaker 2: and a pitch black oval. Why because I felt safer
Speaker 2: in the middle, because I didn't think anyone would have
Speaker 2: the balls to walk through it. You know, things like
Speaker 2: that that our children don't have to be concerned about.
Speaker 2: You know what is the excuse?
Speaker 1: There is none, There is none but one life can
Speaker 1: go off track and your circumstances. Again, I keep coming
Speaker 1: back to it because it just blows me away that
Speaker 1: you've got to this point and you've given me some
Speaker 1: cutos full cu thos to you what you're doing with
Speaker 1: your life now, Like I know what you're doing, and
Speaker 1: you're trying to make a difference, and you are actually
Speaker 1: making a difference with the messaging that's coming out from
Speaker 1: the clink, because the one thing that comes across in
Speaker 1: the clink is about stories of redemption. So it doesn't
Speaker 1: matter how low you are in life, there's always a
Speaker 1: possibility that you can turn things around. And I think
Speaker 1: if we're talking about reducing crimes and lives that have
Speaker 1: gone off track, that's such strong messaging, isn't It doesn't
Speaker 1: matter where you are, you can make something of your life.
Speaker 1: You can turn it around.
Speaker 2: I want to give credit to everybody out there that
Speaker 2: has experienced you know, and I'm a big believer in
Speaker 2: lived experience is very very wealthy in knowledge, and I
Speaker 2: feel that there's a lot of us out there. And
Speaker 2: I say us as in a broader spectrum of persons
Speaker 2: who have walked the other side of life or whatever
Speaker 2: you want to call it. I don't like to label
Speaker 2: us as all criminals. Criminality is a part of my past.
Speaker 2: But there's a lot of men and women out there
Speaker 2: today whom are coming forward through their lived experience and
Speaker 2: making a difference in so many different spaces. For you
Speaker 2: to acknowledge persons similar to myself across that board, I
Speaker 2: think is a really really nice thing. And I think
Speaker 2: that it's actually not a bad thing seeing someone like
Speaker 2: yourself who has stepped away from that law authority sort
Speaker 2: of figure to now actually seeing things from a different
Speaker 2: perspective understanding more about the wise. Why do people become
Speaker 2: the way that they do. Why does someone like whom
Speaker 2: you were in that sort of position of law dealing
Speaker 2: with angry people with addiction, you know, just people with
Speaker 2: a high rate of crime. Why And now you're starting
Speaker 2: to see from the outside looking back in to the
Speaker 2: realisms of why people.
Speaker 1: I think where I'm in a fortunate position. I honestly
Speaker 1: believe I'm in a fortunate position because people are not
Speaker 1: going to look at me at there's a bleeding hard
Speaker 1: or a do good if I'm saying, well, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe we could do something differently that they not looking
Speaker 1: at me as just someone that's just been sold the
Speaker 1: dummy and oh yeah, let's go soft on crime and
Speaker 1: the world will be a beautiful place. It's not that way.
Speaker 1: You made the point of lived experience. I cannot stress
Speaker 1: highly enough how important drawing on that is. People like yourself.
Speaker 1: If you sit down and speak to someone whose life's
Speaker 1: going off track the path that you've gone, they're going
Speaker 1: to listen to you. I know what. I know what
Speaker 1: the brain's like. When you're a young bloken your head
Speaker 1: off in directions. You look up to certain people with
Speaker 1: certain people who listen to other people that you ignore.
Speaker 1: Before we sat down here and you ambushed me in
Speaker 1: part one I was talking to just had a text
Speaker 1: from Nata Hamden, who you know through through.
Speaker 2: And so much respectful. I was with him at Mount Penning.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the top bloke and he's doing he's doing some
Speaker 1: work in the juvenile justice space and at schools and
Speaker 1: he was a top world rated boxer, thought for world titles.
Speaker 2: Nator Hamden is just a genuinely beautiful man who has
Speaker 2: a set of hands that could put anybody. He yea man.
Speaker 2: My fondest memories of him as watching him take it
Speaker 2: to a bully who was a man seekers back then
Speaker 2: twenty one and still be in the boys' homes, you know.
Speaker 2: And you know you said these older blokes standing over
Speaker 2: the younger blockers. Nate ha never copped anybody standing over anyone.
Speaker 2: Just was in his go And they went out in
Speaker 2: the oval out the front of war Pole and Vernon
Speaker 2: and mate it was on and they're just fed him
Speaker 2: and the over fool, you know, right out the front
Speaker 2: of what they called the snake pit, and Ny there
Speaker 2: just fed him. And it was a big thing because
Speaker 2: Nata didn't do it for glory, neally did it for
Speaker 2: the little person. And that's who he is. The lion heart. Well,
Speaker 2: well that's who he is, you know, and like he
Speaker 2: is giving back today and by going back into these centers.
Speaker 1: I just so impressed. And the way you've described him
Speaker 1: is when the kids takes boxing gear in there, I'll
Speaker 1: do a bit of training, break it down, and they
Speaker 1: look up to him and respect. And he's got all
Speaker 1: these words of words of wisdom based on his own
Speaker 1: life experience. And he managed to get through and not
Speaker 1: many do through that juvenile justice system, but not go
Speaker 1: back into in the prison as an adult. And so
Speaker 1: there's something therefore before him.
Speaker 2: Know, he was well known street cred wise. I don't
Speaker 2: be fooled that the fact that he wasn't lined up
Speaker 2: to do a big whack in jail. Yeah, he was
Speaker 2: going there one hundred percent. He was going to be
Speaker 2: another statistic. It didn't happen that way. You know, he
Speaker 2: was blessed and God put him on a beautiful path
Speaker 2: that allowed him to use his talents which were he
Speaker 2: gifted hands to be able to better his life. And now,
Speaker 2: what a beautiful family, what a great fathering you know
Speaker 2: what an inspiration to many.
Speaker 1: All these people like that. People are from drug addictions,
Speaker 1: and I know you've had a few on the clinkers,
Speaker 1: I have on eye catch killers. The ones that have
Speaker 1: gone down that path understand what it takes to break
Speaker 1: the addiction, and they've set up these retreats and different things. Yes,
Speaker 1: why don't we buy into it? I don't know if
Speaker 1: the government support them. I know that quite often they
Speaker 1: struggle for money. I know people like Nata are looking
Speaker 1: for opportunities to make a living now making good passing
Speaker 1: on these messages. So we need to invest in that.
Speaker 2: I think I think so too, and look to be
Speaker 2: honest with the gary. I had the honor of standing
Speaker 2: up some years ago now in front of nearly five hundred.
Speaker 2: Now you're going to hit me out there, I know
Speaker 2: because I'm going to say it wrong. Cleinetians. Is that
Speaker 2: how it's pronounced? Coordnicians, clinicians whatever. A bunch of fucking
Speaker 2: professional people that went to university.
Speaker 1: And got.
Speaker 2: To say that they know what life's all about. Now,
Speaker 2: hang on, let me take a backwards step there, because
Speaker 2: I don't want to offend anybody, and I mean this sincerely.
Speaker 2: We are definitely in need of some wonderful people out
Speaker 2: there in that space. But it was a national suicide
Speaker 2: prevention conference that was held here in Brisbane and I
Speaker 2: was invited to stand up and speak on behalf of
Speaker 2: lived experience. Now I was just just a kid from
Speaker 2: the streets, you know what I mean, like the Western
Speaker 2: Suburbs Housing Commission of Sydney that had a story. But
Speaker 2: the value of the story becomes so much greater in
Speaker 2: that moment because I was able to impact so many
Speaker 2: people through my words of being present and being able
Speaker 2: to share what it was like today. I love being
Speaker 2: able to help others, and I love being able to
Speaker 2: give back, and I love being able to listen and
Speaker 2: I guess serve and help the the dog and be
Speaker 2: somebody there who can be a voice. You know. The
Speaker 2: Clink is something that and this season we've switched it up.
Speaker 2: You know, We've done four years of stories of Redemption
Speaker 2: which has been very, very impacted and it took its
Speaker 2: toll on me. It did it really interest me, and
Speaker 2: it put me in a position where I wasn't sure
Speaker 2: if I was going to continue on doing what I did.
Speaker 2: Having seen the response from the public and the amount
Speaker 2: of people that the clink has helped. I felt that
Speaker 2: we needed to come back with something new and fresh.
Speaker 2: That being said, we've come in this season, season sixteen
Speaker 2: with being able to give people tools through each episode
Speaker 2: of our Guests, and I will ask you to leave
Speaker 2: two valuable tools that you feel could help somebody to
Speaker 2: be able to grow themselves in a way that enables
Speaker 2: them to have the confidence to chase their dreams or
Speaker 2: business minds or whatever it might be. Because we've all
Speaker 2: got these wonderful visions and beliefs that we can do
Speaker 2: this and you can do anything. I tell my kids,
Speaker 2: be the best, you can be, dream big because anything
Speaker 2: is possible. The thing is, we get stuck in this
Speaker 2: position where for me, it i'm hopeless, you know, like
Speaker 2: I have started a business that is starting to become
Speaker 2: really really good. It's not obviously anywhere near where it
Speaker 2: can be, but I'm working hard. Unfortunately, I'm not educated
Speaker 2: in some spaces in the IT era, like a space
Speaker 2: of the business, so I have to constantly learn and
Speaker 2: reach out and it'd be very easy for me to
Speaker 2: get it's all too hard. Fuck it, I'm just I'm
Speaker 2: done with it. Many others out there would be feeling
Speaker 2: the same over. Maybe they're too scared or too shamed
Speaker 2: to reach out to ask somebody that does, because I
Speaker 2: want to feel like they don't know that different.
Speaker 1: I think it comes into all aspects of life, and
Speaker 1: that if you surround yourself with good people, people that understand,
Speaker 1: like it is not my fothe a, but I've got
Speaker 1: friends that are good at it them I'll learn stuff
Speaker 1: from them and I might give them something. Surrounding yourself
Speaker 1: with good people. But yeah, life, life journey. I'm a
Speaker 1: big one, and I think society and maybe we're delving
Speaker 1: in too deep. And though I'm really cares well, I
Speaker 1: think that I'll say it anyway that you've got to
Speaker 1: work at things.
Speaker 2: Life.
Speaker 1: Life is going to give your setbacks. Life is going
Speaker 1: to kick your life is going to do all sorts
Speaker 1: of things. But you you've got to pay your dues
Speaker 1: and get in there and work and the reward will come.
Speaker 1: It might be instant, but it will come down down
Speaker 1: the track.
Speaker 2: I think it builds resilience, and I think that word
Speaker 2: is very powerful and each of us have to understand
Speaker 2: what resilience is. Once again, I refer back to my children.
Speaker 2: You know I've gone through and my family have gone
Speaker 2: through a really tough last four or five years. You know,
Speaker 2: there's been a lot in the background that has gone
Speaker 2: on and it is still going on. That's had a
Speaker 2: massive impact in my life and my children's life, But
Speaker 2: it is also built a lot of strength and a
Speaker 2: lot of resilience, and I see it in the eyes
Speaker 2: of my children each day, you know. And it's a
Speaker 2: tough walk, but in some ways it's a blessing because
Speaker 2: they're setting themselves up to be great young people in
Speaker 2: our society.
Speaker 1: And it's easy as a parent to spoil a child
Speaker 1: and shield them from all the knocks and bruises that
Speaker 1: come with growing up. But you've got to You've got
Speaker 1: to with control, let them out there a little bit,
Speaker 1: get their grazes come back, heal them up, and that's
Speaker 1: where that resilience builds up.
Speaker 2: I think so, And I think you know, like obviously
Speaker 2: you know your children seeing what their dad has gone
Speaker 2: through as well. You know, like, man, you've had as
Speaker 2: far along concern, Yeah, okay, you had a great career,
Speaker 2: but you've also had a real shit ending to something
Speaker 2: you gave your heart and soul to and obviously sacrificed
Speaker 2: and lost a lot of your life, yea too.
Speaker 1: To be in the best you can be it And
Speaker 1: and part of part of what hurt me because you
Speaker 1: want to protect those that you love. And I love
Speaker 1: my kids obviously, and they were taking on my pain.
Speaker 1: I didn't want them to take on my pain, but
Speaker 1: it was such in your face. So that, yeah, that
Speaker 1: I resented, resented people that put me through that, not
Speaker 1: because what I was suffering, but how it impacted impacted
Speaker 1: on my kids. But yeah, again you get rewarded what
Speaker 1: you put into it. And my kids didn't have the
Speaker 1: easiest of life. They went through a marriage, breakup with
Speaker 1: myself and their mother.
Speaker 2: So but that too, that come down obviously, and I mean,
Speaker 2: I'm only just I'm guessing I can use that word.
Speaker 2: I'm guessing though that would have come down to your
Speaker 2: your choice of employment, which would have then and then
Speaker 2: created a version of you. Sometimes it wouldn't have been
Speaker 2: the best version of you, it would have been. So
Speaker 2: I guess involved and just committed to wanting to see
Speaker 2: an end result to certain things. I mean, I can
Speaker 2: honestly say with my oldest son, you know, my choice
Speaker 2: of life living a certain way, not being present, not
Speaker 2: being there when I needed to be, but be thinking
Speaker 2: that I'm being a dad. No. I was a father,
Speaker 2: but I wasn't an active, present father. And that's the difference.
Speaker 2: And you know, I think that if you are out
Speaker 2: there listening today and you have children, you question yourself
Speaker 2: about what you're giving. And none of us are perfect.
Speaker 2: I do it myself, you know. I look at my
Speaker 2: little fellow, my youngest of four, and I go I
Speaker 2: need to I need to look at him a little
Speaker 2: bit different from the other three. I need to give
Speaker 2: him a bit more compassion, a bit more time. I
Speaker 2: need to spend more time kicking the footy, you know,
Speaker 2: having those chats.
Speaker 1: One thing that a good thing that came from the separation.
Speaker 1: I think that the life that I had when I
Speaker 1: I was with my wife, first wife, with mother of
Speaker 1: my children, that I had the opportunity I could go away,
Speaker 1: I could throw myself in the work, so I'd come
Speaker 1: back and I'd be the weekend dad or whatever. But
Speaker 1: I wasn't packing their lunches at school and in their
Speaker 1: school uniforms, planning my daughter's hair. When we separated. When
Speaker 1: I'm looking after the children for a week, I had
Speaker 1: to be more invested. I had to sit down and
Speaker 1: do their homework with them. I had to make sure
Speaker 1: their uniform was on, packed their lunches and all that.
Speaker 1: And in one way, I'm thankful for that because it
Speaker 1: made me wake up to and appreciate, you know, what
Speaker 1: I was missing and what my wife was doing for me.
Speaker 1: At the time, I didn't really realize all the behind
Speaker 1: the scenes. So I think I became closer to my
Speaker 1: kids in a bizarre soor the way because I had
Speaker 1: to look after them like that, or if they're sick
Speaker 1: and they're with you, you're the one taking their temperature or
Speaker 1: you're the one doing things. So I did learn something
Speaker 1: from that.
Speaker 2: It's funny that someone sort of said to me just recently,
Speaker 2: you know when you're going to sort of catch up
Speaker 2: and come and have a feed in a beer, and
Speaker 2: I said, I'm not. I said wow. I said, well,
Speaker 2: at the moment, I'm just man. My sons and I
Speaker 2: need to be present twenty four to seven. If something
Speaker 2: goes wrong, exactly what you just said. If something there's
Speaker 2: an emergency, or you know, whatever it might be, it's
Speaker 2: on me. There's no family, there's no turn to anyone else.
Speaker 2: It's on you. Oh sorry, I'm too pissed. I went
Speaker 2: out and I got on the piss with me mate,
Speaker 2: had a long lunch or whatever. Well, hang on your boys,
Speaker 2: sitting down the road and pissing down rain. You meant
Speaker 2: to have picked him up, you know, ship, There's no
Speaker 2: room for that. There's no root. It's about you know,
Speaker 2: being I guess, being honest with yourself, taking ownership, being
Speaker 2: a present father, you know, putting the time and effort
Speaker 2: in and giving back.
Speaker 1: And I like, my kids are adults now. And what
Speaker 1: I what I can say is Okay, we've had the
Speaker 1: separation and the dramas that come come with that, but
Speaker 1: the work that I put in the stay connected. And
Speaker 1: I see this a lot in the in the cops,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of divorces or the divorces across across
Speaker 1: the range.
Speaker 2: Now you should say.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can only imagine, but I see guys that
Speaker 1: there was one though I won't won't say his name,
Speaker 1: but he was working in the city. He'd moved to
Speaker 1: the city, but his son was living up at Newcastle.
Speaker 1: So you're looking at our and a half two hour
Speaker 1: two hour drive. Realistically, he would coach the football team.
Speaker 1: He would drive up there and like four hours behind
Speaker 1: the wheel, but just wanted to coach the team. I
Speaker 1: said to this bloke and he was a good friend,
Speaker 1: or he's a good friend, And I said, by doing
Speaker 1: what you're doing, you're going to be rewarded in the future.
Speaker 1: When your son grows up, he's going to know how
Speaker 1: much you put in so little things like that. So
Speaker 1: if we're sitting here now, wise and wise people, I
Speaker 1: just think the time you invest in your children comes
Speaker 1: back in bucket loads when they get older. I see
Speaker 1: the type of kids or type of adults my children
Speaker 1: have grown up to and all the values that was
Speaker 1: painstakingly tried to install them as they were growing up.
Speaker 1: I actually got it. I didn't know at the time,
Speaker 1: but they actually got it. And I'm really proud. You know.
Speaker 2: You know what I just think I've gotten here, Garrett,
Speaker 2: right now is the value of our conversation in reference
Speaker 2: to being fathers. Yeah, like here we are really to
Speaker 2: talk about, you know, I scares giving people better ways
Speaker 2: and better choices in life through not choosing the paths
Speaker 2: of criminality and all that sort of stuff. I think
Speaker 2: the purpose of us being here has brought us to
Speaker 2: where we are now about us with our past yeah,
Speaker 2: not being what we thought was the best version of
Speaker 2: ourselves as fathers to being here right now, and this
Speaker 2: is the conversation we were meant to have, which I
Speaker 2: think brings us so much value because I think the
Speaker 2: tools that we can give to people, which is a
Speaker 2: part of what we're trying to achieve here with season
Speaker 2: sixteen about bettering ourselves, it all starts within the home.
Speaker 1: Well, it's funny how we fell there. It fell into
Speaker 1: this spot because it wasn't where we were going.
Speaker 2: But not at all.
Speaker 1: I've had opportunity to reflect on where my life is now,
Speaker 1: with all the things that have changed, and when it
Speaker 1: comes all said and done, the excitement of what I've
Speaker 1: had in the Cops, the exciting stuff I'm doing post
Speaker 1: the Cops, when it's all said and done, it's a
Speaker 1: family that really Yeah, that's the thing that rocks my boat.
Speaker 1: When it's all said and done. I could lose all
Speaker 1: that and if I still had the relationships. The personal
Speaker 1: relationships are fans.
Speaker 2: Life's good. For anybody out there that's doubting the love
Speaker 2: of your child, don't because it's the most purest love
Speaker 2: that you'll ever have. You'll have marriage, breakups, you'll have
Speaker 2: partners maybe come and go. And if you're blessed to
Speaker 2: be of that small percentage that's able to be in
Speaker 2: love and have that one love for the rest of
Speaker 2: your life and raise your family, then that's amazing. And
Speaker 2: I feel that that is just a really beautiful gift.
Speaker 2: Embrace that. But for majority, and I feel that here
Speaker 2: is a majority today as we speak. Never ever, ever
Speaker 2: feel that your children don't love you, and never give up.
Speaker 2: As somebody who has a distant relationship with my oldest
Speaker 2: son because of the choices that I did make, I
Speaker 2: have one hundred percent learned to be a better father
Speaker 2: with my three children after that, and I will always
Speaker 2: keep that door open. And the love is unquestionable. But
Speaker 2: I also look and I feel, you know, when my
Speaker 2: children look at me and say thanks to that all
Speaker 2: I'm proud of you, Dad, or give me that hug
Speaker 2: and that so can you tuck me in, Dad? Still
Speaker 2: means a lot, you know, it means a lot. And
Speaker 2: give me a little bit emotional.
Speaker 1: Tsuesh there you got the tissues.
Speaker 2: That was another thing. There was props put there for
Speaker 2: the reason. So you know what, Gary, I'm just going
Speaker 2: to flip this on its head and say this was
Speaker 2: never the path that we're going to end up. But
Speaker 2: how's the meaning and the purpose right now? And the
Speaker 2: real like the reality of real of two fathers. Forget
Speaker 2: about where we've come from, the paths we've walked, but
Speaker 2: what we've learned and how we've been able to give
Speaker 2: that back to our children and become better men because
Speaker 2: of the love of our children.
Speaker 1: We didn't thought think we'd be talking down this path.
Speaker 2: Well, no, I wasn't going personal with you, but it's
Speaker 2: ended up. Well I've had no we were going personal,
Speaker 2: was very personal to start. Well, yeah, this is a
Speaker 2: different person.
Speaker 1: I've had a lot of time to reflect on things
Speaker 1: and my life and the chaos that was my life,
Speaker 1: and my chaos would have partly insignificance to what it
Speaker 1: would be in the outlaw motorcycle gangs, but the chaos
Speaker 1: of your life and when it's all said and done,
Speaker 1: the highs and lows and very similar, what's what's left?
Speaker 1: You got your kids and someone that loves you or
Speaker 1: people that love you. They're the important thing and it's unconditional.
Speaker 2: You never need to question it like you have relationships,
Speaker 2: and you do you question at times is this really,
Speaker 2: you know, is it going to last? Am I happy?
Speaker 1: Well, that's true and sadly, I've been through quite a
Speaker 1: few relationships, but there's one consistency is my kids are
Speaker 1: always there.
Speaker 2: And I think that if our listeners can take something
Speaker 2: from this podcast of ours, is that just give your
Speaker 2: children every possible opportunity that you can to your best means,
Speaker 2: and that doesn't mean monetary. Just give them your heart,
Speaker 2: give them your time, give them your patience. And I'm
Speaker 2: I've got to slap myself in the face here and
Speaker 2: take some of my own advice because I'm at times
Speaker 2: the worst person in the world. I find it very
Speaker 2: hard sometimes patient wise. But then I stand there and
Speaker 2: as I'm getting older, I do look and I take
Speaker 2: that breath and I go, It's okay, they're doing good.
Speaker 2: I'm doing good, you know, And I think that you're
Speaker 2: doing good. You're doing real good. To all those parents
Speaker 2: out there, just don't give up.
Speaker 1: Well yeah, yeah, you've got to hang in there. You
Speaker 1: really have got to hang in there, and it's worthwhile.
Speaker 1: The rewards come, the reward for the effort to put
Speaker 1: in and sometimes yeah, you don't need it, you don't
Speaker 1: want it, but I know you've got to do it
Speaker 1: and that comes. The rewards come at the end. Another
Speaker 1: thing that's happened here, Brent, and I think this is
Speaker 1: an important thing, and I've seen it on your podcast
Speaker 1: and I feel it on my podcast sitting down speaking
Speaker 1: to people like there. I've met so many people doing
Speaker 1: the pod car so I never really thought they'd have
Speaker 1: something in common with like, yeah, you and I. On paper,
Speaker 1: it should have been we should have been punching on
Speaker 1: that's the reality of it. But sitting down, I understand
Speaker 1: where you're coming from, and I think you know but
Speaker 1: grudgingly you might understand where I'm coming from. But yeah,
Speaker 1: there's some respect there. But the way you've gone about
Speaker 1: your life, I know, I've got to say full credit
Speaker 1: to you.
Speaker 2: I've got a lot of faults, mate, and I try
Speaker 2: to still work on them every day. You know, like
Speaker 2: I'm far from perfect, and if I can better myself
Speaker 2: one percent better every day, then I know I'm doing
Speaker 2: a good job. And trust me, these days, I wake up,
Speaker 2: look in the mirror and go, you're not winning today.
Speaker 2: There's something there's something here that's not allowing me to
Speaker 2: fill my heart with that joy. But I'm learning learning
Speaker 2: to take that breath, learning to look at what is good,
Speaker 2: weigh it up and think, Hey, I've been in worse positions.
Speaker 2: Life has been a lot worse than this. I've lost
Speaker 2: a lot, A lot's gone that I can never ever
Speaker 2: bring back. Time you'll never get back. So be present.
Speaker 2: I may not fill one hundred percent today. I've got
Speaker 2: to make the best of every opportunity and every situation.
Speaker 2: Right now.
Speaker 1: I think you should be proud of yourself. Where how
Speaker 1: you've turned your life around. Because if I look the
Speaker 1: riding on the wall, it wasn't going to be the end.
Speaker 2: It wasn't going to be pretty nah. And to be
Speaker 2: honest with you, I was prepared to have already been
Speaker 2: dead ten times over. But that was where my life
Speaker 2: was heading. You know, there was nothing, nothing good that
Speaker 2: was coming of my life. You know, the hurdles are
Speaker 2: still there, but I'm going over them, and I'm going
Speaker 2: over them in strides that are very strong, and I
Speaker 2: believe that, you know, I will come out the other
Speaker 2: side and life will be good. And if God allows
Speaker 2: me to continue to live and live in a healthy manner,
Speaker 2: and you know, watch my children grow, then so be it.
Speaker 2: If He's got other decisions, then that's just the way.
Speaker 1: Can I say another thing too, And I'm seeing the
Speaker 1: battles you're going through physically with injuries and the way
Speaker 1: you keep yourself fit. And we have talked about this
Speaker 1: that it keeps us sane. The mental training, you know,
Speaker 1: if you're looking if yeah, not that we've got great
Speaker 1: wisdom look at this to burn out X bikey x cop,
Speaker 1: but the importance of physical training that keeps me sane.
Speaker 1: That honestly, no matter what I'm going through, if I
Speaker 1: can get out and work up a sweat, do something
Speaker 1: that keeps me saying.
Speaker 2: I think it's a very important tool for the toolbox
Speaker 2: and I feel that, you know, if you actually take
Speaker 2: that step, just create that hour. Everyone says I haven't
Speaker 2: got time. Bullshit. I get up at four o'clock in
Speaker 2: the morning, you know what I mean. So I make
Speaker 2: that time between four and five is my time. Whatever
Speaker 2: I can get in that hour is a worthy hour,
Speaker 2: and I make the best of it and it sets
Speaker 2: me up for the day. You know. I'm sure you've
Speaker 2: got tools in your box that are very relative as well.
Speaker 1: I love those early morning starts. People say I'm not
Speaker 1: a morning person. It is the best time. I feel
Speaker 1: like I've got the head start on everyone else in
Speaker 1: the mind.
Speaker 2: I like to say, rise with the sun.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, get up there and get into it. And
Speaker 1: you've already doesn't matter what happens for the rest of
Speaker 1: the day, because you've done some stuff for yourself, done
Speaker 1: your training and ready to go.
Speaker 2: Well, there you have it, guys, Gary jubilant, Thank you
Speaker 2: very much for the I Catch Killers, Clink hot Cross.
Speaker 1: Finally we've got eye catch killers. I've given them the
Speaker 1: credit where the credits due. I got you up here.
Speaker 2: I milked you in and look, you know, I had
Speaker 2: to be done. I feel that it needed to be done,
Speaker 2: and I'm glad we got to break the ice. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I don't look at you as a cop or ex
Speaker 2: cop or anything like. I look at you as, you know,
Speaker 2: another bloke doing his best. And you know, I really
Speaker 2: have to say to have experienced and gone through some
Speaker 2: of the things that you've done and the great things
Speaker 2: that you've achieved to help people, you know, especially in
Speaker 2: the space of young young children and stuff like that
Speaker 2: I couldn't personally do. I don't think many of us could.
Speaker 2: So from from a real human point of view, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I just want to say, may you can really, I
Speaker 2: think have been an asset to helping helping others through
Speaker 2: your actions the earlier spaces in you okay, fuck yourself.
Speaker 2: I knew if I had to get it in at
Speaker 2: the end makers all jakeus side, you could have been
Speaker 2: one of those pricks at Batsby, but thankfully you weren't.
Speaker 2: But which stage, But no, all jokes aside to do
Speaker 2: the job that you did, especially in the back end
Speaker 2: of your career, it's you're a one percent you know,
Speaker 2: of being able to successfully do that job and not.
Speaker 2: And well, I don't say not, because I'm sure that
Speaker 2: it has had it.
Speaker 1: Look for you saying that it's humble, then I need
Speaker 1: to just put out there too. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: people that put in a lot of a lot of
Speaker 1: hard work, and not just in the Cops. I've said
Speaker 1: it since I've left the Cops. People are doing some
Speaker 1: shit loader heavy lifting that don't get the recognition because
Speaker 1: of the nature of my work. I was getting a
Speaker 1: lot of recognition. But I appreciate, appreciate what you're saying.
Speaker 1: But yeah, as you say, you're not perfect, No mean
Speaker 1: it's perfect. I'm a cluster fucking a lot of things
Speaker 1: in my life. I just happen to be able to
Speaker 1: do some aspects of policing very well. But I've enjoyed
Speaker 1: coming on. I haven't worked out what the revenge is,
Speaker 1: how I'm going to get you down the Sydney, but
Speaker 1: we'll work it out. Might line up, I could set
Speaker 1: up the boxing ring.
Speaker 2: A charity boxing shit, Okay, what we're doing?
Speaker 1: What's the agreed way?
Speaker 2: I ain't dropping another twenty kilos, That's all I know.
Speaker 2: And on that note, thank you very much, Gary Jubulant,
Speaker 2: and to everybody out there, I hope that you've enjoyed
Speaker 2: these couple of episodes. It is something that I really
Speaker 2: feel have a lot of value. And for everybody out
Speaker 2: there that's doing your best, just continue to be the
Speaker 2: best you can be and know that that love from
Speaker 2: your children is an unconditional love and never question it.
Speaker 1: All Right, you tried to steal the ending. Also, i'd
Speaker 1: like to say for my Catch Killers, not just the Clink,
Speaker 1: I enjoyed the chat too. So whichever platform you're listening
Speaker 1: to the I Catch Killers Slash Clink or Clink Slash
Speaker 1: by Catch Killers podcast, hope you enjoy it like we've
Speaker 1: been enjoyed the chat. Well, I know I probably shouldn't
Speaker 1: like Brent. Well, I don't know I shouldn't like him.
Speaker 1: I do like him. I'm glad we got to have
Speaker 1: a discussion, and it's good to see things from other
Speaker 1: people's perspectives, and I think we found some common ground.
Speaker 1: And I respect you for the person that you are.