1 00:00:01,960 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: The public has had a long held fascination with detectives. 2 00:00:05,440 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: Detective sy a side of life the average person is 3 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:11,160 Speaker 1: never exposed to. I spent thirty four years as a cop. 4 00:00:11,640 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: For twenty five of those years, I was catching killers. 5 00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:16,280 Speaker 1: That's what I did for a living. I was a 6 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:20,600 Speaker 1: homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead, 7 00:00:20,640 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated. 8 00:00:23,880 --> 00:00:26,480 Speaker 1: The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories 9 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 1: from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw 10 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some 11 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:34,680 Speaker 1: of the content and language might be confronting. That's because 12 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:37,720 Speaker 1: no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged. 13 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:40,599 Speaker 1: Join me now as I take you into this world. 14 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:49,320 Speaker 2: Welcome back to the Clink. This is part two of 15 00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 2: my story with Gary Jubulant, and I think you're really 16 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:55,120 Speaker 2: going to enjoy this second part. 17 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: Gary just ad for a sec when we had the 18 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,040 Speaker 1: and the cameras turned off, didn't we agree? It was 19 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 1: the Clink and I catch killers. 20 00:01:04,600 --> 00:01:06,760 Speaker 2: Well, I got you on the first episode. Well I 21 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:08,039 Speaker 2: tried to pull it on the second. 22 00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, nah, nah, You're not going to sleep. Yeah, 23 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:15,039 Speaker 1: I learned, Gary jubilant. Okay, welcome back to part two 24 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 1: of The Clink and I Catch Killers episode. I was 25 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 1: ambushed in part one, but all jokes aside, I think 26 00:01:21,560 --> 00:01:24,000 Speaker 1: we've got some worthwhile stuff to talk about. 27 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, look, we really do. And look, I'm not going 28 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 2: to apologize, as you haven't for anything stuff apologize, you know, 29 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:35,959 Speaker 2: like I swear by it. And I feel that these 30 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:39,119 Speaker 2: are the conversations that we need to have, and we 31 00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:41,240 Speaker 2: have a platform to have this ability to have these 32 00:01:41,280 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 2: conversations in a respectful manner, but a very direct and 33 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:48,200 Speaker 2: honest conversation. So to ore our listeners out there, I 34 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:50,360 Speaker 2: think from both of us, I hope you do appreciate 35 00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 2: where we've come from in the angle that we've taken, 36 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:55,240 Speaker 2: because I feel that it needs to have been spoken of. 37 00:01:56,480 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 2: Part two is now and it really is something worth 38 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 2: listening to. I feel that we're both trying to achieve 39 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:08,720 Speaker 2: a very similar goal in what we see in what's 40 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:13,560 Speaker 2: happening in our society, what's happening around the world, even 41 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 2: you know, whether it be through our youth, our young 42 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 2: person incarcerations. 43 00:02:19,720 --> 00:02:21,920 Speaker 1: It seems like an angry place at the moment, doesn't it. 44 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 1: It just has this feel, this vibe. 45 00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:28,079 Speaker 2: It really does, and I think that it's it's scary 46 00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:31,079 Speaker 2: as a father and both of us are of young, 47 00:02:31,760 --> 00:02:35,520 Speaker 2: young persons. You know what, what does the world hold 48 00:02:36,480 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 2: for them? You know, we're trying to keep our children. 49 00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 2: I wouldn't say protected as in knowledgeably protected, but definitely 50 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:49,000 Speaker 2: protected from things that could drag them into certain spaces. 51 00:02:49,080 --> 00:02:52,800 Speaker 1: Well, you want like my thing when I was in 52 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: the cops, like I wanted to make a difference in crime. 53 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 2: I don't want to hear you talk about the cops anymore. Like, 54 00:02:58,000 --> 00:02:58,720 Speaker 2: let's move forward. 55 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 1: But well the cops, all right, all you bikis too. 56 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:06,320 Speaker 2: Lets it was a criminal before I was a biking Okay. 57 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 1: But what I'm saying, I still want to make a 58 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 1: difference and what I've learned. 59 00:03:11,240 --> 00:03:14,079 Speaker 2: So Gary Jubilan wants to make a difference. I want to. 60 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: I want to make a difference in the world the crime. 61 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 1: I've still got passion, I've still got anger. I still 62 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:21,000 Speaker 1: want to channel it, channel it somewhere. But while I've 63 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 1: worked out, these people have been making a bigger difference 64 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:26,080 Speaker 1: in the world of crime than I ever did. With 65 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 1: guns and the handcuffs. These are the people that we're 66 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:35,600 Speaker 1: taught restorative justice. We talk about reducing recidivism, putting young kids, 67 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:38,320 Speaker 1: pointing them in the right direction. Imagine your life, Brent. 68 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 1: I just thray, this is a hypothetical. If someone there 69 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 1: and you went through some really rough stuff, if someone 70 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: there was therefore you and pointed you in the right direction, 71 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:49,240 Speaker 1: could have that that could have made the world the 72 00:03:49,280 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: difference to you, just one good person. 73 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 2: And I've always said that. I even say it to 74 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 2: my children. You know what is your excuse? You have, 75 00:03:57,440 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 2: you know, parents that love you, a roof of your head, 76 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 2: clothes on the back, You've got food on the table, 77 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:06,000 Speaker 2: You've got a warm bed to sleep in. You're very, 78 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 2: very I guess, loved within your peers. You've got support 79 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 2: within your sporting groups. All these wonderful things that are 80 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 2: there for everybody. What is your excuse to not putting 81 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 2: it in your best interest? And you know, being one 82 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:25,240 Speaker 2: percent better every day than what you were yesterday, You 83 00:04:25,240 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 2: know what is the excuse? Because I know for me, 84 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 2: I tried my best sleeping in a football oval middle 85 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:35,000 Speaker 2: of winter, telling people that you know I had a 86 00:04:35,040 --> 00:04:37,479 Speaker 2: home to go to when I was I didn't, I'd 87 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,919 Speaker 2: go to football training I was a great football I 88 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:43,840 Speaker 2: had all the opportunities, but I'd wait till everybody had 89 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 2: taken off. I'd sneak back into the dressing sheds, you know, 90 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:49,200 Speaker 2: after training in winter, have a quick shower, go and 91 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,120 Speaker 2: get my sleeping bag that I'd stash in, and I'd 92 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 2: roll it out in the middle of a cricket pitch 93 00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:55,480 Speaker 2: and a pitch black oval. Why because I felt safer 94 00:04:55,520 --> 00:04:57,120 Speaker 2: in the middle, because I didn't think anyone would have 95 00:04:57,120 --> 00:04:59,479 Speaker 2: the balls to walk through it. You know, things like 96 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:02,720 Speaker 2: that that our children don't have to be concerned about. 97 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:05,760 Speaker 2: You know what is the excuse? 98 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:10,640 Speaker 1: There is none, There is none but one life can 99 00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:14,720 Speaker 1: go off track and your circumstances. Again, I keep coming 100 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:16,720 Speaker 1: back to it because it just blows me away that 101 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 1: you've got to this point and you've given me some 102 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:22,919 Speaker 1: cutos full cu thos to you what you're doing with 103 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 1: your life now, Like I know what you're doing, and 104 00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:27,039 Speaker 1: you're trying to make a difference, and you are actually 105 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 1: making a difference with the messaging that's coming out from 106 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 1: the clink, because the one thing that comes across in 107 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:35,160 Speaker 1: the clink is about stories of redemption. So it doesn't 108 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:37,280 Speaker 1: matter how low you are in life, there's always a 109 00:05:37,320 --> 00:05:40,119 Speaker 1: possibility that you can turn things around. And I think 110 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:43,479 Speaker 1: if we're talking about reducing crimes and lives that have 111 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:49,080 Speaker 1: gone off track, that's such strong messaging, isn't It doesn't 112 00:05:49,080 --> 00:05:52,279 Speaker 1: matter where you are, you can make something of your life. 113 00:05:52,279 --> 00:05:53,040 Speaker 1: You can turn it around. 114 00:05:53,080 --> 00:05:55,120 Speaker 2: I want to give credit to everybody out there that 115 00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 2: has experienced you know, and I'm a big believer in 116 00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:03,080 Speaker 2: lived experience is very very wealthy in knowledge, and I 117 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:06,279 Speaker 2: feel that there's a lot of us out there. And 118 00:06:06,320 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 2: I say us as in a broader spectrum of persons 119 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:13,320 Speaker 2: who have walked the other side of life or whatever 120 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 2: you want to call it. I don't like to label 121 00:06:15,640 --> 00:06:19,279 Speaker 2: us as all criminals. Criminality is a part of my past. 122 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:22,720 Speaker 2: But there's a lot of men and women out there 123 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 2: today whom are coming forward through their lived experience and 124 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,279 Speaker 2: making a difference in so many different spaces. For you 125 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 2: to acknowledge persons similar to myself across that board, I 126 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:39,640 Speaker 2: think is a really really nice thing. And I think 127 00:06:39,640 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 2: that it's actually not a bad thing seeing someone like 128 00:06:41,880 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 2: yourself who has stepped away from that law authority sort 129 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:49,599 Speaker 2: of figure to now actually seeing things from a different 130 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:55,920 Speaker 2: perspective understanding more about the wise. Why do people become 131 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,119 Speaker 2: the way that they do. Why does someone like whom 132 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:03,799 Speaker 2: you were in that sort of position of law dealing 133 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:09,000 Speaker 2: with angry people with addiction, you know, just people with 134 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:13,200 Speaker 2: a high rate of crime. Why And now you're starting 135 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:15,760 Speaker 2: to see from the outside looking back in to the 136 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:17,840 Speaker 2: realisms of why people. 137 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 1: I think where I'm in a fortunate position. I honestly 138 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 1: believe I'm in a fortunate position because people are not 139 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:27,200 Speaker 1: going to look at me at there's a bleeding hard 140 00:07:27,320 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: or a do good if I'm saying, well, you know, 141 00:07:29,680 --> 00:07:33,560 Speaker 1: maybe we could do something differently that they not looking 142 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: at me as just someone that's just been sold the 143 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: dummy and oh yeah, let's go soft on crime and 144 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:41,080 Speaker 1: the world will be a beautiful place. It's not that way. 145 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 1: You made the point of lived experience. I cannot stress 146 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 1: highly enough how important drawing on that is. People like yourself. 147 00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 1: If you sit down and speak to someone whose life's 148 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:55,600 Speaker 1: going off track the path that you've gone, they're going 149 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:57,960 Speaker 1: to listen to you. I know what. I know what 150 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 1: the brain's like. When you're a young bloken your head 151 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 1: off in directions. You look up to certain people with 152 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:05,560 Speaker 1: certain people who listen to other people that you ignore. 153 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 1: Before we sat down here and you ambushed me in 154 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:11,119 Speaker 1: part one I was talking to just had a text 155 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: from Nata Hamden, who you know through through. 156 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 2: And so much respectful. I was with him at Mount Penning. 157 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, the top bloke and he's doing he's doing some 158 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 1: work in the juvenile justice space and at schools and 159 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 1: he was a top world rated boxer, thought for world titles. 160 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 2: Nator Hamden is just a genuinely beautiful man who has 161 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 2: a set of hands that could put anybody. He yea man. 162 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 2: My fondest memories of him as watching him take it 163 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:44,760 Speaker 2: to a bully who was a man seekers back then 164 00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:47,680 Speaker 2: twenty one and still be in the boys' homes, you know. 165 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:50,440 Speaker 2: And you know you said these older blokes standing over 166 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 2: the younger blockers. Nate ha never copped anybody standing over anyone. 167 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:56,079 Speaker 2: Just was in his go And they went out in 168 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:58,040 Speaker 2: the oval out the front of war Pole and Vernon 169 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 2: and mate it was on and they're just fed him 170 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:03,680 Speaker 2: and the over fool, you know, right out the front 171 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:05,839 Speaker 2: of what they called the snake pit, and Ny there 172 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,200 Speaker 2: just fed him. And it was a big thing because 173 00:09:09,320 --> 00:09:11,600 Speaker 2: Nata didn't do it for glory, neally did it for 174 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:15,439 Speaker 2: the little person. And that's who he is. The lion heart. Well, 175 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 2: well that's who he is, you know, and like he 176 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:21,760 Speaker 2: is giving back today and by going back into these centers. 177 00:09:21,880 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: I just so impressed. And the way you've described him 178 00:09:26,280 --> 00:09:29,640 Speaker 1: is when the kids takes boxing gear in there, I'll 179 00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 1: do a bit of training, break it down, and they 180 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 1: look up to him and respect. And he's got all 181 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 1: these words of words of wisdom based on his own 182 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 1: life experience. And he managed to get through and not 183 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 1: many do through that juvenile justice system, but not go 184 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 1: back into in the prison as an adult. And so 185 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 1: there's something therefore before him. 186 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 2: Know, he was well known street cred wise. I don't 187 00:09:51,840 --> 00:09:54,679 Speaker 2: be fooled that the fact that he wasn't lined up 188 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:56,680 Speaker 2: to do a big whack in jail. Yeah, he was 189 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:58,719 Speaker 2: going there one hundred percent. He was going to be 190 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 2: another statistic. It didn't happen that way. You know, he 191 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:04,240 Speaker 2: was blessed and God put him on a beautiful path 192 00:10:04,600 --> 00:10:06,959 Speaker 2: that allowed him to use his talents which were he 193 00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:09,840 Speaker 2: gifted hands to be able to better his life. And now, 194 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 2: what a beautiful family, what a great fathering you know 195 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:14,079 Speaker 2: what an inspiration to many. 196 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,240 Speaker 1: All these people like that. People are from drug addictions, 197 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:22,080 Speaker 1: and I know you've had a few on the clinkers, 198 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 1: I have on eye catch killers. The ones that have 199 00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 1: gone down that path understand what it takes to break 200 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: the addiction, and they've set up these retreats and different things. Yes, 201 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:33,640 Speaker 1: why don't we buy into it? I don't know if 202 00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:36,320 Speaker 1: the government support them. I know that quite often they 203 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:39,199 Speaker 1: struggle for money. I know people like Nata are looking 204 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 1: for opportunities to make a living now making good passing 205 00:10:43,160 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 1: on these messages. So we need to invest in that. 206 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:48,200 Speaker 2: I think I think so too, and look to be 207 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:50,840 Speaker 2: honest with the gary. I had the honor of standing 208 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:55,080 Speaker 2: up some years ago now in front of nearly five hundred. 209 00:10:55,160 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 2: Now you're going to hit me out there, I know 210 00:10:56,679 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 2: because I'm going to say it wrong. Cleinetians. Is that 211 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:02,760 Speaker 2: how it's pronounced? Coordnicians, clinicians whatever. A bunch of fucking 212 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,520 Speaker 2: professional people that went to university. 213 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 1: And got. 214 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 2: To say that they know what life's all about. Now, 215 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:10,840 Speaker 2: hang on, let me take a backwards step there, because 216 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 2: I don't want to offend anybody, and I mean this sincerely. 217 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,920 Speaker 2: We are definitely in need of some wonderful people out 218 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:18,760 Speaker 2: there in that space. But it was a national suicide 219 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:21,320 Speaker 2: prevention conference that was held here in Brisbane and I 220 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:24,880 Speaker 2: was invited to stand up and speak on behalf of 221 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:29,680 Speaker 2: lived experience. Now I was just just a kid from 222 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 2: the streets, you know what I mean, like the Western 223 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 2: Suburbs Housing Commission of Sydney that had a story. But 224 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:40,000 Speaker 2: the value of the story becomes so much greater in 225 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 2: that moment because I was able to impact so many 226 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 2: people through my words of being present and being able 227 00:11:46,600 --> 00:11:51,200 Speaker 2: to share what it was like today. I love being 228 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 2: able to help others, and I love being able to 229 00:11:53,240 --> 00:11:55,560 Speaker 2: give back, and I love being able to listen and 230 00:11:56,120 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 2: I guess serve and help the the dog and be 231 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 2: somebody there who can be a voice. You know. The 232 00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 2: Clink is something that and this season we've switched it up. 233 00:12:09,360 --> 00:12:11,680 Speaker 2: You know, We've done four years of stories of Redemption 234 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:14,719 Speaker 2: which has been very, very impacted and it took its 235 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 2: toll on me. It did it really interest me, and 236 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:20,120 Speaker 2: it put me in a position where I wasn't sure 237 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 2: if I was going to continue on doing what I did. 238 00:12:23,240 --> 00:12:25,680 Speaker 2: Having seen the response from the public and the amount 239 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:27,880 Speaker 2: of people that the clink has helped. I felt that 240 00:12:27,920 --> 00:12:30,080 Speaker 2: we needed to come back with something new and fresh. 241 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:35,000 Speaker 2: That being said, we've come in this season, season sixteen 242 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 2: with being able to give people tools through each episode 243 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 2: of our Guests, and I will ask you to leave 244 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:47,120 Speaker 2: two valuable tools that you feel could help somebody to 245 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 2: be able to grow themselves in a way that enables 246 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 2: them to have the confidence to chase their dreams or 247 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:55,280 Speaker 2: business minds or whatever it might be. Because we've all 248 00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 2: got these wonderful visions and beliefs that we can do 249 00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 2: this and you can do anything. I tell my kids, 250 00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 2: be the best, you can be, dream big because anything 251 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:07,200 Speaker 2: is possible. The thing is, we get stuck in this 252 00:13:07,240 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 2: position where for me, it i'm hopeless, you know, like 253 00:13:11,559 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 2: I have started a business that is starting to become 254 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:19,040 Speaker 2: really really good. It's not obviously anywhere near where it 255 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 2: can be, but I'm working hard. Unfortunately, I'm not educated 256 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 2: in some spaces in the IT era, like a space 257 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 2: of the business, so I have to constantly learn and 258 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:32,000 Speaker 2: reach out and it'd be very easy for me to 259 00:13:32,040 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 2: get it's all too hard. Fuck it, I'm just I'm 260 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:37,200 Speaker 2: done with it. Many others out there would be feeling 261 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:40,960 Speaker 2: the same over. Maybe they're too scared or too shamed 262 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:43,280 Speaker 2: to reach out to ask somebody that does, because I 263 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 2: want to feel like they don't know that different. 264 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 1: I think it comes into all aspects of life, and 265 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:53,520 Speaker 1: that if you surround yourself with good people, people that understand, 266 00:13:53,600 --> 00:13:55,959 Speaker 1: like it is not my fothe a, but I've got 267 00:13:56,000 --> 00:13:59,439 Speaker 1: friends that are good at it them I'll learn stuff 268 00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:03,720 Speaker 1: from them and I might give them something. Surrounding yourself 269 00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 1: with good people. But yeah, life, life journey. I'm a 270 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 1: big one, and I think society and maybe we're delving 271 00:14:10,400 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 1: in too deep. And though I'm really cares well, I 272 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:15,240 Speaker 1: think that I'll say it anyway that you've got to 273 00:14:15,280 --> 00:14:15,920 Speaker 1: work at things. 274 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:16,640 Speaker 2: Life. 275 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:18,880 Speaker 1: Life is going to give your setbacks. Life is going 276 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:20,520 Speaker 1: to kick your life is going to do all sorts 277 00:14:20,560 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 1: of things. But you you've got to pay your dues 278 00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,760 Speaker 1: and get in there and work and the reward will come. 279 00:14:25,800 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 1: It might be instant, but it will come down down 280 00:14:28,360 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 1: the track. 281 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 2: I think it builds resilience, and I think that word 282 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:34,440 Speaker 2: is very powerful and each of us have to understand 283 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:38,320 Speaker 2: what resilience is. Once again, I refer back to my children. 284 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:40,520 Speaker 2: You know I've gone through and my family have gone 285 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 2: through a really tough last four or five years. You know, 286 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:44,920 Speaker 2: there's been a lot in the background that has gone 287 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:47,440 Speaker 2: on and it is still going on. That's had a 288 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 2: massive impact in my life and my children's life, But 289 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,360 Speaker 2: it is also built a lot of strength and a 290 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,280 Speaker 2: lot of resilience, and I see it in the eyes 291 00:14:56,320 --> 00:15:00,080 Speaker 2: of my children each day, you know. And it's a 292 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 2: tough walk, but in some ways it's a blessing because 293 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 2: they're setting themselves up to be great young people in 294 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:09,040 Speaker 2: our society. 295 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 1: And it's easy as a parent to spoil a child 296 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 1: and shield them from all the knocks and bruises that 297 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: come with growing up. But you've got to You've got 298 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 1: to with control, let them out there a little bit, 299 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 1: get their grazes come back, heal them up, and that's 300 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:28,880 Speaker 1: where that resilience builds up. 301 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 2: I think so, And I think you know, like obviously 302 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 2: you know your children seeing what their dad has gone 303 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:38,160 Speaker 2: through as well. You know, like, man, you've had as 304 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 2: far along concern, Yeah, okay, you had a great career, 305 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 2: but you've also had a real shit ending to something 306 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:48,520 Speaker 2: you gave your heart and soul to and obviously sacrificed 307 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 2: and lost a lot of your life, yea too. 308 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 1: To be in the best you can be it And 309 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:56,240 Speaker 1: and part of part of what hurt me because you 310 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:58,280 Speaker 1: want to protect those that you love. And I love 311 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: my kids obviously, and they were taking on my pain. 312 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: I didn't want them to take on my pain, but 313 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 1: it was such in your face. So that, yeah, that 314 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 1: I resented, resented people that put me through that, not 315 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:14,600 Speaker 1: because what I was suffering, but how it impacted impacted 316 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 1: on my kids. But yeah, again you get rewarded what 317 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,560 Speaker 1: you put into it. And my kids didn't have the 318 00:16:20,600 --> 00:16:23,400 Speaker 1: easiest of life. They went through a marriage, breakup with 319 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 1: myself and their mother. 320 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:28,240 Speaker 2: So but that too, that come down obviously, and I mean, 321 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 2: I'm only just I'm guessing I can use that word. 322 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:36,080 Speaker 2: I'm guessing though that would have come down to your 323 00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 2: your choice of employment, which would have then and then 324 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 2: created a version of you. Sometimes it wouldn't have been 325 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:44,120 Speaker 2: the best version of you, it would have been. So 326 00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 2: I guess involved and just committed to wanting to see 327 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 2: an end result to certain things. I mean, I can 328 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 2: honestly say with my oldest son, you know, my choice 329 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:57,680 Speaker 2: of life living a certain way, not being present, not 330 00:16:57,760 --> 00:17:00,400 Speaker 2: being there when I needed to be, but be thinking 331 00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:03,960 Speaker 2: that I'm being a dad. No. I was a father, 332 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:08,360 Speaker 2: but I wasn't an active, present father. And that's the difference. 333 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 2: And you know, I think that if you are out 334 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:14,159 Speaker 2: there listening today and you have children, you question yourself 335 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:16,919 Speaker 2: about what you're giving. And none of us are perfect. 336 00:17:17,080 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 2: I do it myself, you know. I look at my 337 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:21,040 Speaker 2: little fellow, my youngest of four, and I go I 338 00:17:21,119 --> 00:17:23,240 Speaker 2: need to I need to look at him a little 339 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:25,160 Speaker 2: bit different from the other three. I need to give 340 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:27,560 Speaker 2: him a bit more compassion, a bit more time. I 341 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:30,080 Speaker 2: need to spend more time kicking the footy, you know, 342 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:31,160 Speaker 2: having those chats. 343 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:34,560 Speaker 1: One thing that a good thing that came from the separation. 344 00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 1: I think that the life that I had when I 345 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:40,959 Speaker 1: I was with my wife, first wife, with mother of 346 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:45,200 Speaker 1: my children, that I had the opportunity I could go away, 347 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,400 Speaker 1: I could throw myself in the work, so I'd come 348 00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:50,919 Speaker 1: back and I'd be the weekend dad or whatever. But 349 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:53,479 Speaker 1: I wasn't packing their lunches at school and in their 350 00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 1: school uniforms, planning my daughter's hair. When we separated. When 351 00:17:57,560 --> 00:17:59,919 Speaker 1: I'm looking after the children for a week, I had 352 00:18:00,119 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 1: to be more invested. I had to sit down and 353 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 1: do their homework with them. I had to make sure 354 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:08,160 Speaker 1: their uniform was on, packed their lunches and all that. 355 00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:11,159 Speaker 1: And in one way, I'm thankful for that because it 356 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: made me wake up to and appreciate, you know, what 357 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 1: I was missing and what my wife was doing for me. 358 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:19,439 Speaker 1: At the time, I didn't really realize all the behind 359 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 1: the scenes. So I think I became closer to my 360 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:23,919 Speaker 1: kids in a bizarre soor the way because I had 361 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 1: to look after them like that, or if they're sick 362 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 1: and they're with you, you're the one taking their temperature or 363 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 1: you're the one doing things. So I did learn something 364 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:32,800 Speaker 1: from that. 365 00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:35,760 Speaker 2: It's funny that someone sort of said to me just recently, 366 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:37,239 Speaker 2: you know when you're going to sort of catch up 367 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:38,919 Speaker 2: and come and have a feed in a beer, and 368 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 2: I said, I'm not. I said wow. I said, well, 369 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:44,639 Speaker 2: at the moment, I'm just man. My sons and I 370 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 2: need to be present twenty four to seven. If something 371 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 2: goes wrong, exactly what you just said. If something there's 372 00:18:49,800 --> 00:18:52,320 Speaker 2: an emergency, or you know, whatever it might be, it's 373 00:18:52,320 --> 00:18:54,960 Speaker 2: on me. There's no family, there's no turn to anyone else. 374 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:57,960 Speaker 2: It's on you. Oh sorry, I'm too pissed. I went 375 00:18:58,000 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 2: out and I got on the piss with me mate, 376 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:03,399 Speaker 2: had a long lunch or whatever. Well, hang on your boys, 377 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 2: sitting down the road and pissing down rain. You meant 378 00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:09,120 Speaker 2: to have picked him up, you know, ship, There's no 379 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:11,679 Speaker 2: room for that. There's no root. It's about you know, 380 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:17,320 Speaker 2: being I guess, being honest with yourself, taking ownership, being 381 00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 2: a present father, you know, putting the time and effort 382 00:19:19,840 --> 00:19:20,800 Speaker 2: in and giving back. 383 00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:23,879 Speaker 1: And I like, my kids are adults now. And what 384 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,439 Speaker 1: I what I can say is Okay, we've had the 385 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: separation and the dramas that come come with that, but 386 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:33,119 Speaker 1: the work that I put in the stay connected. And 387 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:35,240 Speaker 1: I see this a lot in the in the cops, 388 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,159 Speaker 1: there's a lot of divorces or the divorces across across 389 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 1: the range. 390 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:39,919 Speaker 2: Now you should say. 391 00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, I can only imagine, but I see guys that 392 00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,000 Speaker 1: there was one though I won't won't say his name, 393 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,240 Speaker 1: but he was working in the city. He'd moved to 394 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:52,879 Speaker 1: the city, but his son was living up at Newcastle. 395 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:54,920 Speaker 1: So you're looking at our and a half two hour 396 00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:59,040 Speaker 1: two hour drive. Realistically, he would coach the football team. 397 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:02,600 Speaker 1: He would drive up there and like four hours behind 398 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,720 Speaker 1: the wheel, but just wanted to coach the team. I 399 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:08,480 Speaker 1: said to this bloke and he was a good friend, 400 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:11,480 Speaker 1: or he's a good friend, And I said, by doing 401 00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:13,600 Speaker 1: what you're doing, you're going to be rewarded in the future. 402 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:15,639 Speaker 1: When your son grows up, he's going to know how 403 00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:17,919 Speaker 1: much you put in so little things like that. So 404 00:20:18,320 --> 00:20:21,879 Speaker 1: if we're sitting here now, wise and wise people, I 405 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:24,240 Speaker 1: just think the time you invest in your children comes 406 00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,440 Speaker 1: back in bucket loads when they get older. I see 407 00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 1: the type of kids or type of adults my children 408 00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:32,119 Speaker 1: have grown up to and all the values that was 409 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 1: painstakingly tried to install them as they were growing up. 410 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:37,920 Speaker 1: I actually got it. I didn't know at the time, 411 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:39,960 Speaker 1: but they actually got it. And I'm really proud. You know. 412 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:42,280 Speaker 2: You know what I just think I've gotten here, Garrett, 413 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 2: right now is the value of our conversation in reference 414 00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 2: to being fathers. Yeah, like here we are really to 415 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:54,520 Speaker 2: talk about, you know, I scares giving people better ways 416 00:20:54,520 --> 00:20:57,679 Speaker 2: and better choices in life through not choosing the paths 417 00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:00,680 Speaker 2: of criminality and all that sort of stuff. I think 418 00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:02,679 Speaker 2: the purpose of us being here has brought us to 419 00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 2: where we are now about us with our past yeah, 420 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 2: not being what we thought was the best version of 421 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:14,360 Speaker 2: ourselves as fathers to being here right now, and this 422 00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:17,159 Speaker 2: is the conversation we were meant to have, which I 423 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:20,639 Speaker 2: think brings us so much value because I think the 424 00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:23,159 Speaker 2: tools that we can give to people, which is a 425 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:25,879 Speaker 2: part of what we're trying to achieve here with season 426 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 2: sixteen about bettering ourselves, it all starts within the home. 427 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,800 Speaker 1: Well, it's funny how we fell there. It fell into 428 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:34,800 Speaker 1: this spot because it wasn't where we were going. 429 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:35,440 Speaker 2: But not at all. 430 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 1: I've had opportunity to reflect on where my life is now, 431 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,560 Speaker 1: with all the things that have changed, and when it 432 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:43,880 Speaker 1: comes all said and done, the excitement of what I've 433 00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:47,400 Speaker 1: had in the Cops, the exciting stuff I'm doing post 434 00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:49,720 Speaker 1: the Cops, when it's all said and done, it's a 435 00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 1: family that really Yeah, that's the thing that rocks my boat. 436 00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 1: When it's all said and done. I could lose all 437 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:58,960 Speaker 1: that and if I still had the relationships. The personal 438 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 1: relationships are fans. 439 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:05,920 Speaker 2: Life's good. For anybody out there that's doubting the love 440 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 2: of your child, don't because it's the most purest love 441 00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:14,040 Speaker 2: that you'll ever have. You'll have marriage, breakups, you'll have 442 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:16,359 Speaker 2: partners maybe come and go. And if you're blessed to 443 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 2: be of that small percentage that's able to be in 444 00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:21,240 Speaker 2: love and have that one love for the rest of 445 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,520 Speaker 2: your life and raise your family, then that's amazing. And 446 00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 2: I feel that that is just a really beautiful gift. 447 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:31,120 Speaker 2: Embrace that. But for majority, and I feel that here 448 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:35,840 Speaker 2: is a majority today as we speak. Never ever, ever 449 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,680 Speaker 2: feel that your children don't love you, and never give up. 450 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:42,439 Speaker 2: As somebody who has a distant relationship with my oldest 451 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:45,399 Speaker 2: son because of the choices that I did make, I 452 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,639 Speaker 2: have one hundred percent learned to be a better father 453 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:53,400 Speaker 2: with my three children after that, and I will always 454 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:57,239 Speaker 2: keep that door open. And the love is unquestionable. But 455 00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:59,359 Speaker 2: I also look and I feel, you know, when my 456 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 2: children look at me and say thanks to that all 457 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:03,560 Speaker 2: I'm proud of you, Dad, or give me that hug 458 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:05,359 Speaker 2: and that so can you tuck me in, Dad? Still 459 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 2: means a lot, you know, it means a lot. And 460 00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 2: give me a little bit emotional. 461 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,120 Speaker 1: Tsuesh there you got the tissues. 462 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:14,639 Speaker 2: That was another thing. There was props put there for 463 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 2: the reason. So you know what, Gary, I'm just going 464 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 2: to flip this on its head and say this was 465 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:25,159 Speaker 2: never the path that we're going to end up. But 466 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 2: how's the meaning and the purpose right now? And the 467 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 2: real like the reality of real of two fathers. Forget 468 00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:36,560 Speaker 2: about where we've come from, the paths we've walked, but 469 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:40,160 Speaker 2: what we've learned and how we've been able to give 470 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 2: that back to our children and become better men because 471 00:23:44,000 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 2: of the love of our children. 472 00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 1: We didn't thought think we'd be talking down this path. 473 00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 2: Well, no, I wasn't going personal with you, but it's 474 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:54,880 Speaker 2: ended up. Well I've had no we were going personal, 475 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:58,000 Speaker 2: was very personal to start. Well, yeah, this is a 476 00:23:58,000 --> 00:23:58,720 Speaker 2: different person. 477 00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 1: I've had a lot of time to reflect on things 478 00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: and my life and the chaos that was my life, 479 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 1: and my chaos would have partly insignificance to what it 480 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 1: would be in the outlaw motorcycle gangs, but the chaos 481 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:12,400 Speaker 1: of your life and when it's all said and done, 482 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:17,879 Speaker 1: the highs and lows and very similar, what's what's left? 483 00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 1: You got your kids and someone that loves you or 484 00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 1: people that love you. They're the important thing and it's unconditional. 485 00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:27,199 Speaker 2: You never need to question it like you have relationships, 486 00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:30,080 Speaker 2: and you do you question at times is this really, 487 00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:33,199 Speaker 2: you know, is it going to last? Am I happy? 488 00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:37,080 Speaker 1: Well, that's true and sadly, I've been through quite a 489 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:40,159 Speaker 1: few relationships, but there's one consistency is my kids are 490 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:40,720 Speaker 1: always there. 491 00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:43,439 Speaker 2: And I think that if our listeners can take something 492 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:49,959 Speaker 2: from this podcast of ours, is that just give your 493 00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 2: children every possible opportunity that you can to your best means, 494 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 2: and that doesn't mean monetary. Just give them your heart, 495 00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 2: give them your time, give them your patience. And I'm 496 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 2: I've got to slap myself in the face here and 497 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,719 Speaker 2: take some of my own advice because I'm at times 498 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 2: the worst person in the world. I find it very 499 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:10,920 Speaker 2: hard sometimes patient wise. But then I stand there and 500 00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 2: as I'm getting older, I do look and I take 501 00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:18,200 Speaker 2: that breath and I go, It's okay, they're doing good. 502 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:22,240 Speaker 2: I'm doing good, you know, And I think that you're 503 00:25:22,280 --> 00:25:25,879 Speaker 2: doing good. You're doing real good. To all those parents 504 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 2: out there, just don't give up. 505 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:30,679 Speaker 1: Well yeah, yeah, you've got to hang in there. You 506 00:25:30,800 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: really have got to hang in there, and it's worthwhile. 507 00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:36,920 Speaker 1: The rewards come, the reward for the effort to put 508 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,920 Speaker 1: in and sometimes yeah, you don't need it, you don't 509 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:43,080 Speaker 1: want it, but I know you've got to do it 510 00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:46,760 Speaker 1: and that comes. The rewards come at the end. Another 511 00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,040 Speaker 1: thing that's happened here, Brent, and I think this is 512 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,639 Speaker 1: an important thing, and I've seen it on your podcast 513 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:56,800 Speaker 1: and I feel it on my podcast sitting down speaking 514 00:25:56,800 --> 00:25:59,640 Speaker 1: to people like there. I've met so many people doing 515 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:01,600 Speaker 1: the pod car so I never really thought they'd have 516 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 1: something in common with like, yeah, you and I. On paper, 517 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:06,439 Speaker 1: it should have been we should have been punching on 518 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:12,920 Speaker 1: that's the reality of it. But sitting down, I understand 519 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:14,919 Speaker 1: where you're coming from, and I think you know but 520 00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,160 Speaker 1: grudgingly you might understand where I'm coming from. But yeah, 521 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 1: there's some respect there. But the way you've gone about 522 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: your life, I know, I've got to say full credit 523 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:25,680 Speaker 1: to you. 524 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 2: I've got a lot of faults, mate, and I try 525 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 2: to still work on them every day. You know, like 526 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 2: I'm far from perfect, and if I can better myself 527 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:36,040 Speaker 2: one percent better every day, then I know I'm doing 528 00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:38,320 Speaker 2: a good job. And trust me, these days, I wake up, 529 00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 2: look in the mirror and go, you're not winning today. 530 00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:45,280 Speaker 2: There's something there's something here that's not allowing me to 531 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:51,240 Speaker 2: fill my heart with that joy. But I'm learning learning 532 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:55,600 Speaker 2: to take that breath, learning to look at what is good, 533 00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:59,920 Speaker 2: weigh it up and think, Hey, I've been in worse positions. 534 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,439 Speaker 2: Life has been a lot worse than this. I've lost 535 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:07,000 Speaker 2: a lot, A lot's gone that I can never ever 536 00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 2: bring back. Time you'll never get back. So be present. 537 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:15,359 Speaker 2: I may not fill one hundred percent today. I've got 538 00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,520 Speaker 2: to make the best of every opportunity and every situation. 539 00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:19,359 Speaker 2: Right now. 540 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:24,240 Speaker 1: I think you should be proud of yourself. Where how 541 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,480 Speaker 1: you've turned your life around. Because if I look the 542 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,359 Speaker 1: riding on the wall, it wasn't going to be the end. 543 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:31,879 Speaker 2: It wasn't going to be pretty nah. And to be 544 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:35,120 Speaker 2: honest with you, I was prepared to have already been 545 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,200 Speaker 2: dead ten times over. But that was where my life 546 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 2: was heading. You know, there was nothing, nothing good that 547 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:45,919 Speaker 2: was coming of my life. You know, the hurdles are 548 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 2: still there, but I'm going over them, and I'm going 549 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,200 Speaker 2: over them in strides that are very strong, and I 550 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,440 Speaker 2: believe that, you know, I will come out the other 551 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,679 Speaker 2: side and life will be good. And if God allows 552 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:01,760 Speaker 2: me to continue to live and live in a healthy manner, 553 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,760 Speaker 2: and you know, watch my children grow, then so be it. 554 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,400 Speaker 2: If He's got other decisions, then that's just the way. 555 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:10,960 Speaker 1: Can I say another thing too, And I'm seeing the 556 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: battles you're going through physically with injuries and the way 557 00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:16,719 Speaker 1: you keep yourself fit. And we have talked about this 558 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,639 Speaker 1: that it keeps us sane. The mental training, you know, 559 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 1: if you're looking if yeah, not that we've got great 560 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,680 Speaker 1: wisdom look at this to burn out X bikey x cop, 561 00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,720 Speaker 1: but the importance of physical training that keeps me sane. 562 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 1: That honestly, no matter what I'm going through, if I 563 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 1: can get out and work up a sweat, do something 564 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:36,720 Speaker 1: that keeps me saying. 565 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,400 Speaker 2: I think it's a very important tool for the toolbox 566 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 2: and I feel that, you know, if you actually take 567 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 2: that step, just create that hour. Everyone says I haven't 568 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 2: got time. Bullshit. I get up at four o'clock in 569 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:49,440 Speaker 2: the morning, you know what I mean. So I make 570 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:52,080 Speaker 2: that time between four and five is my time. Whatever 571 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:54,920 Speaker 2: I can get in that hour is a worthy hour, 572 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:56,640 Speaker 2: and I make the best of it and it sets 573 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 2: me up for the day. You know. I'm sure you've 574 00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:02,680 Speaker 2: got tools in your box that are very relative as well. 575 00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 1: I love those early morning starts. People say I'm not 576 00:29:06,040 --> 00:29:08,680 Speaker 1: a morning person. It is the best time. I feel 577 00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:10,600 Speaker 1: like I've got the head start on everyone else in 578 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:10,840 Speaker 1: the mind. 579 00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 2: I like to say, rise with the sun. 580 00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:15,240 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, get up there and get into it. And 581 00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 1: you've already doesn't matter what happens for the rest of 582 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:20,600 Speaker 1: the day, because you've done some stuff for yourself, done 583 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 1: your training and ready to go. 584 00:29:23,360 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 2: Well, there you have it, guys, Gary jubilant, Thank you 585 00:29:25,720 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 2: very much for the I Catch Killers, Clink hot Cross. 586 00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,400 Speaker 1: Finally we've got eye catch killers. I've given them the 587 00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:35,480 Speaker 1: credit where the credits due. I got you up here. 588 00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:38,040 Speaker 2: I milked you in and look, you know, I had 589 00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 2: to be done. I feel that it needed to be done, 590 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,240 Speaker 2: and I'm glad we got to break the ice. Yeah. 591 00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:44,840 Speaker 2: I don't look at you as a cop or ex 592 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 2: cop or anything like. I look at you as, you know, 593 00:29:48,320 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 2: another bloke doing his best. And you know, I really 594 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:55,320 Speaker 2: have to say to have experienced and gone through some 595 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 2: of the things that you've done and the great things 596 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:00,960 Speaker 2: that you've achieved to help people, you know, especially in 597 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 2: the space of young young children and stuff like that 598 00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:08,120 Speaker 2: I couldn't personally do. I don't think many of us could. 599 00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 2: So from from a real human point of view, Yeah, 600 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 2: I just want to say, may you can really, I 601 00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:21,760 Speaker 2: think have been an asset to helping helping others through 602 00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:29,200 Speaker 2: your actions the earlier spaces in you okay, fuck yourself. 603 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 2: I knew if I had to get it in at 604 00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 2: the end makers all jakeus side, you could have been 605 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,840 Speaker 2: one of those pricks at Batsby, but thankfully you weren't. 606 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 2: But which stage, But no, all jokes aside to do 607 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:46,239 Speaker 2: the job that you did, especially in the back end 608 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,600 Speaker 2: of your career, it's you're a one percent you know, 609 00:30:49,920 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 2: of being able to successfully do that job and not. 610 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:55,880 Speaker 2: And well, I don't say not, because I'm sure that 611 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 2: it has had it. 612 00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:01,200 Speaker 1: Look for you saying that it's humble, then I need 613 00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:02,960 Speaker 1: to just put out there too. There's a lot of 614 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:04,360 Speaker 1: people that put in a lot of a lot of 615 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:06,640 Speaker 1: hard work, and not just in the Cops. I've said 616 00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:08,680 Speaker 1: it since I've left the Cops. People are doing some 617 00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:12,600 Speaker 1: shit loader heavy lifting that don't get the recognition because 618 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:14,120 Speaker 1: of the nature of my work. I was getting a 619 00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: lot of recognition. But I appreciate, appreciate what you're saying. 620 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,280 Speaker 1: But yeah, as you say, you're not perfect, No mean 621 00:31:21,320 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: it's perfect. I'm a cluster fucking a lot of things 622 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,320 Speaker 1: in my life. I just happen to be able to 623 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:30,880 Speaker 1: do some aspects of policing very well. But I've enjoyed 624 00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 1: coming on. I haven't worked out what the revenge is, 625 00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:34,440 Speaker 1: how I'm going to get you down the Sydney, but 626 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:37,480 Speaker 1: we'll work it out. Might line up, I could set 627 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:38,640 Speaker 1: up the boxing ring. 628 00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:44,280 Speaker 2: A charity boxing shit, Okay, what we're doing? 629 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:47,000 Speaker 1: What's the agreed way? 630 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 2: I ain't dropping another twenty kilos, That's all I know. 631 00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:53,360 Speaker 2: And on that note, thank you very much, Gary Jubulant, 632 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 2: and to everybody out there, I hope that you've enjoyed 633 00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,520 Speaker 2: these couple of episodes. It is something that I really 634 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:01,880 Speaker 2: feel have a lot of value. And for everybody out 635 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,160 Speaker 2: there that's doing your best, just continue to be the 636 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 2: best you can be and know that that love from 637 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:10,239 Speaker 2: your children is an unconditional love and never question it. 638 00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 1: All Right, you tried to steal the ending. Also, i'd 639 00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,800 Speaker 1: like to say for my Catch Killers, not just the Clink, 640 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 1: I enjoyed the chat too. So whichever platform you're listening 641 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:23,440 Speaker 1: to the I Catch Killers Slash Clink or Clink Slash 642 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 1: by Catch Killers podcast, hope you enjoy it like we've 643 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:32,400 Speaker 1: been enjoyed the chat. Well, I know I probably shouldn't 644 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:34,960 Speaker 1: like Brent. Well, I don't know I shouldn't like him. 645 00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 1: I do like him. I'm glad we got to have 646 00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,680 Speaker 1: a discussion, and it's good to see things from other 647 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:44,680 Speaker 1: people's perspectives, and I think we found some common ground. 648 00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,600 Speaker 1: And I respect you for the person that you are.