WEBVTT - Credlin | 3 September 0:00:08.100 --> 0:00:10.340 Good evening. Welcome to the program. It's been a big week. 0:00:10.420 --> 0:00:13.600 Here's what's coming up tonight on Credlin. More on the 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:18.290 Bondi Royal Commission. A second whistleblower coming forward. And the 0:00:18.370 --> 0:00:22.190 AFP Association said the police union, they'll join me live 0:00:22.230 --> 0:00:25.829 tonight as they confirm warnings were sent to the government... 0:00:25.970 --> 0:00:29.290 just weeks before the Bondi attack. More reasons why this 0:00:29.350 --> 0:00:33.780 Royal Commission must be reopened. An update in the fight 0:00:33.820 --> 0:00:38.900 against the highly controversial New England Renewable Energy Zone. Locals 0:00:39.060 --> 0:00:44.540 fighting a growing revolt against a 305 kilometre transmission corridor 0:00:44.950 --> 0:00:46.650 as farmers and residents. 0:00:46.250 --> 0:00:47.729 Battle to protect their land. 0:00:48.390 --> 0:00:52.770 It's National Flag Day today, 125 years ago to the 0:00:52.830 --> 0:00:56.930 day since the Australian flag was first raised in Melbourne. 0:00:57.310 --> 0:00:59.550 Plenty of you have sent me your flags. We'll get 0:00:59.570 --> 0:01:02.070 them up on the screen shortly. So we celebrate our 0:01:02.110 --> 0:01:05.789 country and our flag as we should. And the Coalition 0:01:05.850 --> 0:01:09.890 unveils its tobacco tax alternative, vowing to wipe out the 0:01:09.930 --> 0:01:14.250 illegal trade, end the tobacco wars and light a fire 0:01:14.330 --> 0:01:17.390 under Labor for creating the mess in the first place. 0:01:18.100 --> 0:01:24.360 More crime, more smoking, and the result is Australians are 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:27.210 worse off and less tax. 0:01:27.130 --> 0:01:28.289 Revenues for the government. 0:01:28.330 --> 0:01:29.929 So it's been a complete disaster. 0:01:31.930 --> 0:01:34.750 But first, if the report by the Bondi Royal Commission 0:01:34.870 --> 0:01:37.890 is handed down as planned on the 18th of December, 0:01:38.510 --> 0:01:41.310 it will be one of our shortest ever royal commissions 0:01:41.770 --> 0:01:46.350 into our worst ever terror attack. If that happens, I 0:01:46.390 --> 0:01:50.010 don't believe it will have done what Australians expected this 0:01:50.050 --> 0:01:52.610 Royal Commission to do. To get to the bottom of 0:01:52.690 --> 0:01:56.680 how and why in a country like this, 15 innocent men, 0:01:56.860 --> 0:02:00.020 women and children could be gunned down in an act 0:02:00.060 --> 0:02:05.000 of terror. And to exhaustively examine what obviously went wrong 0:02:05.480 --> 0:02:08.530 so that we do whatever it takes to make sure 0:02:08.690 --> 0:02:12.770 acts of terror have no place in Australia. But thus far, 0:02:12.830 --> 0:02:16.350 from everything I've read, all the witness testimony I've heard, 0:02:16.930 --> 0:02:20.690 and now what whistleblowers are telling me, I just don't 0:02:20.830 --> 0:02:24.059 think that's going to happen. And we can't accept that, 0:02:24.100 --> 0:02:28.919 can we? Because unless Virginia Bell urgently reopens public hearings 0:02:29.300 --> 0:02:32.720 and this Royal Commission starts taking evidence from people like 0:02:32.760 --> 0:02:35.399 the brave police officer who made sure I saw his 0:02:35.480 --> 0:02:42.460 submission exposing critical capability flaws in counterterrorism, Well, we won't 0:02:42.500 --> 0:02:45.760 get a royal commission with fair dinkum recommendations. We won't 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:48.780 get a royal commission that honestly deals with the acts 0:02:48.820 --> 0:02:52.080 and omissions of government and those that should have done 0:02:52.340 --> 0:02:57.750 better will never be held account. Unless Virginia Bell urgently 0:02:57.810 --> 0:03:01.190 reopens his royal commission, the risk is that she will 0:03:01.270 --> 0:03:05.450 deliver a report that's too bad, so sad, and we 0:03:05.490 --> 0:03:08.660 all move on. Remember, this is what happened in the 0:03:08.740 --> 0:03:13.400 Daniel Andrews era, that infamous coat inquiry into hotel quarantine 0:03:13.460 --> 0:03:18.269 failures that cost the lives of some 1,000 Victorians. All 0:03:18.310 --> 0:03:21.970 those MPs, the Premier, everyone, and ministers too, all there 0:03:22.030 --> 0:03:25.390 on the stand saying, I don't know, I don't remember, 0:03:26.110 --> 0:03:28.810 with the ultimate conclusion when the report was handed down 0:03:29.340 --> 0:03:32.780 that it was catastrophic failure across the board, but no 0:03:33.200 --> 0:03:35.300 one individual responsible. 0:03:36.290 --> 0:03:38.250 And that was it. That was the end of it. 0:03:38.790 --> 0:03:43.510 No consequences and definitely no changes as to how government 0:03:43.550 --> 0:03:48.480 might deal with a future pandemic crisis. Part of Cote's 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:50.700 problem was that she never had the powers of a 0:03:50.740 --> 0:03:55.570 royal commission. to compel documents and subpoena witnesses. But that's 0:03:55.690 --> 0:03:59.290 no impediment to Bell. A Royal Commission is the most 0:03:59.390 --> 0:04:03.790 powerful vehicle we have as Australians to get to the truth. 0:04:04.530 --> 0:04:08.070 But those powers are only applicable if the Commissioner is 0:04:08.110 --> 0:04:11.310 prepared to use them. Now, I go back to the 0:04:11.370 --> 0:04:15.780 point that if Virginia Bell has not called the head 0:04:15.820 --> 0:04:18.460 of the Australian Federal Police, Chrissie Barrett, to give evidence 0:04:18.540 --> 0:04:22.520 to the Royal Commission, then how serious is it How 0:04:22.540 --> 0:04:25.539 can we have heard testimony from Netball Australia but not 0:04:25.580 --> 0:04:30.320 the boss of the AFP? Indeed, the only senior AFP 0:04:30.490 --> 0:04:34.750 evidence that's been put publicly has come from the Assistant Commissioner, 0:04:34.770 --> 0:04:37.390 Stephen Nutt, and even then he was only in the 0:04:37.510 --> 0:04:40.040 stand for 38 minutes. 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:41.860 Well, not good enough. 0:04:42.790 --> 0:04:45.929 After I broke news of this submission here on Monday 0:04:45.970 --> 0:04:49.850 night and the detail in it, that memo from counter-terrorism 0:04:49.930 --> 0:04:55.210 commanders to the AFP top brass, where they pleaded for 0:04:55.350 --> 0:05:01.120 additional resources after other former AFP police have since now 0:05:01.500 --> 0:05:05.140 made contact with me. Tonight, I want to share you 0:05:05.220 --> 0:05:10.960 this from a man we'll call John to protect his identity. Now, 0:05:11.000 --> 0:05:14.880 John's had three decades in the job, working across a 0:05:14.920 --> 0:05:20.540 number of frontline specialist capabilities in the AFP, including counter-terrorism. 0:05:21.360 --> 0:05:23.360 He says he did not make a submission to the 0:05:23.400 --> 0:05:27.720 Royal Commission because he feared it would be ignored. But 0:05:27.820 --> 0:05:30.500 after he watched my program on Monday night, he said, 0:05:31.380 --> 0:05:35.110 I felt it was important to offer corroboration to what 0:05:35.140 --> 0:05:38.930 was being reported because he says things in the AFP 0:05:39.330 --> 0:05:43.590 need to change. As a man of integrity, John says, 0:05:44.430 --> 0:05:48.610 I'm prohibited from providing operational specifics, but I hope what 0:05:48.630 --> 0:05:51.830 I have to say adds weight to what you have reported. 0:05:52.710 --> 0:05:53.350 So here it is. 0:05:54.270 --> 0:05:58.140 He writes, I am not a disgruntled ex-employee motivated by 0:05:58.339 --> 0:06:02.219 revenge or ill will. On the contrary, I offer this 0:06:02.260 --> 0:06:05.380 information in the belief of the truth and that things 0:06:05.520 --> 0:06:09.720 could improve for those operational members who remain in the AFP. 0:06:10.960 --> 0:06:15.580 He says key covert capabilities of the AFP that support 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:20.850 CT in the field are in fact frequently understaffed, writes John, 0:06:21.350 --> 0:06:25.810 when measured against best practice parameters. He says covert teams 0:06:25.870 --> 0:06:29.190 are often deployed with lesser numbers than what best practice 0:06:29.250 --> 0:06:34.710 requires and for extended periods of time. This is often 0:06:34.930 --> 0:06:40.650 contrary to training. He says officers frequently perform duties absent 0:06:40.680 --> 0:06:44.120 of effective command and control, that they are often in 0:06:44.160 --> 0:06:48.420 the field absent of suitable equipment needed to protect themselves 0:06:48.560 --> 0:06:53.520 and others from harm. This is particularly concerning, he says, 0:06:54.290 --> 0:06:59.349 given the targets of CT operations are within or approaching 0:06:59.850 --> 0:07:05.489 radical mindsets and considering radical responses. In the very least, 0:07:05.830 --> 0:07:09.940 the targets are suspected to be so, hence the deployment 0:07:10.380 --> 0:07:16.160 of AFP resources. As John, this former AFP officer, tells me, 0:07:16.940 --> 0:07:20.080 it's not uncommon for a member working in a counter-terrorism 0:07:20.460 --> 0:07:25.660 covert capacity for their only training to be their foundation training, 0:07:26.300 --> 0:07:30.250 their basic course, he says. That is, it is common 0:07:30.290 --> 0:07:34.950 for there to be no formal skills maintenance, recertification, or 0:07:35.060 --> 0:07:40.140 skills enhancement for some frontline members who work counter-terrorism targets. 0:07:41.100 --> 0:07:46.670 Many AFP members working in counter-terrorism are declared competent in 0:07:46.700 --> 0:07:48.690 their roles only once. 0:07:49.470 --> 0:07:51.630 He says skills atrophy. 0:07:52.230 --> 0:07:56.470 Shifts in methodology and technology are not accounted for in 0:07:56.530 --> 0:08:01.100 any credible way across some capabilities that support CT operations. 0:08:02.240 --> 0:08:07.160 The AFP commonly places managers in charge of capabilities for 0:08:07.180 --> 0:08:11.800 which they have no personal qualification or operational experience in. 0:08:12.840 --> 0:08:16.640 He says these managers therefore can have no operational empathy 0:08:16.700 --> 0:08:19.600 for members in the field and do not understand fully 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:24.100 the practical risks. He says pressures and complications members face 0:08:24.600 --> 0:08:29.960 in the challenging counter-terrorism environment are all there. Now go 0:08:30.020 --> 0:08:32.750 back to the information I reported on out of that 0:08:32.850 --> 0:08:37.370 internal memo on Monday, the memo that was co-authored back 0:08:37.429 --> 0:08:43.270 in May 2024 by four counter-terrorism commanders, because that memo 0:08:43.380 --> 0:08:48.900 is damning if accurately describing what a former officer said, 0:08:48.920 --> 0:08:52.240 a former officer, of course, who was never called to 0:08:52.260 --> 0:08:59.800 give evidence. That internal memo reported 25% overall shortfall in 0:08:59.880 --> 0:09:06.000 counter-terrorism staffing nationally, including a 38% critical capability shortage in 0:09:06.040 --> 0:09:11.200 New South Wales. It noted unsustainable leadership vacancies, in particular, 0:09:11.620 --> 0:09:16.160 disabling the Enduring Risk Investigations team, which is responsible for 0:09:16.210 --> 0:09:21.250 monitoring high-risk terrorism offenders. And in a line that demands 0:09:21.510 --> 0:09:26.050 answers from the Albanese government and ministers, these commanders note 0:09:26.130 --> 0:09:31.070 an earlier decision of the National Security Cabinet Committee. It 0:09:31.170 --> 0:09:35.250 was to exclude the AFP from seeking additional resources due 0:09:35.290 --> 0:09:38.770 to budget constraints and that this posed a direct risk 0:09:38.809 --> 0:09:43.850 to the commands and the AFP's ability to meet Australia's 0:09:44.130 --> 0:09:49.939 national security requirements. Now, there is nothing in this information 0:09:49.980 --> 0:09:54.120 tonight from my second whistleblower that's at odds with that 0:09:54.179 --> 0:09:58.090 memo is there. Indeed, it just underscores how seriously challenged 0:09:58.550 --> 0:10:02.620 our counter-terrorism unit appear to be because they just don't 0:10:02.650 --> 0:10:06.920 have the resources that frontline officers say they need. Now, 0:10:06.960 --> 0:10:10.900 what disturbed me most in this latest material I've received 0:10:10.940 --> 0:10:16.280 from this second whistleblower is this. John says, the AFP 0:10:16.300 --> 0:10:21.630 has experienced much success in CT operations. Those operational members 0:10:21.690 --> 0:10:25.809 deserve thanks for doing great work within an internal AFP 0:10:25.870 --> 0:10:31.780 environment that is not conducive to such success. See, this 0:10:31.820 --> 0:10:34.660 is the stuff, this is the stuff that should be 0:10:34.720 --> 0:10:39.459 put under the microscope in a Royal Commission. Not Netball Australia, please, 0:10:39.480 --> 0:10:40.300 we've had enough of that. 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:41.620 We want the. 0:10:41.760 --> 0:10:46.860 Operational reality that counter-terrorism police live under every day to 0:10:47.440 --> 0:10:50.250 try and keep us safe from terrorism. And as I've 0:10:50.290 --> 0:10:53.079 said before, I want to see the politicians under oath 0:10:53.740 --> 0:10:57.800 questioned long and hard about what they did and didn't 0:10:57.900 --> 0:11:02.300 do when it comes to Bondi. All of that must 0:11:02.380 --> 0:11:08.870 be on the table. Otherwise, why are we spending $ 130 0:11:07.690 --> 0:11:12.770 million on this Royal Commission? We don't just want a report. 0:11:12.809 --> 0:11:14.170 Do we? 0:11:14.190 --> 0:11:19.040 We want change and we want the truth. We owe 0:11:19.120 --> 0:11:22.370 the dead the truth. And if we don't get the truth, 0:11:22.450 --> 0:11:25.810 we will have failed them. Because in failing the dead, 0:11:26.210 --> 0:11:29.790 we fail ourselves as a nation to do our best 0:11:30.390 --> 0:11:35.030 to ensure this sort of terrorism never happens again. I 0:11:40.030 --> 0:11:43.120 tell you, it's a crock. Let's head to camera now 0:11:43.140 --> 0:11:47.350 for the headlines. Sky News political reporter. News 24 political reporter, 0:11:47.370 --> 0:11:47.829 there you go. 0:11:47.890 --> 0:11:48.710 Ruben Spargo. 0:11:49.890 --> 0:11:50.370 Good evening. 0:11:50.550 --> 0:11:54.670 The Coalition is pledging to slash the tobacco excise by 80% 0:11:54.670 --> 0:11:57.990 under a new plan to crush organised crime. It would 0:11:58.030 --> 0:12:02.080 also legalise, regulate and tax vapes and nicotine pouches for adults. 0:12:02.080 --> 0:12:06.480 $ 200 million would be spent on a nationwide law enforcement surge. 0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:10.020 The Coalition's plan would knock about $ 24 off a packet 0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:10.679 of cigarettes. 0:12:10.980 --> 0:12:12.500 This has got to stop. 0:12:13.550 --> 0:12:14.870 And it's got to stop now. 0:12:15.010 --> 0:12:16.170 What's wrong with that plan? 0:12:16.730 --> 0:12:19.360 It will kill people. Like, seriously. 0:12:19.380 --> 0:12:23.640 It's estimated around 80% of tobacco consumed in recent years 0:12:23.840 --> 0:12:27.720 has been illicit. Economists are telling borrowers to prepare for 0:12:27.900 --> 0:12:31.300 one or even two more interest rate rises this year. 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:34.280 Mortgage stress is now at its highest level since the 0:12:34.320 --> 0:12:35.720 global financial crisis. 0:12:35.880 --> 0:12:37.980 And we think that probably one is not going to 0:12:38.000 --> 0:12:39.599 be quite enough, that they may very well have to 0:12:39.640 --> 0:12:42.750 come in and deliver two hikes to get inflation to 0:12:42.780 --> 0:12:43.640 head back to target. 0:12:43.970 --> 0:12:47.970 Home values are continuing to fall. HSBC is the latest 0:12:48.050 --> 0:12:51.710 bank to downgrade its price predictions. The Prime Minister is 0:12:51.750 --> 0:12:54.770 on his way home from the Pacific Islands Forum in Palau. 0:12:55.110 --> 0:12:56.740 Beijing loomed over the talks. 0:12:57.030 --> 0:13:00.720 Leaders were unable to reach a consensus statement condemning China's 0:13:00.760 --> 0:13:03.100 missile test, near Tuvalu in July. 0:13:03.620 --> 0:13:06.510 We made an immediate response to that. 0:13:06.890 --> 0:13:07.970 It's a clear response. 0:13:08.230 --> 0:13:13.130 It's unequivocal. And China has certainly heard that message. 0:13:13.490 --> 0:13:17.250 The Prime Minister opened a new Australian-funded solar farm worth 0:13:17.250 --> 0:13:19.290 $ 31 million before departing. 0:13:21.010 --> 0:13:23.400 Right, let's bring in my panel now for the issues 0:13:23.540 --> 0:13:25.359 of the day. We'll get across them all for you now. 0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:29.860 News24 contributor Carolee Katzenbarnes says And News 24 host James Morrow. 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:31.080 Welcome to you both. 0:13:31.780 --> 0:13:33.579 I want to start with the shocking news out of 0:13:33.620 --> 0:13:36.319 New South Wales today, James. What's believed to be a 0:13:37.059 --> 0:13:42.850 second mistaken identity killing in just 48 hours. Here's the 0:13:42.890 --> 0:13:45.370 state opposition leader, Liberal Kelly Sloan. 0:13:46.850 --> 0:13:51.450 To have two people, mistaken identities, where police believe it's 0:13:51.490 --> 0:13:55.380 been a case of mistaken identity, lose their lives at 0:13:55.410 --> 0:13:57.660 their homes, in their bed, in their driveways. 0:13:58.290 --> 0:13:59.429 Is absolutely terrifying. 0:13:59.990 --> 0:14:02.790 And the people of Sydney are right to be terrified 0:14:02.830 --> 0:14:04.550 and they're right to feel like they've been let down 0:14:04.590 --> 0:14:07.880 by their government, a government that has lost control of 0:14:08.679 --> 0:14:10.260 organised crime on our streets. 0:14:11.929 --> 0:14:13.370 Yeah, she's right to say terrifying. 0:14:13.429 --> 0:14:17.050 It's absolutely terrifying in your bed, in your driveway, and 0:14:17.070 --> 0:14:20.250 they're never meant to kill you. You know, we know 0:14:20.270 --> 0:14:22.910 from what police have said today, James, that some of 0:14:22.950 --> 0:14:27.500 these contract killings are conducted by kids, obviously by idiots 0:14:27.520 --> 0:14:30.240 who are getting the wrong person. But it's very, very 0:14:30.400 --> 0:14:33.560 cheap now to source this stuff on the dark web 0:14:33.960 --> 0:14:37.720 and we've got ordinary civilians in the crossfire here. Are 0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:40.460 police on top of this? Is the government on top 0:14:40.500 --> 0:14:43.800 of this? because I fear people in Sydney tonight could 0:14:43.820 --> 0:14:45.950 be justifiably worried they're not. 0:14:46.370 --> 0:14:49.490 Well, particularly if you live, Peter, in Western Sydney and 0:14:49.510 --> 0:14:50.890 some of the areas where a lot of this sort 0:14:50.910 --> 0:14:52.670 of thing takes place. You know, the last 48 hours, 0:14:52.710 --> 0:14:57.150 we've had two shocking cases, one believed to be mistaken identity, 0:14:57.170 --> 0:15:00.180 where a young university student was murdered in his house. 0:15:00.220 --> 0:15:04.170 They had the wrong house. The second case... Today, it's 0:15:04.210 --> 0:15:07.490 believed to have been a tradesperson who was visiting a 0:15:07.550 --> 0:15:10.200 house that may have had a connection to some sort 0:15:10.220 --> 0:15:13.000 of organized crime activity that's all being investigated. But again, 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:17.520 another innocent victim. The cops are doing what they can here, 0:15:17.540 --> 0:15:20.980 but the government is clearly has clearly lost control of 0:15:21.020 --> 0:15:23.500 this one. There's a lot to unpack here. Number one, 0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:25.720 of course, you said these are kids, idiot kids a 0:15:25.740 --> 0:15:27.980 lot of times doing this. But they're doing it because 0:15:28.020 --> 0:15:32.140 they know that the penalties for various crimes are less 0:15:32.230 --> 0:15:34.450 when you are a kid, when you are younger. So 0:15:34.490 --> 0:15:39.690 there's a legal issue around that. There's also a cultural issue, Peter, 0:15:39.730 --> 0:15:43.170 within the gangs where the gangs have now taken on 0:15:43.210 --> 0:15:46.130 a motivation, I think, where they think, well, anybody who's 0:15:46.210 --> 0:15:49.980 vaguely associated with a target or a target family is 0:15:50.040 --> 0:15:53.359 now fair game. So it's become quite tribal now. And 0:15:53.740 --> 0:15:57.500 it's really disturbing because if this continues, you know, it 0:15:57.540 --> 0:15:59.420 just becomes real lawless stuff. 0:16:01.230 --> 0:16:03.250 Yeah, it becomes like, you know, those gang wars we 0:16:03.270 --> 0:16:07.070 saw in Los Angeles a couple of decades ago. Let's 0:16:07.110 --> 0:16:09.830 go to this from the Climate Change Authority today. It 0:16:10.270 --> 0:16:13.220 says concerns about the cost of energy or the impact 0:16:13.500 --> 0:16:18.600 of renewables on regional communities is, quote, misinformation. This is 0:16:18.660 --> 0:16:21.100 a new paper out. It argues that narratives that seek 0:16:21.140 --> 0:16:25.800 to Increase uncertainty about climate policies, technology solutions that focus 0:16:25.860 --> 0:16:30.240 on the cost of living, energy prices, reliability, jobs, regional impacts, 0:16:30.340 --> 0:16:30.780 all of that. 0:16:31.480 --> 0:16:34.450 They're asking whether or not this stuff should be reported on. 0:16:34.460 --> 0:16:37.990 They're claiming it's misinformation if we go down this path, Carol. 0:16:38.020 --> 0:16:40.770 Well, it's an inconvenient truth for them, but they're facts. 0:16:40.990 --> 0:16:41.490 They're facts. 0:16:41.870 --> 0:16:45.330 The prices are going up. Regional communities are cranky. I mean, 0:16:45.350 --> 0:16:47.750 this is all well and in the extreme. 0:16:48.410 --> 0:16:51.070 Absolute gaslighting of every Australian. I mean, if there's any 0:16:51.110 --> 0:16:55.710 misinformation around, isn't it the $ 275 decrease that was meant 0:16:55.750 --> 0:16:58.840 to happen with our power bills? We have spent billions 0:16:59.240 --> 0:17:03.250 on these renewable energy projects. They're just not working. I mean, 0:17:03.370 --> 0:17:08.830 the irony is we export all our uranium. 31 countries 0:17:08.869 --> 0:17:12.830 around the world get their electricity from nuclear, and yet 0:17:12.890 --> 0:17:15.850 we export it. We're not willing to actually invest in 0:17:15.890 --> 0:17:17.899 our own technology. Now, it doesn't matter how we do it, 0:17:18.250 --> 0:17:23.260 but renewables, they're not working. Wind farms, green energy, hydrogen plants. 0:17:23.580 --> 0:17:26.300 We've done all that with billions of taxpayer dollars done 0:17:26.340 --> 0:17:29.740 for subsidies. It's an absolute cheat that the Climate Authority 0:17:29.780 --> 0:17:33.280 has even done this. They're the ones responsible for the misinformation. 0:17:34.180 --> 0:17:36.070 Let's go to that news today, the policy announcement for 0:17:36.090 --> 0:17:40.409 the Coalition. They've pledged to slash the tobacco excise, a 0:17:40.530 --> 0:17:44.910 tobacco tax, by... 80%, they'll legalise vapes, they'll crack down 0:17:45.490 --> 0:17:47.930 on the illicit market if they win the election. I 0:17:48.490 --> 0:17:49.969 have to say, James, I don't think they can do 0:17:50.250 --> 0:17:55.369 anything else here. The government talks about law enforcement. Horses 0:17:55.410 --> 0:17:58.850 bolted on that. The government was critical of the coalition 0:17:58.910 --> 0:18:00.270 foregoing all this revenue. 0:18:00.630 --> 0:18:02.530 Well, memo to the government, have you look at your books. 0:18:02.570 --> 0:18:06.040 You're not getting this revenue because people are not buying 0:18:06.500 --> 0:18:08.040 legal tobacco anymore. 0:18:09.200 --> 0:18:11.060 It's got to happen, I assume. It's got to happen. 0:18:11.480 --> 0:18:13.379 Well, it has to happen. And I can tell you 0:18:13.420 --> 0:18:15.600 that me and fellow host here, Paul Murray, will be 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:17.880 cheering this every step of the way. But, you know, 0:18:18.020 --> 0:18:21.040 it is the basic economics of this are when you 0:18:21.060 --> 0:18:23.840 tax something past a certain point, it's called the Laffer curve. 0:18:24.080 --> 0:18:26.900 You get less of the tax because you've just discouraged 0:18:26.940 --> 0:18:29.419 the activity. With tobacco, of course, you can get the 0:18:29.440 --> 0:18:32.010 illegal stuff because it's very light and easy to smuggle. 0:18:32.050 --> 0:18:34.270 And there you have the situation we are today. But 0:18:34.310 --> 0:18:36.590 it's very funny we're talking about this when we started 0:18:36.650 --> 0:18:40.109 this segment talking about organized crime. The big thing is 0:18:40.170 --> 0:18:42.710 here is that all of this money is getting shoved 0:18:42.770 --> 0:18:45.949 into organized crime. I mean, today, as the coalition announced 0:18:46.000 --> 0:18:49.380 this policy, I think there were two firebombings in Melbourne 0:18:49.420 --> 0:18:52.600 thought to be connected to this trade. It's just like 0:18:52.640 --> 0:18:55.740 the untouchables in Chicago and the old days of prohibition. 0:18:56.040 --> 0:18:58.929 You know, at some point, the government has to back down. 0:18:59.590 --> 0:19:02.450 They'll cut the excise tax dramatically. And I guarantee you 0:19:02.470 --> 0:19:03.889 they're going to get more money out of it. 0:19:05.880 --> 0:19:08.340 Carol, I was pretty outspoken last night about pill testing. 0:19:08.740 --> 0:19:09.480 I don't like it. 0:19:09.560 --> 0:19:10.399 I don't support it. 0:19:10.400 --> 0:19:14.230 I think if something is illegal, it's illegal. You can't 0:19:14.250 --> 0:19:17.669 have a mixed message on it. You're a mum of 0:19:17.770 --> 0:19:20.190 three teenagers. Let me have your take. 0:19:20.790 --> 0:19:22.409 And I'm a tough mum, and I actually wrote a 0:19:22.430 --> 0:19:24.990 column on this 10 years ago that when it did, 0:19:25.020 --> 0:19:26.139 it got shed 30,000 times, and it was. 0:19:28.240 --> 0:19:30.660 Ice addicts, why is it never their fault? I got 0:19:30.740 --> 0:19:35.139 trolled mercilessly because I don't agree with pill testing whatsoever. 0:19:35.300 --> 0:19:38.750 It is actually endorsing illicit and illegal drug use. Saw 0:19:38.770 --> 0:19:41.489 Kel Richards last night as well. Because no one ever 0:19:41.530 --> 0:19:45.310 wants to take responsibility. No one asks people to take drugs. 0:19:45.790 --> 0:19:48.810 Nobody's life ever got better by taking an illicit drug. 0:19:49.109 --> 0:19:50.950 And the problem that I've got... is that no one 0:19:51.020 --> 0:19:53.160 is prepared to actually say it as it is. You 0:19:53.220 --> 0:19:57.360 thankfully did. The problem is in Victoria, they introduced this 0:19:57.420 --> 0:20:01.120 with music festivals. Christmans had said, oh, I was a sceptic, 0:20:01.160 --> 0:20:04.979 now I'm doing it. What message are we sending young people? 0:20:05.340 --> 0:20:08.340 Why are we spending billions of dollars on Australian education? 0:20:08.859 --> 0:20:11.740 and giving them drug education use when we're actually endorsing 0:20:11.850 --> 0:20:15.270 something that actually is illegal. The other thing is, not 0:20:15.330 --> 0:20:19.189 only does it lead to a very weak stance on drugs, 0:20:19.250 --> 0:20:22.790 such as decriminalisation, but people going to music festivals that 0:20:22.890 --> 0:20:27.240 get their pills done. Where is the liability for taxpayers 0:20:27.580 --> 0:20:30.100 and the liability for the pill tester? Because if the 0:20:30.140 --> 0:20:32.560 pill tester tests it, I mean, what else are in 0:20:32.600 --> 0:20:34.979 these illegal drugs? People that are taking it know that 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:37.990 there's solvents and all bits and pieces in there. But 0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:39.899 if you're a pill tester and you say to somebody, 0:20:40.040 --> 0:20:42.619 this is unsafe, are you really happy for them to 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:45.020 then take their drugs, go away and do it? Where's 0:20:45.060 --> 0:20:46.970 the moral thing of grabbing it out of their hand 0:20:47.050 --> 0:20:49.630 and wanting to actually destroy it? But the one thing 0:20:49.690 --> 0:20:51.669 I do want to share with you, Peter, is I 0:20:51.690 --> 0:20:54.650 got trolled mercilessly that I had to rebuild social media 0:20:54.670 --> 0:20:57.909 because because people didn't like what I said. One person 0:20:57.950 --> 0:21:00.909 that did was the mother of a girl that had 0:21:00.970 --> 0:21:04.170 taken her own life. She was left looking after the grandchildren. 0:21:04.550 --> 0:21:07.370 She hand-wrote me a letter and sent it to where 0:21:07.430 --> 0:21:10.129 I was working, and she said, thank you for actually 0:21:10.210 --> 0:21:12.830 saying it. Nobody asked my daughter to go down the 0:21:12.869 --> 0:21:16.780 drug path. I've been left raising two grandchildren. My daughter 0:21:16.820 --> 0:21:20.540 didn't take responsibility, left a huge burden for everybody else. 0:21:20.920 --> 0:21:23.560 And she said, why is the Australian taxpayer always having 0:21:23.600 --> 0:21:27.750 to do this? pill testing, quality control for drug dealers, 0:21:28.150 --> 0:21:31.730 and it's endorsing something that is illegal in Australia. And 0:21:31.770 --> 0:21:33.810 people need to be stronger and just call it out 0:21:33.869 --> 0:21:36.450 for what it is. And no, I do not agree 0:21:36.490 --> 0:21:37.190 with it at all. 0:21:38.350 --> 0:21:40.389 Let's just have a look before we go to my 0:21:40.430 --> 0:21:43.990 next guest. This Oz poll voting intention data has been 0:21:44.030 --> 0:21:46.810 put up this afternoon, and this is really interesting. This 0:21:46.850 --> 0:21:49.949 is the first time we've seen a poll that's in 0:21:50.050 --> 0:21:52.630 positive territory like this for the Liberals in a long, 0:21:52.670 --> 0:21:53.250 long time. 0:21:53.310 --> 0:21:55.030 It's the 4%. move there. 0:21:55.070 --> 0:21:57.830 This is a central Guardian's poll. So Guardian's no friend 0:21:57.869 --> 0:22:01.179 of the Liberal Party. 26% there. Evens with Labor on 26. 0:22:01.170 --> 0:22:05.790 They've done a 5% drop. One Nation's at 23%. The Greens, 0:22:06.170 --> 0:22:08.930 sort of where I'd peg them at, at 13%. There 0:22:08.950 --> 0:22:11.600 you go. I think that's pretty interesting. We'll see what 0:22:11.660 --> 0:22:13.980 happens in the next sort of series of polls from that. 0:22:14.460 --> 0:22:15.960 But those people that say the Libs are dead, I 0:22:16.260 --> 0:22:17.820 think that's telling you something else. 0:22:18.340 --> 0:22:18.920 See you both. 0:22:19.420 --> 0:22:21.540 I'll see you on Sunday, James, when I watch Insiders 0:22:21.619 --> 0:22:26.670 and your show, of course. The US report on Friday night. 0:22:27.130 --> 0:22:29.129 Let's go now to Victoria. This week, the truth appears 0:22:29.170 --> 0:22:32.300 to have come back to bite, to haunt new Premier 0:22:32.359 --> 0:22:36.080 Ben Carroll. Revelations that despite claiming he was in the dark, 0:22:36.560 --> 0:22:39.179 the Labor cabinet was well and truly briefed about the 0:22:39.300 --> 0:22:42.429 secret transport tax a long time ago in 2024 and 0:22:43.670 --> 0:22:47.230 when at the time, of course, Carol was Jacinta Allen's deputy. 0:22:47.810 --> 0:22:51.450 Joining me now, Victorian political editor at The Australian, Anthony Galloway. Well, 0:22:51.490 --> 0:22:55.710 this is utter BS now, Anthony. He prevaricated, sat on 0:22:55.730 --> 0:22:58.030 the fence there for a couple of weeks. We couldn't 0:22:58.050 --> 0:23:01.360 get a straight answer from him. He can't pretend he 0:23:01.390 --> 0:23:02.700 didn't know now that we. 0:23:02.660 --> 0:23:03.820 Know he knew. 0:23:03.840 --> 0:23:06.679 And he was even dodging these questions from our own 0:23:06.920 --> 0:23:08.060 Georgie Dickerson. 0:23:08.140 --> 0:23:10.129 Have a look. Were people not. 0:23:10.090 --> 0:23:12.090 Doing their job properly if they weren't reading the cabinet 0:23:12.130 --> 0:23:14.520 brief and documents in June 2024 if no one seemed 0:23:14.560 --> 0:23:16.320 to know about this charge until now? 0:23:17.140 --> 0:23:20.800 It's very unfair to say something was put in a 0:23:20.859 --> 0:23:27.770 cabinet minute that was decided on seven months earlier. It 0:23:27.810 --> 0:23:31.210 was unfair from the very first day that that cabinet 0:23:31.350 --> 0:23:38.250 meeting occurred with Andrews, Pallison, Allen and Molino in 2021. 0:23:38.550 --> 0:23:40.449 They should have said, this is what we're looking at 0:23:40.950 --> 0:23:42.530