Speaker 1: Why on Sky News.
Speaker 2: This is Sharry.
Speaker 3: Good Evening. Welcome to the show. Coming up tonight. Leaked
Speaker 3: WhatsApp messages of pro Palestinian activists in Australia saying they
Speaker 3: hope Hermas kidnap Peter Dutton. I'll bring you those inflammatory
Speaker 3: messages in a moment. This comes as Peter Dutton goes
Speaker 3: on the attack over the Albanesi government flying Hermas sympathizers
Speaker 3: into Australia. Talk about a national security crisis. On the
Speaker 3: PM's watch, our former ambassador to Israel, Dave Sharma, will
Speaker 3: be on the show to speak about what's at steak
Speaker 3: here and Albanizi's refusal to listen to the RBA on
Speaker 3: pay rises sparks serious concern in the business community. Meanwhile,
Speaker 3: the woke left come out to defend the indefensible. Yes,
Speaker 3: I'm speaking about Raygun.
Speaker 4: In a Maldominated sport as the only woman and you
Speaker 4: look at the history of war we have had as
Speaker 4: women athletes has faced in terms.
Speaker 5: Of criticism, belittlement, judgment.
Speaker 3: Are we now living in a society where criticism of
Speaker 3: poor performance is dismissed as sexism? Or Jennie O Dowd
Speaker 3: would join me to discuss a bit later, but first
Speaker 3: we often sit here and lament that political leaders aren't
Speaker 3: taking national security seriously enough. Well, today Peter Dutton showed
Speaker 3: leadership and said that Albanesi shouldn't be issuing visas to
Speaker 3: Palestinians from the war zone in Gaza.
Speaker 1: I don't think people should be coming in from that
Speaker 1: war zone at all at the moment.
Speaker 6: It's not proven to do so, and I think it
Speaker 6: puts our national security at risk.
Speaker 3: It's an utterly different approach from the Albanesi government, which
Speaker 3: has granted visas to nearly three thousand Palestinians since October seven.
Speaker 3: About half have already arrived in Australia. Visas are being
Speaker 3: granted in as little as an hour, and some aren't
Speaker 3: being sent to Azio for security checks at all. Dart
Speaker 3: And Today put the issue front and center, the topic
Speaker 3: dominating parliamentary question time. This force to left wing media
Speaker 3: outlets to finally report on the concerns around these visas
Speaker 3: that we've been covering on this show since November. It
Speaker 3: all exposed Alberanesi's lack of answers to crucial questions about
Speaker 3: our national security or Peter Dutton today open question time
Speaker 3: by asking whether someone who supports terror terrorism should be
Speaker 3: given an Australian visa.
Speaker 7: Prime Minister, in order to hold a visa, individuals must
Speaker 7: pass a character tist. Does supporting a listed terrorist organization
Speaker 7: like Hamas pass Australia's character tist?
Speaker 3: Of course, Albanzi couldn't answer that question. High immigration is
Speaker 3: already an issue with voters. How could the Prime Minister
Speaker 3: possibly defend bringing people into the country who support a
Speaker 3: listed terror group? Instead, Albanzi accused Dutton of division.
Speaker 8: This week over here he can't ever say can't ever
Speaker 8: say no to anyone on his own team, can't ever
Speaker 8: say no to attempting to raise tension in our community,
Speaker 8: and is always looking for an opportunity to create division.
Speaker 3: And Albanize said by contrast, he seeks to bring people together,
Speaker 3: but if he truly cared about social cohesion, then he
Speaker 3: wouldn't be bringing potential He must sympathizers into Australia. The
Speaker 3: Coalition hounded the government on this issue.
Speaker 9: Has any agency expressed any concern about any individual who
Speaker 9: has arrived from the Gaza war zone since October the seventh?
Speaker 7: Can the Prime Minister guarantee that no individual who participated
Speaker 7: in or supported the October seven Hamas terror attacks, the
Speaker 7: worst mass murder of Jews since the Holocaust, has been
Speaker 7: granted a visa by his government. Will applicants be eligible
Speaker 7: for a permanent or a temporary visa.
Speaker 10: To the Minister for Immigration.
Speaker 11: Has the minister been lobbied by anyone in his electorate
Speaker 11: or any other electorate for a visa?
Speaker 10: That's point for an individual.
Speaker 9: From the Gaza war zone since October seventh.
Speaker 3: Of course, Albanizi had no real answers. He could only
Speaker 3: joke about the topic.
Speaker 2: One of their best, one of their best.
Speaker 8: That question is perhaps of the entire time since Federation,
Speaker 8: perhaps the most broad.
Speaker 3: Well, I don't think he'll be laughing if God forbid
Speaker 3: as an attack from a Hamas supporter that he's flown
Speaker 3: into the country at taxpayer's expense. The truth is we
Speaker 3: don't know precisely how many Palestinians arriving from the war
Speaker 3: zone have undergone rigorous security checks. Defat officials have conceded
Speaker 3: that some visas were being granted in as little as
Speaker 3: one hour.
Speaker 2: Some individuals claim that visit a visa for relatives were approved.
Speaker 12: Within one hour.
Speaker 1: It is possible, sure that how could you possibly do
Speaker 1: all the necessary security and other checks in just an
Speaker 1: hour from an applicant.
Speaker 5: I mean that's lightning speed approval when.
Speaker 6: We apply that vast range of information to consideration of
Speaker 6: visit divisions. So if globally a very large number of
Speaker 6: our visit a visas would be done inside an hour,
Speaker 6: the assessment is essentially looking at all the information we
Speaker 6: hold and applying that in a number of ways to.
Speaker 3: Short the application in front it well to show just
Speaker 3: how pathetic that is. The former AZO boss Duncan Lewis
Speaker 3: said in twenty nineteen that security checks can take months.
Speaker 13: Really the issue that I wanted to get to. If
Speaker 13: a person's a foreign national who's lived a substantial part
Speaker 13: of their lives overseas, there would be some difficulty turning
Speaker 13: around the advice for a QSA or or an ASA
Speaker 13: from AZOS perspective, getting that advice to a minister in
Speaker 13: a timely manner.
Speaker 14: There could be yes, we would typically have to go
Speaker 14: to second and third countries to test their holdings on
Speaker 14: the individual, and that takes time.
Speaker 13: When you say that takes time, can you give us
Speaker 13: an indication.
Speaker 5: Of by how long that it can be?
Speaker 3: Several months, months, several months, not an hour, not a day.
Speaker 3: Worse than this, AZIO Director General Mike Burgess has said
Speaker 3: not all visas are sent to the top spy agency.
Speaker 3: Here was that shocking admission.
Speaker 2: And I can assure your audience that when things get
Speaker 2: referred to Asia, we deal with them effectively. And of
Speaker 2: course there might be times when they didn't get referred to.
Speaker 12: Us in time.
Speaker 3: There might be times when they didn't get referred to
Speaker 3: us in time. That comment is highly alarming given there
Speaker 3: are thousands of terrorists and her Must supporters in Gaza. Well,
Speaker 3: it was first on this show that we exposed the
Speaker 3: flawed security process, and I revealed back in February that
Speaker 3: a her Must sympathizer was now in Melbourne after being
Speaker 3: granted by the Albanese government a visa. Now, this right
Speaker 3: here is the list of hundreds, nearly five hundred Palestinians
Speaker 3: who've been granted visas to leave Gaza. Eighty one of
Speaker 3: them he headed for Australia. And our revelation tonight that
Speaker 3: the Albanzi government has granted a twenty one year old
Speaker 3: her Must sympathizer a visa calls into question the adequacy
Speaker 3: of their security checks was in February, yet they just
Speaker 3: kept granting visas regardless. Australia's Israel and Jewish Affairs Councils
Speaker 3: Colin Rubinstein said today that he was concerned that Hermask
Speaker 3: supporters could enter the country under this scheme. He said,
Speaker 3: while we understand and support the need to help Palestinian
Speaker 3: civilians affected by the war her Musk launched on October seven,
Speaker 3: it's also important to remember that opinion polls of guards
Speaker 3: or residents show a significant majority not only support her
Speaker 3: Musk but also its actions on that day. And you
Speaker 3: don't need me to remind you how horrific the actions
Speaker 3: on that day were.
Speaker 1: Now.
Speaker 3: Dartan has experienced backlash for his tough stance. Two weeks
Speaker 3: ago when he visited Israel, an activist in a pro
Speaker 3: Palestinian WhatsApp group posted why can't her Musk kidnap him
Speaker 3: while he's there but don't return him? I rang that
Speaker 3: activist today who'd made those remarks, and she laughed at
Speaker 3: me on the phone and she said it was an
Speaker 3: effing joke, go away and hung up the phone. The
Speaker 3: way Albanesi and Dutton approached this issue reflect how they
Speaker 3: see Israel and the current war. Alban Ezi has been
Speaker 3: anti Israel and a pro Palestinian activist for most of
Speaker 3: his political career. Owing wes Yep, Albanzi there holding the megaphone,
Speaker 3: and he was already in federal politics. But Dutton is
Speaker 3: tough on national security. He knows that Israel is constantly
Speaker 3: under attack from terrorists on all borders. It's a daily
Speaker 3: fight for survival. Dutton knows two that Islamic extremism is
Speaker 3: the current top terror threat facing our country. So on
Speaker 3: earth would Albanezi think it's okay to kick start in
Speaker 3: immigration program from the most radical, violent and bloodthirsty regime
Speaker 3: in the world right now, especially without adequate security screening.
Speaker 3: Albanese's obligation, not even his obligation. His duty as Prime
Speaker 3: Minister is not to save people on the other side
Speaker 3: of the world. It's to protect his own citizens. We
Speaker 3: have unprecedented lawlessness and racism in Australia under his watch,
Speaker 3: and he risks adding fuel to the fire with a
Speaker 3: reckless immigration program. Albanize needs to wake up and realize
Speaker 3: he's no longer a radical left wing protester. He's the
Speaker 3: prime minister and he needs to govern for all Australians.
Speaker 5: Now I'm going to come back.
Speaker 3: To that topic with Dave Sharma in a moment, but
Speaker 3: for now, let's turn to the economy and pay rises
Speaker 3: for public sector workers. New data from the ABS has
Speaker 3: shown that public sector wages have grown at three point
Speaker 3: nine percent in the year to June. That's up from
Speaker 3: three point one percent a year earlier. Now, this zero
Speaker 3: point nine percent growth is the highest June quarter rise
Speaker 3: in twelve years. That's a good thing if you're a
Speaker 3: worker receiving a pay rise, But for the rest of
Speaker 3: the country, these public sector pay rises are inflationary and
Speaker 3: they risk pushing up rates even higher. Albanezi gave childcare
Speaker 3: workers a fifteen percent pay rise just days after RBA
Speaker 3: Governor Michelle Bullock warned government spending was inflationary. And now
Speaker 3: unions representing aged care workers and disability care as are
Speaker 3: set to demand pay rises.
Speaker 5: Too, And who could blame?
Speaker 3: Who could blame them? They do deserve a pay rise,
Speaker 3: but the issue is that Michelle Bullock has specifically said
Speaker 3: that even modest wage gains, and fifteen percent isn't modest,
Speaker 3: but even modest wage gains of three and a half
Speaker 3: percent would prove inflationary if productivity growth didn't improve the
Speaker 3: fact that their strong wage growth without productivity growth is
Speaker 3: risky and it's keeping inflation persistent. Well, to further discuss this,
Speaker 3: let's bring in tonight's political panel Labor MP and Chair
Speaker 3: of the Australian Labor Party Economics Committee, Andrew Charlton and
Speaker 3: National's leader in the Senate Bridget Mackenzie. Great to see
Speaker 3: you both back again. Andrew, you're famously an economist. Do
Speaker 3: you agree with the RBA that pay rises in the
Speaker 3: public sector are inflationary when productivity is as weak as
Speaker 3: it is at the moment.
Speaker 1: Well, good to be with you, Shari, and you're right.
Speaker 1: We did get wages data out this week and that
Speaker 1: wages data showed that real wages have grown in Australia
Speaker 1: for the last three concents secutive quarters. And that's in
Speaker 1: contrast to the last ten years when Australian wages flatlined.
Speaker 1: There was no real wages growth for ten years. So
Speaker 1: I think it's a good thing that wages are moving
Speaker 1: in the right direction. Specifically, on the types of workers
Speaker 1: that you've been talking about and their impact on inflation,
Speaker 1: I'd say a couple of things. First, of all, I'd
Speaker 1: say that most Australians would look at those workers and
Speaker 1: agree that they have been underpaid for a long time.
Speaker 1: And most Australians would also see that if we don't
Speaker 1: lift wages in those sectors, we're going to have a
Speaker 1: workforce crisis in critical areas areas like age care looking
Speaker 1: after elderly Australians and childcare educating the next generation of Australians.
Speaker 1: But your point is right. If we want these wage
Speaker 1: risers to be sustainable, which we do, we have to
Speaker 1: make sure they are backed by productivity gains and that's
Speaker 1: why the government is so focused on lifting the rate
Speaker 1: of productivity growth up from the record low that the
Speaker 1: Liberals left it at.
Speaker 3: Bridget Are you confident that the government is doing enough,
Speaker 3: as Andrew just said, to lift productivity and enough to
Speaker 3: mean that these fifteen percent pay rises that could be
Speaker 3: replicated in other sectors, that they won't be inflationary.
Speaker 15: No, I'm not, Shahi. There's no surprise in that. And
Speaker 15: I'm not the only one that lacks confidence in the
Speaker 15: federal government. It seems the Reserve Bank governor does as well.
Speaker 15: The reality is she was very very clear that state
Speaker 15: and federal governments. Labor governments are not only increasing the
Speaker 15: pay rate of public servants, they're also increasing the headcount,
Speaker 15: which is actually leading to significant issues and keeping inflation
Speaker 15: higher than it for longer than it actually needs to be.
Speaker 15: Economists are very, very concerned about the spending profile of
Speaker 15: state and federal labor governments and the heated nature that
Speaker 15: they having in our economy. More broadly, so Andrew talks
Speaker 15: a big game on productivity. It starts with a zero.
Speaker 15: It has the entire time they've been in government. And
Speaker 15: when you've got productivity dampening policies such as the industrial
Speaker 15: relations policies that they've been bringing in, such as cuts
Speaker 15: to funding critical road and rail infrastructure projects that would
Speaker 15: increase the productivity, particularly of our supply chains across the country,
Speaker 15: they're pulling all the wrong levers and that is why
Speaker 15: Australians are having to have interest rates higher than they
Speaker 15: need to be for longer than they need to be
Speaker 15: and longer than they are being in comparable countries acround
Speaker 15: the world.
Speaker 3: Look, let's have a look at the levels of immigration.
Speaker 3: The Daily Telegraph today reporting a massive one point one
Speaker 3: five million migrants have arrived under the Alban Ezy government.
Speaker 3: That's sixty two percent more migrants than during the rud
Speaker 3: Gillard Rudd era, when it was also quite high. Now
Speaker 3: Andrew the government has argued publicly that it does intend
Speaker 3: to cut the migration program. But do you think that
Speaker 3: this now could be delayed or should be delayed, and
Speaker 3: do you think migration might be kept high so as
Speaker 3: to keep Australia out of a recession.
Speaker 1: Well, Charry, you're right that migration numbers have been high,
Speaker 1: and in particular they've been high in comparison to the
Speaker 1: record lows during COVID. There was a big bounce back
Speaker 1: from those record lows once international borders reopened and once
Speaker 1: students started to come back to Australia from other countries.
Speaker 1: What the government has now done is to make sure
Speaker 1: that we manage the overall rate of migration. We are
Speaker 1: in the process of harving the net migration to Australia
Speaker 1: from its peak by the end of this financial year,
Speaker 1: and we're doing that through responsible actions to close some
Speaker 1: of the loopholes that the previous government left in the
Speaker 1: post COVID era, by making sure that we bring integrity
Speaker 1: back to our international education system, and by reforming the
Speaker 1: migration system to make sure it best suits the needs
Speaker 1: of Australia and the skills gaps that we have in
Speaker 1: this country. So I think we're getting the migration numbers
Speaker 1: down by half and doing it in a way that
Speaker 1: will deliver lots of positive benefits to Australia over the
Speaker 1: longer term.
Speaker 3: Bridget. The issue is the migration levels are putting more
Speaker 3: pressure on housing, no doubt about it. But without the
Speaker 3: high migration we'd been recession right now. So do you think,
Speaker 3: given the economy is still teetering and we're still walking
Speaker 3: that narrow path to avoid going into recession, do you
Speaker 3: think actually perhaps the government does need to keep migration
Speaker 3: levels high for at least the next twelve months.
Speaker 5: No, I don't, Chari.
Speaker 15: I think if they actually did other things, like got
Speaker 15: their spending under control and focused on productivity enhancing measures
Speaker 15: rather than politically enhancing economic measures, you'd see a different
Speaker 15: economic profile right now.
Speaker 5: The reality is we've got record migration.
Speaker 15: Because the Labor Party has approved a record number of
Speaker 15: visas since coming to government.
Speaker 5: That's it, full stop.
Speaker 15: And if you are in our suburbs or congested regional capitals,
Speaker 15: you cannot afford a house if you're in the market
Speaker 15: and you can't find a house to actually rent, and
Speaker 15: that is the reality. And anybody who's sat in the
Speaker 15: car park that are our main road arterials at peak
Speaker 15: hour it knows that we need to put a brake
Speaker 15: on migration. And I'm really tired of hearing the talking
Speaker 15: points and yet again seeing no action from the ministers
Speaker 15: responsible on behalf of the Australian people to get this
Speaker 15: under control.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a huge problem, the rental crisis as well.
Speaker 3: We seeing average families becoming homeless as well. Now this
Speaker 3: is a bit of a controvert rcial idea from Government
Speaker 3: Services Minister Bill Shott, and he's announced a thought bubble
Speaker 3: perhaps that Labor is developing a digital ID program. It's
Speaker 3: known as the Trust Exchange or TEXT for shot here
Speaker 3: he was speaking about it yesterday.
Speaker 14: Text is something brand new and world leading. It is
Speaker 14: not a wallet, nor an app nor ID, but rather
Speaker 14: it is a secure means by which to exchange with
Speaker 14: a third party who you are, your identity and what
Speaker 14: you can do your credentials.
Speaker 3: Andrew, why do Australians need a digital ID?
Speaker 1: Well, Australians should have the choice to have a digital ID.
Speaker 1: Because it will significantly increase their security online. What we
Speaker 1: have at the moment is a system where if you
Speaker 1: want to prove your identity to any service provider, a
Speaker 1: healthcare provider, a bank, another utility, you are required to
Speaker 1: provide them with ID documentation, your passport, your license, and
Speaker 1: those documents are then stored by those institutions and have
Speaker 1: been the subject of cyber hacks, and that means that
Speaker 1: millions of Australians are losing valuable information which can then
Speaker 1: put them at risk. So what Bill Shorten is talking
Speaker 1: about is providing people with an option where instead of
Speaker 1: providing those documents and putting themselves at risk that those
Speaker 1: documents could fall into the hands of cyber criminals, there'll
Speaker 1: be an alternative method for them to prove their identity
Speaker 1: which doesn't expose them to those same risks. I think
Speaker 1: it's important for Australians to have choice. But this is
Speaker 1: a choice that many Australians I think will find attractive
Speaker 1: because it will reduce their risk of identity theft and
Speaker 1: reduce their risk of cybercrime.
Speaker 3: Bridget There are concerns about government holding such sensitive data,
Speaker 3: given government cybersecurity is not known to be a strong point.
Speaker 3: Do you think this is a good idea and would
Speaker 3: you trust the government rather than the private sector to
Speaker 3: develop technology like this?
Speaker 15: Shari, I'm a conservative. I don't trust the government over
Speaker 15: private citizens at all. But I think governments have shown
Speaker 15: to have data breaches regularly. I'm a Laura Biding firearm owner,
Speaker 15: and there's been numerous state governments where suddenly everyone that
Speaker 15: owns a firearm in that state has been released publicly
Speaker 15: for public disclosure where they lived and where the firearm is.
Speaker 15: I mean that is a public safety issue, not just
Speaker 15: a personal integrity issue.
Speaker 5: So I would have significant concerns.
Speaker 15: I think the Labor Party the last tried they tried
Speaker 15: something like an Australia card didn't go down well. So
Speaker 15: I would be wanting to see a lot more detail
Speaker 15: from Bill Shorten and the Labor Party before I'm subscribing
Speaker 15: to something a digital version of an Australia card.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there is a digital version of an
Speaker 1: Australia card.
Speaker 5: I just want to see the detail.
Speaker 1: And very very different.
Speaker 3: Then, how is it different from the first century thing?
Speaker 10: How is it different?
Speaker 1: Well, this is a way for people to avoid precisely
Speaker 1: the problem that Bridget is talking about rather than having
Speaker 1: to give over your sensitive documents in order to prove
Speaker 1: your identity when you sign up to a new service,
Speaker 1: this is an alternative that people can choose to be
Speaker 1: able to prove their identity without doing that.
Speaker 15: Until some bright young spark in a country far away
Speaker 15: works out how to hack it.
Speaker 1: Well, bright young sparks in countries far away are hacking
Speaker 1: our private sector systems every single day, and we've seen
Speaker 1: that in Optus, in Medibank, in medi Secure, on and
Speaker 1: on if.
Speaker 5: So, it doesn't sound like a great idea to me, Andrew.
Speaker 1: And what this is doing is making us safer from
Speaker 1: precisely those things, because instead of Optus having to store
Speaker 1: your license and your passport, you won't have to provide
Speaker 1: those documents to Optus. So Bridget needs to read this legislation,
Speaker 1: understand what it's doing, and appreciate that what it's doing
Speaker 1: is actually meaning that you'll have to give over fewer
Speaker 1: documents and that will increase your cybersecurity produce your risk.
Speaker 3: Andrew, I think if she managed to read your thick
Speaker 3: economics textbook, I think she can get a handle on
Speaker 3: this legislation. We can talk about it next Wednesday. Next
Speaker 3: Wednesday on the show all Right, good to see you both,
Speaker 3: Bridget mackenzie Andrew Charlton. Thank you now. Let's return now
Speaker 3: to today's top story, Peter Dutton's demand for a Palestinian
Speaker 3: a visa ban. This has triggered a barrage of backlash
Speaker 3: from Labor and the Greens. Here was some of that
Speaker 3: criticism today.
Speaker 14: I seek to try to.
Speaker 8: Bring people together, not always looking for a wage or
Speaker 8: to divide.
Speaker 14: I'm disappointed in Peter Dutton. All reasonable people know that
Speaker 14: not all people in Gaza are members of Hamas we
Speaker 14: know there's a lot of innocent people caught.
Speaker 11: Up in a war not of their making.
Speaker 4: Peter Dutton continues to campaign on cruelty. If politicians don't
Speaker 4: want people fleeing Gaza, then Labor and Liberal should join
Speaker 4: to put pressure on the extremist Israeli government to stop
Speaker 4: bombing Gaza.
Speaker 3: But security experts are deeply concern to ask BE Executive Director.
Speaker 3: Justin Bassi, who used to be chief of staff to
Speaker 3: the Foreign Minister, said there needs to be clear leadership here.
Speaker 16: If there is uncertainty, if you don't know whether someone
Speaker 16: supports or doesn't support a terrorist organization. Unfortunately, the default
Speaker 16: should be not to provide a visa to someone you're
Speaker 16: uncertain about. The policymakers and the politicians do need to
Speaker 16: come out and say any support for a terrorist organization,
Speaker 16: whether it's in starting violence or not, is unacceptable and
Speaker 16: you are unable to get a visa if you do
Speaker 16: support a terrorist organizer.
Speaker 3: What well to discuss this further, Let's bring in someone
Speaker 3: who's been on the ground, who knows the risks in
Speaker 3: the region very clearly, Australia's former ambassador to Israel, Liberal
Speaker 3: Senator Dave Sharma. Great to see you again, Dave. Look,
Speaker 3: the Albertezi government has granted visas to nearly three thousand
Speaker 3: Palestinians from Gaza. Do you think you went into Palestinian
Speaker 3: territories often when you were ambassador. Do you think it's
Speaker 3: likely that at least some of those nearly three thousand
Speaker 3: who've been granted visas would support HERMAS, which is the
Speaker 3: governing body in Gaza.
Speaker 2: Well, I think there's a high risk of that, Charon,
Speaker 2: if we haven't been able to do the necessary identity, health,
Speaker 2: security and other verification checks that you would normally do
Speaker 2: on any individual, and most certainly individuals coming from a
Speaker 2: war zone. I don't see how we can have any
Speaker 2: surety of that. I mean, bear in mind that these
Speaker 2: people are in a war zone. They're in Gaza. We're
Speaker 2: not able to send Australian officials there to interview them.
Speaker 2: There's no functioning government in Gaza with whom we can
Speaker 2: verify documents, identities, other elements that you'd want to reassure
Speaker 2: the Australian public about the views and proclivities of these people.
Speaker 2: And in those circumstances, I think it makes abundant sense
Speaker 2: to be exercise a very high degree of caution. And
Speaker 2: I don't think we've been reassured by the government that
Speaker 2: they are doing that, because, simply put, the circumstances do
Speaker 2: not exist to allow that to happen.
Speaker 3: The Albanizi government and particularly the Prime Minister today said well,
Speaker 3: you guys in the coalition you did the same thing
Speaker 3: when it came to Afghanistan and other war Syria as well.
Speaker 3: How was the process different when it came to security
Speaker 3: checking under the coalition?
Speaker 2: Well, look, I mean you raise a very good point.
Speaker 2: I mean, for instance, when Tony Abbott promised to resettle
Speaker 2: twelve thousand, I think it was it might have been
Speaker 2: twenty thousand people who are fleeing Islamic State in Syria
Speaker 2: and Iraq. The government was criticized, The coalition government was
Speaker 2: criticized for how long it was taking, and we spent
Speaker 2: a lot of time planning that this process took time
Speaker 2: because usually these people had gone to third countries. We
Speaker 2: had to send Australian officials, immigration officials, but also security
Speaker 2: officials to interview these people to verify their identity, to
Speaker 2: verify their claims, to check that they weren't members or
Speaker 2: sympathizers of Islamic State. Because our first and most fundamental
Speaker 2: duty is to the security of the Australian people, and
Speaker 2: much as we might want to behave in a compassionate
Speaker 2: way and I'm all for that, we need to make
Speaker 2: sure that we're putting the security of Australian citizens and
Speaker 2: the security of our own country first before any other impulse.
Speaker 2: And I think how we've handled these situations in the past,
Speaker 2: including in Afghanistan, is At times we've gotten a lot
Speaker 2: of criticism from civil society, human rights groups, the Labor
Speaker 2: Party two for the process taking too long, but it
Speaker 2: was necessary to take that time to make sure we
Speaker 2: could do these checks. Now, there's no evidence that the
Speaker 2: Labor government is taking the time to do these checks
Speaker 2: on this caseload from Gaza, and simply put, the circum
Speaker 2: stances do not allow it. I mean, we're not able
Speaker 2: to send people there. This caseload is not in Egypt
Speaker 2: or in the third country where we can travel safely.
Speaker 2: So how are we possibly assuring ourselves that some of
Speaker 2: these people are not members of her Muffs or sympathizers
Speaker 2: of her Muffs. I mean, we just saw last week
Speaker 2: the UN itself admitted that its own employees in Gus
Speaker 2: exactly were actively involved in the Oktober seventh terrorist attack. Now,
Speaker 2: the UN system was not able to detect that until
Speaker 2: after the fact, and they're on the ground. There's you know,
Speaker 2: there's hundreds of UN employees in Gaza. How can we
Speaker 2: possibly be expected to meet these sorts of checks and
Speaker 2: safeguards which the Australian people are right to demand in
Speaker 2: the circumstances that we're facing.
Speaker 3: Dave, Apart from hermas sympathies, are you also concerned that
Speaker 3: some of these Palestinian visa holders may have just anti
Speaker 3: Western attitudes, may not share our inclusive Australian values. I mean,
Speaker 3: what are the attitudes to other sexualities in Gaza, for example,
Speaker 3: or what about women's rights.
Speaker 2: Well, look, I think that's a very good point. I mean,
Speaker 2: anyone who is settling in Australia, we want to make
Speaker 2: sure that they sign up to Australian values, that they're
Speaker 2: going to support our system of government. And if we're
Speaker 2: providing temporary refuge from a conflict, that's one thing. But
Speaker 2: inevitably these people who were granting visitor visas too will
Speaker 2: apply to resettle permanently in Australia, or a large proportion
Speaker 2: of them, And we need to make sure that you know,
Speaker 2: there are millions of people around the world, more than that,
Speaker 2: tens of millions, hundreds of millions, who would beat down
Speaker 2: the doors for a chance to come to Australia. We're
Speaker 2: in the fortunate position that, you know, we get to
Speaker 2: choose who comes to Australia. That is part of our
Speaker 2: sovereign right. And we want to make sure that the
Speaker 2: people we're bringing to Australia contribute to the economy, contribute
Speaker 2: to society, help build a stronger Australia, help build the
Speaker 2: more united Australia. Those are all legitimate aims of any
Speaker 2: settlement program and no matter what your other impulses are,
Speaker 2: that needs to be front and foremost amongst these considerations.
Speaker 3: Yeah, good pointer, No doubt this debate will continue in
Speaker 3: Parliament tomorrow. Dave Sharma, thank you very much for your time.
Speaker 3: Now coming up after the break a Ray Gun's protection racket,
Speaker 3: the left wing media and woke Olympic officials who are
Speaker 3: blaming misogyny for her viral routine that scored zero plus
Speaker 3: Australia isn't just failing in breakdancing but education too. Will
Speaker 3: have a look at the shocking naplan results with my
Speaker 3: panel Kroger and Richo a bit later. Welcome back well.
Speaker 3: While most of the world was appalled by Rachel Gunn's
Speaker 3: breakdancing routine, some say the reaction is a case of
Speaker 3: sexism and misogyny. Here's Australia's most senior Olympics official and
Speaker 3: Emir's If you don't know Rachel's story in two thousand
Speaker 3: and eight, she was locked in a room crying being
Speaker 3: involved in a maldominated sport as the only woman. Now
Speaker 3: you look at the history of what we have had
Speaker 3: as women athletes has faced in terms of criticism, belittlement,
Speaker 3: judgment all about gender, not performance. Well, the project also
Speaker 3: jumped in to support ray Gun.
Speaker 17: And all anybody is talking about is ray Gun.
Speaker 5: And can I just say right now, I.
Speaker 17: Am so rooting for this woman, Like if you think
Speaker 17: that she was not qualified to be there, she didn't
Speaker 17: get pulled in off the street, like she had to
Speaker 17: win a championship to get there, right, And.
Speaker 3: We'll look at that claim in a minute. But The
Speaker 3: Nightlies columnist Jennio Dowd said this had nothing to do
Speaker 3: with misogyny. She writes, the thirty six year old was
Speaker 3: criticized for thinking breaking involved hopping like a kangaroo and
Speaker 3: rolling around the floor like a dog on freshly mown grass.
Speaker 3: It had nothing at all to do with her being female.
Speaker 3: It had everything to do with her lack of talent
Speaker 3: reflected in her score. And Jennio Dowd, the former editor
Speaker 3: of both The Sunday and The Saturday Telegraph and my
Speaker 3: former editor as well, joins me, Now, Jenny, great to
Speaker 3: have you here, Hi, So what did you think of
Speaker 3: Raygun's performance and why it received such shocking reviews?
Speaker 18: Well, it was clearly cringe worthy, Shari. Everybody couldn't believe
Speaker 18: their eyes when they saw it. I remember the first
Speaker 18: time I saw it and I'm like, it's this for real,
Speaker 18: you know, like you know, she wasn't having a crack
Speaker 18: like the Prime Minister said, she was taking the piss.
Speaker 18: She clearly could not perform break dancing.
Speaker 3: And then you've got people like an Emirs who try
Speaker 3: and turn this into a gender issue. Was there any
Speaker 3: sexism or misogyny involved in this at all?
Speaker 18: It had absolutely nothing to do about gender. And it's
Speaker 18: a shame that Animeirs said that because it was all
Speaker 18: about her performance and the process of how she got
Speaker 18: to get there. There was no qualifying standard for anyone
Speaker 18: in the breaking competition. And I'll give you an example
Speaker 18: for Jessica Hole to compete in the fifteen h where
Speaker 18: she won a silver and you know what a wonderful
Speaker 18: moment that was for everyone in Australia and for jess herself.
Speaker 10: But jess had spent years and years and years of training.
Speaker 18: Like most athletes, she started in year two at cross country.
Speaker 18: She then went to albiam Park Little Athletics. She competed
Speaker 18: at state national competitions, international competitions, but to be selected
Speaker 18: to run in that race, she had to win the
Speaker 18: New South Wales competition. She had to actually meet a
Speaker 18: qualifying standard to even compete at Nationals, and then she
Speaker 18: had to get in the top. To one of the
Speaker 18: competitors about the question without question, But you're looking at
Speaker 18: someone who has devoted their entire life to get to
Speaker 18: that moment, and then you look at someone else who
Speaker 18: hasn't devoted their entire life. Is a thirty six year
Speaker 18: old academic who thought she'd have a crack at breakdancing,
Speaker 18: and it's made Australia laughable around the woind.
Speaker 3: You actually looked into the process for this column of
Speaker 3: how she did get to be selected and can you
Speaker 3: tell us a bit about that?
Speaker 18: Yeah, well I was quite interested because I know a
Speaker 18: little bit about sport. And there was a competition at
Speaker 18: the Sydney Town Hall which I don't think anyone heard about.
Speaker 18: It certainly wasn't advertised, but it was an Oceana competition,
Speaker 18: the first one that ever held to pick Australia's representative
Speaker 18: or the Oceana representative for breaking But she actually only
Speaker 18: competed against fifteen other women, and yes she won gold,
Speaker 18: but it was literally like she was pulled off the
Speaker 18: street because that was the only competition that she had
Speaker 18: to do, and that was the only standard. Every other competition,
Speaker 18: like you saw it, Brandon Stark doing the high jump,
Speaker 18: like he had to meet a minimum standard to get
Speaker 18: there in the discus, Matt Denny minimum standard. But breaking, No,
Speaker 18: let's just compete against fifteen people and voila.
Speaker 10: I'm going to the Olympics with my husband.
Speaker 3: One of the best lines from your column you say
Speaker 3: that so unqualified was Rachel for this role. You write
Speaker 3: that it's like sending a swimmer who doggy paddles, escape
Speaker 3: boarder who unable to perform the required tricks simply rides
Speaker 3: down the half pipes sitting on their board, or runner
Speaker 3: who jogs rather than sprint as they are not fit.
Speaker 3: It's such a great column, and you were actually quite
Speaker 3: enthusiastic about breaking, as they call it, being part of
Speaker 3: the Olympics, and you were encouraging people to have a look.
Speaker 10: Yeah.
Speaker 18: I was, And you know, I have to say I
Speaker 18: enjoyed it. You know, I enjoyed seeing the young people
Speaker 18: doing it, But I just what I didn't enjoy was
Speaker 18: seeing someone who wasn't qualified performing and representing our country.
Speaker 10: And I just think it made a mockery of every other.
Speaker 18: Athlete who's spent years and years and years to get
Speaker 18: to compete on the world stage.
Speaker 3: And also the message that it sends to children. You know,
Speaker 3: we've got this environment at the moment where every child
Speaker 3: thinks they deserve a medal for participation. And while you
Speaker 3: want to encourage people to participate, the Olympics isn't about
Speaker 3: it's about the best of the best.
Speaker 10: It is. It's about the best of the best.
Speaker 18: And now kids probably are kangaroo hopping, you know, to
Speaker 18: try and get to the next Olympics. But you know,
Speaker 18: but I think even kids know better than Rachel Gunn Shari.
Speaker 18: I mean, really, the national cross country is going to
Speaker 18: be held in Tasmania in a couple of weeks, and
Speaker 18: for a kid to get there, they had to win
Speaker 18: their school competition, win their zone competition, win their regional competition,
Speaker 18: go to state, get in the top six of the state,
Speaker 18: and meet a minimum time to compete. And that we're
Speaker 18: talking about ten year olds, eleven year olds. This is
Speaker 18: what happens in every other proper sport.
Speaker 3: Yeah right, Jenny, Dad, great to see you again.
Speaker 10: Thank you, Shari.
Speaker 3: Now still to come schools getting caught up in woke ideology. Well,
Speaker 3: it's coming back to bite them. Is it any surprise
Speaker 3: that more and more children are failing basic reading, writing
Speaker 3: and arithmetic. We'll look at those Naplan results next, also
Speaker 3: show you how Kamala Harris has been caught out doctoring
Speaker 3: news headline to paint her in a positive light. All
Speaker 3: of that and more with Michael Kroger and Graham Richardson next.
Speaker 3: Welcome back, and lots more to get through tonight. So
Speaker 3: let's bring in our Wednesday panel former Victorian Liberal Party
Speaker 3: President Michael Kroger and labor legend Graham Richardson. Welcome to
Speaker 3: you both. Let's start with the Naplan results. As you
Speaker 3: know by now, Australia has scored an F in this
Speaker 3: year's Naplan at least four hundred thousand children having who
Speaker 3: fell so far behind that they now require catch up tutoring.
Speaker 3: It's even more concerning that one in three students are
Speaker 3: not meeting the national baseline standards. Michael Kroger, you worried
Speaker 3: that schools are getting so far off their curriculum they
Speaker 3: teach about all this other woke ideology, Now that that
Speaker 3: students are just not able to read, write, and do
Speaker 3: maths properly, the basics, and it is going.
Speaker 12: To affect them for the rest of their life. Show.
Speaker 12: I mean, I remember when I was in school, which
Speaker 12: was a while ago. Now, there was an absolutely laser
Speaker 12: like focus on you being able to count and you
Speaker 12: being able to read. And nothing in the world has
Speaker 12: changed in terms of them still being your major priorities
Speaker 12: in your educational curriculum. But yes, the curriculum is now
Speaker 12: so full of other things without naming them all but
Speaker 12: essentially woke ideology, that it's going to destroy the lives
Speaker 12: of young people. I mean, if you can't count, if
Speaker 12: you don't understand basic arithmetic and mass, you're in for
Speaker 12: a very locky, rocky life because everything is about maths
Speaker 12: and everything's about reading. So you know, in a number
Speaker 12: of years time, the wake earliology era will have will
Speaker 12: have died a painful death, and schools will return to
Speaker 12: normal those children going.
Speaker 3: Through Michael Kroger from your mouth to.
Speaker 5: God, it will happen.
Speaker 3: This can't go on, Joe, what do you think. I mean,
Speaker 3: billions of dollars are being poed into education more every year,
Speaker 3: but the results just aren't lifting.
Speaker 19: Yeah, there's something seriously wrong when the results plateau. No
Speaker 19: matter how much money you pour in, that means there's
Speaker 19: got to be something wrong. And when you get into
Speaker 19: all sorts of strife if you criticize teaching standards. But
Speaker 19: let's face it, to get into university teaching colleges is
Speaker 19: the lowest mark. You're in the low sixties. You know,
Speaker 19: you want to get into law, you've got to get ninety,
Speaker 19: but get not to become a teacher. And I think
Speaker 19: that's where we go wrong. We don't value teaching the
Speaker 19: way we should.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I agree, And maybe if the pay was higher,
Speaker 3: you'd have better people being attracted to that profession. Now,
Speaker 3: let's have a look at Kamala Harris's campaignting because they've
Speaker 3: been caught out secretly editing news headlines in Google Search
Speaker 3: to paint her in a more favorable light. This is
Speaker 3: quite an explosive story in the US. Michael, what do
Speaker 3: you think about this? I mean, this is literally fake news.
Speaker 3: They accused Donald Trump of fake news, but this actually
Speaker 3: is fake news.
Speaker 12: Well, Harris's campaign team, I've got to have done an
Speaker 12: outstanding job so far. I mean, anyone who's watched this
Speaker 12: pro this station over the last three years and Anyone
Speaker 12: who's watched Fox in America knows that Harris is completely
Speaker 12: unqualified to be president in the United States. But you know,
Speaker 12: here's the thing. No one knew in America, apart from
Speaker 12: Fox viewers and Sky viewers. No one knew until a
Speaker 12: month ago that Biden had dementia. Most people in America
Speaker 12: have no idea that she has not given an interview yet.
Speaker 12: That's why her ratings are so high. They're completely unaware.
Speaker 12: They see it at rallies, they see her occasionally stop by
Speaker 12: a plane. No one's aware that she hasn't given an interview.
Speaker 12: They just think they've read she's great because they left.
Speaker 12: The hard left media are so desperate to defeat Trump.
Speaker 12: There's been this shocking protection racket of her as there
Speaker 12: was of Biden's dementia, that she's getting way with murder.
Speaker 12: So none of this surprises me, and they've done an
Speaker 12: excellent job so far. The question is can they pull
Speaker 12: the wool over the eyes of the American public for
Speaker 12: another three months. I think the answer is probably not,
Speaker 12: but they might.
Speaker 3: Look the media is helping with that. Have a look
Speaker 3: at this front cover of the Time magazine. They're basically
Speaker 3: saying let's bring it up. It's time for Kamala Harris.
Speaker 3: I mean, rich Oh, you know Donald Trump unquestionably divisive,
Speaker 3: but there's no doubt the media would never get behind
Speaker 3: him like this.
Speaker 19: No, I think that's probably true. Then again, if you're
Speaker 19: in my shoes, you say thank God for that. I'm
Speaker 19: looking forward to Harris presidency. I can't wait for it
Speaker 19: to happen.
Speaker 3: And it will happen, you think it will. What's your
Speaker 3: what's your history of political predictions like when it comes
Speaker 3: to elections.
Speaker 19: Richo, Pretty bloody good?
Speaker 3: Look it is looking that way. I mean if you
Speaker 3: would have if you would have asked the question Michael
Speaker 3: a month ago, just after the attempted assassination of Donald Trump,
Speaker 3: you would have thought he was a shoe in. But
Speaker 3: there's been this transformation of Kamala's image and it does
Speaker 3: look like, you know, she's giving him a run for
Speaker 3: his money.
Speaker 12: Well, she's a narrow favorite to win. I would think
Speaker 12: the recent polls in Wisconsin and Pennsylvania have her in front.
Speaker 12: And Pennsylvania as they go to state for this election,
Speaker 12: if she wins the nine in votes there, she probably wins.
Speaker 12: But as I said, we're in this extraordinary twilight zone
Speaker 12: of unreality as to where people are looking and thinking.
Speaker 12: Isn't she great? No, she was a hopeless vice president.
Speaker 12: She is the most left wing candidate the American public
Speaker 12: have ever seen, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. All
Speaker 12: the things that sky viewers know. She's in front of
Speaker 12: the battleground states.
Speaker 5: Bazally, Yeah, I'm concerned. Absolutely.
Speaker 3: He emerged over the past day or so with his
Speaker 3: links to extremists as well. Just very quickly, before we go,
Speaker 3: I want to ask you both about these ugly scenes
Speaker 3: that are Sydney council chambers last night. These are Greens
Speaker 3: led pro Palestinian protest. It forced the meeting to be
Speaker 3: abandoned over safety concerns. This was all over a motion
Speaker 3: to boycott Israel, and the eight labor counselors who voted
Speaker 3: against the motion were actually escorted by police to their cars.
Speaker 3: One hundred strong crowd. If we have time, can we
Speaker 3: play a very quick snippet rich O, why can't these
Speaker 3: councils just collect our rubbish and start worrying about foreign policy.
Speaker 19: I think that's a good question, because I'm not sure
Speaker 19: what their qualifications are to comment on it. But one
Speaker 19: thing's for certain. You know, you get activist councils and
Speaker 19: they'll consider themselves expert on everything and able to intervene
Speaker 19: on everything. They're not content with where council powers begin
Speaker 19: and end, and so they simply assume they can extend
Speaker 19: them travelers. They can't, and we're not going to let
Speaker 19: them anyway.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, Michael Kroger, Graham Richardson, great to see
Speaker 3: you both.
Speaker 10: Thank you so much, gentlemen.
Speaker 3: Now up next, how universities are protecting their golden goose
Speaker 3: international students at all costs, and more on the rift
Speaker 3: between labor and the RBA. Judith Sloan will join me
Speaker 3: after this quick break.
Speaker 5: Welcome back.
Speaker 3: Well, let's look at the biggest story of the week,
Speaker 3: the RBA having a go at the government effectively. For
Speaker 3: more analysis on this, let's bring in the contributing economics
Speaker 3: editor at The Australian, Judith Sloan. Judith, so wonderful to
Speaker 3: have you on the program again. Look the RBA statements,
Speaker 3: and there have been many of them now, have criticized
Speaker 3: the government for its public spending but also so for
Speaker 3: the pay rises which are inflationary. What do you think,
Speaker 3: how do you think the Albertezi government is handling this
Speaker 3: issue of public sector pay rises?
Speaker 11: Well, I think on the spat between the bank and
Speaker 11: the government.
Speaker 5: Is hilarious because I guess this is a sort.
Speaker 11: Of argumentation one oh one, which is Abbot saying, oh,
Speaker 11: she didn't say that, and then you go and look
Speaker 11: at the transcript and she says, well, she actually did
Speaker 11: say that.
Speaker 10: She did point to the.
Speaker 11: Profligacy of the federal government and state governments pushing out
Speaker 11: aggregate demand. But the issue of wages is really important
Speaker 11: because they want to brag about the rate of increase
Speaker 11: in wages, but if you actually look at what's happening,
Speaker 11: they're very much being driven by public sector wages and
Speaker 11: they are doing that's happening in the context of there
Speaker 11: being no productivity growth, and from the point of view
Speaker 11: of the Reserve Bank, that is a very big issue
Speaker 11: because it's essentially inflationary.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so let's drill down on that a bit more.
Speaker 3: We spoke about this early in the show. I asked
Speaker 3: Andrew Charlton about it. But what are the risks if
Speaker 3: productivity growth remains very slow and weak as it is
Speaker 3: at the moment. But you've got pay rises increasing and
Speaker 3: the Dune quarter was the highest that zero point nine
Speaker 3: percent pay rise growth in the June quarter was the
Speaker 3: highest in twelve years. So what impact would that have
Speaker 3: on the economy? What are the risks here?
Speaker 11: So what the bank will look at as something called
Speaker 11: unit labor costs, So what that takes into account is
Speaker 11: the increase in the wages, but also what's happening to productivity,
Speaker 11: and they worry when the growth of unit labor costs
Speaker 11: is too high to meet their inflation target. So if
Speaker 11: you look at the recent monetary statement, for example, there
Speaker 11: is quite a lot of discussion of that.
Speaker 10: The key here is that productivity growth.
Speaker 11: It's not actually productivity growth that's just fallen in a hole,
Speaker 11: it's absolute productivity. We're actually lower than we were several
Speaker 11: years ago, and that makes the economy very difficult to
Speaker 11: manage because basically you're getting absolutely nothing from the supply side,
Speaker 11: but aggregate demand is forging ahead.
Speaker 3: Judith, you've written a column where you're concerned about the
Speaker 3: high numbers of students that universities are relying on, but
Speaker 3: the impact that this is having on our wider community.
Speaker 3: Can you explain a bit of that to us?
Speaker 11: Well, If we look at the immigration figures, and I
Speaker 11: think there have been some ones that have been released
Speaker 11: today under the Albanesi government, there's been a net increase
Speaker 11: of over a million new migrants, So when you think
Speaker 11: of the housing situation, that seems particularly dire. But the
Speaker 11: biggest single group within the migrant arrivals are the international students.
Speaker 11: Now the government says that they are going to do
Speaker 11: something about this, they are considerably higher than they were
Speaker 11: in twenty nineteen going into COVID, so we're now in
Speaker 11: mid twenty twenty four. But I think, Shari, we need
Speaker 11: to watch this space because I think it's one of
Speaker 11: those things that they say they intend to do something,
Speaker 11: but they actually are very weak in terms of actually
Speaker 11: producing any action on this. And I think it's a
Speaker 11: real issue because not only have we had this inflow
Speaker 11: of students, they actually have the ability to stay for
Speaker 11: very considerable periods of time. For example, there are graduation
Speaker 11: visas that are available to a large numbers. So it's
Speaker 11: one of those things that I think the government understands
Speaker 11: the politics, the electoral implications, but they actually find it
Speaker 11: very difficult, partly because they're beholden to the universities and
Speaker 11: other interest groups. She find it very hard to pull
Speaker 11: back on the migrant intake.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it does seem to be quite a powerful lobby group.
Speaker 3: The university is Judah Sloan and great to see you
Speaker 3: as always. Thank you so much and thanks everyone for
Speaker 3: your company tonight. I'll see you tomorrow at eight and
Speaker 3: don't miss the show tomorrow night. I've got a high
Speaker 3: profile US politician on. Here's Paul Murray.