Speaker 1: We'd like to acknowledge that traditional custodians of the land
Speaker 1: on which this podcast was produced the Galligall people of
Speaker 1: the Urination. We pay our respects to Elder's past and present.
Speaker 2: It's August twenty twenty one and we're at Perishah in
Speaker 2: Australia's Snowy Mountains. Twenty one year old medical student Jimmy
Speaker 2: jan moved down here two months ago when COVID lockdowns
Speaker 2: caused his university classes to move online. He's planning to
Speaker 2: spend the semester here, splitting his days between the slopes
Speaker 2: and his studies. One bell ber morning, he decides to
Speaker 2: squeeze in a few runs before logging online for the afternoon.
Speaker 2: Jimmy has the train park to himself and he's skiing
Speaker 2: the jumps he's done many times before, but one wrong
Speaker 2: maneuver changes everything. Jimmy wakes up a few minutes later
Speaker 2: to find himself surrounded by the ski They tell him
Speaker 2: to stay still, remove his boots and ask you if
Speaker 2: he can wiggle his toes.
Speaker 3: He tries, but no movement follows.
Speaker 2: Hours later, X rays will show fratured vertebrae.
Speaker 3: I'm Att Middleton and this is head Game Today. Jimmy
Speaker 3: Jan on.
Speaker 2: Embracing life after a spinal cord injury. Jimmy Jan listen,
Speaker 2: thank you ever so much for coming on my podcast
Speaker 2: Head Game. Talk about mindset cop pulling through and having
Speaker 2: to deal with the change that you've dealt with. But
Speaker 2: first and foremost, Jimmy, how are you, buddy, and how's
Speaker 2: life treating you?
Speaker 4: I am very good. Yeah, thanks for having me at
Speaker 4: honor to be on your podcast. But yeah, I'm doing good.
Speaker 4: I'm in my fourth year of medicine at the moment,
Speaker 4: so that keeps him busy for the most part. Yeah,
Speaker 4: doing good.
Speaker 2: Was that something that comes from the family? Is there
Speaker 2: doctors and nurses in the family? Where does that sort
Speaker 2: of medical sort of background come from.
Speaker 4: Look, I want to say, like it's you know me,
Speaker 4: who's you know, decided I want to do this and
Speaker 4: like gone through it. But I guess there is a
Speaker 4: bit of a health background in my family. My dad's
Speaker 4: a dentist, and my mum's an occupational therapist. My sister
Speaker 4: actually she's a doctor as well.
Speaker 5: So I'm not.
Speaker 4: Really I don't know if I'm following in the footsteps,
Speaker 4: but yeah, I guess there's health. Health based family. At
Speaker 4: the start, I don't know. I guess I just kind
Speaker 4: of thought it would be cool. And as I've studied
Speaker 4: it and kept going, like, it's just so much more
Speaker 4: cool to me and so much more exciting.
Speaker 5: I just really love learning. Learning's really fun.
Speaker 4: And so I don't know, I think medicine is this
Speaker 4: really awesome career because like there's just so many different
Speaker 4: directions you can go, and you can never quite know everything,
Speaker 4: and so you just can learn forever. And then I
Speaker 4: just think learning forever is a lot fun.
Speaker 2: I love that, mate, you know what. I love that
Speaker 2: you can learn forever because ultimately, that's what life is
Speaker 2: all about. That's what we're all about, right, We're always learning,
Speaker 2: we're always growing, We're always trying to become that better
Speaker 2: version of who we are through wisdom and knowledge. And
Speaker 2: I suppose with your accident in two thousand and twenty one,
Speaker 2: the medical field, has it become more fascinating for you?
Speaker 2: Has it has it become more fascinating probably the wrong word,
Speaker 2: but has it become a bit more fascinating or interesting?
Speaker 4: I think, oh, like absolutely, Like I've had an insight
Speaker 4: into you know, healthcare that like a bit on the
Speaker 4: other side, I guess of like the healthcare you know sector,
Speaker 4: and so I, you know, for my first couple of
Speaker 4: years of med school before my accident, you know, just
Speaker 4: learning about all these things and I don't know, then
Speaker 4: suddenly I'm like, you know, have the perspective of a patient,
Speaker 4: and I learned a lot, and yeah, I think I
Speaker 4: definitely look at like I guess my future career as
Speaker 4: a doctor from like a different perspective, just you know,
Speaker 4: having that experience as a patient, I suppose.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can almost put yourself in that patient sort
Speaker 2: of sector as well, so you're almost studying on yourself.
Speaker 2: Took me through the day in the life of Jimmy
Speaker 2: jam before before the accident in twenty twenty one.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so before my accident, Yeah, yeah, I was living
Speaker 4: in a van and I was I was living in
Speaker 4: Newcastle at the time. I just honestly parked at the
Speaker 4: beach most mornings and go for a surf in the
Speaker 4: morning and then go to UNI and yeah, I was
Speaker 4: just kind of trying to have as much fun as
Speaker 4: they could do a bit of travel. And then COVID
Speaker 4: hit and so a lot of our classes were online
Speaker 4: for a while, and in twenty twenty one, we had
Speaker 4: like that second wave of COVID, and I had already
Speaker 4: got my season passed for the snow and I was like,
Speaker 4: I'm just gonna drive my van down there, Like you know,
Speaker 4: they're not locked down there yet, so I'll just park
Speaker 4: at the snow and ski and snowboard every day and
Speaker 4: get my classes online.
Speaker 2: What a place to be able to sort of park
Speaker 2: your van up, study online and then go and hit
Speaker 2: the slopes or the mountains whatever you wanted to do.
Speaker 2: Is that exactly what you've done?
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly, Like I was living the dream. I was
Speaker 4: having so much fun. Like you know, I would be
Speaker 4: up on the chair lift and I got my headphones
Speaker 4: in listening to you know, a lecture and just you know,
Speaker 4: hitting the slopes.
Speaker 5: It was an absolute blast.
Speaker 2: So you were literally living the dreamers as a student
Speaker 2: who says you don't live the dream of the student.
Speaker 2: So take me back to that day in twenty twenty one.
Speaker 2: You know, you wake up in your campra Van. Just
Speaker 2: talk me through that day and how it transpired.
Speaker 4: I had a class i think in the afternoon, and
Speaker 4: so I was like, I'll just go up and do
Speaker 4: a couple hours on the mountain and yeah, I just
Speaker 4: wake up, had my oats like I do every day,
Speaker 4: drove up the mountain, took the chair lift up, and
Speaker 4: it was my first run of the day. I'm coming
Speaker 4: down the mountain and I was wanting to go like
Speaker 4: all the way across the mountain to like a different
Speaker 4: track basically, and I went past the train park and
Speaker 4: it was empty because like it was early in the morning,
Speaker 4: and I was like, oh, m, just hit the.
Speaker 5: Jumps on the way down.
Speaker 4: Usually there's just like heaps of people of the train
Speaker 4: park and I don't really like waiting, but you know,
Speaker 4: it was all empty, so I was like, I just
Speaker 4: hit some jumps on the way down, and yeah, I
Speaker 4: hit the first jump and it was fine, and then
Speaker 4: hit the second jump and I just kind of, yeah,
Speaker 4: took off wrong, I guess, and wasn't in the right
Speaker 4: position where I need to be. I wasn't trying to
Speaker 4: do any tricks. I was literally just trying to jump
Speaker 4: and yeah, I just had a bit of speed going
Speaker 4: into it and ended up doing like kind of like
Speaker 4: I guess, a bad backflip and came down and landed
Speaker 4: on my head and then knocked myself out and woke
Speaker 4: up a few minutes later, and there was like ski
Speaker 4: patrol all around me, and I was like trying to
Speaker 4: get up, and they're like, nah, you don't just stay
Speaker 4: stay where you're on and I was like, oh, like
Speaker 4: I can't actually get up, and yeah, that was when
Speaker 4: I knew that I guess things were about to get
Speaker 4: interesting for me.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 2: So this is just a normal day for you, right,
Speaker 2: You've just been as in normal day, You've got that
Speaker 2: routine going, you parked your van up, You've been hitting
Speaker 2: the slopes as normal. Had you hit that jump before?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'd been doing the jumps and on like the
Speaker 4: skis and the snowboard, and this one just went poorly.
Speaker 2: You know. Was it one of those where I suppose,
Speaker 2: you know, you build up the confidence like on anything,
Speaker 2: you know, motorbikes, squad bikes, ski slopes. You know, were
Speaker 2: you getting faster and with the jumps getting higher?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: No, it was definitely like I've been hitting them quite
Speaker 4: a lot that week, and so I was getting more
Speaker 4: and more confident, and so probably like not paying as
Speaker 4: attention as much as I maybe should have been, and
Speaker 4: I guess focusing when I got to the top of
Speaker 4: the jump, I like I knew like it wasn't going
Speaker 4: to work out.
Speaker 5: Like I remember thinking to myself.
Speaker 4: Like, oh, crap, this is gonna hurt because probably, like
Speaker 4: I don't know, maybe like a month earlier, I had
Speaker 4: kind of jumped poorly on my snowboard and stacked it
Speaker 4: and that hurt, and so like when I was at
Speaker 4: the top of the jump, I was like, yeah, crap,
Speaker 4: this is actually gonna hurt a lot.
Speaker 5: And yeah, that's the last thing I remember thinking about.
Speaker 2: I guess because you've studied medicine or you you know,
Speaker 2: you're studying medicine, and you were probably you know, in
Speaker 2: the thicker things because of the knowledge that you already
Speaker 2: had in the medical field. Did you know something was
Speaker 2: up right away or what? Did it take a bit
Speaker 2: of time for it to for you to really go, oh,
Speaker 2: something seriously up.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't think it was like right away. It
Speaker 4: was when on the snow like I kind of just
Speaker 4: I don't know, like i'd just woken up. I didn't
Speaker 4: really know it was like going on, I guess. And
Speaker 4: when they took me down the mountain to the the
Speaker 4: medical center, they did some like X rays, and I
Speaker 4: asked if I could see the X rays after they
Speaker 4: did them, and they're like, oh, like, are you show
Speaker 4: you order like and I was like yeah, yeah, Like
Speaker 4: I love X rays, like yeah, yeah, I used to
Speaker 4: study radiography as well, so I don't know, I just
Speaker 4: think X rays are cool. And so that they showed
Speaker 4: me and I could see that my T ten was
Speaker 4: like basically completely displaced over my spinal cord and yeah,
Speaker 4: when I saw that X ray, I was like, oh,
Speaker 4: like this is this is bad, this is serious.
Speaker 5: I suppose like we had.
Speaker 4: Just done our neuro unit the semester before, so this
Speaker 4: was all in my second year of medicine, So we
Speaker 4: had just done our neurology unit in the semester before,
Speaker 4: so you know, I'd kind of learned about spinal cord
Speaker 4: injuries and so yeah, I saw the X ray and
Speaker 4: I was like, yeah, this is serious. And so then
Speaker 4: they flew me to Sydney on a fun little helicopter
Speaker 4: ride and and I got some fun surgery. Wow.
Speaker 2: How you said you say, obviously when you hit the
Speaker 2: deck you're unconscious. How long were you actually out cold
Speaker 2: before you you you came.
Speaker 4: To It was about three minutes And like the way
Speaker 4: the terrain park is like situated on Paris. Rat's like
Speaker 4: right on the front valley, so it's quite near to
Speaker 4: I guess skip atroll and like it's actually like right
Speaker 4: under the the ski lift. So there's a lot of
Speaker 4: people who got a front ray seat of my nice stack,
Speaker 4: so lots of people saw, so they were quick on it,
Speaker 4: onto it to come and collect me.
Speaker 2: You know, just being unconscious for thirty seconds a minute,
Speaker 2: but three minutes wow, you know that you know you've
Speaker 2: you've taken a big, big fall there. And when you
Speaker 2: come to as well, you say that they're doing you know,
Speaker 2: are they doing the the up? You know it's not
Speaker 2: studied medicine, but I've been a team medic and I
Speaker 2: you know, I know about the awareness and coming in,
Speaker 2: you know, securing the heads, making sure was all of
Speaker 2: that taking place, and you know, wiggle the toes and
Speaker 2: can you feel your legs from here? You know, touching.
Speaker 2: Did all that take place on the slope or did
Speaker 2: that do they just take you whisk your way straight away? Yeah?
Speaker 4: No, it happened on the on the mountain. I remember
Speaker 4: them taking my boots off and asking if I could
Speaker 4: wiggle my toes. Yeah, And I was like, am I
Speaker 4: not wiggling my toes. I'm pretty sure I'm whiggling my toes,
Speaker 4: but I wasn't wiggling my toes. It's really weird to
Speaker 4: like have control, I guess if your whole body in
Speaker 4: one second, and then like you know, a few minutes later,
Speaker 4: you wake up and it's like, oh, half half my body,
Speaker 4: like the control of half my body is just like gone.
Speaker 5: It's it's a weird, weird thing.
Speaker 2: Was there ever a moment on the slope, you know,
Speaker 2: why you were being transported from the slope to the hospital.
Speaker 2: Was there ever a moment that you thought I could
Speaker 2: be paralyzed.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: When they showed me my x rays, I was in
Speaker 4: the medical center, I think for maybe like an hour,
Speaker 4: I think before like they flew me away in the helicopter.
Speaker 4: Vertebra are not supposed to be over on top of
Speaker 4: your spinal cord, and so when I saw that, Yeah,
Speaker 4: I knew I was.
Speaker 5: Definitely in it for the long run.
Speaker 4: I think, like I knew this wasn't just going to
Speaker 4: be like a you know, six weeks in hospital and
Speaker 4: you're back out walking like it's whatever was happening was
Speaker 4: going to be a big change in my life.
Speaker 2: Wow, and when when do you get confirmation then of
Speaker 2: the news that you are paralyzed from from the waist
Speaker 2: down and that you know you're going to spend the
Speaker 2: rest of your life, you know, in a wheelchair. Was
Speaker 2: there any hope of them saying this could be repaired
Speaker 2: and you might be able to walk one day or
Speaker 2: was it just a straight hardcore truth of your paralyzed
Speaker 2: from the waist down.
Speaker 4: So like the morning after my surgery, So after I've
Speaker 4: been flown to Sydney and had surgery, I think I
Speaker 4: woke up late that night and after my surgery and
Speaker 4: then yeah, they were like, you've severed a spine accord,
Speaker 4: so you're not going to be walking.
Speaker 2: You know, your your head must have been absolutely everywhere
Speaker 2: and anywhere. Right, You've just come out of surgery. You
Speaker 2: know you're probably groggy from from you know, from the process,
Speaker 2: and just to be given that news. Can you just
Speaker 2: put me in that setting? Was the family around you
Speaker 2: when you receive that news. That's big news, mate, that's.
Speaker 3: Big, big news.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's definitely big news to get. But now I
Speaker 4: was all by I'm a little handsome in hospital it
Speaker 4: because it was during like that, like COVID so my
Speaker 4: family is, well, my parents they live in Queensland, so
Speaker 4: they're in a different state. And then yeah, it wasn't
Speaker 4: allowed any visitors, and I think wait, while I was
Speaker 4: in ICU, I I was allowed I think a two
Speaker 4: hour visit a day, and so my sisters came the
Speaker 4: next day, so like eventually had some family around me.
Speaker 2: You come across as super positive, But how what how
Speaker 2: did you manage that and how did you process that
Speaker 2: news by yourself? Because I know you had the nurses
Speaker 2: and the doctors for support, but to receive that by
Speaker 2: yourself and to have having to process that as well
Speaker 2: by yourself, I can't even start to imagine that. That's
Speaker 2: that's talk about psychological resilience. That's something that I'll be
Speaker 2: fascinating to hear how you dealt with it.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I think at the time I.
Speaker 4: Was just kind of like, oh, like yeah, I mean,
Speaker 4: I guess I broke my back paralyzed in the waist down,
Speaker 4: like there's nothing I can do about it, And so
Speaker 4: pretty early on I was kind of just like I
Speaker 4: had accepted that, and like even like on the first
Speaker 4: day after the after the team had rounded and then
Speaker 4: I had my breakfast, I remember thinking oh my gosh,
Speaker 4: like I'm supposed to be in class today, like I
Speaker 4: have to email the UNI and tell them why I'm
Speaker 4: missing class. And so I like hop on my little
Speaker 4: computer and I'm like, hey, I broke my back yesterday
Speaker 4: and I might miss class for the rest of the week.
Speaker 5: So I don't know. I didn't.
Speaker 4: My head was weird, like that's not really something that
Speaker 4: should be a major priority, I think in the time,
Speaker 4: but I was like, oh, I need to tell I
Speaker 4: need to make sure you know the UNI knows that
Speaker 4: why I'm missing class.
Speaker 2: So your first thought process was I'm missing class. I
Speaker 2: need to inform the I need.
Speaker 3: To inform the UNI that I'm not going to be there.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the email I received back was like, oh, this
Speaker 4: is not really a priority. Thinking about medicine, I was like,
Speaker 4: can I still do medicine? Like really briefly, But one
Speaker 4: of the teams that rounded on me really early on
Speaker 4: was like, oh, have you heard about this doctor? You know,
Speaker 4: a doctor in a wheelchair, And so then I was like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 4: medicine is still an option for me.
Speaker 2: When did you actually start thinking about yourself? When did
Speaker 2: you actually start thinking why I've got a hell of
Speaker 2: a lot of work to do here.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I was in ICU for for five days
Speaker 4: and so after that, like I was allowed I could
Speaker 4: actually start doing rehab and stuff. And I started UNI
Speaker 4: back when I got out of ICU. So one day,
Speaker 4: I guess I took a week off and I guess
Speaker 4: that was that was a nice distract action, I guess
Speaker 4: to keep me going in hospital. And then yeah, I
Speaker 4: started doing a lot of.
Speaker 5: Rehab and.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was probably like yeah, a couple of weeks
Speaker 4: into it, and then I was like, oh, like this
Speaker 4: is forever. This is how it is now, like, yeah,
Speaker 4: this is I don't know, this is going to be
Speaker 4: an adventure and yeah, a lot of work.
Speaker 2: And I suppose I have the same mindset as well,
Speaker 2: you know, any sort of setbacks, not backs, problems, you know,
Speaker 2: I sort of look at them as challenges. And you
Speaker 2: just said it there. I don't know if you said
Speaker 2: it or burpose, but you said, well, I've got this adventure. Now,
Speaker 2: how did your rehab look?
Speaker 3: Was it?
Speaker 2: Was it a lot of psychological that acceptance and dealing
Speaker 2: with it or taught me through your rehab from day
Speaker 2: dar like after my surgery, I remember like when they
Speaker 2: first sat me up, my blood pressure just dropped and
Speaker 2: I kind of like passed out almost And when I
Speaker 2: woke up from that, I just sme thinking like, oh
Speaker 2: my gosh, I can't even sit up without passing out,
Speaker 2: Like this is this is gonna this is gonna be
Speaker 2: like I don't know a lot. And each day, like
Speaker 2: I started doing more and more. And I remember the
Speaker 2: first time dressing myself after my accident, because you know,
Speaker 2: after after the accident, there's like a team of nurses
Speaker 2: and they're like there's people showering you and doing all
Speaker 2: this stuff. And like going from like completely independent to
Speaker 2: being absolutely dependent on for everything is a really really
Speaker 2: jarring experience, really weird to go, like for a twenty
Speaker 2: one year old is doing everything living by himself, and
Speaker 2: then you know, suddenly I need someone to, you know,
Speaker 2: help me.
Speaker 5: Go to the bathroom. Like it's just weird.
Speaker 4: And so I was just kind of determined to just
Speaker 4: get back every inch of independence I could, and so
Speaker 4: I just started working like really hard, and I remember
Speaker 4: like the first time dressing myself, and I was just
Speaker 4: so exhausted at the end of it, and like picking
Speaker 4: up each each one of my legs and you know,
Speaker 4: sliding my legs through. Like I remember like laying back
Speaker 4: being exhausted, and I was like, that's sick. Like I
Speaker 4: just dressed myself, which is just a weird thing for
Speaker 4: a twenty one year old to be like really proud
Speaker 4: of themselves for. But yeah, every every single one of
Speaker 4: those experiences that I was able to like get back,
Speaker 4: I just I don't know, it's just victories, right, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you feel like you've overcome that challenge, and you know,
Speaker 2: no matter how small or big it is, it's still
Speaker 2: it's still a victory, right, still ticking the box where
Speaker 2: you're like, well I've got that, I've achieved that, you know,
Speaker 2: onto the next.
Speaker 4: There was just so many things that I had to
Speaker 4: like try and get back for myself, to like get
Speaker 4: back to my independence. And yeah, there was a lot
Speaker 4: and there's a lot of hard work. But I mean,
Speaker 4: I know, you got one experience of life, and I
Speaker 4: want it to be as fun as it can be
Speaker 4: for me, So I just kept working hard. I guess.
Speaker 2: How was the acceptance of you know, you live in
Speaker 2: the outdoor adventure life, you know, in your camper van,
Speaker 2: you've got that free spirit mentality and attitude. How does one,
Speaker 2: you know, accept that and move and process things to progress,
Speaker 2: to move on.
Speaker 4: I think like at the start, I kind of just
Speaker 4: was like, I don't know, a bit blase about the
Speaker 4: whole thing. Like I was like, ah, what are you
Speaker 4: going to do? Like that's life, you know, just keep going.
Speaker 4: And then like as time went on and I'm like
Speaker 4: I said, I was like, oh, wow, this is forever.
Speaker 4: I like kind of was like able to reflect on
Speaker 4: it more, I guess, and like because I did have
Speaker 4: I had such an active life and I literally just
Speaker 4: used to do whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted, like
Speaker 4: just free little spirit, if you will. And then for
Speaker 4: a brief period, I was like, oh, it's gone, like
Speaker 4: I'm never going to have fun again, like never gonna
Speaker 4: have fun as my which as I had fun before.
Speaker 4: And then I was like, I don't know, just kind
Speaker 4: of trying to reframe the way I was thinking about that,
Speaker 4: and it's like I might never have fun like I
Speaker 4: had before, but like that's not to say I won't
Speaker 4: have fun, Like there's so many ways to have fun
Speaker 4: in life, and like now I just have to find
Speaker 4: all those new ways for me to have fun.
Speaker 5: You know, I used to do like.
Speaker 4: A lot of running and a lot of scuba diving
Speaker 4: and lots of all that stuff like active you know,
Speaker 4: use your legs, and I can't do.
Speaker 5: A lot of that anymore.
Speaker 4: But like, I mean, there's there's more than six activities
Speaker 4: on offer in life, so I just need to, you know,
Speaker 4: find the new ones to have fun with.
Speaker 3: And did that get you down, Jimmy?
Speaker 5: There were definitely, like.
Speaker 4: A lot of times, especially like while I was still
Speaker 4: in rehab, these moments where I definitely had like down moments.
Speaker 4: They didn't like last They're not like these long periods
Speaker 4: that like kind of take over my mind. I kind
Speaker 4: of would just you know, have that moment and like,
Speaker 4: you know, try and work through it. I've got this
Speaker 4: album on my my photos on my phone and it's
Speaker 4: called Legs, And when I was like being all depressed
Speaker 4: in hospital, I would like go through all my photos
Speaker 4: and add all these photos into an album called Legs,
Speaker 4: And then whenever I was like kind of feeling bummy
Speaker 4: in hospital, I would just feel sorry for myself and
Speaker 4: swipe through this like album of photos and shit, No,
Speaker 4: definitely it definitely did some of the pictures and then
Speaker 4: I'm just like I'm never going to stand on top
Speaker 4: of that mountain ever again. I think after a while,
Speaker 4: I would just look at these pictures and it's not
Speaker 4: like I'll never be able to do these again. It's like,
Speaker 4: I'm so grateful that I had the experienced to do
Speaker 4: all of these things before, because like there's a lot
Speaker 4: of people in the world who will never do, like,
Speaker 4: you know, some of the fun stuff I've had the
Speaker 4: you know, forty and privilege to experience and.
Speaker 2: That you will continue to experience exactly because exactly like
Speaker 2: you said, there's still so much fun that could be had.
Speaker 3: There's still so much you can do, right.
Speaker 4: You're absolutely right, Like this world is so exciting, Like
Speaker 4: there's so much to do, so much to learn, and like, yeah,
Speaker 4: you only have one experience on this planet and like
Speaker 4: just got to soak it, soak up as much as
Speaker 4: you can.
Speaker 5: So that's that's what I'm trying to do.
Speaker 2: And there's as a word that I'm going to say
Speaker 2: this word and you'll probably smile upsy, yeahpsy, Yeah, talk
Speaker 2: to me about oopsy and how that sort of played
Speaker 2: a role in your life.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So, like after I broke my back, I was
Speaker 4: laying in the medical center and I had the X
Speaker 4: rays and got my little I think I had a
Speaker 4: little collar on and I was just laying in there
Speaker 4: and I don't know. I had my phone and I
Speaker 4: just took a selfie and on Snapchat, and I wrote
Speaker 4: the little caption as UPSI because I had had an
Speaker 4: upsy and I feel like that was the way to
Speaker 4: I guess sum up the experience I was having. And yeah,
Speaker 4: I still like, yeah, when I think about that day,
Speaker 4: it's it's still it's upsy. You know, just sometimes things happen,
Speaker 4: and you know, see exactly.
Speaker 2: It must be fascinating that you're in the medical field
Speaker 2: and you know, like you said, you're you're the patient
Speaker 2: as well. Has your medical studies become even more interesting
Speaker 2: now due to your accident?
Speaker 4: Yeah, No, definitely, Like a lot of like topics have
Speaker 4: become much more interesting where I'm like trying to like
Speaker 4: figure out, you know, I guess the path of physiology
Speaker 4: of like different things, even like you know, spinal cords,
Speaker 4: spinal cord injuries. A lot of doctors probably like fortunately,
Speaker 4: don't have the experience of like I guess, I don't
Speaker 4: know disability or like I don't know chronic health conditions,
Speaker 4: and so I do have that insight, and so that's
Speaker 4: something that you know, I'm now able to take into
Speaker 4: my future practice, you know, my future interactions with patients.
Speaker 4: So it's a crappy situation, you know, becoming paralyzed, but
Speaker 4: you know, it is what it is, and I guess, yeah,
Speaker 4: it's one of the positives I can definitely take from it.
Speaker 4: It's just I guess, an insight into like what it's
Speaker 4: like to you know, have your world change in an
Speaker 4: instant or just you know, lose function or you know,
Speaker 4: there's lots of different stuff about disability that I now
Speaker 4: definitely understand a lot more than I did when I
Speaker 4: briefly covered it, you know, in a semester before my accident.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and how is that.
Speaker 2: Sort of transpired into the psychology side of things you have?
Speaker 2: You are you taking that on as well or is
Speaker 2: it just pure medicine And because the psychology side of
Speaker 2: what you've been through will surely help people and it
Speaker 2: will help people in the future.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Biggest part from my experience was just I think I'm
Speaker 4: probably resilient before my accident happened, and I think I mean,
Speaker 4: if I had to give advice to someone psychology wise,
Speaker 4: it would be like, start developing your resilience now, Like,
Speaker 4: don't wait until something bad happens to try and be resilient,
Speaker 4: because it's, you know, something you need to practice before
Speaker 4: you're right.
Speaker 2: Resilience is isn't about just being strong and bouncing things off,
Speaker 2: And resilience is actually going through these hardships, going through
Speaker 2: these situations and coming out the other side or processing
Speaker 2: whatever's happened to you or the situation in order to
Speaker 2: make it work for you. Right, That's what resilience is.
Speaker 2: It's not there being there and that word is used,
Speaker 2: you know too often. It's not there bouncing stuff off.
Speaker 2: It's actually once you've been through the mill, once you've
Speaker 2: been through something that's you know, traumatic, and you can
Speaker 2: really look at it as a life experience and use
Speaker 2: it like you do, as a life experience to regress
Speaker 2: and to be better. That's what resilience really is. And
Speaker 2: you know that's why you know, talk about resilient mindset
Speaker 2: car to come through the psychological side, not just the
Speaker 2: physical side. The physical side is pretty pretty obvious, right,
Speaker 2: But the psychological side of coming through that and making
Speaker 2: it work to your advantage, that's that's huge.
Speaker 4: Yeah, bouncing back from an injury like this. It's a
Speaker 4: lot easier I guess, even in Australia compared like if
Speaker 4: I was in a different country, like the resources I
Speaker 4: had access to, you know, like it's easy, easy to
Speaker 4: bounce back when you have universal healthcare and you know
Speaker 4: your university is supportive of you continuing your studying and
Speaker 4: so like, Yeah, I think it's definitely important to have
Speaker 4: the supports around.
Speaker 3: Yeah, good support network.
Speaker 2: And also you mentioned before about someone there's a doctor
Speaker 2: in a wheelchair that you mentioned before. Have you reached
Speaker 2: out to any doctors in wheelchairs and you know, got
Speaker 2: a bit of inspirational or knowledge from them?
Speaker 4: Yeah, No, there's a there's a doctor in the Gold
Speaker 4: Coast in Australia, doctor Deniesh Palipana. He's an emergency physician
Speaker 4: and he's really cool. He messaged me on Instagram and
Speaker 4: got to chatting and yeah, I've met him a few
Speaker 4: times and actually I did a keynote speech with him
Speaker 4: on disability and medicine a couple of years ago, and yeah,
Speaker 4: he's really cool.
Speaker 5: I hope to work with them one day.
Speaker 2: How does it help you knowing that there's someone like yourself,
Speaker 2: obviously not as young as you, but someone like yourself
Speaker 2: in the same situation. Does that give you a little
Speaker 2: bit of hope, a little bit of inspiration or you
Speaker 2: just quite you know, listen, this is life.
Speaker 3: I'll deal with it.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 4: No, it's definitely helped, like just being like, all right,
Speaker 4: it's been done, like if someone can do it, like
Speaker 4: I'm sure I can do it, you know, So like
Speaker 4: it's good like to have that for myself, but I
Speaker 4: actually also think it's good probably for the people around
Speaker 4: me as well, who are like, oh, like oh being
Speaker 4: a doctor, like in a wheelchair, like any people who
Speaker 4: might have reservations when they hear that. But I guess
Speaker 4: when you know you can just kind of point to
Speaker 4: someone who's already done it, it's.
Speaker 5: Just easier to you know, subdue the haters.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. And this question, and excuse my ignorance on
Speaker 2: this question, but bar the operations, is is there any
Speaker 2: pain that because you've had your your nerves or did
Speaker 2: you have to deal with a lot of pain or
Speaker 2: was it just from post operations and just taught me
Speaker 2: through through that how that works.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so post operatively I was I was like I
Speaker 4: did have a lot of pain, Like I was being
Speaker 4: treated by the pain team, but one of the doctors
Speaker 4: actually on my team, like everyone knew I was a
Speaker 4: medical student, and so they're kind of like speaking to
Speaker 4: me as I guess more of like a peace Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 4: And one of the pain specialists probably I had probably
Speaker 4: been in hospital for about a week, but she gave
Speaker 4: me a book and it was about pain and spinacleed injuries,
Speaker 4: like specifically, and she's like, yeah, this is probably like
Speaker 4: a good resource for you, and so I read it
Speaker 4: and I had a like I'm really glad I had
Speaker 4: that resource straight away because it was just I don't know,
Speaker 4: it was all about pain and spinacle injuries obviously, and
Speaker 4: I guess that kind of directed all my thoughts about
Speaker 4: pain and like chronic pain, and because I had never
Speaker 4: really experienced I guess bad pain before and so like
Speaker 4: after MaxEnt, I like I get neuropathic pain.
Speaker 5: So there's like a it's like a band around my.
Speaker 4: Waist basically where like where the nerves are all just
Speaker 4: like modeled up. But I'm calling it pain now, but
Speaker 4: like I usually I'm like very hesitant to even use
Speaker 4: the word pain when talking about like the sensations, like
Speaker 4: even the uncomfortable ones. She should call it like you know,
Speaker 4: discomfort or whatever, just because like I mean, your brain
Speaker 4: is so powerful and just like even like calling it
Speaker 4: pain and like he can you know, really amp it up.
Speaker 4: And so you know how like when someone gets like
Speaker 4: their leg cut off like amputation, they might get like
Speaker 4: phantom pain.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, like so like I get phantom pain, but I
Speaker 4: call it phantom sensation because it's not it's not painful,
Speaker 4: like it's sometimes it's like uncomfortable, but like it's not
Speaker 4: pain per se.
Speaker 2: See That's what I'm really interested about, Jimmy. So it's
Speaker 2: not it's not pain that it's not pain. Is it
Speaker 2: more of a is it more of a tingling?
Speaker 4: Like right now, like I swear I can feel my
Speaker 4: feet like they're just like buzzy, Like my feet are
Speaker 4: just constantly just like they just feel warm and like
Speaker 4: tingling and like buzzing. But like it's not actually my feet,
Speaker 4: it's just like my brain. I Well, this is me
Speaker 4: theorizing it's my brain like so used to having access
Speaker 4: to all this like input from my lower limbs and
Speaker 4: then it got suddenly cut off and it's like kind
Speaker 4: of expecting it still still be there. And yeah, I
Speaker 4: think my brain just makes stuff up. I don't trust
Speaker 4: this thing.
Speaker 2: But do you have you ever had the sensations where
Speaker 2: you thought, I can feel my legs. I can probably
Speaker 2: stand up right now.
Speaker 5: I think, like.
Speaker 4: After spending so much time in hospital, especially like I
Speaker 4: was in for a long time, I used to like
Speaker 4: lay in my bed and be like, no, I can
Speaker 4: definitely feel them, like okay, like let's start whiggling.
Speaker 5: These toads like I'm ready. I'm ready, but.
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, like I can still stand, Like the muscles
Speaker 4: still work, I just can't control them. So like the
Speaker 4: muscles will like spasm, I just can't control them. So
Speaker 4: if I like pull myself up, my legs will lock
Speaker 4: out and the muscles will contract for about I don't know,
Speaker 4: thirty seconds and I can stand and wave at you,
Speaker 4: but then they'll stop working and I'll fall over.
Speaker 2: Is there ever an obsession to fix yourself? And do
Speaker 2: you think that that could ever ever happen in the future.
Speaker 4: I think about it like in two ways. In one way,
Speaker 4: like if I spend the rest of my life in
Speaker 4: a wheelchair, I'm content with that, Like my life is incredible.
Speaker 4: Like if like if this is what it's like for
Speaker 4: the rest of my life. Like that's cool. I've yeah
Speaker 4: accepted that. Yeah, But like on the other side of that,
Speaker 4: like this, like the scientific innovation and like technology these
Speaker 4: days is insane and medical research like is just flying
Speaker 4: at an incredible pace. And so if I'm to have
Speaker 4: a spinacle injury at any time in history, this is
Speaker 4: the best time to have one, because like things things
Speaker 4: are happening. Like I think last year or the year before,
Speaker 4: there was a guy who he had a seven spinal
Speaker 4: cord and they were I can't quite remember all the
Speaker 4: specifics of this research, but basically they were doing i
Speaker 4: think a spinal stimulation below like the level of injury,
Speaker 4: and he's able to walk with a like a four
Speaker 4: wheelie walker, and like he had a seven spinal cord.
Speaker 5: And so.
Speaker 4: I'm not like like hoping that, you know, one day
Speaker 4: I'll be able to walk, but like I feel like
Speaker 4: it's on the cards, and like if it doesn't happen,
Speaker 4: that's cool, But like I don't know, I don't I
Speaker 4: don't want to get ahead.
Speaker 2: Of my love that I love that there's hope there
Speaker 2: in your head and you've got you've got your whole
Speaker 2: life in front of you and it's great that you've
Speaker 2: accepted you know that you know you've got going to
Speaker 2: lead a good life in a wheelchair, which you can.
Speaker 2: There's so much you can do, but there's that there's
Speaker 2: that hope, or there's that you know, not hopes as much,
Speaker 2: but there's that It could you know, I could walk
Speaker 2: a again one day.
Speaker 3: Is that something that keeps you going?
Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I'd love to walk again. Walking walking was
Speaker 5: a lot of fun.
Speaker 4: I don't want to say like I took it for
Speaker 4: granted before, but like probably wasn't something that.
Speaker 5: I like thought about.
Speaker 4: I probably did take it for granted. I guess most
Speaker 4: people who walk probably do. But yeah, I'd love to just,
Speaker 4: you know, trot down, trot down the sound again, because
Speaker 4: getting down to the ocean in a wheelchair is so
Speaker 4: much more work than just simply walking across the sand.
Speaker 4: So I wouldn't mind walking across the sand again.
Speaker 3: And do you think that there's enough out there.
Speaker 2: For people like yourself who in wheelchairs? And you know,
Speaker 2: because like you said this, there's a lot of there's
Speaker 2: a lot of barriers in the way, right And I've
Speaker 2: you know, went onto your social media and I looked
Speaker 2: at your I looked at your Instagram and I saw
Speaker 2: straight away you love to pop a wheelie.
Speaker 5: I feel like if you could do it whelly all day,
Speaker 5: you do it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I see, you know, I get that as well.
Speaker 2: But I see you know you've done the bungee jump
Speaker 2: and they were lifting you up the stairs. Do you
Speaker 2: think there could be can be more done for people
Speaker 2: like yourself that are living life in wheelchairs?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 4: I think like for me, like in a manual wheelchair,
Speaker 4: like mine's light and I can kind of get picked
Speaker 4: up and carried places where it's you know, not super accessible,
Speaker 4: but I think like it's a lot harder for people
Speaker 4: who are in like electric wheelchairs, you know, who don't
Speaker 4: have I guess as much function as me or you know,
Speaker 4: have these big, heavy mobility devices. So like, yeah, there's
Speaker 4: in terms of access, like I don't know, there's a
Speaker 4: lot of curves, there's a lot more stairs than you
Speaker 4: think there's just everyone as curves. But yeah, I think
Speaker 4: there's you know, definitely room for improvement. But I think
Speaker 4: it's the direction you know, society is moving and creating
Speaker 4: inclusives is to you know, make its over and can
Speaker 4: make use of a space and access things they need access.
Speaker 2: I've got another question. It might be the world's dumbest question.
Speaker 2: Have you got back on the slopes?
Speaker 5: I have?
Speaker 2: Yeah, wow, yeah, and in what form? And how did
Speaker 2: that that feel?
Speaker 5: So it's it's called sit skiing.
Speaker 4: I I knew I wanted to go skiing, like even
Speaker 4: when I was in hospital, I was like, it'd be
Speaker 4: so fun to go skiing again. And I kind of
Speaker 4: decided that was like, oh, it'd be really fun to
Speaker 4: go skiing, like on my anniversary of my accident. But
Speaker 4: then I didn't want to learn how to ski on
Speaker 4: the anniversary accident because I knew i'd probably like I
Speaker 4: don't know, not enjoy falling over constantly. So I think
Speaker 4: it was it was probably ten months after my accident
Speaker 4: I went down to the snow and started learning to
Speaker 4: ski again. And yeah, the first three days I did
Speaker 4: a lot of four and over and then I think
Speaker 4: by day five I had like kind of picked it
Speaker 4: up and like, I still have a lot of room
Speaker 4: to improve, but you know, I can manage my way
Speaker 4: down the mountain and go fast again, which is one
Speaker 4: of my favorite things to do. So yeah, by the
Speaker 4: time my twelve month anniversary came around, I was hitting
Speaker 4: the slopes.
Speaker 5: That's great.
Speaker 2: Wow, And your social media as well was absolutely blown up,
Speaker 2: your TikTok, your Instagram. You know, how do you feel
Speaker 2: about the love that you received from the world, basically
Speaker 2: because you've got a huge following and you're always putting positive,
Speaker 2: inspirational stuff out there to help people.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was really strange at the start, like having
Speaker 4: videos go viral like it it was really weird. I
Speaker 4: was super bored in rehab and like it wasn't allowed
Speaker 4: any visitors, so like it was really fun to post
Speaker 4: videos and then just have like thousands of people commenting
Speaker 4: nice things using up my ego.
Speaker 3: We all eat it every now and then.
Speaker 5: But yeah, no, it was really cool.
Speaker 4: And yeah, I don't know, just like i've I've got
Speaker 4: a perspective about life, and I feel like i've you know,
Speaker 4: had this for a while and I don't know, a
Speaker 4: lot of people don't seem to be enjoying their life
Speaker 4: or just like life sucks for them. And if I
Speaker 4: can kind of, you know, give someone I don't know,
Speaker 4: maybe push them into you know, viewing their life from
Speaker 4: a different perspective, I think that's a great use of
Speaker 4: my social media. And so if that's what's happening for people.
Speaker 4: I'm stoked with that.
Speaker 3: Brilliant, mate, brilliant. Yeah, it is this powerful, you know,
Speaker 3: social media.
Speaker 2: I know there's a lot of good and bad, but
Speaker 2: the good thing about social media is, you know, people
Speaker 2: do look at it and they can gain you know,
Speaker 2: that glimmer of hope, that ounce of inspiration, you know,
Speaker 2: that that little method of if. If that they can
Speaker 2: do it, then so can I. You know, so it
Speaker 2: is powerful for that reason. Are you still studying, Jimmy,
Speaker 2: And if so, how long have you got left? And
Speaker 2: you know, when, what's what's next for you? What's what's
Speaker 2: the next studies for you? Once you're fully fully cold?
Speaker 4: Yes, I am still studying. I actually took last year
Speaker 4: off and so I've got the rest of this year
Speaker 4: and then next year. Yeah, I'll be a first year doctor.
Speaker 4: So I have to find a nice hospital to work in,
Speaker 4: and yeah, I won't be a student anymore.
Speaker 5: She'll be exciting.
Speaker 2: And is there anything outside of medicine that really really
Speaker 2: interests you and that you're going to look at developing?
Speaker 2: You know, sort of once you fully qualify as a doctor.
Speaker 4: At the moment, like medicine takes up most of my time.
Speaker 4: Like so, I feel at the moment maybe it's just medicine,
Speaker 4: but after that, I am I'd love to do more skiing, Honestly.
Speaker 4: I I've skied every year since my accident, and I
Speaker 4: wouldn't mind, you know, doing a bit of competitive skiing
Speaker 4: down the line.
Speaker 3: Oh really nice? Nice?
Speaker 2: Do you know what, Jimmy, I almost see you and
Speaker 2: I'm throwing this out to you. You know, I'd love
Speaker 2: to see you do something like robotics. I'd love to
Speaker 2: see you merge your medical field with robotics, because you
Speaker 2: know you've got time ahead of you. That field as well,
Speaker 2: is really really developing at a rapid rate of.
Speaker 3: Longs like the medical field is.
Speaker 2: So maybe I'm just planting the seed there, mate, you
Speaker 2: can merge the two together. And listen, I'm going to
Speaker 2: need an XO skeleton. My body's falling apart. I'm going
Speaker 2: to need an EXO skeleton in a few years. So
Speaker 2: hopefully I can come knocking at your door.
Speaker 4: Okay, when I've finished making myself my new legs, I'll
Speaker 4: start making yours.
Speaker 3: There you go, Jimmy, there you go.
Speaker 2: Mate. Absolutely love chatting to you, mate, Thank you ever
Speaker 2: so much for coming on the podcast, and for those
Speaker 2: of you that wants some inspiration and want to to
Speaker 2: gain some resilience, and certainly check out Jimmy jan and
Speaker 2: his journey. It's fascinating and Jimmy, it's been an absolute
Speaker 2: pleasure speaking to you. Thank you so much, Thank you
Speaker 2: very much, Thanks so much for joining me on Headgame.
Speaker 2: If you enjoyed this episode, make sure you're subscribed so
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Speaker 3: I'm Aunt Middleton. Catch you again next time