WEBVTT - Become Your Own Boss 0:00:00.870 --> 0:00:03.660 Hey, everyone, it's Kia. Do you ever feel like the 0:00:03.660 --> 0:00:06.450 classic nine- to- five office job working for someone else 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:09.780 just isn't quite right for you? Well, there are lots 0:00:09.780 --> 0:00:12.389 of other options out there. Self- employment could be a 0:00:12.389 --> 0:00:16.229 really empowering option, and it's getting more and more accessible, 0:00:17.070 --> 0:00:19.738 but you do need to wear many hats as well 0:00:19.739 --> 0:00:21.900 as your main hustle. You have to be the HR 0:00:21.900 --> 0:00:27.779 department, finance, marketing, sales, and digital teams. I'm chatting with 0:00:27.780 --> 0:00:31.020 Georgina Merckel about the opportunities self- employment has given her, 0:00:31.500 --> 0:00:33.598 as well as the financial stuff you need to keep 0:00:33.598 --> 0:00:37.470 in mind when you're working for yourself. Georgina is 27. 0:00:37.620 --> 0:00:40.350 She's the founder of TOPA, a small business and nonprofit 0:00:40.350 --> 0:00:43.530 consultancy. She's also won a Young Freelancer of the Year 0:00:43.530 --> 0:00:46.949 Award in 2022, so she's definitely the right person to 0:00:46.950 --> 0:00:52.680 be speaking to. So, Georgina, can you start by talking 0:00:52.680 --> 0:00:55.830 us through your self- employment journey? Because we want to 0:00:55.830 --> 0:00:57.390 know how that's looked like for you. 0:00:58.050 --> 0:01:02.250 So, I came out of university, I did a master's, 0:01:02.250 --> 0:01:04.949 and I just got an admin job working for somebody 0:01:04.950 --> 0:01:07.559 else, and I started that, and it was a couple 0:01:07.559 --> 0:01:10.499 of weeks before the pandemic actually, I decided to make 0:01:10.559 --> 0:01:13.470 some extra money online. I Googled, " How can you make 0:01:13.470 --> 0:01:16.110 more money online?" And virtual assistant came up, and I 0:01:16.110 --> 0:01:18.450 was like, " I can do that. I'm doing HR, admin." 0:01:18.959 --> 0:01:22.289 And I joined a freelancing platform, and so I just 0:01:22.410 --> 0:01:25.710 put myself online, got some clients, started doing the work, 0:01:26.039 --> 0:01:27.959 and then we went into lockdown, and I just went 0:01:28.020 --> 0:01:30.208 from being in the office to working from home, so 0:01:30.209 --> 0:01:32.580 I could do eight till four in my job and 0:01:32.580 --> 0:01:36.090 then four till eight in my self- employed stuff. It 0:01:36.090 --> 0:01:39.569 really grew from there. So, by six months in, I 0:01:39.569 --> 0:01:43.259 decided to do part- time work, so I cut my 0:01:43.259 --> 0:01:45.090 hours down to three days a week and did my 0:01:45.179 --> 0:01:47.789 freelancing work two days a week, and the weekends and the 0:01:47.789 --> 0:01:51.900 evenings. And then eventually, about nine months after I started 0:01:51.900 --> 0:01:55.740 in March, I went fully self- employed, and my business 0:01:55.740 --> 0:01:58.320 just evolved. I moved away from admin into consulting and 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:01.439 operations, and then it's just grown from there really. 0:02:01.950 --> 0:02:03.749 So, Georgina, what are some of the things that you 0:02:03.750 --> 0:02:05.699 love when it comes to being self- employed? 0:02:06.630 --> 0:02:09.300 The freedom that self- employment gives you is out of 0:02:09.300 --> 0:02:12.090 this world. So, I pretty much work from my sofa 0:02:12.180 --> 0:02:15.210 with my dogs every day. I take random walks in 0:02:15.210 --> 0:02:17.610 the middle of the day. I get to choose who 0:02:17.610 --> 0:02:20.849 I work with and when. Last week, there was one 0:02:20.849 --> 0:02:23.489 day where I worked from 5: 00 PM to 11:00 PM. I did all- 0:02:23.490 --> 0:02:26.910 day cleaning. There's just so much you can do. I've 0:02:26.910 --> 0:02:28.980 worked with clients that just don't really vibe, and at 0:02:28.980 --> 0:02:30.870 some point you can just say, " This is not going 0:02:30.870 --> 0:02:32.429 to work for me." And then you can just move 0:02:32.429 --> 0:02:35.070 on and find clients that serve you better. And tomorrow 0:02:35.070 --> 0:02:36.960 I could be like, " I don't like the direction of 0:02:36.960 --> 0:02:39.330 my business, so I'm going to start marketing myself somewhere 0:02:39.330 --> 0:02:43.889 else." But you can do everything all- in- one job, 0:02:44.040 --> 0:02:46.169 and that's the best bit. I think it's the right 0:02:46.169 --> 0:02:48.150 choice for me and for so many people out there, 0:02:48.150 --> 0:02:51.269 and we just don't get the exposure to being why 0:02:51.270 --> 0:02:52.919 you should be self- employed or why you can be self- 0:02:52.919 --> 0:02:58.619 employed because there's a whole world of self- employment and 0:02:58.619 --> 0:03:02.040 community and people who are literally targeting the same audiences. 0:03:02.040 --> 0:03:03.720 But we're all so different. I have so many friends 0:03:03.720 --> 0:03:06.840 who do similar things, but one client might not be 0:03:07.050 --> 0:03:09.899 for me or for my friend, but they'll vibe with 0:03:09.900 --> 0:03:13.169 someone else we know, and there's no competition. So, I 0:03:13.169 --> 0:03:16.349 just really love being in that freelancer community and really 0:03:16.350 --> 0:03:19.710 just setting my own life and my own plans, and 0:03:20.160 --> 0:03:21.660 there's no restrictions. 0:03:21.810 --> 0:03:24.330 You're selling it to me, and I'm already there. It 0:03:24.330 --> 0:03:27.660 sounds amazing. It sounds great. I mean, having a sofa 0:03:27.660 --> 0:03:29.579 office, being able to do all that work when you want. 0:03:29.580 --> 0:03:31.470 Yeah. I mean, I call it the soft office. 0:03:31.530 --> 0:03:31.740 Yeah. 0:03:31.740 --> 0:03:32.939 That's basically where I work all the time. It's not 0:03:32.940 --> 0:03:35.100 good for your back, though. I do have a desk. 0:03:35.100 --> 0:03:38.190 I do try and I do the whole standing, sitting desk situation, 0:03:38.340 --> 0:03:39.870 but most of the time I'm just sat on the 0:03:39.870 --> 0:03:42.720 sofa with the dogs with a blanket work from my 0:03:42.720 --> 0:03:46.769 laptop. I've worked in the car. I travel, and I'll 0:03:46.770 --> 0:03:48.840 just be sat on my laptop in a service station 0:03:49.230 --> 0:03:52.409 typing, drinking Starbucks, and filming myself for reels. 0:03:52.980 --> 0:03:54.840 Sounds like a dream. Where do I sign up? You've 0:03:54.840 --> 0:03:57.900 already sold me. I want to sign on the dotted line now and join the self- 0:03:57.900 --> 0:04:03.899 employment route. Self- employment is such a big leap, especially 0:04:03.900 --> 0:04:05.819 the way that you did it. You did it a really 0:04:05.820 --> 0:04:08.729 smart way, having your nine to five and then your 0:04:08.730 --> 0:04:11.999 five to nine, as people call it, working on your 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:14.700 side hustle effectively until it became your main hustle. But 0:04:15.060 --> 0:04:17.640 what was it that gave you that confidence to say, " 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:21.599 I'm going to leave my skew nine to five and 0:04:21.599 --> 0:04:25.620 actually take the plunge and the leap into my side 0:04:25.620 --> 0:04:26.001 hustle (inaudible) "? 0:04:27.000 --> 0:04:28.739 It took me such a long time, and I could 0:04:28.740 --> 0:04:29.879 have done it a lot sooner if I'd had the 0:04:29.879 --> 0:04:31.859 confidence to do it, but it got to the point 0:04:31.860 --> 0:04:33.630 where I just couldn't juggle both, and I was reaching 0:04:33.630 --> 0:04:36.930 the point of burnout, and I was just working all 0:04:36.930 --> 0:04:39.089 the time. And at some point, I knew that had to 0:04:39.089 --> 0:04:41.160 change. So, it took a lot longer than I would've 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:42.540 wanted it to. If I could go back in time 0:04:42.540 --> 0:04:45.330 now, maybe it would've left after six months. But what 0:04:45.330 --> 0:04:48.359 was great is I started building clients and my job, 0:04:48.360 --> 0:04:51.029 so I started matching my salary, and by the time 0:04:51.029 --> 0:04:54.510 I could match my take- home monthly, I decided that 0:04:54.510 --> 0:04:56.309 was probably the right time to leave because I wasn't 0:04:56.309 --> 0:04:58.200 going to take this big drop in income. 0:04:58.260 --> 0:04:58.589 Of course. 0:04:59.160 --> 0:05:01.740 I was just going to go straight into the same 0:05:02.370 --> 0:05:04.920 salary, but on my terms, and then I could just 0:05:04.920 --> 0:05:06.689 take it from there and see what happens after that. 0:05:07.140 --> 0:05:08.550 But it took a lot of guts in the end 0:05:08.580 --> 0:05:12.570 really to get there because I didn't know anyone self- 0:05:12.570 --> 0:05:14.880 employed. I just did it. A lot of the people 0:05:14.880 --> 0:05:18.120 I'm around are all employed people with secure jobs, and 0:05:18.178 --> 0:05:20.550 they didn't know what to say either. I kept saying, " 0:05:21.000 --> 0:05:22.379 I think I'm going to leave my job." And they 0:05:22.379 --> 0:05:25.049 were like, " Whoa, you're making that decision? That's a bit 0:05:25.050 --> 0:05:27.960 scary, isn't it? You've got this job." And by that 0:05:27.960 --> 0:05:29.190 time, I'd fallen out of love with it because I 0:05:29.190 --> 0:05:31.740 fell in love with working for myself. I just couldn't 0:05:31.740 --> 0:05:33.599 do both. So, at some point, I had to give, 0:05:33.809 --> 0:05:36.450 and I'm so glad I did. The pandemic definitely was the 0:05:36.450 --> 0:05:39.389 reason why that took off because everyone, all my clients, 0:05:39.389 --> 0:05:43.080 needed virtual support, didn't care whether you were in an 0:05:43.080 --> 0:05:45.930 office or at home, on your sofa wherever you were, 0:05:46.230 --> 0:05:49.830 but were just ready. And so it just really was 0:05:49.830 --> 0:05:51.779 all those things at the right place at the right time. 0:05:51.809 --> 0:05:53.999 That's amazing that it's all just falling into place, and 0:05:55.049 --> 0:05:57.270 I mean, your journey is a testament to everything. So, 0:05:57.330 --> 0:06:00.060 that is amazing. Now we're going to move on to 0:06:00.360 --> 0:06:02.969 more the money side. So, the financial side of things. 0:06:02.970 --> 0:06:05.130 So, when it comes to self- employment, I've been self- 0:06:05.130 --> 0:06:08.159 employed, I am self- employed right now. And I myself 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:12.570 know how finances can take you aback, and especially when 0:06:12.570 --> 0:06:14.759 you've come from something so stable as a nine to 0:06:14.759 --> 0:06:17.850 five to being self- employed, there are things that can 0:06:18.029 --> 0:06:20.969 change your finances and some things that may take you 0:06:20.970 --> 0:06:23.789 by surprise. So what, when it comes to the financial 0:06:23.790 --> 0:06:26.190 side of being self- employed, took you by surprise? 0:06:26.670 --> 0:06:29.969 I didn't have any kind of insight into what I needed 0:06:29.969 --> 0:06:32.099 to do. I had no plans, I didn't take any 0:06:32.099 --> 0:06:35.698 advice. I just went self- employed, and that included the 0:06:35.699 --> 0:06:38.040 financial aspects. So, I knew about tax; I knew I'd 0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:39.779 have to pay it a different way to how I'd 0:06:39.779 --> 0:06:43.260 been doing it in a payslip, but I just thought, " Well, 0:06:43.350 --> 0:06:45.779 that happens in January, and I'll work it out then." And 0:06:45.779 --> 0:06:47.969 then I did get an accountant, who I just didn't 0:06:47.969 --> 0:06:51.599 educate myself well enough on, the right person to work 0:06:51.599 --> 0:06:53.849 with and to get the right advice, and I never 0:06:53.850 --> 0:06:57.330 even asked how much he cost until I got the bill 0:06:57.330 --> 0:06:59.790 at the end. And he was like four times the 0:06:59.790 --> 0:07:00.361 price of my current accountant. 0:07:00.361 --> 0:07:00.841 Oh my gosh. 0:07:01.380 --> 0:07:04.320 And I was shocked. I was shocked at how much 0:07:04.320 --> 0:07:07.320 tax I had to pay, and I didn't know I had to pay a year 0:07:07.320 --> 0:07:09.630 and a half, basically, of tax. You had to pay payments 0:07:09.630 --> 0:07:11.879 on account, and I didn't know about that, even though 0:07:11.879 --> 0:07:13.500 I think I did in the back of my head 0:07:13.500 --> 0:07:16.650 and I just hadn't thought about it, prepared. But then there's 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:21.599 so much more. There's income protection and your pension. I 0:07:21.599 --> 0:07:23.819 paid into a pension when I had a job, but 0:07:24.210 --> 0:07:26.459 I never realized you had to do that as a self- 0:07:26.460 --> 0:07:29.250 employed person. I never thought about what happens if I 0:07:29.250 --> 0:07:32.070 get called for jury duty tomorrow or have an accident, 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:35.340 or what if my business closes. What am I going 0:07:35.340 --> 0:07:37.560 to do? And so I had not made any of 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:40.770 those plans. Now I'm so grateful I have got those 0:07:40.770 --> 0:07:43.679 things in place, but I didn't read enough. It was 0:07:43.679 --> 0:07:47.219 like a year in, and suddenly I started to realize 0:07:47.219 --> 0:07:49.350 I had to learn this stuff quickly. 0:07:49.740 --> 0:07:52.200 I think a lot of people will share the same 0:07:52.650 --> 0:07:55.470 story as you do. I know I definitely do. You 0:07:55.470 --> 0:07:57.900 kind of jump into self- employment, and it's great. You 0:07:57.900 --> 0:07:59.579 get to be your own boss, you get to do 0:07:59.580 --> 0:08:01.470 things that you want to do in your own time, 0:08:01.740 --> 0:08:04.799 and then the financial side comes, you're like, " Wow." Because 0:08:04.799 --> 0:08:06.900 I know for me, income protection was, again, something I 0:08:06.900 --> 0:08:09.450 didn't have. I wasn't fully aware of when I first 0:08:09.450 --> 0:08:12.571 started my journey. Also, having an emergency fund- 0:08:12.571 --> 0:08:12.572 Yes. 0:08:12.572 --> 0:08:16.050 -For your business was something that I hadn't factored in 0:08:16.050 --> 0:08:17.729 until I'd gotten to a point where I'm like, " I 0:08:17.730 --> 0:08:19.649 should really have a pot of money just sitting there 0:08:19.650 --> 0:08:21.779 in case I need to cover things in case things..." 0:08:22.289 --> 0:08:24.690 As you know, income comes and it ebbs and flows; some 0:08:24.719 --> 0:08:27.420 months are great, some other months are just lower. And 0:08:27.420 --> 0:08:28.680 those are things that I had to learn on the go, 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:30.210 and it's only because I have an accountant and I have 0:08:30.210 --> 0:08:32.309 all of that. But if you don't know, there's all things 0:08:32.309 --> 0:08:35.070 that you'd never know to consider until you're in that 0:08:35.070 --> 0:08:38.968 situation that's typically too late. So, Georgina, knowing what you 0:08:38.969 --> 0:08:43.049 know about your journey, what do you wish that you 0:08:43.050 --> 0:08:47.700 would've known or would've done differently/ again recommended to others 0:08:47.700 --> 0:08:50.130 who were about to embark on their self- employment journey? 0:08:50.639 --> 0:08:53.849 I think get really good advice. I mean, it's never 0:08:53.849 --> 0:08:56.189 too early to get an accountant. First of all, they 0:08:56.190 --> 0:08:58.769 know what they're doing. They are experts. Now I have 0:08:58.770 --> 0:09:01.500 an amazing small business accountant who works with people just 0:09:01.500 --> 0:09:05.010 like me. And so you get proper advice about your 0:09:05.010 --> 0:09:08.159 taxes, what you can claim, whether you should be a 0:09:08.160 --> 0:09:11.160 limited company or a sole trader, what you should be 0:09:11.160 --> 0:09:14.099 paying into. I didn't know that if you've got a 0:09:14.099 --> 0:09:16.619 limited company, they can pay your pension on your behalf, 0:09:16.619 --> 0:09:18.990 but if you're a sole trader, you pay yourself. So, 0:09:18.990 --> 0:09:22.200 there's a tax difference there. And if you get that 0:09:22.200 --> 0:09:25.260 good advice and also get the fees upfront, so you 0:09:25.260 --> 0:09:28.410 know, on budget ahead of time, that will really help. 0:09:28.740 --> 0:09:30.360 I wish now if I could go back in time. I had 0:09:30.630 --> 0:09:33.480 a checklist of things to do from day one, things 0:09:33.480 --> 0:09:37.319 to do from six months in, and I'm now a 0:09:37.319 --> 0:09:40.530 member of IPSE, and they have a package where you 0:09:40.530 --> 0:09:45.240 get jury service cover and income protection. There's some life 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:49.950 assurance and contract dispute cover, and those things come together; 0:09:49.950 --> 0:09:52.559 you don't have to think about them separately. So, if 0:09:52.559 --> 0:09:55.468 you get the proper advice and you look at what 0:09:55.500 --> 0:09:58.800 your options are, clearly you can make those decisions well 0:09:58.800 --> 0:10:00.510 in advance and be prepared for them. 0:10:00.510 --> 0:10:02.368 I completely agree with the advice that you've given, I 0:10:02.370 --> 0:10:06.119 think is so key. What would you say then to 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:10.559 someone who's on the fence about becoming self- employed? Because 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:13.860 it is a big jump. You and I have both 0:10:13.860 --> 0:10:16.020 done it, and I'm sure we can both agree that 0:10:16.020 --> 0:10:18.870 it is a big leap. It's one that I'm happy 0:10:18.870 --> 0:10:19.470 that I've done. 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:19.800 Yeah. 0:10:19.800 --> 0:10:22.740 However, I do understand it is a big change. So, 0:10:22.740 --> 0:10:24.838 what would you say to someone who is on the 0:10:24.840 --> 0:10:25.439 fence about that? 0:10:25.920 --> 0:10:28.049 I think if you're thinking about it, it's probably the 0:10:28.049 --> 0:10:31.410 right decision for you. If you're on the fence, start 0:10:31.410 --> 0:10:35.010 taking it seriously and start thinking about it. I would 0:10:35.250 --> 0:10:40.529 start doing both your paid job and the self- employment 0:10:40.530 --> 0:10:43.110 thing at the same time to build up that income 0:10:43.230 --> 0:10:44.880 because once... It's like a momentum thing; once you start 0:10:44.880 --> 0:10:47.910 getting clients or bringing in money, it carries on from 0:10:47.910 --> 0:10:50.220 there. So, it's really simple to keep doing it, but 0:10:50.490 --> 0:10:53.610 personally, I would do it. The freedom I get from being self- 0:10:53.610 --> 0:10:57.270 employed is just way above anything else in terms of 0:10:57.870 --> 0:11:00.118 any other benefits I could get. I wouldn't change it 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:01.559 for the world. And I think if you're thinking about 0:11:01.559 --> 0:11:03.389 it, you're probably on the path already there. 0:11:03.450 --> 0:11:04.858 I love that. I think, yeah, like you said, if 0:11:04.859 --> 0:11:07.828 it's rooted in your mind, it's probably something that you 0:11:07.830 --> 0:11:11.819 do want to do. So, Georgina, let's talk about pensions. 0:11:11.850 --> 0:11:15.330 Okay, so in episode three of A Little Ritual, we 0:11:15.330 --> 0:11:17.610 cover the importance of having a pension when you're in 0:11:17.610 --> 0:11:20.400 a workplace, but when you're self- employed, we know that 0:11:20.400 --> 0:11:24.179 workplace pensions don't actually apply here. Just a little summary 0:11:24.179 --> 0:11:26.640 to our listeners. A pension is a pot that you 0:11:26.640 --> 0:11:29.640 contribute to that will essentially fund your lifestyle once you 0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:33.030 reach retirement age. There are many benefits to contributing to 0:11:33.030 --> 0:11:35.940 a pension, especially from a younger age, as you're able 0:11:35.940 --> 0:11:39.059 to benefit from government top- ups and certain tax exemptions. 0:11:39.330 --> 0:11:41.520 But a question I want to ask you, Georgina, is 0:11:41.580 --> 0:11:44.520 how can someone who's self- employed go about setting up 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:47.370 a pension, and why is it so important to have one? 0:11:48.330 --> 0:11:50.429 It's important because at some point you're not going to 0:11:50.429 --> 0:11:52.080 want to work anymore, or at least the level that 0:11:52.080 --> 0:11:53.790 you're doing right now. So, you have to be able 0:11:53.790 --> 0:11:56.849 to pay for your life. So, you need to start 0:11:56.849 --> 0:11:59.399 doing that. And the earlier you do it, the better 0:11:59.400 --> 0:12:03.150 it is. About a year into my self- employed journey, 0:12:03.150 --> 0:12:05.580 I just set up a pension using an app and 0:12:05.580 --> 0:12:07.950 started paying two pound a week into it. And in 0:12:07.950 --> 0:12:09.719 my head, I was like, I've ticked the box of 0:12:09.719 --> 0:12:12.150 setting up the pension, and I'm going to come back 0:12:12.150 --> 0:12:14.549 to it in three months time and work out what 0:12:14.549 --> 0:12:17.848 I should be putting in there. And that step for 0:12:17.850 --> 0:12:20.670 me was really helpful because I'd done the admin bit 0:12:21.090 --> 0:12:24.689 and I'd got over that hump. Then I started working 0:12:24.690 --> 0:12:27.180 out what actually I need to save between now and 0:12:27.780 --> 0:12:29.940 50 or 60 whenever I want to step away from 0:12:29.940 --> 0:12:32.610 my business. What am I going to need to live 0:12:32.610 --> 0:12:34.740 on to make the same money I can make now? 0:12:35.340 --> 0:12:37.530 So, it's really important that you start thinking about it. 0:12:37.530 --> 0:12:38.400 The earlier, the better. 0:12:39.030 --> 0:12:41.910 Even though you contributed two pounds a week, it's the 0:12:41.910 --> 0:12:43.320 action of starting it. 0:12:43.440 --> 0:12:43.800 Yeah. 0:12:43.890 --> 0:12:46.620 That is what's going to trigger you to, at some 0:12:46.620 --> 0:12:49.170 point, sit down with it and say, " Actually," like you said, " 0:12:49.410 --> 0:12:52.050 how much do I need to have in there? What 0:12:52.379 --> 0:12:54.210 amount am I trying to get to?" And then work 0:12:54.210 --> 0:12:58.410 backwards to start actually putting money into there. So, we 0:12:58.410 --> 0:13:00.990 mentioned how it's important, but how can someone actually start 0:13:01.950 --> 0:13:03.450 actually saving into a pension? How did you do it, 0:13:03.450 --> 0:13:03.780 for example? 0:13:03.990 --> 0:13:07.650 So I literally Googled self- employed pensions, and there are 0:13:07.650 --> 0:13:09.629 loads of options out there. I just signed up with 0:13:09.630 --> 0:13:13.110 an app where I put my details in, you do 0:13:13.110 --> 0:13:14.850 the admin bit, and then you just set up a 0:13:14.850 --> 0:13:16.591 regular amount or a lump sum. It's up to you. 0:13:16.591 --> 0:13:19.080 And I think that's so key. As somebody who's self- employed, 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:22.740 being able to control how much you put in, being 0:13:22.740 --> 0:13:24.330 in control of that is what you need. 0:13:24.330 --> 0:13:24.420 Yes. 0:13:24.509 --> 0:13:28.619 So, I completely agree with you on that. I want 0:13:28.619 --> 0:13:30.780 to run off the episode as we always do, Georgina, 0:13:31.110 --> 0:13:33.120 and I'm going to ask you. What are your three 0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:35.490 tips to help our listeners get a little bit richer? 0:13:36.210 --> 0:13:40.259 So, if you're thinking about self- employment, start now. Start 0:13:40.260 --> 0:13:43.020 earning money or building that momentum. It's hard work, but 0:13:43.020 --> 0:13:44.910 it will pay off in the long run because then 0:13:44.910 --> 0:13:48.870 the drop or the change will be less dramatic. Start 0:13:48.870 --> 0:13:51.208 the pension early, like day one. You can do it if 0:13:51.210 --> 0:13:53.220 you're employed, right? You can just set up a private 0:13:53.220 --> 0:13:56.790 pension. There's nothing stopping you. And I think the third 0:13:56.790 --> 0:13:59.069 thing is look into what packages are available. Can you 0:13:59.070 --> 0:14:02.670 get a group insurance that'll cover multiple things? Because it's 0:14:02.670 --> 0:14:05.249 better for you in the long run. Work out what 0:14:05.250 --> 0:14:07.980 the best options are, but get started sooner rather than 0:14:07.980 --> 0:14:12.690 later. The earlier you start sacrificing that income, you'll be 0:14:12.690 --> 0:14:15.420 better off in the long run, and it'll all just flow. 0:14:16.020 --> 0:14:19.380 Thank you so much, Georgina. You've shared so many amazing 0:14:19.380 --> 0:14:20.731 insights and gems for us on this episode. 0:14:20.731 --> 0:14:21.241 Thank you. 0:14:21.690 --> 0:14:24.720 That has made self- employment not seem as daunting for 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:25.920 anyone who wants to get into it. So, thank you 0:14:25.920 --> 0:14:28.650 so much for joining us. It's been great to hear 0:14:28.650 --> 0:14:32.280 Georgina talk about her experiences of self- employment. Next week, 0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:35.160 we're continuing the conversation about the different career journeys that 0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:37.889 are out there. Where we look at the freedom your finances can 0:14:37.889 --> 0:14:42.210 give you. Want to retire early, travel, work part- time? 0:14:42.930 --> 0:14:45.630 Take a listen to hear what might be possible. In 0:14:45.630 --> 0:14:49.380 the meantime, be sure to follow the podcast and tell your friends. Bye.