1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:06,720 Krutika Adatia: Hello and welcome back to On Your Marks from ACCA. 2 00:00:07,110 --> 00:00:11,130 Krutika Adatia: I'm Krutika Adatia and I'm a chartered accountant. I now support 3 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:15,300 Krutika Adatia: accountancy students through their training. And as an educator, I'm 4 00:00:15,300 --> 00:00:18,270 Krutika Adatia: regularly up close and personal with some of the common 5 00:00:18,270 --> 00:00:22,680 Krutika Adatia: issues people face while studying for and sitting their accountancy 6 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:26,640 Krutika Adatia: exams. So in this series for ACCA, I'm chatting to 7 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:30,480 Krutika Adatia: experts about strategies we can all use when facing some 8 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:35,400 Krutika Adatia: of life's challenges. This week we're looking at exercise. Some 9 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:37,740 Krutika Adatia: of us love it, some of us hate it, but we 10 00:00:37,740 --> 00:00:40,740 Krutika Adatia: all know that when we're busy or stressed, it's really 11 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:44,670 Krutika Adatia: easy to let exercise fall by the wayside, even when 12 00:00:44,670 --> 00:00:48,390 Krutika Adatia: we know it's good for us. So how does exercising 13 00:00:48,390 --> 00:00:52,050 Krutika Adatia: our bodies affect our brains? How can it actually make 14 00:00:52,050 --> 00:00:55,410 Krutika Adatia: learning easier and what can we all do to ensure 15 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:59,370 Krutika Adatia: we're getting the benefits? This is On Your Marks because 16 00:00:59,370 --> 00:01:08,280 Krutika Adatia: you'll never know until you try. I came to exercise 17 00:01:08,370 --> 00:01:11,459 Krutika Adatia: perhaps a little later than some. It wasn't really part 18 00:01:11,459 --> 00:01:15,060 Krutika Adatia: of how I grew up and I often dismissed it. Maybe 19 00:01:15,060 --> 00:01:17,700 Krutika Adatia: that was down to my environment or growing up in 20 00:01:17,700 --> 00:01:21,929 Krutika Adatia: an Indian family where comments about exercise were sometimes casually 21 00:01:21,930 --> 00:01:25,979 Krutika Adatia: tied to weight rather than wellbeing. But in my 30s, 22 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:31,200 Krutika Adatia: something shifted. I started to approach exercise differently and since 23 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:34,050 Krutika Adatia: making it a regular part of my life, I've been 24 00:01:34,050 --> 00:01:38,670 Krutika Adatia: genuinely surprised by the impact, not just physically but mentally 25 00:01:38,670 --> 00:01:42,900 Krutika Adatia: too, including my mood, my focus and my overall sense 26 00:01:42,900 --> 00:01:47,220 Krutika Adatia: of wellbeing. So this is something I've become really curious 27 00:01:47,220 --> 00:01:51,240 Krutika Adatia: about. What exercise actually does for us beyond the surface 28 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,480 Krutika Adatia: level narratives that we often hear and that's why I'm 29 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:59,280 Krutika Adatia: really excited to have this conversation with Sandrine Thuret. Sandrine 30 00:01:59,280 --> 00:02:03,330 Krutika Adatia: is a professor of neuroscience at King's College London and 31 00:02:03,330 --> 00:02:09,090 Krutika Adatia: she's fascinated by how exercise affects our brains. So Sandrine, 32 00:02:09,090 --> 00:02:12,570 Krutika Adatia: let's start with the basics. What is happening in our 33 00:02:12,570 --> 00:02:14,550 Krutika Adatia: brains when we are exercising? 34 00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:18,090 Sandrine Thuret: So there's a lot of things that are happening in 35 00:02:18,090 --> 00:02:22,109 Sandrine Thuret: our brain. I would say what people are mostly aware 36 00:02:22,110 --> 00:02:25,650 Sandrine Thuret: of or have read about is these endorphin feelings after the 37 00:02:25,830 --> 00:02:30,360 Sandrine Thuret: exercise, how you feel good and happy about your achievement. 38 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,900 Sandrine Thuret: What we are studying in my research lab is more 39 00:02:33,900 --> 00:02:38,940 Sandrine Thuret: the longer term effect of the exercise, continuous effect. And 40 00:02:38,940 --> 00:02:40,980 Sandrine Thuret: one of the thing that exercise does is that it 41 00:02:40,980 --> 00:02:45,000 Sandrine Thuret: increase production of new neurons, which we call neurogenesis. 42 00:02:45,150 --> 00:02:48,180 Krutika Adatia: Oh, wow. And that is something that certainly I'd like 43 00:02:48,180 --> 00:02:50,250 Krutika Adatia: to hear more about. I mean, what are some of 44 00:02:50,250 --> 00:02:52,530 Krutika Adatia: the benefits of this neurogenesis? 45 00:02:52,650 --> 00:02:57,690 Sandrine Thuret: So yeah, this neurogenesis, so producing new neuron is quite 46 00:02:57,690 --> 00:03:03,270 Sandrine Thuret: important. I mean first, obviously we thought that this is 47 00:03:03,270 --> 00:03:05,550 Sandrine Thuret: not existing for a very long time. We thought that 48 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:09,480 Sandrine Thuret: once you are grown up, you have made all the 49 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:13,139 Sandrine Thuret: number of neurons that you have and you can't make 50 00:03:13,139 --> 00:03:16,830 Sandrine Thuret: anymore. However, we another to discover that you can produce 51 00:03:16,830 --> 00:03:20,580 Sandrine Thuret: new neurons in the hippocampus, which is important for learning and 52 00:03:20,580 --> 00:03:24,000 Sandrine Thuret: memory and mood and emotion. And over many years to 53 00:03:24,000 --> 00:03:26,610 Sandrine Thuret: probably 20 years of research, now we have learned that 54 00:03:26,669 --> 00:03:30,120 Sandrine Thuret: these adult- borne neurons are important for learning and memory 55 00:03:30,600 --> 00:03:34,110 Sandrine Thuret: and then mood and emotion. So they are quite key 56 00:03:34,110 --> 00:03:40,140 Sandrine Thuret: players and that's why you should promote the production of 57 00:03:40,140 --> 00:03:41,041 Sandrine Thuret: this new neuron through your entire life. 58 00:03:41,041 --> 00:03:44,370 Krutika Adatia: Amazing. So what I'm hearing you say is that we 59 00:03:44,370 --> 00:03:48,450 Krutika Adatia: exercise, we feel good, it produces new neurons. It's doing 60 00:03:48,450 --> 00:03:52,350 Krutika Adatia: this in the hippocampus where the learning takes place. So 61 00:03:52,350 --> 00:03:55,350 Krutika Adatia: that sounds like great news for our students, right? We 62 00:03:55,350 --> 00:03:56,220 Krutika Adatia: should be doing more of it. 63 00:03:56,250 --> 00:03:59,820 Sandrine Thuret: Yes, absolutely. So indeed they are really important for learning 64 00:03:59,820 --> 00:04:05,700 Sandrine Thuret: and memory and they are important for specific task or specific 65 00:04:05,700 --> 00:04:09,000 Sandrine Thuret: type of learning. So one is spatial recognition. So you 66 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:12,720 Sandrine Thuret: need this new neuron for finding new ways. So that's 67 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:16,350 Sandrine Thuret: useful for everyone. But I think one might be particularly 68 00:04:16,350 --> 00:04:19,650 Sandrine Thuret: interesting for your student is that these neuron are important 69 00:04:19,650 --> 00:04:23,339 Sandrine Thuret: for what we call pattern separation. So it's the ability 70 00:04:23,339 --> 00:04:27,570 Sandrine Thuret: we have to distinguish similar memories. So let's say if 71 00:04:27,570 --> 00:04:31,440 Sandrine Thuret: we give an example of people that are maybe in 72 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,680 Sandrine Thuret: the US, you have this big parking lot structure, right? 73 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:38,970 Sandrine Thuret: They park their car in one spot, maybe same car, 74 00:04:39,570 --> 00:04:42,539 Sandrine Thuret: same floor every day, but slightly a different spot. However, 75 00:04:43,920 --> 00:04:46,320 Sandrine Thuret: if all goes well, you will find back your car 76 00:04:46,410 --> 00:04:48,990 Sandrine Thuret: although it's a slightly different spot. So this is this pattern 77 00:04:48,990 --> 00:04:53,430 Sandrine Thuret: separation, how you distinguish very similar memory. So reflecting on 78 00:04:53,430 --> 00:04:58,140 Sandrine Thuret: the work your students are doing, they have to bring 79 00:04:58,140 --> 00:05:01,500 Sandrine Thuret: on this patent separation a lot, distinguishing very similar set of 80 00:05:01,500 --> 00:05:06,089 Sandrine Thuret: data, I guess coming across all of these spreadsheets, I 81 00:05:06,089 --> 00:05:09,390 Sandrine Thuret: could imagine that patent separation is very important. And then these other 82 00:05:09,390 --> 00:05:12,000 Sandrine Thuret: born neuron are these specific tasks to help you do that. 83 00:05:13,050 --> 00:05:15,839 Krutika Adatia: Oh, wow. That's amazing because that's making me think that 84 00:05:16,380 --> 00:05:19,409 Krutika Adatia: with the ACCA exams, they often link to one another 85 00:05:19,410 --> 00:05:23,760 Krutika Adatia: as well. So if they've covered something before, then there's 86 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:25,529 Krutika Adatia: a way that it can then come up in another 87 00:05:25,529 --> 00:05:28,350 Krutika Adatia: exam in a slightly more detailed way or maybe a 88 00:05:28,350 --> 00:05:31,920 Krutika Adatia: slightly different way. So what we're saying is that actually 89 00:05:32,190 --> 00:05:37,080 Krutika Adatia: the neurons that are created through exercising could potentially help 90 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:38,130 Krutika Adatia: or support that. 91 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:43,560 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah, absolutely. So exercise is one way you can create this neuron 92 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:45,930 Sandrine Thuret: and we can maybe discuss later. There's other way for 93 00:05:45,930 --> 00:05:49,950 Sandrine Thuret: people maybe who don't like exercise, how you can create 94 00:05:50,310 --> 00:05:52,320 Sandrine Thuret: this new neuron. But yeah, they are a key layer 95 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:56,219 Sandrine Thuret: in that. And so unfortunately we know that the production 96 00:05:56,220 --> 00:05:58,800 Sandrine Thuret: of this new neuron stay throughout life, but it goes down 97 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,310 Sandrine Thuret: slightly as we get older. So, but you could try 98 00:06:02,310 --> 00:06:05,849 Sandrine Thuret: to compensate that with some activity that are going to 99 00:06:05,850 --> 00:06:09,870 Sandrine Thuret: promote the production of this new neuron. And we know that this 100 00:06:09,870 --> 00:06:12,779 Sandrine Thuret: ability to do pattern separation as well goes down with 101 00:06:12,779 --> 00:06:15,540 Sandrine Thuret: aging. That kind of mimic the production of new neurons. 102 00:06:16,230 --> 00:06:19,440 Sandrine Thuret: So there's quite a lot of evidence that they are important for that. 103 00:06:20,070 --> 00:06:22,170 Krutika Adatia: So you mentioned the evidence. How do we know that 104 00:06:22,170 --> 00:06:25,020 Krutika Adatia: this is actually happening in our brains? 105 00:06:25,110 --> 00:06:29,730 Sandrine Thuret: So very good question. So all started with animal mouse 106 00:06:29,730 --> 00:06:34,740 Sandrine Thuret: studies. So this concept of neurogenesis is conserved throughout mammalian 107 00:06:34,740 --> 00:06:39,270 Sandrine Thuret: spaces. So to understand really the role at the molecular 108 00:06:39,270 --> 00:06:41,790 Sandrine Thuret: and cellular level, it's important to have these kind of 109 00:06:41,790 --> 00:06:45,120 Sandrine Thuret: models. And this is how it was discovered very important 110 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:49,320 Sandrine Thuret: for learning, mood and emotion, because we could see all 111 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,799 Sandrine Thuret: these differences in animal model. Now in the human, we 112 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:55,740 Sandrine Thuret: know this does exist with postmortem studies. So we see 113 00:06:56,070 --> 00:07:00,750 Sandrine Thuret: in brain of people who have died, unfortunately, we can 114 00:07:00,750 --> 00:07:05,130 Sandrine Thuret: detect them and we can see that's why in depression 115 00:07:05,130 --> 00:07:08,070 Sandrine Thuret: in people who have suffered from depression and we can 116 00:07:08,070 --> 00:07:11,580 Sandrine Thuret: see that they have a lower level of neurogenesis, people who 117 00:07:13,470 --> 00:07:17,970 Sandrine Thuret: have dementia or Alzheimer's disease have lower level of neurogenesis. 118 00:07:17,970 --> 00:07:22,140 Sandrine Thuret: So we can see this is there, this is existing and it is 119 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:26,640 Sandrine Thuret: modulated with age, but you can compensate with activity, but 120 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:29,250 Sandrine Thuret: also it disturbing certain disorders and disease. 121 00:07:29,550 --> 00:07:32,880 Krutika Adatia: Yeah. Actually, when I think about exercise, I started with 122 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:36,360 Krutika Adatia: cardio first and I started doing Zumba because I was like, " 123 00:07:36,450 --> 00:07:39,840 Krutika Adatia: That doesn't feel like exercise to me." And then I've 124 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:43,440 Krutika Adatia: also added strength to it as well because I kept 125 00:07:43,440 --> 00:07:47,610 Krutika Adatia: seeing in mainstream media and the content graders that I 126 00:07:47,610 --> 00:07:50,040 Krutika Adatia: follow that you've got to add some strength training in as 127 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,560 Krutika Adatia: well. So my question to you is, does it really 128 00:07:52,620 --> 00:07:56,430 Krutika Adatia: matter whether you're doing cardio or strength to get this 129 00:07:56,430 --> 00:07:59,790 Krutika Adatia: kind of neurogenesis benefits that you're outlining here? 130 00:07:59,790 --> 00:08:04,620 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah, that's a really good question. So from the earlier data, 131 00:08:04,650 --> 00:08:08,490 Sandrine Thuret: so animal model data, for example, mice love running naturally. 132 00:08:08,550 --> 00:08:10,560 Sandrine Thuret: So you give them access to a running wheel and 133 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:12,690 Sandrine Thuret: they will run, run, run, run, run like up to 134 00:08:13,260 --> 00:08:18,480 Sandrine Thuret: 14 kilometers per night. So they are nocturnal. Human, we are 135 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:22,830 Sandrine Thuret: not going to run that far proportionally, but a lot of the human 136 00:08:22,830 --> 00:08:27,930 Sandrine Thuret: studies thought, okay, let's do cardio work. However, in our 137 00:08:27,930 --> 00:08:32,069 Sandrine Thuret: latest trial, we did a focus group with participant who 138 00:08:32,070 --> 00:08:37,110 Sandrine Thuret: did not exercise before. So we thought it was important to get their opinion 139 00:08:37,110 --> 00:08:39,540 Sandrine Thuret: before we design a study to see what type of 140 00:08:39,540 --> 00:08:44,069 Sandrine Thuret: exercise would people stick to and enjoy doing. And the people who 141 00:08:44,070 --> 00:08:46,920 Sandrine Thuret: didn't exercise, they explained to us that the reason they 142 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:52,260 Sandrine Thuret: don't exercise was, well, it's boring. And you trying Zumba 143 00:08:52,260 --> 00:08:55,590 Sandrine Thuret: because it's more exciting, right? There's music and it's monotonous. 144 00:08:55,590 --> 00:08:57,300 Sandrine Thuret: They don't want to be on a stationary bike. They 145 00:08:57,300 --> 00:08:59,670 Sandrine Thuret: don't want to be on a treadmill. So they want 146 00:08:59,670 --> 00:09:02,940 Sandrine Thuret: something varied and also it's about time, right? Time management. 147 00:09:02,940 --> 00:09:06,600 Sandrine Thuret: So we designed a trial where indeed we mix cardio and 148 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:10,080 Sandrine Thuret: strength. So it was an intervention three times a week, 149 00:09:10,140 --> 00:09:17,220 Sandrine Thuret: 30 minutes with live trainer, but online though. So people 150 00:09:17,220 --> 00:09:19,440 Sandrine Thuret: could do it at home. So we didn't have to 151 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:21,660 Sandrine Thuret: go to a gym, but they had someone live online to 152 00:09:21,660 --> 00:09:23,880 Sandrine Thuret: tell them and push them. And it was like in a 153 00:09:23,880 --> 00:09:26,819 Sandrine Thuret: group so you could see other people on Zoom. And 154 00:09:26,850 --> 00:09:31,950 Sandrine Thuret: so we did one cardio, one strength, and then one 155 00:09:32,010 --> 00:09:38,100 Sandrine Thuret: basically hybrid mix of both. And people really enjoyed it. It 156 00:09:38,100 --> 00:09:41,939 Sandrine Thuret: was three months and 90% of the people stuck with it. 157 00:09:42,270 --> 00:09:45,059 Sandrine Thuret: And I think it was about the variety of the 158 00:09:45,059 --> 00:09:48,210 Sandrine Thuret: exercise. And then so when we tested then via memory 159 00:09:48,210 --> 00:09:51,600 Sandrine Thuret: and mood, we saw a nice improvement on mood. Memory 160 00:09:51,660 --> 00:09:55,230 Sandrine Thuret: was a lot more variable across individual. We had people 161 00:09:55,230 --> 00:09:57,959 Sandrine Thuret: that really responded well, some people not so well. So 162 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:00,300 Sandrine Thuret: now at the research level, we are trying to understand 163 00:10:00,300 --> 00:10:03,990 Sandrine Thuret: why some people respond better than others, but everyone improved 164 00:10:03,990 --> 00:10:07,440 Sandrine Thuret: their mood basically, which was really nice. And most of the 165 00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:13,170 Sandrine Thuret: people really stuck to the program, which I think show 166 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:18,630 Sandrine Thuret: that you should do an exercise that you like. Don't force yourself 167 00:10:18,630 --> 00:10:21,300 Sandrine Thuret: in doing something that you don't like. So choose an 168 00:10:21,300 --> 00:10:24,569 Sandrine Thuret: exercise that yours because we think that whatever exercise it 169 00:10:24,569 --> 00:10:29,730 Sandrine Thuret: is, it will produce this effect, meaning increase blood flow. 170 00:10:30,090 --> 00:10:33,750 Sandrine Thuret: So by increasing blood flow, potentially you have what we 171 00:10:33,750 --> 00:10:36,870 Sandrine Thuret: call this growth factor that are in your blood that 172 00:10:36,870 --> 00:10:41,160 Sandrine Thuret: will reach out the brain and this pushes these cells 173 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:45,179 Sandrine Thuret: in hippocampus to then become neurons and do their job. 174 00:10:45,570 --> 00:10:47,730 Krutika Adatia: Can I just ask you, which exercise do you prefer? 175 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:52,380 Sandrine Thuret: I think as a convenience, I like running myself. When 176 00:10:52,380 --> 00:10:55,829 Sandrine Thuret: I was younger, not. I would play sports game like 177 00:10:57,510 --> 00:11:01,980 Sandrine Thuret: basketball or handball or something that was a little bit more exciting. But 178 00:11:02,340 --> 00:11:06,870 Sandrine Thuret: as you get older and have a busy work, a 179 00:11:06,870 --> 00:11:11,160 Sandrine Thuret: family, I find running very convenient because you just need 180 00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:14,400 Sandrine Thuret: your pair of shoes, like your outfit and then you 181 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:17,219 Sandrine Thuret: go. I like swimming, but it's time- consuming. I think 182 00:11:17,220 --> 00:11:20,160 Sandrine Thuret: it's a matter of, I'm sure your students are working 183 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,420 Sandrine Thuret: hard. So it's a matter of them finding what fits 184 00:11:24,420 --> 00:11:28,290 Sandrine Thuret: in their life as well. So something you like and 185 00:11:28,290 --> 00:11:30,480 Sandrine Thuret: that fits and then maybe something in the middle. 186 00:11:31,140 --> 00:11:36,120 Krutika Adatia: Just circling back to exercise specifically itself and the benefits 187 00:11:36,120 --> 00:11:40,140 Krutika Adatia: of neurogenesis, why have we evolved that way, do you think? 188 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,350 Sandrine Thuret: So yeah, that's an interesting question. So I mentioned it's 189 00:11:43,350 --> 00:11:49,080 Sandrine Thuret: conserve in all mammalian species and very specifically in the hippocampus. 190 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:51,390 Sandrine Thuret: So we don't have neurogenesis in the other part of 191 00:11:51,390 --> 00:11:56,069 Sandrine Thuret: the brain and hippocampus is important for learning and memory 192 00:11:56,070 --> 00:11:59,580 Sandrine Thuret: and mood and emotion. So we could wonder why do 193 00:11:59,580 --> 00:12:02,760 Sandrine Thuret: we have the production of neuron just there. So obviously 194 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:07,679 Sandrine Thuret: on obvious explanation is that, well, we need to continue 195 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:12,809 Sandrine Thuret: to learn throughout life. So that's one aspect. Now, how 196 00:12:12,809 --> 00:12:15,839 Sandrine Thuret: is it related to mood and emotion? It might just 197 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:22,439 Sandrine Thuret: be purely anatomical because hippocampus is a little crescent shape 198 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:25,260 Sandrine Thuret: where you have a top and bottom part and then 199 00:12:25,590 --> 00:12:28,140 Sandrine Thuret: the top or what we call the dorsal part is 200 00:12:28,140 --> 00:12:30,390 Sandrine Thuret: important for learning and memory and the bottom part for mood 201 00:12:30,390 --> 00:12:34,439 Sandrine Thuret: and emotion. And you have this neurogenesis happening throughout. So 202 00:12:34,530 --> 00:12:37,140 Sandrine Thuret: whatever, if you have more new neuron in one area, 203 00:12:37,140 --> 00:12:40,980 Sandrine Thuret: it will affect the other one. So evolutionary is tricky 204 00:12:40,980 --> 00:12:44,640 Sandrine Thuret: to explain, but definitely the need of continuous learning would 205 00:12:44,640 --> 00:12:47,910 Sandrine Thuret: explain why we still have new neurons in this area. 206 00:12:48,540 --> 00:12:53,400 Sandrine Thuret: Now, why exercise is something that affects that? It's probably 207 00:12:53,730 --> 00:12:58,950 Sandrine Thuret: a lot to deal with body mind interaction where whatever 208 00:12:58,950 --> 00:13:01,170 Sandrine Thuret: we are doing, eating or doing and you have an 209 00:13:01,170 --> 00:13:06,900 Sandrine Thuret: increased blood flow, then it will affect your brain, definitely. 210 00:13:06,960 --> 00:13:09,870 Sandrine Thuret: And hippocampus is highly vascularized, so there's loads of blood 211 00:13:09,870 --> 00:13:13,260 Sandrine Thuret: vessel there. So we think there's a lot of component from nutrient 212 00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:17,970 Sandrine Thuret: or growth factor that you increase when you exercise that will reach 213 00:13:18,330 --> 00:13:21,360 Sandrine Thuret: these cells or stem cells that produce these new neurons. 214 00:13:21,510 --> 00:13:25,470 Krutika Adatia: Yeah. Now earlier you mentioned that you can get neurogenesis 215 00:13:25,470 --> 00:13:27,929 Krutika Adatia: benefits if you don't like exercise. So could I just 216 00:13:27,929 --> 00:13:30,000 Krutika Adatia: circle back to that point because it feels appropriate. I 217 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:31,920 Krutika Adatia: mean, I've asked you what you like, but I'm sure 218 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:34,500 Krutika Adatia: our listeners are thinking, " Yeah, don't like strength. I don't 219 00:13:34,500 --> 00:13:36,720 Krutika Adatia: like cardio." What can they do? 220 00:13:36,900 --> 00:13:39,750 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, if you really don't like 221 00:13:39,750 --> 00:13:43,829 Sandrine Thuret: exercise, then I think indeed from first I thought like, 222 00:13:44,640 --> 00:13:48,660 Sandrine Thuret: is this true? Are they people that really don't like exercise and don't 223 00:13:48,660 --> 00:13:52,320 Sandrine Thuret: find there are any benefits for them? And then after our 224 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:54,689 Sandrine Thuret: study, I mean, I had data in front of me 225 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:57,450 Sandrine Thuret: and then I said, " Okay, now I believe my brother 226 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:00,660 Sandrine Thuret: who does not like exercising." And every time I'm like, " 227 00:14:00,929 --> 00:14:02,309 Sandrine Thuret: What do you mean you don't like? Surely you feel 228 00:14:02,309 --> 00:14:04,860 Sandrine Thuret: good after." I said, " No, I don't." And now we 229 00:14:04,860 --> 00:14:12,120 Sandrine Thuret: are trying to dissect what are the interaction maybe into, is 230 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:17,490 Sandrine Thuret: it genetic or is it different interaction with that? So luckily this 231 00:14:17,490 --> 00:14:22,500 Sandrine Thuret: process of neurogenesis, you can modulate it by not just 232 00:14:22,500 --> 00:14:25,860 Sandrine Thuret: exercise but diet definitely is one of them. So we and 233 00:14:25,860 --> 00:14:29,460 Sandrine Thuret: others have shown that there are specific diet that will push 234 00:14:29,610 --> 00:14:32,520 Sandrine Thuret: neurogenesis and production of new neurons such as omega- free 235 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:36,540 Sandrine Thuret: fatty acids increase neurogenesis, which is contained in fatty fish 236 00:14:36,540 --> 00:14:41,700 Sandrine Thuret: like a small piece of salmon like 100 gram every 237 00:14:41,700 --> 00:14:47,250 Sandrine Thuret: day on average will increase neurogenesis probably as much as going 238 00:14:47,250 --> 00:14:52,260 Sandrine Thuret: for a run, we'll say proportionally. And then learning itself 239 00:14:52,710 --> 00:14:55,950 Sandrine Thuret: increase neurogenesis, which is really cool for your student, I 240 00:14:55,950 --> 00:15:00,330 Sandrine Thuret: guess, because they are revising, they are learning. So learning 241 00:15:00,330 --> 00:15:04,530 Sandrine Thuret: itself will increase neurogenesis. So you have this loop as well 242 00:15:04,530 --> 00:15:08,250 Sandrine Thuret: that you can foster. Obviously sleep as well is a 243 00:15:08,250 --> 00:15:11,490 Sandrine Thuret: big one where we rather have shown that actually sleep 244 00:15:11,490 --> 00:15:19,140 Sandrine Thuret: deprivation is decreasing neurogenesis, stress is decreasing neurogenesis. So basically 245 00:15:19,140 --> 00:15:22,770 Sandrine Thuret: balancing all that if you achieve some kind of a 246 00:15:22,770 --> 00:15:26,640 Sandrine Thuret: slightly positive slope with the good thing is good because 247 00:15:26,640 --> 00:15:30,090 Sandrine Thuret: we know that if you are revising probably you will sleep 248 00:15:30,090 --> 00:15:31,950 Sandrine Thuret: less and you will be a bit more stressed. So 249 00:15:31,950 --> 00:15:37,291 Sandrine Thuret: then if you are eating well and maybe exercising, that's a good one. 250 00:15:37,291 --> 00:15:40,109 Krutika Adatia: You can balance out the kind of effects, right? 251 00:15:40,110 --> 00:15:40,920 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah, exactly. 252 00:15:40,980 --> 00:15:44,430 Krutika Adatia: Yeah. And it's so great that you've mentioned sleep, nutrition, 253 00:15:44,430 --> 00:15:47,370 Krutika Adatia: and learning, because we've got episodes and all of those 254 00:15:47,370 --> 00:15:50,490 Krutika Adatia: on our series. Excellent. It's great for our listeners that it kind 255 00:15:50,490 --> 00:15:52,321 Krutika Adatia: of all ties into one another. 256 00:15:52,321 --> 00:15:59,370 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah. Molecular, cellular neurobiology level, sleep, stress, all of that and 257 00:15:59,370 --> 00:16:02,340 Sandrine Thuret: nutrition exercise will affect the production of new neurons. 258 00:16:02,340 --> 00:16:05,760 Krutika Adatia: I see. Now of course we've spoken about the kind 259 00:16:05,760 --> 00:16:10,410 Krutika Adatia: of benefits to learning and memory for certainly the short 260 00:16:10,410 --> 00:16:12,780 Krutika Adatia: term, but what are the sort of benefits also long 261 00:16:12,780 --> 00:16:16,290 Krutika Adatia: term by doing sustained periods of exercise and making it 262 00:16:16,290 --> 00:16:17,970 Krutika Adatia: a habitual thing, for example? 263 00:16:18,060 --> 00:16:22,140 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah. So I think, well, we didn't discuss a small 264 00:16:22,170 --> 00:16:24,270 Sandrine Thuret: detail of how long it takes to make a new neuron, 265 00:16:24,270 --> 00:16:28,140 Sandrine Thuret: but it's going to take to go from... So they are 266 00:16:28,140 --> 00:16:32,400 Sandrine Thuret: born from this neural stem cells that you have in the hippocampus and they are 267 00:16:33,030 --> 00:16:36,510 Sandrine Thuret: quite some meaning they are quiet, they will not divide, 268 00:16:36,510 --> 00:16:38,880 Sandrine Thuret: are not going to produce any neurons. But when they 269 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:45,600 Sandrine Thuret: start, when they get the good stuff, it will take between probably eight 270 00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:48,480 Sandrine Thuret: to 10 weeks to go from a neural stem cell 271 00:16:48,510 --> 00:16:52,020 Sandrine Thuret: that does not have yet a function to become a 272 00:16:52,020 --> 00:16:54,540 Sandrine Thuret: neuron that is going to connect with the rest of the 273 00:16:54,540 --> 00:16:59,310 Sandrine Thuret: brain. So if you have this sustained activity, you are 274 00:16:59,310 --> 00:17:04,379 Sandrine Thuret: maintaining this flow of newborn neuron to be generated while 275 00:17:04,440 --> 00:17:06,570 Sandrine Thuret: obviously if it's just a one- off, once in a 276 00:17:06,570 --> 00:17:10,020 Sandrine Thuret: while, you might have a little burst and then nothing 277 00:17:10,290 --> 00:17:13,800 Sandrine Thuret: because it will take time to build this pool of 278 00:17:13,800 --> 00:17:18,480 Sandrine Thuret: cells that you are going to produce neurons that integrate 279 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:21,480 Sandrine Thuret: your network and do their job basically. 280 00:17:21,660 --> 00:17:26,460 Krutika Adatia: Right. I see. So you almost have to do sustained 281 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,280 Krutika Adatia: longer periods of exercise to reap the benefits of it. It 282 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:32,580 Krutika Adatia: can't just be like you're saying, a workout here, wait 283 00:17:32,580 --> 00:17:35,040 Krutika Adatia: three months, do another workout, it's got to be more. 284 00:17:35,220 --> 00:17:38,850 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah, it is better to have this sustained effect. Of 285 00:17:38,850 --> 00:17:42,510 Sandrine Thuret: course, we did talk at the start about this effect 286 00:17:42,510 --> 00:17:46,560 Sandrine Thuret: of this under thin release, it just makes you feel 287 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:50,310 Sandrine Thuret: good after and that might have beneficial effect on its own, right? 288 00:17:50,910 --> 00:17:53,040 Sandrine Thuret: But when we talk about neurogenesis, this is more a 289 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:54,929 Sandrine Thuret: sustained effect long term. 290 00:17:55,140 --> 00:17:57,420 Krutika Adatia: And you've just mentioned mood. Actually, I want to dig 291 00:17:57,420 --> 00:18:00,060 Krutika Adatia: into that a little bit more. I mean, how is 292 00:18:00,060 --> 00:18:03,420 Krutika Adatia: it that exercise is helping to improve our mood? And 293 00:18:04,020 --> 00:18:07,080 Krutika Adatia: we know for instance, our students can be really stressed. 294 00:18:07,380 --> 00:18:10,500 Krutika Adatia: So when you're stressed, you may not intuitively think to 295 00:18:10,500 --> 00:18:13,859 Krutika Adatia: go to exercise, but I know as well, since I've 296 00:18:13,859 --> 00:18:17,400 Krutika Adatia: started doing exercise, I noticed the change in my mood. So 297 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,380 Krutika Adatia: talk to us a little bit more about that mood 298 00:18:19,380 --> 00:18:20,280 Krutika Adatia: impact on the side. 299 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:22,919 Sandrine Thuret: So we have a lot of study on the aspect 300 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:28,379 Sandrine Thuret: of mood and exercise and neurogenesis. So basically, I mentioned 301 00:18:28,650 --> 00:18:31,649 Sandrine Thuret: the anatomy of the hippocampus, so this ventral part that's 302 00:18:31,650 --> 00:18:35,460 Sandrine Thuret: really important for mood regulation and you have neurogenesis there 303 00:18:35,460 --> 00:18:41,700 Sandrine Thuret: as well and some colleague in Colombia have shown more 304 00:18:41,700 --> 00:18:44,609 Sandrine Thuret: than 25 years ago in animal model that if you 305 00:18:44,609 --> 00:18:50,010 Sandrine Thuret: block neurogenesis in mouse model, basically so you induce almost 306 00:18:50,010 --> 00:18:54,510 Sandrine Thuret: depressive effect and we see the same if you induce 307 00:18:54,510 --> 00:18:58,020 Sandrine Thuret: stress, you are going to decrease neurogenesis and induce depressive- 308 00:18:58,020 --> 00:19:01,710 Sandrine Thuret: like behavior. But what they did there back then is 309 00:19:01,710 --> 00:19:04,530 Sandrine Thuret: that actually they block the ability to make new neuron, 310 00:19:04,530 --> 00:19:08,400 Sandrine Thuret: which you can do with some drugs. And then what they 311 00:19:08,550 --> 00:19:11,430 Sandrine Thuret: could see is that then if you try to give antidepressant to 312 00:19:11,430 --> 00:19:15,090 Sandrine Thuret: the mice, the antidepressant wouldn't work. So not all antidepressant 313 00:19:15,090 --> 00:19:18,840 Sandrine Thuret: would work this way, but some will be working this 314 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:22,200 Sandrine Thuret: way. So that's why exercise on its own or anything 315 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:27,720 Sandrine Thuret: that would improve neurogenesis will have this antidepressant- like effect 316 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:29,310 Sandrine Thuret: if you want. 317 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,850 Krutika Adatia: Ah, so it's almost like when our students are stressed, 318 00:19:33,210 --> 00:19:36,450 Krutika Adatia: they almost need to do the exercise and get out and do stuff. Even 319 00:19:36,450 --> 00:19:37,919 Krutika Adatia: if it's a walk, would a walk- 320 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:41,850 Sandrine Thuret: Oh, yes. Yeah, absolutely. Anything that we think that is going 321 00:19:41,850 --> 00:19:45,570 Sandrine Thuret: to increase heart rate, so then stimulate blood flow and 322 00:19:46,260 --> 00:19:51,600 Sandrine Thuret: preferably is enjoyable. So even if during COVID, one of 323 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:56,490 Sandrine Thuret: my kid really got off, you couldn't do anything much 324 00:19:56,820 --> 00:20:00,060 Sandrine Thuret: and I was worried for them. So we're lucky enough 325 00:20:00,060 --> 00:20:02,880 Sandrine Thuret: to come up on a treadmill that we put in 326 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:05,429 Sandrine Thuret: our backyard, courtyard. 327 00:20:05,430 --> 00:20:05,551 Krutika Adatia: I love it. 328 00:20:05,551 --> 00:20:10,830 Sandrine Thuret: And then for kids, going on the treadmill is useless. So then 329 00:20:10,830 --> 00:20:15,090 Sandrine Thuret: I just put a little cartoon on his iPad, stuck 330 00:20:15,090 --> 00:20:18,270 Sandrine Thuret: on the treadmill and then do what works for you. 331 00:20:18,270 --> 00:20:21,780 Sandrine Thuret: If you listen to your favorite podcast, if you want 332 00:20:21,780 --> 00:20:25,650 Sandrine Thuret: to go for a run or a walk. Worse to come, if you're like, " 333 00:20:26,100 --> 00:20:28,109 Sandrine Thuret: You know what? I'm more a visual person. I'm going 334 00:20:28,109 --> 00:20:32,220 Sandrine Thuret: to watch my favorite TV show at the gym while 335 00:20:32,220 --> 00:20:34,080 Sandrine Thuret: on the treadmill works as well." 336 00:20:34,230 --> 00:20:36,389 Krutika Adatia: Yeah, I love that. Go for a walk, listen to 337 00:20:36,390 --> 00:20:37,921 Krutika Adatia: On Your Marks whilst you're on your walk. Yeah. Dual benefits there. 338 00:20:37,921 --> 00:20:38,880 Sandrine Thuret: Yes, yes. 339 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:44,159 Krutika Adatia: Love that. So actually let's get really real, I suppose. 340 00:20:44,700 --> 00:20:48,150 Krutika Adatia: How much exercise do we actually need to be doing 341 00:20:48,150 --> 00:20:50,490 Krutika Adatia: to reap the benefits? So could I say if I 342 00:20:50,490 --> 00:20:52,320 Krutika Adatia: just go for a 10- minute walk, I'm going to 343 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:55,230 Krutika Adatia: reap the benefits of some of the things that you've 344 00:20:55,650 --> 00:20:57,780 Krutika Adatia: described or does it need to be longer? What are 345 00:20:58,200 --> 00:20:58,590 Krutika Adatia: your views on that? 346 00:20:59,700 --> 00:21:02,699 Sandrine Thuret: Well, from our own data, what I can say is 347 00:21:02,700 --> 00:21:08,070 Sandrine Thuret: that we did from the intervention, so a proper trial 348 00:21:08,910 --> 00:21:12,060 Sandrine Thuret: where you have all the proper control, we see that 349 00:21:12,060 --> 00:21:16,619 Sandrine Thuret: we have efficacy three times a week for 30 minutes. 350 00:21:17,340 --> 00:21:20,909 Sandrine Thuret: So it is doable and the way we had structure 351 00:21:20,910 --> 00:21:24,450 Sandrine Thuret: it is that we are offering people to say people busy, 352 00:21:24,780 --> 00:21:27,960 Sandrine Thuret: they could choose between doing it early morning during their 353 00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,619 Sandrine Thuret: lunch break or in the evening. So it didn't matter 354 00:21:31,890 --> 00:21:34,409 Sandrine Thuret: when they were doing it, but as long as they 355 00:21:34,410 --> 00:21:37,050 Sandrine Thuret: were consistent to do that three times a week. So 356 00:21:37,050 --> 00:21:40,980 Sandrine Thuret: that's what we can say from our study. We think that 357 00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:45,420 Sandrine Thuret: would be the minimum where we have shown benefits. 358 00:21:45,630 --> 00:21:50,250 Krutika Adatia: Yeah. So 30 minutes, three times a week , but consistency. 359 00:21:50,460 --> 00:21:50,850 Sandrine Thuret: Yeah. 360 00:21:51,330 --> 00:21:54,210 Krutika Adatia: I kind of want to just understand from you, is there also 361 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,359 Krutika Adatia: a preferred time of day or does it boil down 362 00:21:57,359 --> 00:21:58,770 Krutika Adatia: to personal preference? 363 00:21:59,130 --> 00:22:02,190 Sandrine Thuret: I think people have to try and see what they 364 00:22:02,190 --> 00:22:05,550 Sandrine Thuret: like best. I have a colleague who works on, basically 365 00:22:05,550 --> 00:22:09,209 Sandrine Thuret: it's more like a chronobiology and they find out indeed 366 00:22:09,210 --> 00:22:14,490 Sandrine Thuret: that some people have clear preferences when they enjoy exercising. 367 00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:21,270 Sandrine Thuret: So I think people should try and then realize, well, 368 00:22:21,270 --> 00:22:23,970 Sandrine Thuret: actually it works better for me in the morning or 369 00:22:23,970 --> 00:22:29,189 Sandrine Thuret: in the evening or during the day they can. Equally, it might be 370 00:22:29,190 --> 00:22:33,750 Sandrine Thuret: driven by what works in their busy life, but trying 371 00:22:33,750 --> 00:22:37,800 Sandrine Thuret: out both, I think like you, they will find out which 372 00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,100 Sandrine Thuret: one they preferred. I also suspect from personal experience, I 373 00:22:41,100 --> 00:22:45,030 Sandrine Thuret: suspect as well it's age as well aspect. I think 374 00:22:45,030 --> 00:22:48,300 Sandrine Thuret: when I was younger, I would like to exercise late 375 00:22:48,300 --> 00:22:50,879 Sandrine Thuret: at night better, but now I'm like you, I prefer 376 00:22:51,090 --> 00:22:55,170 Sandrine Thuret: to do it early morning. So things might change actually 377 00:22:55,170 --> 00:22:58,169 Sandrine Thuret: according to your life stages as well. So people have 378 00:22:58,170 --> 00:23:00,629 Sandrine Thuret: to try it and see what works better, but we 379 00:23:00,630 --> 00:23:04,409 Sandrine Thuret: didn't find a relation between efficacy and when the people 380 00:23:04,410 --> 00:23:07,380 Sandrine Thuret: were doing their classes. If you have the choice, then 381 00:23:07,380 --> 00:23:08,340 Sandrine Thuret: what do you like best? 382 00:23:09,030 --> 00:23:12,240 Krutika Adatia: So there's no real scientific evidence or studies that back 383 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:13,980 Krutika Adatia: up at preferred time of day, I suppose. 384 00:23:13,980 --> 00:23:19,950 Sandrine Thuret: No, we didn't find statistically significance between when people would take 385 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:21,540 Sandrine Thuret: the classes. 386 00:23:21,900 --> 00:23:25,680 Krutika Adatia: You have shared so many golden nuggets through this conversation 387 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:27,960 Krutika Adatia: and I've certainly picked up a few things for myself, 388 00:23:28,230 --> 00:23:30,900 Krutika Adatia: but just in terms of wrapping up, I mean, Sandrine, 389 00:23:30,900 --> 00:23:34,439 Krutika Adatia: what would be your three top tips for exercising to 390 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:35,430 Krutika Adatia: get benefits for the brain? 391 00:23:36,900 --> 00:23:41,550 Sandrine Thuret: I think we touch upon quite a few already. I 392 00:23:41,550 --> 00:23:46,830 Sandrine Thuret: would say find an exercise that you enjoy. I think that's the 393 00:23:46,830 --> 00:23:51,480 Sandrine Thuret: number one because no one want to be pushed to 394 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:55,710 Sandrine Thuret: do something they don't like. If it stresses you to 395 00:23:55,710 --> 00:23:59,490 Sandrine Thuret: think about doing this exercise, then it's kind of lose out 396 00:23:59,490 --> 00:24:02,160 Sandrine Thuret: the benefit, I think. So if you try to find 397 00:24:02,609 --> 00:24:06,720 Sandrine Thuret: a type of exercise that you enjoy, or if you're 398 00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,710 Sandrine Thuret: older, you used to play sports game, maybe join again 399 00:24:10,710 --> 00:24:14,670 Sandrine Thuret: a team, something like that. So I think that would 400 00:24:14,670 --> 00:24:17,970 Sandrine Thuret: be the number one. Number two would be, I know 401 00:24:17,970 --> 00:24:21,869 Sandrine Thuret: we are all busy and trying to fit time in 402 00:24:21,869 --> 00:24:25,679 Sandrine Thuret: your life or exercising is very difficult. So I think 403 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:30,780 Sandrine Thuret: this is a tricky one, but think about the benefit 404 00:24:30,869 --> 00:24:34,409 Sandrine Thuret: we have discussed and then said, " Okay, can I spare 405 00:24:34,410 --> 00:24:40,200 Sandrine Thuret: 30 minutes today for myself for my brain or think about the 406 00:24:40,619 --> 00:24:44,459 Sandrine Thuret: long term?" Because we haven't discussed it yet, or we 407 00:24:44,460 --> 00:24:47,100 Sandrine Thuret: don't have time maybe to discuss it, but it is 408 00:24:47,100 --> 00:24:50,250 Sandrine Thuret: protective against dementia. So even if you are super young, 409 00:24:50,250 --> 00:24:52,890 Sandrine Thuret: or I would say even if you are in your 410 00:24:52,890 --> 00:24:56,340 Sandrine Thuret: early 30s, what you are doing now will have an 411 00:24:56,340 --> 00:25:00,300 Sandrine Thuret: impact when you are 70. So I would say try 412 00:25:00,300 --> 00:25:03,630 Sandrine Thuret: to say to motivate yourself, think about the long- term 413 00:25:03,630 --> 00:25:06,629 Sandrine Thuret: benefits like, oh, I don't have time today for this 30 414 00:25:06,630 --> 00:25:10,619 Sandrine Thuret: minutes, but do you really? Can you find maybe twice 415 00:25:10,619 --> 00:25:14,280 Sandrine Thuret: 15 minutes maybe morning and evening, worse to come, you 416 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:17,669 Sandrine Thuret: could do that. And then the last one, what would 417 00:25:17,670 --> 00:25:21,899 Sandrine Thuret: be the last one? If you find within your family, 418 00:25:22,710 --> 00:25:26,460 Sandrine Thuret: your partner, convince them to join you, it might help 419 00:25:26,490 --> 00:25:29,850 Sandrine Thuret: because then you start motivating each other to say it, " 420 00:25:29,850 --> 00:25:34,920 Sandrine Thuret: Okay, let's do that together, let's go together." Yeah. So 421 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:35,970 Sandrine Thuret: that would be my third one. 422 00:25:36,090 --> 00:25:38,490 Krutika Adatia: And just on that third tip, actually, I must admit, 423 00:25:38,490 --> 00:25:41,400 Krutika Adatia: I find myself being a lot more motivated when I'm 424 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:45,659 Krutika Adatia: going to classes rather than having to... Yeah, on days, 425 00:25:45,660 --> 00:25:48,929 Krutika Adatia: because obviously Easter has just gone and there were weeks 426 00:25:48,930 --> 00:25:51,810 Krutika Adatia: where the classes weren't on. And so when I was 427 00:25:51,810 --> 00:25:54,990 Krutika Adatia: trying to then do homework out, I just wasn't finding 428 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,630 Krutika Adatia: the motivation as opposed to when you're in class. So 429 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:00,060 Krutika Adatia: thank you so much for sharing that sound dream. 430 00:26:00,060 --> 00:26:04,680 Sandrine Thuret: There is a social aspect as well of exercise that could 431 00:26:04,680 --> 00:26:07,409 Sandrine Thuret: come into play. So something to keep in mind because 432 00:26:07,650 --> 00:26:11,100 Sandrine Thuret: yeah, the last one we know as well that social 433 00:26:11,100 --> 00:26:13,290 Sandrine Thuret: interaction increased neurogenesis. There you go. 434 00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:14,400 Krutika Adatia: Oh, wow. 435 00:26:14,430 --> 00:26:15,540 Sandrine Thuret: Good exercise in group. 436 00:26:15,869 --> 00:26:18,390 Krutika Adatia: Thank you so much, Sandrine. That's been really useful. 437 00:26:18,660 --> 00:26:19,109 Sandrine Thuret: Thank you. 438 00:26:19,770 --> 00:26:22,889 Krutika Adatia: That's it from this episode of On Your Marks. Thank 439 00:26:22,890 --> 00:26:26,970 Krutika Adatia: you, Sandrine, for chatting with me today. For more information about 440 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:33,900 Krutika Adatia: ACCA exams, you can go to www. accaglobal. com/ exams 441 00:26:34,140 --> 00:26:36,720 Krutika Adatia: and to watch the video version of this podcast, check 442 00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,419 Krutika Adatia: out the link in the show notes. See you next 443 00:26:39,420 --> 00:26:43,440 Krutika Adatia: time. I'm Krutika Adatia and this has been On Your Marks. 444 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,710 Krutika Adatia: On Your Marks is a Fresh Air Production for ACCA. 445 00:26:47,070 --> 00:26:51,780 Krutika Adatia: Its producers are Eva Higginbotham, Annie Day and Finlay Macrae. 446 00:26:52,109 --> 00:26:53,940 Krutika Adatia: It's edited by Helen Quigley.