1 00:00:28,310 --> 00:00:34,980 Suze: March 19, Welcome everybody to the Women and Money podcast 2 00:00:34,979 --> 00:00:39,550 Suze: as well as everybody smart enough to listen. Today, Suze 3 00:00:39,550 --> 00:00:43,920 Suze: School is a very, very special Suze School because all 4 00:00:43,920 --> 00:00:48,530 Suze: of us including me are going to be students today. 5 00:00:48,940 --> 00:00:53,639 Suze: Students of one of the most incredible women I have 6 00:00:53,650 --> 00:00:59,920 Suze: ever met in my life. Her name is Sheila Bair. 7 00:01:00,050 --> 00:01:04,330 Suze: From 2006 to 2011, 8 00:01:04,990 --> 00:01:08,589 Suze: Chairman Bear, which she is formally referred to 9 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:12,990 Suze: was the chairman of the F D I C. 10 00:01:13,620 --> 00:01:16,420 Suze: And if you think about the years that she was 11 00:01:16,420 --> 00:01:18,950 Suze: chairman of the F D I C, which is the 12 00:01:18,950 --> 00:01:23,830 Suze: Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation, which is what insures banks, which is, 13 00:01:23,830 --> 00:01:26,940 Suze: what is freaking all of you out. Are you insured? 14 00:01:26,950 --> 00:01:32,260 Suze: Are you not insured? She was in charge of it all. 15 00:01:32,610 --> 00:01:35,890 Suze: But it was more than just her being chairman of 16 00:01:35,890 --> 00:01:37,410 Suze: the F D I C. 17 00:01:38,050 --> 00:01:45,090 Suze: It was her really in 2006 informing everybody; be careful warning, warning. 18 00:01:46,520 --> 00:01:51,440 Suze: The subprime mortgages that are out there are absolutely going 19 00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:55,140 Suze: to get us all in trouble. But yet the powers 20 00:01:55,140 --> 00:01:59,270 Suze: that be didn't want to believe her, they didn't want 21 00:01:59,270 --> 00:02:01,530 Suze: to deal with the things that she was talking about 22 00:02:01,530 --> 00:02:07,250 Suze: and then 2008 hit and you all know the rest 23 00:02:07,260 --> 00:02:11,760 Suze: of the story. But what you probably don't know is 24 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:14,720 Suze: that because of Chairman Bair, 25 00:02:15,410 --> 00:02:20,450 Suze: regulations were put into effect that probably over all these 26 00:02:20,450 --> 00:02:26,739 Suze: years saved the banking systems. She wanted regulators in banks. 27 00:02:26,750 --> 00:02:30,500 Suze: She wanted banks to have stress tests. They modeled the 28 00:02:30,500 --> 00:02:34,980 Suze: troubled asset relief program that saved the United States after 29 00:02:34,980 --> 00:02:38,359 Suze: the model that Sheila Bair created 30 00:02:39,110 --> 00:02:41,459 Suze: So I could go on and on. But if I 31 00:02:41,460 --> 00:02:45,360 Suze: went on and on with everything this woman has done 32 00:02:45,370 --> 00:02:51,220 Suze: in her life to make this world financially a safer place, 33 00:02:51,350 --> 00:02:56,440 Suze: that alone would be the entire podcast. Just a very 34 00:02:56,440 --> 00:03:01,100 Suze: brief introduction before I go to Sheila, which is, Sheila 35 00:03:01,100 --> 00:03:06,210 Suze: and I met in 2008 when Sheila or her office 36 00:03:06,210 --> 00:03:07,480 Suze: contacted me: 37 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:11,510 Suze: what can we do to stop a run on the banks? 38 00:03:11,810 --> 00:03:14,690 Suze: And what the two of us did was we made 39 00:03:14,690 --> 00:03:20,500 Suze: many television commercials, public service announcements that went out all 40 00:03:20,500 --> 00:03:24,100 Suze: throughout the United States. But my favorite thing was that 41 00:03:24,110 --> 00:03:28,000 Suze: Chairman Bair and myself being right on screen, two women, 42 00:03:28,010 --> 00:03:32,030 Suze: looking right into the camera and I first said "nobody 43 00:03:32,030 --> 00:03:34,280 Suze: cares about your money more than me." 44 00:03:34,540 --> 00:03:36,930 Suze: And then it went to Sheila and she went "and 45 00:03:36,930 --> 00:03:38,490 Suze: the F D I C." 46 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:43,250 Suze: She allowed me and Suze speak to work with the 47 00:03:43,250 --> 00:03:46,890 Suze: programmers of the calculator system for the F D I C. 48 00:03:46,890 --> 00:03:47,890 Suze: It's called Edie 49 00:03:48,630 --> 00:03:52,660 Suze: so that all of you could understand how it worked. 50 00:03:52,670 --> 00:03:56,800 Suze: She allowed me to work again with the programmers of 51 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,970 Suze: the F D I C website so that you would 52 00:03:59,980 --> 00:04:03,920 Suze: understand how it would work and how it did work. 53 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:07,230 Suze: And I think that the two of us did such 54 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:11,369 Suze: a fabulous job together. I can't even tell you. 55 00:04:12,100 --> 00:04:17,090 Suze: So that's how I met Sheila. So let me welcome 56 00:04:17,100 --> 00:04:20,840 Suze: the Chairman of the F D I C during the 57 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:26,800 Suze: most crucial years, possibly, in America's financial history to the 58 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:29,760 Suze: Women and Money podcast. 59 00:04:30,210 --> 00:04:33,270 Sheila: Thanks for having me, Suze. It's wonderful hearing your voice again. 60 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:35,970 Suze: I was telling everybody about the work a little bit 61 00:04:35,970 --> 00:04:38,880 Suze: about the work when we first met all the way 62 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:45,050 Suze: back in 2008, when you were Chairman of the FDIC 63 00:04:45,060 --> 00:04:50,130 Suze: during probably the biggest bank collapse in a long, long 64 00:04:50,130 --> 00:04:54,539 Suze: time in modern history with over 400 banks failing 65 00:04:54,750 --> 00:04:57,040 Suze: and how we did all these P S A s 66 00:04:57,040 --> 00:05:01,280 Suze: together and we redid the calculator and the website and 67 00:05:01,290 --> 00:05:05,230 Suze: it was fabulous. The work that we did. You went 68 00:05:05,230 --> 00:05:09,900 Suze: on to continue to do extraordinary work in many, many 69 00:05:09,900 --> 00:05:13,740 Suze: ways and you still are to this day. But the real, 70 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:17,070 Suze: the reason I wanted you to come on, the Women 71 00:05:17,070 --> 00:05:22,520 Suze: and Money podcast is because bottom line people understand how 72 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:25,140 Suze: F D I C insurance works. I have schooled them 73 00:05:25,140 --> 00:05:29,339 Suze: in that, but there's still a little bit afraid. And 74 00:05:29,350 --> 00:05:33,580 Suze: I thought if I simply asked you the question for 75 00:05:33,580 --> 00:05:35,390 Suze: those people who have money 76 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:38,200 Suze: in a bank or even in a credit union, because 77 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:42,430 Suze: they understand that credit unions just like banks are insured, 78 00:05:42,430 --> 00:05:45,330 Suze: but with N C U A. Is there anything if 79 00:05:45,330 --> 00:05:50,310 Suze: they are within the insurance limits? Is there anything for 80 00:05:50,310 --> 00:05:52,540 Suze: them to be afraid of? 81 00:05:52,610 --> 00:05:55,810 Sheila: No, for both a for both the credit union account 82 00:05:55,810 --> 00:05:59,480 Sheila: and a bank deposit account, if they're below the insured 83 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:01,750 Sheila: deposit caps, they're absolutely fine. 84 00:06:02,180 --> 00:06:05,050 Sheila: The FDIC has been around for nearly 90 years. Nobody 85 00:06:05,050 --> 00:06:07,920 Sheila: has ever lost a penny of insured deposits. I believe 86 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:11,190 Sheila: the NCUA has a similarly stiller record. So yeah, the 87 00:06:11,190 --> 00:06:13,890 Sheila: government has done a good job of protecting insured deposits 88 00:06:13,890 --> 00:06:15,410 Sheila: that they should not worry about that. 89 00:06:16,260 --> 00:06:19,810 Suze: Alright, so all of you, you just heard it from 90 00:06:19,820 --> 00:06:22,229 Suze: the Chairman of the F D I C during the 91 00:06:22,230 --> 00:06:26,870 Suze: biggest bank collapse like I said in modern history. So 92 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:30,410 Suze: all of you just need to know that a few 93 00:06:30,410 --> 00:06:33,820 Suze: things that people do want to know. Is there a 94 00:06:33,820 --> 00:06:38,030 Suze: limit to how many beneficiaries you can have 95 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:42,510 Suze: so that you have FDIC insurance? They're very aware that 96 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:45,100 Suze: if you have one beneficiary to an account that you 97 00:06:45,100 --> 00:06:50,000 Suze: get 250,000 two beneficiaries you get 500,000, is there a 98 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:54,039 Suze: limit to the number of beneficiaries that you can have? 99 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:57,909 Sheila: Yes, there is a limit. It's, it's five now and I 100 00:06:57,910 --> 00:07:01,360 Sheila: believe those rules are changing in April of next year. 101 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:04,030 Sheila: So I think they're tightening up on them a little bit. So, 102 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:05,910 Sheila: stay tuned. Check the website, 103 00:07:06,070 --> 00:07:08,660 Sheila: always check the website and the, and the Suzie Ormn 104 00:07:08,670 --> 00:07:11,040 Sheila: deposit insured deposit calculator. 105 00:07:11,050 --> 00:07:13,350 Suze: Do they still have my picture next to it? 106 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,100 Sheila: I don't think they do, but they absolutely should and with the two of us and our PSAs. 107 00:07:18,610 --> 00:07:22,150 Suze: Yeah, we were so good. You even got a new hairdo. 108 00:07:22,150 --> 00:07:23,030 Suze: Do you remember that? 109 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:25,450 Sheila: It was, it was... I called it my Suze do because it was 110 00:07:25,450 --> 00:07:27,280 Sheila: very similar to yours. It looked great. 111 00:07:29,180 --> 00:07:34,390 Suze: Right now, you can have up to five beneficiaries per account. 112 00:07:34,400 --> 00:07:39,830 Suze: So that's about one million $250,000 of insurance. And remember 113 00:07:39,830 --> 00:07:43,660 Suze: you can do that on every single different category of 114 00:07:43,660 --> 00:07:47,900 Suze: an account that you have at one bank. Just so 115 00:07:47,900 --> 00:07:52,350 Suze: you know that. Next, what they want to know is 116 00:07:52,350 --> 00:07:55,410 Suze: there a difference between F D I C and N 117 00:07:55,410 --> 00:07:57,920 Suze: C U A insurance? They understand that those two are 118 00:07:57,920 --> 00:07:58,720 Suze: the same, 119 00:07:58,870 --> 00:08:03,660 Suze: but they're also worried they have money in their brokerage account. 120 00:08:03,670 --> 00:08:06,410 Suze: A lot of people have money in a money market 121 00:08:06,410 --> 00:08:10,710 Suze: account at a brokerage account, maybe money market fund. So 122 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:15,180 Suze: can you number one explain to everybody the difference between 123 00:08:15,190 --> 00:08:17,130 Suze: a money market account and 124 00:08:17,145 --> 00:08:21,475 Suze: a money market fund? And are they insured in the 125 00:08:21,475 --> 00:08:24,615 Suze: same way as if their money was at a bank 126 00:08:24,625 --> 00:08:26,195 Suze: or credit union? 127 00:08:26,255 --> 00:08:28,695 Sheila: Well, you mean a money market account that's offered by 128 00:08:28,695 --> 00:08:31,575 Sheila: a bank? No, that, that, that will be protected by 129 00:08:31,575 --> 00:08:34,775 Sheila: deposit insurance, but a money market fund is something very 130 00:08:34,775 --> 00:08:35,415 Sheila: different 131 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:40,980 Sheila: that is run by these big asset managers, Fidelity. Well, Vanguard, 132 00:08:40,980 --> 00:08:44,410 Sheila: all of them have it and the money market funds typically, well, 133 00:08:44,410 --> 00:08:49,040 Sheila: government money market funds are invested only in, in government securities. Obviously, 134 00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:51,760 Sheila: they're allowed to have a small percentage of assets invested 135 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:54,880 Sheila: someplace else. But some other types of money market funds 136 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:57,690 Sheila: actually can be invested in 137 00:08:57,900 --> 00:09:02,059 Sheila: short term paper, and other instruments that are not government 138 00:09:02,059 --> 00:09:05,120 Sheila: backed and those are called prime funds. And there's been 139 00:09:05,120 --> 00:09:08,250 Sheila: some problems with prime funds breaking the buck. So if you, 140 00:09:08,260 --> 00:09:10,170 Sheila: if you want to put your money in a money 141 00:09:10,170 --> 00:09:12,980 Sheila: market fund to make sure that it will, it will 142 00:09:12,980 --> 00:09:16,130 Sheila: maintain that dollar for dollar value, dollar in dollar out, 143 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:19,170 Sheila: make sure that you're in a short term government money 144 00:09:19,170 --> 00:09:22,020 Sheila: market fund. I think those are absolutely the safest ones. 145 00:09:22,390 --> 00:09:25,790 Suze: And when you just said it broke the buck because a 146 00:09:25,790 --> 00:09:29,160 Suze: lot of people don't understand money market accounts as well 147 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:32,050 Suze: as money market funds usually say that you're 148 00:09:32,090 --> 00:09:34,449 Suze: money will be stable and the shares of it will 149 00:09:34,450 --> 00:09:39,790 Suze: always be valued at a dollar a share. In 2008, everybody, 150 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:44,150 Suze: there was a money market fund that broke the dollar, 151 00:09:44,150 --> 00:09:47,490 Suze: it went below the dollar for a short period of time. 152 00:09:47,490 --> 00:09:50,880 Suze: And that was quite something if you remember that. 153 00:09:51,190 --> 00:09:53,979 Sheila: Yes it was, it was a very bad experience and helped 154 00:09:53,980 --> 00:09:57,760 Sheila: lead to a real seizing up of the, of the system. 155 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:01,780 Sheila: So it was an important lesson for money market fund 156 00:10:01,790 --> 00:10:06,179 Sheila: users. The SEC which regulates money market funds, not bank accounts, but 157 00:10:06,179 --> 00:10:10,000 Sheila: money market funds has tightened up on their rules. And again, 158 00:10:10,010 --> 00:10:13,199 Sheila: there are things called prime funds that are not always 159 00:10:13,200 --> 00:10:17,560 Sheila: invested in government securities, but short term money market funds. 160 00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:20,230 Sheila: Short term government money market funds are really a very 161 00:10:20,230 --> 00:10:22,150 Sheila: safe place to put your money. 162 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:25,900 Sheila: With short term treasuries, there's not much loss of market 163 00:10:25,900 --> 00:10:28,170 Sheila: value even when the interest rates go up and the 164 00:10:28,170 --> 00:10:31,329 Sheila: very liquid, you can obviously short term, you know, t bills, 165 00:10:31,340 --> 00:10:34,770 Sheila: you can sell quickly to meet redemptions. So that's, that's 166 00:10:34,770 --> 00:10:37,080 Sheila: a pretty safe place. It's not, it's not covered by 167 00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:38,540 Sheila: F D I C insurance, which is a, 168 00:10:38,820 --> 00:10:39,460 Sheila: a pretty safe place to put your money. 169 00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:44,469 Suze: And people have a hard time understanding SIPC insurance. They 170 00:10:44,470 --> 00:10:47,360 Suze: tend to think, oh, if their money is invested at 171 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:51,020 Suze: a brokerage firm and they're covered by SIPC that their 172 00:10:51,020 --> 00:10:54,690 Suze: $250,000 will be protected there by SIPC 173 00:10:54,990 --> 00:10:57,410 Suze: and their thing. Yes or no. 174 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:01,819 Sheila: So no. SIPC is a completely different animals. So SIPC, the Securities Investor 175 00:11:01,820 --> 00:11:08,150 Sheila: Protection Corporation is really, it protects mainly protects securities investments, 176 00:11:08,150 --> 00:11:10,800 Sheila: not bank accounts, security. The F D I C protects 177 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:11,640 Sheila: bank accounts. 178 00:11:11,970 --> 00:11:15,600 Sheila: Your securities investments are protected by the SIPC, but that's 179 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:20,380 Sheila: really just limited protection against fraud or misappropriation. For instance, 180 00:11:20,380 --> 00:11:22,429 Sheila: if your money market fund breaks the buck, SIPC is 181 00:11:22,429 --> 00:11:25,630 Sheila: not going to pay you. You take that, that, that 182 00:11:25,630 --> 00:11:28,340 Sheila: market risk as an investor, as a securities investor. 183 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:32,510 Sheila: So that's a very important thing to understand. SIPC coverage 184 00:11:32,510 --> 00:11:33,280 Sheila: is very limited. 185 00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:37,220 Suze: So the way that you would normally protect then, either large 186 00:11:37,220 --> 00:11:39,770 Suze: amounts of money or even small amounts of money within 187 00:11:39,770 --> 00:11:43,300 Suze: a brokerage firm is to either buy a certificate of 188 00:11:43,300 --> 00:11:45,860 Suze: deposit at some bank within that brokerage 189 00:11:45,875 --> 00:11:52,765 Suze: firm and or treasury bills, treasury notes, whatever it may be. Also, 190 00:11:52,765 --> 00:11:56,575 Suze: people are really freaked because a lot of people that 191 00:11:56,575 --> 00:11:58,965 Suze: listen to the Women and Money podcast are all throughout 192 00:11:58,965 --> 00:12:02,115 Suze: the United States, some in very small cities or towns 193 00:12:02,115 --> 00:12:03,095 Suze: or whatever. 194 00:12:03,300 --> 00:12:08,220 Suze: And they're hearing how regional banks are going to collapse. 195 00:12:08,220 --> 00:12:10,360 Suze: They're not safe and they need to take their money 196 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:14,219 Suze: out and put it into a major bank. So can 197 00:12:14,220 --> 00:12:18,230 Suze: you briefly tell people what a regional bank is and 198 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:19,730 Suze: your opinion about what I just said. 199 00:12:19,740 --> 00:12:23,440 Sheila: Yeah, so a regional bank is, is a loose phrase 200 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:28,420 Sheila: for basically uh the banks that have hundreds of billions 201 00:12:28,420 --> 00:12:31,730 Sheila: of assets but not trillions of assets. So we call 202 00:12:31,730 --> 00:12:36,180 Sheila: systemic institutions originally those that are multi trillion 203 00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:41,820 Sheila: and for the most part and the smaller depository institutions 204 00:12:41,830 --> 00:12:44,360 Sheila: in the hundreds of billions are generally characterized as regional 205 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:47,660 Sheila: and they're called regional because they typically have a regional 206 00:12:48,020 --> 00:12:49,890 Sheila: footprint within the United States. 207 00:12:50,150 --> 00:12:53,010 Sheila: So P N C, U S Bancorp are two of 208 00:12:53,010 --> 00:12:56,920 Sheila: the biggest ones, M&T and other bit smaller one. Those 209 00:12:56,920 --> 00:13:00,290 Sheila: are just examples of what we call regional banks and, 210 00:13:00,300 --> 00:13:03,040 Sheila: and mostly regional banks are just fine. Actually, during the 211 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:05,310 Sheila: financial crisis, when I was chair of the F D 212 00:13:05,309 --> 00:13:08,420 Sheila: I C, the regional banks performed very well. Actually, 213 00:13:08,650 --> 00:13:11,429 Sheila: they did not make the crazy loans that these thrifts 214 00:13:11,429 --> 00:13:15,240 Sheila: have made, they took deposits, they made good loans and 215 00:13:15,250 --> 00:13:18,089 Sheila: they were quite resilient and stable during the crisis and 216 00:13:18,090 --> 00:13:21,300 Sheila: continue to be so. That's not not to say any bank, 217 00:13:21,300 --> 00:13:25,420 Sheila: you know, uh mid sized bank of the size we're 218 00:13:25,420 --> 00:13:29,900 Sheila: talking about is perfectly safe. But as a group, they are, 219 00:13:29,910 --> 00:13:32,760 Sheila: they've been quite resilient. And again, you don't have to 220 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:36,219 Sheila: worry unless you're you have uninsured deposits of this size bank. 221 00:13:36,460 --> 00:13:38,400 Sheila: And even if you do, I mean, if you've been 222 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:41,170 Sheila: with them for a long time, you know them well, I 223 00:13:41,170 --> 00:13:44,030 Sheila: think you should be comfortable. This problem we have with 224 00:13:44,030 --> 00:13:47,660 Sheila: Silicon Valley Bank, there were two problems. It's risk management 225 00:13:47,660 --> 00:13:48,670 Sheila: was terrible 226 00:13:49,270 --> 00:13:53,080 Sheila: and it relied almost exclusively on uninsured deposits by a 227 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,929 Sheila: bunch of very wealthy venture capitalists and the portfolio companies 228 00:13:56,929 --> 00:14:00,730 Sheila: that the VCs had invested in and they were seeking yield. 229 00:14:00,740 --> 00:14:04,420 Sheila: It was a high interest rate payer too. And so 230 00:14:04,429 --> 00:14:09,640 Sheila: it wasn't a loyal depositor base the way most, you know, longstanding, 231 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:13,430 Sheila: regional banks will have, even with their uninsured depositors, they will, typically, 232 00:14:13,429 --> 00:14:16,570 Sheila: these will be businesses and governments with the larger accounts 233 00:14:16,860 --> 00:14:18,929 Sheila: that have done business with the bank for years and 234 00:14:18,929 --> 00:14:23,280 Sheila: have some loyalty and knowledge of the bank. So, don't worry, I, 235 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:26,390 Sheila: I do worry that just fear itself could, could lead 236 00:14:26,390 --> 00:14:29,600 Sheila: to a lot of deposit outflows at regional banks. There's 237 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:31,810 Sheila: risk in life. We can't guarantee everything. 238 00:14:31,820 --> 00:14:36,140 Suze: So many times the listener will write in and they're 239 00:14:36,140 --> 00:14:40,500 Suze: looking for the highest interest rate wherever they could get it. 240 00:14:40,670 --> 00:14:44,140 Suze: And I keep telling them no, it's not about the 241 00:14:44,140 --> 00:14:48,430 Suze: highest interest rate. It's about the going interest rate at 242 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:53,250 Suze: the safest institution that you can invest your money in 243 00:14:53,250 --> 00:14:56,380 Suze: and that a lot of times banks and credit unions, 244 00:14:56,380 --> 00:14:59,560 Suze: I would imagine, you know, do things so that they 245 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:01,530 Suze: can get a lot of people to put their money 246 00:15:01,540 --> 00:15:05,210 Suze: into them and they're giving higher rates than what they 247 00:15:05,210 --> 00:15:08,780 Suze: can normally really take a risk on. 248 00:15:08,950 --> 00:15:11,490 Suze: I really always want people never to go for the 249 00:15:11,490 --> 00:15:15,570 Suze: highest rate, but go for the financial institution that is 250 00:15:15,570 --> 00:15:19,280 Suze: the safest and that has invested your money in such 251 00:15:19,290 --> 00:15:23,060 Suze: a way that they're not taking any risk with your money. 252 00:15:23,060 --> 00:15:25,990 Suze: So that means you get a quarter percent less. Who cares? 253 00:15:25,990 --> 00:15:27,050 Suze: Would you agree with that? 254 00:15:27,060 --> 00:15:29,620 Sheila: I would absolutely agree with that. That's very sound advice. 255 00:15:29,620 --> 00:15:31,780 Sheila: Generally the highest rate payers are, 256 00:15:31,980 --> 00:15:35,430 Sheila: look, if the banks providing good service, they won't have 257 00:15:35,430 --> 00:15:37,560 Sheila: to pay the highest rate. I mean, the banks that 258 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:39,410 Sheila: are paying the highest rates probably aren't doing anything else 259 00:15:39,410 --> 00:15:42,290 Sheila: to attract deposits, but the ones that are maybe a 260 00:15:42,290 --> 00:15:45,290 Sheila: little lower, but they're probably providing good service and they're 261 00:15:45,290 --> 00:15:47,160 Sheila: drawing and keeping deposits that way. 262 00:15:47,170 --> 00:15:50,300 Suze: Everybody did. You just hear what Sheila said? 263 00:15:50,690 --> 00:15:55,000 Suze: Go for safety over, "I can get a quarter of 264 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:57,370 Suze: a percent more here at eighth of a percent more there." 265 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:03,970 Suze: Absolutely not. One thing that people are really freaked about 266 00:16:04,030 --> 00:16:07,989 Suze: is this debt ceiling that is coming up in a 267 00:16:07,990 --> 00:16:12,990 Suze: few months. So a very strange question is, let's say 268 00:16:12,990 --> 00:16:18,460 Suze: this group of people prevent it from being signed or being raised. 269 00:16:20,370 --> 00:16:24,920 Suze: Is it possible that treasuries will stop paying the interest 270 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:26,060 Suze: rate out to people? 271 00:16:26,070 --> 00:16:30,380 Sheila: I doubt it. I think probably the treasury will give 272 00:16:30,380 --> 00:16:35,200 Sheila: priority to interest payments on, on, on treasury debt. So 273 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:38,320 Sheila: people should be assured on that though. What I really 274 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:40,530 Sheila: would hate is a situation where we don't raise the 275 00:16:40,530 --> 00:16:43,250 Sheila: debt limit. So even though bondholders are getting paid or 276 00:16:43,250 --> 00:16:45,430 Sheila: treasury security holders are getting paid. 277 00:16:45,830 --> 00:16:49,180 Sheila: Social Security beneficiaries may not be or food stamp recipients 278 00:16:49,180 --> 00:16:51,630 Sheila: may not be, you know, so there if they don't 279 00:16:51,630 --> 00:16:55,260 Sheila: raise the debt limit, some there are areas where the 280 00:16:55,260 --> 00:16:58,160 Sheila: government has made commitments of financial responsibility that they will 281 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:01,520 Sheila: not meet. And I think Janet Yellen's right is when 282 00:17:01,520 --> 00:17:03,630 Sheila: she says the default is default. So even if you're 283 00:17:03,630 --> 00:17:06,620 Sheila: paying interest on the treasury securities, if you're not making 284 00:17:06,619 --> 00:17:08,900 Sheila: good on your obligations, in other ways, 285 00:17:09,210 --> 00:17:12,220 Sheila: you're still in default. So, yes, I do think if it 286 00:17:12,220 --> 00:17:14,970 Sheila: comes to that, hopefully they won't, they will prioritize interest 287 00:17:14,970 --> 00:17:18,100 Sheila: on government debt, but I hope it doesn't come to 288 00:17:18,100 --> 00:17:20,820 Sheila: that because the government has other responsibilities that they really 289 00:17:20,820 --> 00:17:22,380 Sheila: should be making good on as well. 290 00:17:22,660 --> 00:17:27,980 Suze: Next question is treasuries versus certificates of deposits, whether they're 291 00:17:27,980 --> 00:17:31,270 Suze: in a bank or a credit union. People seem to 292 00:17:31,270 --> 00:17:35,290 Suze: think that treasuries could be more affected, believe it or not, 293 00:17:35,300 --> 00:17:38,330 Suze: rather than the banks or credit unions that are paying 294 00:17:38,340 --> 00:17:41,580 Suze: interest on certificates of deposit. Any comment on that? 295 00:17:41,910 --> 00:17:44,690 Sheila: Well, I think, look, if there really was a default 296 00:17:44,690 --> 00:17:47,930 Sheila: on treasury debt, it would be highly destabilizing to the 297 00:17:47,940 --> 00:17:51,460 Sheila: banking system. I, I can't imagine we would ever go there. 298 00:17:51,820 --> 00:17:55,800 Sheila: I mean, technically that is right, the, the CD interest 299 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:58,100 Sheila: you're paid is the bank pays you that out of 300 00:17:58,100 --> 00:18:00,250 Sheila: the profits. You know, when they lend your deposit out 301 00:18:00,250 --> 00:18:03,140 Sheila: or invested your paid interest out of the returns they 302 00:18:03,140 --> 00:18:07,100 Sheila: get on that. There's no direct collection between, you know, 303 00:18:07,100 --> 00:18:11,480 Sheila: any default on treasury debt in your banks. The mechanisms 304 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:13,930 Sheila: will get your bank pays interest on your C D. 305 00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:17,580 Sheila: But more generally, you know, it would be catastrophic for 306 00:18:17,580 --> 00:18:22,080 Sheila: the financial system and if, if treasury, if the treasury 307 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:24,500 Sheila: did default on its debt. So again, let's I don't 308 00:18:24,500 --> 00:18:26,649 Sheila: think that would ever happen and let's just hope we 309 00:18:26,650 --> 00:18:27,340 Sheila: don't go there. 310 00:18:27,850 --> 00:18:30,880 Suze: Alright. We can keep our fingers crossed just like you 311 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,939 Suze: hope 2008 would never happen when you told them they 312 00:18:33,940 --> 00:18:36,100 Suze: were all going to happen. But yet that is a 313 00:18:36,100 --> 00:18:41,570 Suze: whole another story is it not. So the bond holdings 314 00:18:41,570 --> 00:18:45,869 Suze: have just been downgraded by Moody's and people want to 315 00:18:45,869 --> 00:18:48,970 Suze: know what does that mean, Suze? Like, does that mean 316 00:18:48,970 --> 00:18:51,760 Suze: that we're not creditworthy anymore? Whatever... 317 00:18:51,780 --> 00:18:54,870 Suze: I do want people to understand that there are different 318 00:18:54,880 --> 00:19:00,100 Suze: rating agencies in the United States Standard and Poor's, Moody's whatever 319 00:19:00,100 --> 00:19:03,740 Suze: they may be and that to be rated. Is it 320 00:19:03,740 --> 00:19:08,190 Suze: not true that the bond issuer asked to pay Moody's 321 00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:11,550 Suze: like x thousands of dollars to have that company rate them? 322 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:12,479 Suze: Isn't that how it works? 323 00:19:13,109 --> 00:19:15,410 Sheila: Yes, that's right. That's been a big issue too because the raters are 324 00:19:16,050 --> 00:19:17,340 Sheila: paid by the issuers. 325 00:19:17,940 --> 00:19:21,270 Suze: So think about that everybody. So when you see a 326 00:19:21,270 --> 00:19:26,650 Suze: downgrade by Moody's, for instance, shame on them. They should 327 00:19:26,650 --> 00:19:30,780 Suze: have downgraded some of these issuers way before when they 328 00:19:30,780 --> 00:19:35,690 Suze: first did their examination of them. But because they're paid 329 00:19:35,700 --> 00:19:40,570 Suze: by the issuers to do what? Grade them, they never 330 00:19:40,570 --> 00:19:42,850 Suze: get usually a bad rating because who's going to pay 331 00:19:42,850 --> 00:19:45,320 Suze: to rate you if they're going to fail you? 332 00:19:45,859 --> 00:19:48,670 Suze: So I just want you all to keep that in 333 00:19:48,670 --> 00:19:52,210 Suze: mind when you see that, would you agree with that? 334 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:55,359 Sheila: Well I do think it's a flaw, I mean, I think most, 335 00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:58,470 Sheila: most of the rating agencies try to be independent but 336 00:19:58,470 --> 00:20:01,590 Sheila: you're right. I mean, the economic incentives are there. You know, 337 00:20:01,590 --> 00:20:04,040 Sheila: it's a huge problem during the crisis because these rating 338 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:07,020 Sheila: agencies were given triple A ratings to these toxic mortgage 339 00:20:07,020 --> 00:20:11,500 Sheila: backed securities and derivatives based on the mortgage backed securities. And, yeah, 340 00:20:11,510 --> 00:20:13,320 Sheila: it was all being driven by the income they were 341 00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:14,680 Sheila: getting from the issuers. So 342 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,480 Sheila: I think with, with, with corporate debt, it's, it's a 343 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,000 Sheila: better system. I think there's much more integrity involved. But 344 00:20:21,000 --> 00:20:23,710 Sheila: some people have suggested maybe the stock exchanges should pay 345 00:20:23,710 --> 00:20:27,590 Sheila: for the ratings or, you know, some investor group, some 346 00:20:27,590 --> 00:20:29,430 Sheila: way to get the investors to pay for it directly. 347 00:20:29,430 --> 00:20:30,820 Sheila: But that just hasn't happened yet. 348 00:20:31,190 --> 00:20:35,980 Suze: So if everyday normal people who don't understand rating agencies 349 00:20:36,020 --> 00:20:42,260 Suze: don't understand anything, they just want their money safe and sound, 350 00:20:42,770 --> 00:20:44,520 Suze: what would you tell them to do with it? 351 00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:47,359 Sheila: So if, if this is money that they cannot afford to 352 00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:50,270 Sheila: lose any money of that, it has to maintain stable 353 00:20:50,270 --> 00:20:52,090 Sheila: value for them, then put it in a bank or 354 00:20:52,090 --> 00:20:54,699 Sheila: put it in a credit union. Banks and credit unions 355 00:20:54,700 --> 00:20:58,200 Sheila: are regulated so that they can maintain stable value, stability 356 00:20:58,200 --> 00:21:01,149 Sheila: in your deposit, dollar in dollar out, plus whatever interest 357 00:21:01,150 --> 00:21:04,060 Sheila: they might pay. So that's where you should put the money. 358 00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:06,640 Sheila: I would put those to the highest and then short 359 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:09,970 Sheila: term government money microphones next in terms of super safe 360 00:21:09,970 --> 00:21:11,120 Sheila: places to put your money 361 00:21:11,630 --> 00:21:14,670 Suze: And where do treasury bills and notes fit into that? 362 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:19,450 Sheila: Well, you can buy those directly too. It may be easier. 363 00:21:19,460 --> 00:21:21,680 Sheila: You'll have more ease of putting the money in and 364 00:21:21,680 --> 00:21:24,290 Sheila: out if you use the money market fund as opposed 365 00:21:24,290 --> 00:21:25,480 Sheila: to buying it directly 366 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:28,180 Suze: yourself. Why do they make it so difficult in so 367 00:21:28,180 --> 00:21:33,400 Suze: many cases to do treasuries? I mean, yeah, I mean, 368 00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:34,200 Suze: I was, you know... 369 00:21:34,630 --> 00:21:37,330 Sheila: I'm a former treasury official. Let's show you an antidote. I wanted 370 00:21:37,330 --> 00:21:39,920 Sheila: to buy an I Bond last summer for my kids 371 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:43,420 Sheila: and I needed to update my bank account information and 372 00:21:43,420 --> 00:21:46,020 Sheila: I waited and waited for months and months and months 373 00:21:46,020 --> 00:21:48,890 Sheila: and months and I finally pulled strings and I emailed some, 374 00:21:48,890 --> 00:21:51,449 Sheila: I didn't want to, but I emailed some colleagues at 375 00:21:51,450 --> 00:21:53,379 Sheila: Treasury and they got it fixed for me because I 376 00:21:53,380 --> 00:21:55,510 Sheila: don't like to, you know, I try to be like 377 00:21:55,510 --> 00:21:59,869 Sheila: everybody else but yeah, their systems are really need an upgrade, 378 00:21:59,869 --> 00:22:01,129 Sheila: they need more people. 379 00:22:01,330 --> 00:22:04,369 Sheila: Um, but they're, they're getting them now, you know, and 380 00:22:04,369 --> 00:22:07,590 Sheila: there's been some controversy but Treasury has always been under 381 00:22:07,590 --> 00:22:09,960 Sheila: resourced when I was there is under resourced. They need 382 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:12,060 Sheila: to give more money to upgrade systems and hire more 383 00:22:12,060 --> 00:22:13,379 Sheila: people to answer the phones too. 384 00:22:13,390 --> 00:22:16,990 Suze: You mentioned I Bonds and the listeners and everybody I 385 00:22:16,990 --> 00:22:18,869 Suze: think in the United States can tell you that for 386 00:22:18,869 --> 00:22:23,660 Suze: the past two years, I've been an I Bond fanatic. 387 00:22:23,670 --> 00:22:27,980 Suze: I mean, really, I went frenzied on it, but after 388 00:22:27,980 --> 00:22:29,260 Suze: this last one, 389 00:22:29,550 --> 00:22:33,970 Suze: I've asked people to think about twice before the end 390 00:22:33,970 --> 00:22:37,560 Suze: of April, obviously and the rate changes in may think 391 00:22:37,570 --> 00:22:42,080 Suze: about it because just maybe it's not the greatest investment 392 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:44,240 Suze: anymore since you have to lock up your money for 393 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:48,250 Suze: five years, since there is a three month interest penalty. 394 00:22:48,250 --> 00:22:50,880 Suze: Although that won't matter so much of interest rates, or 395 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:55,700 Suze: inflation goes down. And do you have a feeling about 396 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,940 Suze: would right now, would I Bonds still be something that 397 00:22:59,940 --> 00:23:02,100 Suze: you would pull all those strings for, to get your 398 00:23:02,100 --> 00:23:05,590 Suze: kids money in it? Versus like you did back then? 399 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:08,940 Suze: Versus would you do that right now? Do you think 400 00:23:08,950 --> 00:23:11,720 Suze: given what probably inflation will be in May? 401 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:15,149 Sheila: Yeah. So I, so I'm not a financial advisor, so 402 00:23:15,150 --> 00:23:17,520 Sheila: I always, when people ask me for advice, I'll just 403 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:18,139 Sheila: tell you what 404 00:23:18,330 --> 00:23:20,160 Sheila: I would do it. I've decided not to buy one 405 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,010 Sheila: at this point in time. I think it's a, it's 406 00:23:22,010 --> 00:23:24,500 Sheila: uncertain what's going to happen with inflation. And I like 407 00:23:24,510 --> 00:23:26,770 Sheila: you have to lock it in for, for, for five 408 00:23:26,770 --> 00:23:27,790 Sheila: years and, 409 00:23:28,410 --> 00:23:32,540 Sheila: you know, inflation, I think the Fed's ability to keep 410 00:23:32,540 --> 00:23:36,220 Sheila: raising rates has been hampered. Uh They just try to 411 00:23:36,220 --> 00:23:38,409 Sheila: go too fast, you know, and I think they're going 412 00:23:38,410 --> 00:23:40,690 Sheila: to hit pause or slow down significantly. We may just 413 00:23:40,690 --> 00:23:42,670 Sheila: have to tolerate a little more inflation for a while 414 00:23:42,670 --> 00:23:44,280 Sheila: to get it under control without, 415 00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:47,900 Sheila: you know, a severe recession or financial crisis. So, um 416 00:23:47,910 --> 00:23:50,690 Sheila: I'm holding off if that's of interest anyone, I am holding off. 417 00:23:51,410 --> 00:23:54,399 Suze: I've told the listeners to hold off as well. All right. 418 00:23:54,410 --> 00:23:57,190 Suze: But that was during a period of time though, when 419 00:23:57,190 --> 00:24:01,380 Suze: I was almost sure that inflation would start to come down, 420 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:06,760 Suze: but interest rates would remain higher. I and I'm not 421 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,939 Suze: sure that that's true anymore. So now I'm caught in 422 00:24:09,940 --> 00:24:13,889 Suze: this thing of really what does one do because you 423 00:24:13,890 --> 00:24:17,340 Suze: could tell by the fluctuation in the treasury market and 424 00:24:17,350 --> 00:24:18,159 Suze: everything 425 00:24:18,310 --> 00:24:22,500 Suze: that it's it's very difficult. It was very simple before 426 00:24:22,510 --> 00:24:27,460 Suze: a week ago. Now, it's become a lot more complicated, 427 00:24:27,460 --> 00:24:31,330 Suze: but we'll just have to see what happens here, right? 428 00:24:31,330 --> 00:24:35,610 Suze: With that. So you mentioned the word recession and you 429 00:24:35,609 --> 00:24:40,930 Suze: put the word severe in front of that word. So 430 00:24:40,940 --> 00:24:44,169 Suze: we've had an inverted yield rate curve now for some 431 00:24:44,170 --> 00:24:45,070 Suze: time 432 00:24:45,330 --> 00:24:48,930 Suze: and all of us know or it's been predicted that 433 00:24:48,930 --> 00:24:53,390 Suze: every time we have one, eventually we go into recession, 434 00:24:53,400 --> 00:24:56,190 Suze: it's not right away. It could be one, two or three years. 435 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:58,609 Suze: But we also know 436 00:24:58,790 --> 00:25:02,410 Suze: that every time we've gone into recession, it happens sooner. 437 00:25:02,420 --> 00:25:06,429 Suze: Once you start to see that inverted yield rate curve 438 00:25:06,430 --> 00:25:09,649 Suze: start to correct, which is in its own little way, 439 00:25:09,660 --> 00:25:13,750 Suze: is doing it like on March eighth. You had a 1% 440 00:25:13,750 --> 00:25:16,370 Suze: difference between the two and the 10 year. 441 00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:21,429 Suze: And now that has limited itself a lot. And so 442 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:26,330 Suze: usually when that happens, it's 4-6 months from that time 443 00:25:26,340 --> 00:25:31,659 Suze: when recession hits. So, do you have an opinion on that? 444 00:25:31,670 --> 00:25:33,890 Sheila: Well, yeah, I mean, I think when that happens it's 445 00:25:33,890 --> 00:25:36,770 Sheila: really the market saying, you know, recession is, is going 446 00:25:36,770 --> 00:25:39,680 Sheila: to be happening sooner than later, meaning that the Fed 447 00:25:39,690 --> 00:25:42,600 Sheila: will have to lower rates. And so that's why you 448 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:44,910 Sheila: get less pressure on the yield curve. 449 00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:48,010 Sheila: So, and that's exactly what's going on. Now, I think 450 00:25:48,010 --> 00:25:51,090 Sheila: with this situation with Silicon Valley Bank and then Credit 451 00:25:51,090 --> 00:25:54,850 Sheila: Suisse and just the uncertainties around people are feeling now 452 00:25:54,850 --> 00:25:58,869 Sheila: about the financial system, um that they're assuming the FED 453 00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,260 Sheila: is going to ease up a bit on its inflation fight. 454 00:26:02,260 --> 00:26:05,670 Sheila: So interest rates will hold steady or go down and 455 00:26:05,670 --> 00:26:08,660 Sheila: may go down further if we have a recession. So 456 00:26:08,670 --> 00:26:10,590 Sheila: that's what, that's what the market is saying. And the 457 00:26:10,590 --> 00:26:13,820 Sheila: market sometimes is right on these things, sometimes not. 458 00:26:14,140 --> 00:26:17,510 Sheila: I'm hoping we can still avoid it. Um that's why 459 00:26:17,520 --> 00:26:20,330 Sheila: last December I said, I thought the Fed should hit pause. 460 00:26:20,330 --> 00:26:23,100 Sheila: They were going too fast. I'm I'm an inflation hawk. 461 00:26:23,100 --> 00:26:25,469 Sheila: I've been, I've been saying since 2010, I wanted them 462 00:26:25,470 --> 00:26:28,170 Sheila: to normalize interest rates. I don't, I think easy money 463 00:26:28,170 --> 00:26:28,690 Sheila: is 464 00:26:28,940 --> 00:26:32,639 Sheila: very destabilizing and you know, it punishes savers and encourages 465 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:36,380 Sheila: leverage and speculation and all the unpleasant things we've seen 466 00:26:36,390 --> 00:26:38,960 Sheila: in the past years, in our economy, it was almost 467 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,460 Sheila: 14 years of easy money. So you can only undo 468 00:26:41,460 --> 00:26:43,290 Sheila: that so fast. So I think they need to hit 469 00:26:43,290 --> 00:26:46,180 Sheila: pause and assess a bit before they go further. 470 00:26:46,510 --> 00:26:50,389 Suze: And if you could give advice or if you want 471 00:26:50,390 --> 00:26:55,040 Suze: to give advice to listeners thinking that we probably, this 472 00:26:55,040 --> 00:26:58,860 Suze: is me thinking it, probably will go into a recession. 473 00:26:58,859 --> 00:27:00,190 Suze: I don't know if it will be a big one 474 00:27:00,190 --> 00:27:03,300 Suze: or not or whatever. What would be the one thing 475 00:27:03,300 --> 00:27:06,600 Suze: that you would want everybody to do to protect themselves 476 00:27:06,609 --> 00:27:09,100 Suze: during a recessionary environment? 477 00:27:09,330 --> 00:27:11,770 Sheila: Well, save money, put it in a bank or put 478 00:27:11,770 --> 00:27:14,340 Sheila: it in a credit union or a liquid government short 479 00:27:14,340 --> 00:27:17,250 Sheila: term money market fund where you can easily access it 480 00:27:17,260 --> 00:27:20,409 Sheila: if you need it. Uh You know, that's, that's the 481 00:27:20,410 --> 00:27:22,310 Sheila: best thing you do. If you lose your job or 482 00:27:22,310 --> 00:27:26,150 Sheila: your hours are cut back, if your pay is reduced, have 483 00:27:26,150 --> 00:27:28,490 Sheila: a cushion to fall back on. The worst thing that 484 00:27:28,490 --> 00:27:30,709 Sheila: happens to people as you get into a recession, they 485 00:27:30,710 --> 00:27:33,490 Sheila: don't have savings, their income goes down, then they have 486 00:27:33,490 --> 00:27:35,550 Sheila: to borrow. So they've got a debt load too. 487 00:27:35,869 --> 00:27:39,160 Sheila: Um So save your money, build up your savings. Um 488 00:27:39,170 --> 00:27:40,909 Sheila: I think, I think that's absolutely the best thing you can do. 489 00:27:41,310 --> 00:27:44,110 Suze: So my last question for you is out of everything 490 00:27:44,109 --> 00:27:48,850 Suze: you've done, which is significant, whether you know it or not. 491 00:27:48,859 --> 00:27:53,889 Suze: Your involvement starting, you know, in 2006 with all the 492 00:27:53,890 --> 00:27:57,200 Suze: policies and how things worked and how everything then was 493 00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:01,850 Suze: modeled was absolutely instrumental into trying to make 494 00:28:02,090 --> 00:28:07,020 Suze: the United States banking system and money system, the safest possible. Obviously, 495 00:28:07,020 --> 00:28:10,630 Suze: they undid a lot of that in 2018, right, but 496 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,710 Suze: you gave it your best shot. So, out of everything 497 00:28:13,710 --> 00:28:18,020 Suze: that you've done, which is monumental up until this point, 498 00:28:18,030 --> 00:28:22,629 Suze: what would you say is the greatest thing you ever accomplished? 499 00:28:23,650 --> 00:28:26,070 Sheila: Well, I I still take a lot of pride in 500 00:28:26,070 --> 00:28:29,399 Sheila: giving people peace of mind during, during the crisis. And again, Suze, 501 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:31,380 Sheila: thank you for, for working with me to help get 502 00:28:31,380 --> 00:28:34,889 Sheila: that message of public confidence. People, you know, people left 503 00:28:34,890 --> 00:28:38,270 Sheila: their money in the banks. Actually, bank deposits grew during 504 00:28:38,270 --> 00:28:40,730 Sheila: this crisis because people had confidence in the F D 505 00:28:40,730 --> 00:28:41,490 Sheila: I C 506 00:28:41,790 --> 00:28:43,690 Sheila: and that was because we got the word out there. 507 00:28:43,690 --> 00:28:46,030 Sheila: I got out there people like you with a lot 508 00:28:46,030 --> 00:28:49,210 Sheila: of credibility vouched for us. And then when banks did 509 00:28:49,210 --> 00:28:51,540 Sheila: fail and we had about 400, we, we handle it 510 00:28:51,540 --> 00:28:54,240 Sheila: smoothly within one business day, everybody had access to the 511 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:56,390 Sheila: insured money. I think there's, there's a lot of work 512 00:28:56,390 --> 00:28:58,160 Sheila: behind the scenes and sometimes I think we made it 513 00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,280 Sheila: look too easy. But that is absolutely the thing I'm 514 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,300 Sheila: the most will always be the most proud of. 515 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:06,420 Suze: All right. And what I'm actually now the most proud 516 00:29:06,420 --> 00:29:10,640 Suze: of for you as to what you have done is 517 00:29:10,650 --> 00:29:14,740 Suze: you have a series of books for kids called Money 518 00:29:14,740 --> 00:29:18,070 Suze: Tales and I believe you have six out, two more 519 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:22,480 Suze: are coming. My favorite one, by the way is Billy 520 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:26,000 Suze: the Borrowing Blue Footed Booby. Because 521 00:29:26,010 --> 00:29:31,969 Suze: he in this book demonstrates exactly what everybody does in 522 00:29:31,970 --> 00:29:34,900 Suze: the United States. You talk about wants versus needs in 523 00:29:34,900 --> 00:29:38,250 Suze: here and everything. So I just want to tell all 524 00:29:38,250 --> 00:29:42,820 Suze: the listeners you have kids, you have grandkids. In fact, 525 00:29:42,830 --> 00:29:49,160 Suze: you could benefit from reading any one of Sheila Bair's 526 00:29:49,310 --> 00:29:53,490 Suze: Money Tale books. And the reason is it brings it 527 00:29:53,490 --> 00:29:56,850 Suze: home to you sometimes when we watch a cartoon or 528 00:29:56,850 --> 00:29:59,570 Suze: when you watch something, a very simplistic way we go. 529 00:29:59,580 --> 00:30:02,210 Suze: Oh my God, that's what I'm doing. Oh my God. 530 00:30:02,220 --> 00:30:05,990 Suze: I am that cartoon character. Oh my God. I am 531 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:10,540 Suze: that character in the book. So I want to tell you, 532 00:30:10,540 --> 00:30:12,590 Suze: I've read all of them so far. 533 00:30:13,020 --> 00:30:17,380 Suze: I think every one of them is fabulous. Truthfully my 534 00:30:17,380 --> 00:30:20,030 Suze: favorite and sitting right in front of me right now, 535 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:24,830 Suze: Billy the Borrowing Blue Footed Booby. Because everybody in the 536 00:30:24,830 --> 00:30:28,670 Suze: United States right now is starting to borrow again and 537 00:30:28,670 --> 00:30:31,240 Suze: again and again. And if all of you were to 538 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:35,390 Suze: read this book, maybe just maybe you would keep yourself 539 00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:39,480 Suze: out of debt. Sheila, I thank you so much for 540 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:42,420 Suze: all your service. I thank you so much for, 541 00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:47,950 Suze: for caring about people and their money. And, and really 542 00:30:47,950 --> 00:30:52,370 Suze: wanting the best for them. And I'm so honored, seriously, 543 00:30:52,380 --> 00:30:55,040 Suze: so honored to call you my friend. 544 00:30:55,490 --> 00:30:58,830 Sheila: Well Suze, the feeling is mutual. You've been amazing over the years, 545 00:30:58,830 --> 00:31:02,110 Sheila: your financial advice and you're, you're just incorruptible. You are 546 00:31:02,110 --> 00:31:04,610 Sheila: so honest and that's why people trust you and that's 547 00:31:04,610 --> 00:31:07,650 Sheila: why we trusted you to help us, you know, get 548 00:31:07,650 --> 00:31:08,970 Sheila: the word out with the F D I C and 549 00:31:08,970 --> 00:31:10,740 Sheila: I still trust you now and thank you for all 550 00:31:10,740 --> 00:31:11,850 Sheila: that you do as well. 551 00:31:12,180 --> 00:31:14,800 Suze: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Sheila. I love you 552 00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:18,530 Suze: so much. Alright, everybody. So I hope you enjoyed that. 553 00:31:18,530 --> 00:31:23,630 Suze: I hope you learned from Miss Sheila Bair herself. However, 554 00:31:24,220 --> 00:31:28,330 Suze: there's always more to learn about your money and that 555 00:31:28,340 --> 00:31:31,880 Suze: is why we do the Women and Money podcast. So 556 00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:36,910 Suze: join me next Thursday with MS Travis for an Ask KT and 557 00:31:36,910 --> 00:31:41,110 Suze: Suze Anything. But until then you know where I'm going, 558 00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:43,479 Suze: you know where I'm going, don't you? There's only one 559 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,719 Suze: thing that I want you to say every single day 560 00:31:46,730 --> 00:31:52,560 Suze: and it is this: today wherever I go, I will 561 00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:59,520 Suze: create a more peaceful, joyful and loving world. Alright. Go 562 00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:03,090 Suze: out there and be unstoppable.