Suze: June 8, 2025. Welcome everybody to the Women and Money
Suze: podcast as well as everybody smart enough to listen. All right,
Suze: we have a surprise for you today, but before I
Suze: tell you about that surprise, I just want to remind
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Suze: Let's go to Suze school. You know, obviously, over the
Suze: past year or two.
Suze: I have been recommending a stock by the name of Palantir,
Suze: and that recommendation came from Keith Fitz-Gerald. Many of you
Suze: are part of his One Bar ahead group, and you
Suze: all love it. You're all smart enough to do that,
Suze: but many of you are also part of 5 with Fitz,
Suze: which is his absolutely free 5 days a week update
Suze: on what he thinks you should and should not be
Suze: doing just that simple.
Suze: Many of you have been mad at me. You've been
Suze: so mad at me because how could I recommend a
Suze: stock like Palantir, Suze Orman, don't you understand the destruction
Suze: that they're doing to the United States of America and
Suze: on and on and on. And so I thought, especially
Suze: with the news, if you've been watching the news lately.
Suze: It's been like, oh my God, Trump has tapped Palantir
Suze: for possibly three projects, and immediately the stock goes down
Suze: from like 130 all the way down to 119. Then
Suze: the very next day it opens up at 124, 125.
Suze: Here's the thing you've got to understand what is Palantir?
Suze: Should you be mad at me that I recommended it?
Suze: What should you understand about investing in stocks? When should
Suze: you hold? When should you sell? What should you do,
Suze: especially with a stock like Palantir, that truthfully everybody has made
Suze: us more money.
Suze: Than any stock that I'm sure you have ever had
Suze: in your portfolio, 'cause remember Keith started to recommend to
Suze: buy it when it was $7 a share, OK?
Suze: So I thought rather than me trying to explain it
Suze: to you, that I would have the maestro himself, Mr.
Suze: Keith Fitz-Gerald, on the podcast today, so that I could
Suze: ask him questions on your behalf, and maybe you could
Suze: get an understanding of why we recommended it, or I
Suze: should say Keith recommended it, and why I believed in
Suze: that recommendation so that I then started to recommend it
Suze: to you.
Suze: And how should you feel about things. So Keith, welcome
Suze: to the Women and Money podcast once again.
Keith: Thank you so much for having me and to everybody
Keith: who's spending a few minutes of their time with us today.
Keith: What an honor. Appreciate it.
Suze: You know, it is an honor, Keith, because as many
Suze: of the listeners know, I don't have guests
Suze: on this show. I get people who write into me
Suze: all the time and say, Suze, I have this expert
Suze: on so and so. Can they be a guest on
Suze: your show? And on and on, and I always write
Suze: them back and say, Don't you listen to the Women
Suze: and Money podcast? We don't have guests. It's just me
Suze: and KT. That's it. But every once in a while,
Suze: I really believe there has to be an exception to
Suze: the rule.
Suze: Especially with somebody like you, Keith. Keith, just tell people
Suze: a little bit about you and why I go to
Suze: you when I really wanna know deep inside information, not insider,
Suze: but inside your head about what's going on, not only
Suze: in the stock market, but in the economy. So let
Suze: everybody know just a little bit about you.
Keith: Oh my goodness, you are most kind, so.
Keith: So for right or for wrong, for better or for worse,
Keith: I've been doing this since I was 15 years old,
Keith: so 45+ years in global markets right now, and I
Keith: love what I do. This is a big puzzle unfortunately
Keith: we've gotten a lot of stuff right over the years.
Keith: Now we made some mistakes, but that comes with the territory, right?
Keith: But I'm what you see is what you get. I
Keith: put my shoes on just like everybody else, and what
Keith: people tell me, including yourself, is that I'm good at
Keith: common sense, breaking it down, no $5 words needed because
Keith: you know what, if you invest in optimism, the profits
Keith: eventually follow. And if you can do that consistently, you
Keith: have a framework, you can keep your emotions out of
Keith: the equation, and we're all guilty of letting them in
Keith: once in a while. But if you can do that,
Keith: then you know what, you got a pretty darn bright
Keith: future in front of yourself. I'm married, got two grown boys.
Keith: Live in the Pacific Northwest and travel the world because
Keith: I love what I do and I love the people
Keith: I meet, and I love the fact that innovation always
Keith: produces profits.
Suze: And just tell people a little bit about how many
Suze: firms you've worked for and how long you've been doing this.
Keith: Oh my goodness, sure. So I made my first trades
Keith: when I was 15 years old, learning at the feet
Keith: of my grandmother Virginia Mimi Gruner, who was widowed at
Keith: a very young age and left with a tiny little
Keith: life insurance settlement.
Keith: And she turned that because she became a global investor
Keith: before the term even existed, and she got so good
Keith: at what she did that she turned that little tiny
Keith: settlement into everything she needed to live for the rest
Keith: of her life and then some. She made sure I
Keith: understood how money worked. She made sure I knew that
Keith: the world was bigger than my garage. So I started
Keith: making my first trades. I was fortunate to get quite
Keith: a few right that helped pay for college, for my
Keith: living expenses, all sorts of things. I never looked back
Keith: and I started in the late 80s at a firm
Keith: called Wilshire Associates, which today is one of the
Keith: pre-eminent worldwide consulting firms, uh, trillions of dollars under advisement
Keith: and consultation. I learned what worked on Wall Street. More importantly,
Keith: I learned early on what really works for individual investors
Keith: and importantly what doesn't work. And so I began to
Keith: put two and two together and ever since, you know, I've,
Keith: I've just been around the world, the global financial centers
Keith: worked with lots of big funds, small funds, big firms,
Keith: small firms today advise a number of advisors.
Keith: Uh, on security selection, market strategy, and in addition, we
Keith: write One Bar Ahead for individual investors around the world.
Suze: Everybody, that's Keith's brief history to tell you the truth.
Suze: It's far more extensive than that, but I'll let him
Suze: be modest for right now. We have a stock, Palantir.
Suze: Most people don't even have a clue what Palantir does.
Suze: So first of all, let's explain that to them. They
Suze: just hear me say buy Palantir, and they do. They
Suze: look at the symbol, they go, OK, and they don't
Suze: know what they have purchased. Tell everybody what they should
Suze: know about Palantir.
Keith: Absolutely let's keep it really simple. So in the old
Keith: days when you put together databases stuff in spreadsheets and
Keith: nice orderly linear columns, you got what was called big
Keith: data and firms like SAP and Oracle, the legacy names
Keith: of the past were great at organizing that stuff, but
Keith: the problem that we've got
Keith: in today's world is that the data has become chaotic.
Keith: It's become multifaceted. It's become multidimensional and so we've got
Keith: so much data, not many people know this, Suze, but
Keith: we've created something like 98% of all the data that
Keith: has ever been created in recorded human history within the
Keith: last five years. Now think about that for, I mean
Keith: that is a staggering figure. The average person today encounters
Keith: more information in a single issue of a newspaper.
Keith: That a person living in the 1700s would have seen
Keith: in their lifetime, so this has continued to accelerate and
Keith: the data continues to get more complex. The problem is,
Keith: as the data gets more complex it becomes harder to
Keith: work with. Now that's where Palantir comes in. They take
Keith: this chaotic data and they take all these nice neat
Keith: stacks of information that you can't otherwise access, organize, or
Keith: even make decisions with.
Keith: And they allow it to talk to each other and
Keith: the byproduct of that is that clients who use it,
Keith: whether it's commercial, whether it's corporate, whether it's government, no
Keith: matter what the application is, suddenly you can make decisions
Keith: using data you couldn't see before you can become more efficient,
Keith: you can increase your sales, you can increase the hospital beds,
Keith: medical treatments, specialized care. There's thousands of use cases for
Keith: what you can do with data.
Keith: Now using Palantir's products that you couldn't do even a
Keith: few years ago.
Suze: And why is it that people write me and tell
Suze: me and yell at me for putting people's money and
Suze: recommending Palantir? What are they misunderstanding or what are they
Suze: understanding about the company that could be very dangerous to
Suze: the safety of everybody in America?
Keith: Well, I would flip that around. There's a lot of
Keith: misinformation out there, right? And Palantir had begun, it has
Keith: its roots in helping make sense of complicated data for
Keith: the military and the intelligence community. So for a lot
Keith: of folks that is a tough pill to swallow because
Keith: they don't want to associate necessarily with the military or
Keith: with the thought that there's an intelligence group out there.
Keith: But they got so good at moving this data around
Keith: and anticipating things and making decisions that they begin to
Keith: expand in their commercial environment so you know this idea
Keith: that the company is suddenly miraculously surfacing out of nowhere
Keith: it's just patently false and incorrect. It's been around a
Keith: very long time and it's very, very good at what
Keith: it does. And the other misconception that's out there right now, Suze,
Keith: and why people are very, very upset is because there
Keith: was an article recently in The New York Times,
Keith: that is filled with erroneous information. I mean dozens of
Keith: technical errors in terms of how the process works, what
Keith: their software does, where they go, the role they play.
Keith: I mean it's just, it's amazing. CEO Alex Karp was
Keith: on CNBC earlier Friday I believe it was, and he said, look,
Keith: he said, 'I'm dyslexic. The New York Times has so
Keith: many errors in their article they may as well hire
Keith: me to do a spelling beat.' You know, I mean,
Keith: it's just, it's astonishing.
Keith: So if you take a few minutes and you understand
Keith: how the product actually works.
Keith: This notion of fear and suddenly surveilling Americans and it's
Keith: doing all these other things is not only patently false
Keith: but that's not what the software does it's not even
Keith: built into the software's capabilities. Palantir, and this will be
Keith: a very controversial statement for a lot of people, but Palantir,
Keith: if you wanted to surveil Americans or other people around
Keith: the world, is absolutely the wrong choice.
Keith: In fact, it's probably the worst choice you could make
Keith: if you're a bad actor because all of the safeguards
Keith: determining who accesses information, how they use it, what they
Keith: do with it exactly to the data point what they
Keith: touch is auditable, it's transparent, it is built into the
Keith: software platform, not as an add-on, which is how all
Keith: the legacy guys did it. So you're talking about
Suze: a software here we are.
Suze: You say the legacy guys how they did it so.
Suze: Explain to people why, and they should understand this, why
Suze: Palantir also protects us here in the United States of America.
Suze: It's not, listen, Palantir, I don't have to know much,
Suze: but I do know that Palantir isn't built so that
Suze: they can spy on all of us and they can
Suze: know what we do. I mean, there are already companies
Suze: out there that know everything that we do.
Keith: Well, the funny, the funny thing is people have voluntarily
Keith: contributed to Meta and Instagram and you know all of
Keith: these other things, TikTok, you know, people worry about the
Keith: Chinese or they worry about Palantir yet in the same
Keith: breath they go onto their Facebook account or they go
Keith: on their Instagram or they dial into their credit bureau
Keith: or they get a mortgage, they have a credit card. It's,
Keith: it's such a contradiction. The irony is extreme because people
Keith: are suddenly like, wait a minute, everybody's
Keith: watching when that cat got out of the bag 40
Keith: years ago and we are living in a digital world
Keith: where if you use a credit card, if you go
Keith: into a store, if you, you get on the Facebook,
Keith: social media, and even the people who are writing to you,
Keith: the irony, the people who are writing to you and
Keith: me and sometimes saying, well, you know, what about Palantir?
Keith: They're using technology that came from the military to begin with.
Keith: So you know, the, the irony is, is really something
Keith: every company has its own set of gremlins.
Keith: And as an investor, you gotta come to terms with
Keith: that because are you looking for the future, or are
Keith: you looking to build upon the past? If you're looking
Keith: for the future, profits are where you wanna be. If
Keith: you're looking for the past, then you know what?
Keith: Move 500 miles from the nearest military installation, go off
Keith: the grid, start turning your own butter, get some sticks
Keith: you can whittle at midnight, you know, there's gonna be
Keith: a very different world. You can't go off the grid anymore.
Keith: But a company like Palantir, here's the real part, and
Keith: this is the part that most people don't understand, particularly
Keith: in light of this New York Times article, is that
Keith: the fear is that, oh my gosh, suddenly everybody's watching this. Well, personally,
Keith: looking at this from a much bigger perspective, which is
Keith: what I do because I do investing, I don't do politics,
Keith: I don't do personalities. I gotta figure out where the
Keith: money is going. That's my job as a money strategist,
Keith: you know, a market strategist.
Keith: And what I know is that there are bad actors
Keith: out there. There are terrorists, there are the Chinese, there
Keith: are the Russians, there are a dozen other folks who,
Keith: if they could, would push a button and eliminate the
Keith: United States of America and consider it a good day's work, OK?
Keith: Palantir is helmed by an unabashedly patriotic CEO who is firmly,
Keith: unequivocally in defense of America and Americans. So I would
Keith: rather
Keith: have him out there with Palantir protecting this country knowing
Keith: full well that the Chinese and Russians and others are
Keith: desperately trying to develop their own versions of Palantir to
Keith: be used against us.
Suze: Just to make it very simple for all of you,
Suze: you want to know what freaks me out, everybody, that
Suze: KT and I are having a conversation, and we're talking about,
Suze: let's just say surfboards. Let's just say that's true.
Suze: And all of a sudden we look on our phone
Suze: and we look at Instagram or we look at Facebook
Suze: or whatever, and there are all these ads about surfboards
Suze: all of a sudden up there advertising to us. So
Suze: you have to realize if you're using Siri, if you're
Suze: using Alexa, if you're using
Suze: this little phone. It is listening to you all the
Suze: time and everything that you are saying. You walk by
Suze: a store on the street and all of a sudden
Suze: you get an ad that says, oh, wanna come in?
Suze: We have a sale. It's like, how did they know
Suze: that I'm even walking by that particular store.
Suze: So you have to not be so freaked out when
Suze: all of a sudden a major company now is doing
Suze: contracts possibly with the government. They've been doing contracts with
Suze: the government for a long time, but when all of
Suze: you see the name Trump is targeting Palantir to do something,
Suze: you automatically think, oh my God, that's it, it's gonna
Suze: be the worst thing.
Suze: And what you also have to understand and Keith tell
Suze: them that doesn't mean just because Trump is targeting them
Suze: to do something that they're going to do it, isn't
Suze: that true?
Keith: Well, that's
Keith: very true. And so we have the 1974 Privacy Protection
Keith: Act which is in play and it's very robust and
Keith: you know our, our the architects of that law did
Keith: a very good job. So you know it's not a
Keith: matter of the President is out there to target you.
Keith: What he actually said and and and this is important.
Keith: Because a lot of folks either can't get past Trump
Keith: or they just can't get past Palantir take Trump out
Keith: of it. Take Palantir out of it. Imagine you're sitting
Keith: in that office, right? And if you know that all
Keith: of these threats are out there, right, there is not
Keith: a leader in the world who would not employ the
Keith: best software he or she could buy to protect his
Keith: or her citizens. That's the crux of the argument.
Keith: And so if we look at this again, take Trump
Keith: out of it, you know, like him, dislike him, I
Keith: don't take sides, I do money, not politics. So if
Keith: you take him out of it.
Keith: The question to ask is, would a sitting president, would
Keith: a leader in any country around the world not take
Keith: steps to buy the very best software they could find
Keith: to help protect their citizens and their nation? And the
Keith: answer is unequivocally yes, they would absolutely try to protect
Keith: their citizens and their nation because that's what they were
Keith: elected to do that.
Keith: Part of the job, so you know my piece when
Keith: you look at it coldly, clinically, OK, fine, it is Trump,
Keith: it is Palantir, but if you look at the framework
Keith: of the 1974 Protection Act, you look at what the
Keith: Palantir software stack actually does, how it works, who controls
Keith: it in the audit trail involved.
Keith: Then the question becomes where is this actually fit within
Keith: our government? What the President actually said was I want
Keith: to build a commonly accessible, more efficient, more cost effective
Keith: database instead of relying on antiquated, outdated systems that cost
Keith: taxpayers billions of dollars, result in hopeless inaccuracies, you know,
Keith: from agencies A to Z in our government. Everybody knows
Keith: they're inefficient.
Keith: So this is an attempt to protect Americans make our
Keith: government more efficient, potentially move us into the next century,
Keith: and again take Trump out of it. What does this
Keith: software actually do? What could we get? What would go right?
Keith: Imagine calling the IRS and actually getting an answer. Imagine
Keith: having Amtrak work the way it was supposed to. Imagine
Keith: the post office being more efficient. Imagine your medical records,
Keith: your tax records, the HIPAA Act, privacy, all of these things.
Keith: Suddenly working the way that they were intended in a
Keith: pre-digital age, but in a digital age, how cool would
Keith: that
Keith: be?
Suze: You know, the truth of the matter is, is that Palantir,
Suze: correct me if I'm wrong, Keith, had a lot to
Suze: do with helping us during COVID and the pandemic and
Suze: all of these things. So all of you take out,
Suze: not all of you, but those of you who have
Suze: been so angry at me, you take out one thing
Suze: and you blow it up and you're mad at me.
Suze: But all right, let's say you're like KT, OK? Sure.
Suze: And Keith experienced this the other day. KT hears the
Suze: news or watching CNN. Immediately she looks at me, she says,
Suze: 'sell it.'
Suze: Now, as all of you know, KT and I have
Suze: a whole lot of Palantir, tens of thousands of shares. OK.
Suze: Now KT has half and I have half, and I said,
Suze: I'm not selling my half. She says, 'oh, you're, I'm,
Suze: I want to sell my half.' So she doesn't ask me,
Suze: and she sends on her email,
Suze: an email to Keith saying what should I do? All
Suze: of a sudden Keith calls. First of all, Not quite
Suze: believing that it's KT cause I don't think KT Keith
Suze: has ever called you before, has she?
Keith: Well, I wanted to make sure it was really her
Keith: because to our point about digital fraud, it could have
Keith: been an imposter, right?
Suze: And so KT now is convinced. She doesn't care. She
Suze: wants to sell. She doesn't want to have anything to
Suze: do with this stock. She is dead set against it.
Suze: And so Keith is explaining all this to her. So
Suze: I want you to imagine that maybe one of you
Suze: out there listened to us when we started to say
Suze: buy it at 7, buy it at 10, buy it
Suze: at 15, cause my average cost base in it is 22.
Suze: So I said to KT, now imagine you're KT. I said, KT,
Suze: if you sell just let's say 5000 shares, do you
Suze: realize the capital gain that you're going to pay here?
Suze: Because the difference between it's a 100% gain for you,
Suze: KT on 5000 shares. You're going to lose 20 or 30%
Suze: of that to capital gains tax anyway.
Suze: So are you aware of that? And she just kind
Suze: of looked at me. Now by this point, Keith is
Suze: on FaceTime with us. So, of course, I handed her
Suze: over to him, and at first she was right, dead
Suze: set against listening to either of us. Don't you agree?
Suze: Right, she was, yeah, she was like, 'no, I'm selling,'
Suze: and I'm like, you are not selling. And now we're
Suze: arguing about it, but here was the bottom line, and
Suze: I'll have Keith tell you what he told KT. Take
Suze: out the fact of the capital gains and all of that.
Suze: But the question becomes, when do you hold the stock?
Suze: That you are vehemently against. You believe in fact, you
Suze: don't believe a thing that we've just said to you
Suze: here on the podcast. You think Palantir is evil, you
Suze: don't like what they're doing, and what should you do
Suze: at that point in time? And Keith, what would you
Suze: tell them?
Keith: Boom, if you are absolutely dead set and you wanna
Keith: sleep and this is driving you bananas and you know
Keith: what sell it and don't look back but make peace
Keith: with the fact that this company is gonna go on
Keith: without you, the future is gonna arrive whether you like
Keith: it or not, and that you're gonna miss out on
Keith: tremendous profit potential going forward.
Keith: Because investing is not about looking backwards in one of
Keith: our cardinal rules is you keep your emotions out of
Keith: the equation. So if you can come to terms with
Keith: the facts, with the potential with the way this is moving,
Keith: then by all means hang on to it. Stocks like Palantir,
Keith: are truly unique. They are only ones in the world
Keith: doing what they do are going to change our future,
Keith: change the trajectory of humanity. And what we know from
Keith: history is that every company has gremlins, but those companies
Keith: like Palantir that truly change our future are worth hanging
Keith: on to if you can stomach doing so.
Suze: So, all of you, I just want you to know
Suze: I have trouble with Musk. I just do.
Suze: And I know that Tesla is one of these stocks
Suze: that Keith loves. You love this stock.
Keith: Oh, I do. He drives me bananas, but I love
Keith: the stock.
Suze: Yeah, but I just want to tell all of you
Suze: I had a very big position in Tesla, but I
Suze: sold it all, Keith. Now I understand very well that
Suze: I probably will miss out on a whole lot of
Suze: money being made in that one stock, however,
Suze: There are other stocks that I can equally buy and
Suze: make money, maybe not as much money, maybe possibly more money,
Suze: but for me, I couldn't stomach owning that stock. If
Suze: that's you,
Suze: When it comes to Palantir, what I would tell you
Suze: is sell it and don't look back, but don't have
Suze: regrets when you look at it and you see it
Suze: skyrocketing as Tesla has done since I sold it.
Suze: You can't have regrets. You have to be firm in
Suze: your conviction as to why you are selling it, and
Suze: if you value yourself more than money.
Suze: Then sell it if that is your feeling. If it's
Suze: not your feeling, don't let somebody make you feel guilty
Suze: about it. This podcast really is about you getting in
Suze: touch with your emotions, cause remember I've said to you
Suze: over all these years that fear, shame, and anger are
Suze: the three internal obstacles to wealth. Keith, what else, as
Suze: we're bringing this to an end, do you want to say?
Keith: Investing in optimism,
Keith: is always more profitable and confidence inspiring than cowering in
Keith: fear and how you define that is uniquely up to
Keith: every listener on this today and what's right for one
Keith: person is different for another, but that's how you share
Keith: information that's how you learn that's how you adjust your
Keith: opinion because companies like Palantir force you to have a
Keith: conversation with somebody in the mirror and as long as
Keith: you're listening.
Keith: There's an opportunity there. If you shut it off reflexively,
Keith: then you know what?
Keith: That's bench level thinking, third level stuff, don't even mess
Keith: with it.
Suze: The main thing I want to say first of all,
Suze: thank you, Mr. Keith Fitz-Gerald. Thank you. Remember all of you,
Suze: you only have a few days left to go to
Suze: musthavedocs.com/birthday to get the must-have documents, $2500 worth of the
Suze: documents you must have. Just go there and check it out. $74.
Suze: And until Thursday, when Ms. Travis joins us again for
Suze: an Ask KT and Suze Anything podcast. Remember, there's only
Suze: one thing I want you to remember when it comes
Suze: to your money, and it's this people first, then money,
Suze: then things. Now you stay safe. Bye-bye.